Author Topic: Pyro, No C-hog perk!! (Read 3806 times)

Maverick · « **Reply #45 on:** January 09, 2001, 02:50:00 PM »

I find this ironic. Everyone (well most everyone) wanted the perk system to help create balance and allow new planes to fly without throwing off the entire arena. Two vehicles alone have been doing just that. The chog and the osty. Now since the numbers indicate a disproportionate number of kills / sorties from the chog show it IS an unbalancing vehicle. Pyro saw it and based the decision on the numbers, not the whines. It's hard to lose your favorite ride for everyday play but if the goal is balance in the arena, the chog should be perked.

I do see a possible new outcome from this type of move however. I see that other planes might be perked for the same reason. The Spit 9, Niky, tiffie and so on based on the lethality of the guns. Is that a good thing? I don't think so as that means the early war plane set may end up being the default set if it continues.

I had posted before in a joking manner that perhaps we should perk cannon aircraft, or those that have 2 or more cannon. It may just come to that because the main draw to a cannon bird IS the lethality of the guns. Certainly the hog can be outmaneuvered by many birds here. If the FM were the issue the dhog would be equivalent in usage. It isn't the FM though, it's the guns.

Next question is going to be, where will te perk system go from here?

Mav

Hooligan · « **Reply #46 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:01:00 PM »

Rip:

My guess is that once about 4 or 5 planes get perked (i.e. all the really popular ones) then there will probably not be any single plane which is flown 15% or 20% of the time. I suppose that will be it for perking non-uber planes. Furthemore when 10% of the arena is made up of F4u-4s, P-47Ms etc... probably none of the non-uber planes are going to need to be perked anymore.

Karnak:

The 1C is not "breaking" the perk system. This is in fact the whole point of the perk system. If the perk system wasn't going to limit availability of some aircraft and encourage use of some others, then why would we even have it? As far as the sky being filled with 262s, HTC can change the perk cost to fly an aircraft at will. If HTC decides that there are too many Spit XIVs flying they change the perk cost from 100 to 300 points. End of problem.

Hooligan

Ripsnort · « **Reply #47 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:21:00 PM »

Anyone remember what the most popular A/C with the most kills was back in beta? That's right, P51D mustang, guess its turn to be perked will be coming after N1K and C-Hog.

Torgo · « **Reply #48 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:31:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hooligan:
[ In another map configuration, which devalues CVs, I would not be surprised to see the N1K quickly reach the top of the popularity chart and get the same treatment.

The N1K1 will be at the top of the popularity chart. It won't get perked.

The issue is HOW FAR it's at the top of the popularity chart.

It's incredibly exasperating to see people continually missing the entire point.

By DEFINITION, there will always be a plane with the most sorties and the most kills.

The question is HOW FAR we allow that gap to grow before perking the leader.

I submit the N1K2 will never be perked because it's blatantly obvious to anyone who actually carefully THINKS about it that the gap between it and everything else will never remotely approach the gap the Chog developed.

Karnak · « **Reply #49 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:33:00 PM »

Hooligan,
Pyro said that the F4U-1C is breaking the perk system.

Ripsnort,
I never claimed to be diplomatic.

In answer to your statement.

Maybe all of the C-Hog fliers will jump to the same plane. But I doubt it.

Now please stop spewing your lies that the C-Hog is being perked because of whines or how powerful it or its guns are. That isn't the reason.

If you debate whether or not it is a good solution to the problem, well, thats different. But your base arguement thus far has been: "What follows next in the 'food chain' of whining:"

Whining has nothing to do with this.

------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother

Sisu
-Karnak

RAM · « **Reply #50 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:39:00 PM »

Where will go all the Chog lovers?...

The navy lovers------>to the Seafire, F6F and Dhog.
The F4U lovers------->to the Dhog
The Jabo lovers------>to the Dhog, Typhoon or Jug
The Hispano dweebs--->to the Typhoon
The Magic HO Dweebs-->to the N1K2

many dweebs will migrate towards the N1K2. However, I doubt they will ever get 20% of the MA kills.

F4U1-C is outbalancing due the fact that its never-jamming turbolasers make an otherwise perfectly normal plane a lazerbird.

either perk it. or give it true hispanos (with jammings, poor ballistics, gun overheating, etc). That way it will stop being outbalancing.

Apache · « **Reply #51 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:43:00 PM »

Quote

I submit the N1K2 will never be perked because it's blatantly obvious to anyone who actually carefully THINKS about it that the gap between it and everything else will never remotely approach the gap the Chog developed.

How can you make that statement? What do you base that statement on? Thats nothing but supposition on your part. You have no basis other than pure guess work.

Jimdandy · « **Reply #52 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:44:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak:
Hooligan kinda has it.

Because perk value is set based on how popular a ride is, any ride that garners 20% of the kills is going to be worth too many points when killed by something that is unpopular, say a Bf109F-4, C.202 or P-38L. This meeans that the person who kills a few of this staggeringly popular ride will then be able to go out and grab his perk Me262 at a much higher rate than HTC intends, thus leading to a glut of Me262s, P-51Hs and Spitfire F.MkXIVs.

I see what your saying but I don't think it will happen like that. If I understand right you start your perk points over at the beginning of each tour? Please correct me if I'm wrong. This would mean that the perk planes would not be showing up tell later in the tour. There wont be many of them in the 1st place. Combine that with the fact that they wont show up tell later in the tour your not going to see anyone out popping enough perk planes with their 202 to make up for the points they didn't get early in the tour. If someone is good enough to be bagging perk planes in there 202 right and left they will probably already have a perk plane anyway. If they don't they deserve one!
As I said my assumptions are based on the fact that you start every tour with zero perk points. HT and the gang upstairs has a good idea by now how many perk points can be gained per tour. They can average lets say the top 300 scores and come up with a point value that would keep these planes from being like flies.

[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-09-2001).]

maik · « **Reply #53 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:47:00 PM »

Geez, that plane gotta has it's fans

.

Maik

Apache · « **Reply #54 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:52:00 PM »

Thats not the point maik. This aircraft is being perked because it has 20% more kills than any other. Can another frame do the same thing? Certainly it can. What then? How many perk planes we gonna have?

Dnil · « **Reply #55 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:54:00 PM »

I dont buy it being perked for its popularity. I mean if its perked I doubt another plane will jump right in and take its place by such a huge margin. Yes another plane will take the lead in the percentage of kills but maybe it will be 15% spits and 14% 51s. We dont know what it will be yet. People fly it for the guns, its why I would grab it, the flying BFG. Nothing wrong with that, its in the game use it.

Now give 5 people F16s fully loaded for A2A and 50 guys 202s. Who is gonna have the most kills? but by numbers which is most popular?

------------------
Dnil---Skyhawk until I get Dnil back

Maj. 900th Bloody Jaguars
Part time aircraft restorer. www.kingwoodcable.com/jheuer

Hooligan · « **Reply #56 on:** January 09, 2001, 03:57:00 PM »

Karnak:

Pyro did not say that the 1C broke the perk system. If you still want to make this claim, please point out the post where you think that he said that.

Hooligan

Karnak · « **Reply #57 on:** January 09, 2001, 04:00:00 PM »

Jimdandy,
As I understand it, you keep your perk points tour to tour.

------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother

Sisu
-Karnak

Jimdandy · « **Reply #58 on:** January 09, 2001, 04:12:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak:
Jimdandy,
As I understand it, you keep your perk points tour to tour.

Well if that's true my system wont work. I'm not sure what they can do then.
Someone help me out. I'm still trying to build on my idea. Is a tour the time between map changes or the time between map resets?

[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-09-2001).]

RAM · « **Reply #59 on:** January 09, 2001, 04:37:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Apache:
Thats not the point maik. This aircraft is being perked because it has 20% more kills than any other. Can another frame do the same thing? Certainly it can. What then? How many perk planes we gonna have?

Apache. Not nearly. The hispano has MORE THAN 100% more kills than its immediate follower, the F6F.

20% is the ammount of TOTAL AA KILLS by the Chog right now. Look Karnak's graph.

that plane is everywhere and killing everything with its god's touch death. so either we remove the unrealistic reliability and performance of the Hispanos, or you perk the plane. Simple.

BTW, again I'd go with the first

[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 01-09-2001).]