Tips on flying the 190A5 needed........

[MANDOBLE]

 

Originally posted by RAM:
You can love to BnZ,Mandoble. I can do it (and do it very well). But simply is boring. I want to FIGHT, and A5 is a MUCH better air superiority aircraft than A8. In all senses.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 01-22-2001).]

RAM, there is no direct connect between E fighting and BnZ (hope you know well that). 190A8 is an E fiter, just because it bleeds its E so quickly. Ok, agree with you, turning&turning&reversing&puking is fun, but believe me, that was not the purpose of any KT desing. KT designed fighters, not child toys.

A5 could be a comparable weapon to A8 only if you use the MGFFs, else you have only something like a gray La5.

And about Aux fuel tank, just take off, climb over your base using DT and then patrol loitering at 15k just above stall speed, now tell me that A8 has just only 5 mins advantage.

In this arena, and for missions purpose, range, lo alt speed and weapons are a main factors. In all of them A8 is the winner.

[RAM]

 

A8 E-fighter

 

hehe, wait for me to laugh a bit more pliz   . A plane that accelerates worse, bleeds E faster and climbs worse (both in zooms and sustained------>tested it), has worse vertical performane...and is a better E-fighter?.

Care to explain it to me?  

A8 is better BnZ-er. Period.and that only because the heavier punch. It can E-fight if you start with advantage, but the E-loss is 2 fast to keep the fighting for long. A5 bleeds less E in EACH move it does, plus accelerates better---------->keeps E-up MUCH MORE than A8.

A5 has less range. 5-10 minutes. Maybe I think that it is less because when I was used to fly A8 there was a higher fuel multiplier, I dont know.

And mandoble...for heavens' sake...I dont TURN in A5.

I close fite in it.   completely different   .

A5 was a fighter. A8 was a buff hunter. Historically and here, they are not comparable for anti-fighter purposes.


NathBDP...A8 more challenging?...yep. But also more survivable.

Lets face, if A5 had 15Mph more on the deck you'd fly it all day long , only because you'd be able to raise twice the K/D you have right now. And we both know that your only, and utmost objective in AH is the have the Highest K/D possible regardless anything else (and yes, that includes to let a m8 that has just saved ur bellybutton before, to be banged by four cons without trying to help him. Been there, suffered that  )



[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 01-23-2001).]

[Nath-BDP]

Go take a gander at my k/d for this tour handsomehunk, I haven't flown the A8 more than a few sorties.

Jeez, you really do talk outa your bellybutton eh?

What's the point of flying for k/d with the perk system? I want perk points, thus perk planes. Once I get a perk plane I will then fly for kd.

Maybe if you came outa the closet and stopped hiding like a little girl people would attempt to save your bellybutton if your in trouble and not regard you as some clueless newbie flying a Typhoon.

[This message has been edited by Nath-BDP (edited 01-23-2001).]

[Nath-BDP]

I wish you would put your money where your mouth is, I challenge you to a duel, me in manly A8 and you in your sissy A5.  I do not expect you to accept since all you can really do is talk.

[RAM]

 

must have hit some nerve here

 

Nath...go to sleep. It's very very late  

[MANDOBLE]

RAM, pedorra, A8 is E fiter just because E is its most preciate value. You can turn forever, cant loop forever, cant climb forever, even cant run from most of the other planes. You must to administrate your E like gold, much better than with A5. For BnZ you need only two factors, advantage over the cons and good weapons. With an effective range of less than 300 yards and a very poor ROF, A8 is anything but a BnZ plane. You must fight your kills and get very close and have very good possition to get a definitive shoot, same than with A5, but a bit harder. Your snapshot capability in A8 is almost null.
Its clear that A5 has advantage over A8 in single engangements. But this arena is not H-H. You just cant go with A5 (2x20) and unack by gun an entire enemy base, then kill its radar and all fuel depots. You will have a hard time trying to stop a buff assault with your A5. And the top speed of A5 at lo level makes this plane unsuitable to stop fast enemy jabos knocking your fields. The short range of A5 makes it inapropiate for scort missions where you must keep a long time over enemy bases waiting for your goons or for relief.
The overal impact of A8 in this kind of arena will be always much greater than A5. A5 will be better than A8 only in scenarios where you only need to kill ufo-spitis or some other easy prey.

[MANDOBLE]

 

Originally posted by Nath-BDP:
I wish you would put your money where your mouth is, I challenge you to a duel, me in manly A8 and you in your sissy A5.  I do not expect you to accept since all you can really do is talk.

Nath we are comparing planes, not pilot skills. If you fight against RAM in A8 and you win, it will be only because you were better pilot. It is evident that in a 1 vs 1 situation, A5 has advantage over A8.

[RAM]

Mandoble, to call a plane an E-fighter because if you lose the E you are ded is very arguable.

in my book an E-fighter is a plane that once it achieves E-superiority, it is able to keep it all the time. I.E. the E-fighter by excellence is a 109G10, closely followed by the Yak9U.

Fw190A5 is a better E-fighter than A8. Way better. Because both can keep E up better than A8 and can accelerate faster to compensate for the E-loss than any maneouver can produce. And also because A5 excells in the vertical while A8 can't follow it.

Thus, A5 is WAY better E-fighter than A8.

A8 is a BnZ plane by exclussion, not by excellence. Fw190A8 can't turn. Fw190A8 can't e-fight for long (because almost any plane will equalize the E with superior acceleration quite fast). Fw190A8 can Boom and Zoom. And when E is getting low, then all it can do is dive and hope that the enemy can't outrun you.

Fw190A5 can E-fight, way LONGER than A8. Fw190A5 can close fight due the agility and rollrate, better acceleration and less E-bleeding than A8. And Fw190A5 can BnZ (almost all planes can BnZ, ones better others worse).

Your "so long range" is 20-25% without DT, and a negligible 10% with DT. I compensate that with engine management, and not firewalling trhottle all day long. Range is not an issue for me.

A5 can't be the better anti-buff plane...but A8 isnt it either. A8 has advantage in this role, I agree, because has 4 cannons, while A5 has two. But that doesnt make A8 a better plane. Just a better buff hunter thing that was already in WWII.

IMO 190A5 is a better plane than A8. For my flying stile, sure it is. For other's maybe not. 340mph on the deck is few, I admit it...but 370 at 7K not. And Fw190A5 reaches 370mph at 6-7K.

Regarding Nath...bah. He can fly as if he was Josef Priller, I dont mind. A guy that runs instead of caring for the guy who has just cleared his six twice has a very low spot in my list of good AH pilots.

He is a very good stick, but a really egocentric character. I wont take his duel (in same planes he will beat me almost sure, but A8-A5 dont be so sure, little Nath  .) Because I dont mind if he is a good stick. I mind that he doesnt help his mates, was all I accused him to do, and is someting he can't rebate.

And I wont talk any more about Nath. This is a 190 thread. Lets keep the thing on topic  

[MANDOBLE]

RAM, pecora, A5 is better E fiter, but not exclusively E fiter, A8 is a pure E fiter, cant do anything without keeping its E. Actually, with those 151/20, you cant use A8 as BnZ plane, else you'll have 1 kill per 1000 attempts. You must to get E advantage over the con and try everything to keep that advantage during the combat. You dont have "miracle" maneouvers with A8, except very precise moves to administrate your E, and the need of an skilled eye to evaluate the enemy E state. With A5 you can mistake your moves and use your extra agitily to get alive, with A8 a single error is usually a sure death. Anyway, I insist, the impact of A5 over the actual arena is minimal and will be always minimal. The same with La5, Yak9, 109F and G2. Punch power is a must in this environment, and A8 excels on it.

If you are arguing that A5 is a better pure fiter than A8, ok, but A8 is a way better "combat plane" than A5.

[StSanta]

I dunno. I just think the A5 is way more forgiving and, as RAM says, a much better e fighting plane.

If flown as one would fly the A8, it would give you added possibilities, with the extra engine power and turning capability.

It's the sissy version of the 190's  

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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

"We are the light at the end of your sorry little tunnel." - A. Eldritch

[Vermillion]

Wow! A Luftwobble cat fight  

*grabs a bag of popcorn*


 

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by StSanta:
I dunno. I just think the A5 is way more forgiving and, as RAM says, a much better e fighting plane.

Huhm, you could say it so. but I really miss those 15Mph on the deck sometimes  

On the E-fighting I keep on what I was saying. Mandoble, under your standard, a P47 would be a nice E-fighter! (and it sux  )

Naw. Fw190A8 is a BnZ-er. nothing else. (nothing less  )

[MANDOBLE]

QUOTE]Originally posted by RAM:
On the E-fighting I keep on what I was saying. Mandoble, under your standard, a P47 would be a nice E-fighter! (and it sux   )
[/QUOTE]

RAM, this is the very last time I try to make you understand something so evident. In "my standar" as you say, P47 is an E fiter, but P47 is also a good BnZ plane: long range weapons, hi rof. I'm not saying 190A8 is a good E fiter, just that 190A8 is an E fiter. A8 has nor the weapons range neither the ROF of P47 to excel as BnZer (suppose you know that snapshot capability is essential for BnZ). And believe me, if you use the 190A8 as a Bnz plane, unless you catch your victims by surprise or fight only against greens, you'll end up with less than a fortuite kill per every 10 sorties. If this was the way you used 190A8 during your 190A8 "era", ok, you've missed and experience ...

[Cobra]

*Grabs a seat next to Verm to watch this cat fight and asks......So when we get the La7, you gonna stick with the Yak of give the La7 a go?  VVS...were real men fly!*

Cobra

[Lephturn]

The P47 is a fine E fighter.

1.  It maintains E very well in zooms and dives, pretty much any vertical move.  At high speed it will maintain that speed better than most planes in the game so long as sustained hard turns are avoided.  Combine that with a great high-speed roll rate to maneuver in the vertical and you have a deadly E fighter.

2.  It can convert an E advantage to a short-term turn boost for the kill.

Now granted, it's not the BEST E fighter in the game, but it's certainly a decent one.  Once the Jug gets a head of steam, it's big weight and great engine tend to keep it rolling.  The only planes I really fear are the Hog and the 51, since they are better at E retention and have the diving ability and sustained speed to stop me from disengaging.  Oh yeah, and they flat turn better too, not that that matters.    Any plane in the game can be used as an E fighter... even a Zeke.  It's more of a fighting style than a plane type.  Some planes tend to get labelled as "E Fighters" when they don't really excell in anyting other than energy retention.  It's funny but nobody every calls the Spit an "E Fighter", when it's one of the BEST E fighters in the game.  Try flying a Spit IX as an E fighter and you will be a very dangerous opponent indeed.  Too many folks overlook it's strengths in this area.  Indeed one of the Spit's weaknesses is that it can't slow down fast enough. <G>

Hmmm, what's the best E fighter in the game?  I'd have to say the P51 Mustang or the good old F4U-1D.  Sure the G-10 has great power and climb, but it can't maintain an E advantage like the other two.  I'd have to give that card to the P51 honestly.  That plane and a skilled pilot can work an E advantage and maintain it better than anything in the game IMHO.

Honestly, both FW's are fine E fighters as well in the right hands.  They have many of the same charactristics as the Jug.  Which FW is the better E fighter?  Depends on your criteria really, but I'd take the A5 if I had to choose.

Oh and RAM, don't assume that because Nath let YOU die, he would let anybody else die.  He was just letting you get killed because well, you're you.  

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Lephturn - Chief Trainer
A member of The Flying Pigs  http://www.flyingpigs.com
 
"A pig is a jolly companion, Boar, sow, barrow, or gilt --
A pig is a pal, who'll boost your morale, Though mountains may topple and tilt.
When they've blackballed, bamboozled, and burned you, When they've turned on you, Tory and Whig,
Though you may be thrown over by Tabby and Rover, You'll never go wrong with a pig, a pig,
You'll never go wrong with a pig!" -- Thomas Pynchon, "Gravity's Rainbow"

[This message has been edited by Lephturn (edited 01-23-2001).]