are the "vorfluegel" modelled in 109 FM?

[HABICHT]

sorry, but i only knew the german description
it's called vorfluegel and was a little "wing" which automatically comes out of the front of a 109 wing. it comes out at lowspeed, and so the 109 had a very good low speed handling.
is this aerodynamic spoiler modelled in the
current 109FM?
did you know, that a 109f2 could reach a
diving speed of 906KM/h (mach 0.8)!!!!!!!!
think about the current Fm of 109 in AH...

habicht
jg2"richthofen"

[SnakeEyes]

I believe they are known as "slats" in English.  

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SnakeEyes
o-o-o-
=4th Fighter Group=

[Minotaur]

HABICHT;

You can check with HTC, but I believe those wing slats are modeled.  To be exact, they are included in the FM for their performance effect, but they are not graphically depicted.


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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
Trainer

[indian]

They could be slats or they can be called leading edge flaps. depending on the use on the airplane. Dont know much about the 109 but an example of this is the boing 727 has leading edge flaps that drop down under the front of the wing.

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Tommy (INDIAN) Toon
  1st Aces High Trainer Crew
Home of The Allied Fighter Wing A.F.W.
A.F.W. Homepage

[juzz]

 

did you know, that a 109f2 could reach a
diving speed of 906KM/h (mach 0.8)!!!!!!!!
think about the current Fm of 109 in AH...

The Spitfire could go to Mach 0.9!

Btw, I have alot more info on the Me 109 divespeed. Ie: An article from the test pilot who flew the dive trials.

But what do you mean by "think about the current Fm of 109 in AH..." - is there something wrong with the maximum dive speed?

[Sundog]

The diving speed you are referencing was calculated at what pressure altitude? Mach .8
with the velocity you posted was probably referencing the speed of sound at sea level. So, if you are going to reference that to the in game FM, try to time your vertical dive to hit maximum dive speed right before you enter compressibility and auger      . Then see if the speed right before you augered corresponds. Just kidding. Just wanted to point out that the non-dimensional Mach .8 number is the one you have to watch, not the velocity.

Maybe you can talk HTC into building you a Mach-Meter for flight testing..then maybe when they start adding really late war models, they can keep improving until we get to Korean War era aircraft which would need a Mach-Meter! Then I just have to figure out a way to sneak a Tigercat over to the WW2 arena!  


[This message has been edited by Sundog (edited 02-27-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Sundog (edited 02-27-2000).]

[Sundog]

Oh, BTW..The 109 had leading edge slats not flaps. If they were leading edge flaps, there wouldn't be a gap between the surface and the wing when it is extended. However, since there is a gap to re-energize the flow, they were slats.

[juzz]

Here's the full info on that dive test...

Me 109 Wk. Nr.9228, coded TH+TF. A Me 109F model with modifications; fitted with Me 109G wings, ailerons limited to 50% travel, catapult seat and various recording cameras and instruments.

   

The next four flights followed with a trim setting of 1º15'. With this trim setting, one had to overcome high forces by pushing forward on the stick during the start of the dive. These forces reduced to zero at the recovery point of the dive. By pulling smoothly but firmly, the aircraft recovered safely. During these dives I was able to increase the indicated air speed to more than 700km/h(435mph), but only to a point beyond which a further increase did not seem feasible.

As mentioned above, I had increased the initial altitude for the dives to 10,000 metres (32,809ft), which enabled me to reach maximum speed at an altitude well above 5,000 metres (16,405ft). As a result, I reached more than Mach 0.8, i.e. in excess of 900km/h(559.2mph) true airspeed. Whenever this speed was reached, the aircraft started the rolling motions previously described, giving me the jitters every time. I was travelling at a speed nearly 200km/h(125mph) faster than Fritz Wendel during his (horizontal) record flight with the Me 209. This phenomenon is best described thus: The aircraft would begin to bank slightly to the right, which I was able to counteract using aileron. Without prior warning, the forces reduced and suddenly reversed. The roll to the left then had to be counteracted. Just as I had it under control, it flipped to the other side again. These pendulum type movements continued until the speed had been reduced during recovery. If aileron deflection had not been limited to half the value of normal travel, the overcompensation of the ailerons could have cost me my neck. By modifying the ailerons, Messerschmitt was able to reduce the phenomenon to a tolerable minimum.

On 16th March(1943), I made my twenty-sixth, twenty-seventh and twenty-eighth dives with the Me 109G Wk. Nr.9228. In my final report I declared the task completed, and summed up as follows: 'Achieved maximum values with an initial altitude of 10.7 Km(35,106ft) above sea level and an in-flight weight of 2,900kg(6,380lbs). The dive was initiated by rolling in at a speed of Va = 240km/h(149.1mph). The elevator trim was set to +1º15' and the engine performance at 100 per cent. The dive angle was approximately 70º-80º(reported by the pilot) maximum indicated airspeed: Va max = 737km/h(459mph) at 4.5km(14,764ft) altitude. Maximum true air speed reached, Vw max = 906km/h(563mph) at 5.8km(19,029ft) altitude. Maximum Mach number reached: M max = 0.805 at 7.0km(22,966ft) altitude.'

Lukas Schmid, from Test Pilots by W.Späte.

Btw: Compression isn't really modelled in Aces High.

Yup, when I see over 675mph ias on the dial, I start to wonder what's going on...  

[This message has been edited by juzz (edited 02-27-2000).]

[janneh]

here's a pic of leading edge slats:

 

[funked]

Kurt Tank took the Fw 190A to 1000 km/h TAS at 6000 m.  What Mach is that?

[indian]

That coreect anout the slats that why I said not a expert on 109. Do believe they were spring loaded wernt they. I dont hav any real info on the 109 series plane, but bekieve they come up with air pressure brought on by the speed increase.

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Tommy (INDIAN) Toon
  1st Aces High Trainer Crew
Home of The Allied Fighter Wing A.F.W.
A.F.W. Homepage

[Kieren]

The slats (from what I've read) were also a source of trouble in some situations. At high AOA and turning uneven deployment caused instability, often spoiling an otherwise great guns solution.

LW grognards correct me!  

[Rebel]

ooops

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-Rebel
"With a Rebel yell!"

[This message has been edited by Rebel (edited 02-27-2000).]

[juzz]

 

I am unable to recall the stall characteristics of the 109 with the (leading edge) slats retracted but, at the beginning of the trials, the slats were released when the flaps were lowered. When the slats then automatically extended at low speeds, the ailerons briefly, but suddenly, deflected. In order to prevent this, the aircraft had to be 'broken in' in order to smooth out the slat movement. It was also essential, through careful maintenance, to keep them moving freely and smoothly.

 

On one of the last successful gun test flights, high spirits got the better of me and I flew over the heads of my ground crew at very low level. During one of the turns, the leading edge slats of the Me 109 operated, which was not unusual. However, what caught me by suprise was the fact that they did not operate simultaneously! The outside wing extended the slat a fraction of a second earlier than the inside, causing the aircraft to roll nearly inverted. And this with only 30 metres (100ft) altitude! I frightened myself considerably, but the other wing slat decided to come out as well and stopped the roll - all was normal again, and so was my emotional balance. I reproached myself for being so careless, but once in a while a pilot needs a reminder of his fallibility.

Heinrich Beauvais and Fritz Shäfer, from Test Pilots by W.Späte.

[wells]

Funked, that works out to 0.88 Mach!