Author Topic: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out  (Read 4569 times)

Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #30 on: January 18, 2010, 07:53:03 PM »
SERVICE DATE - means the date it went into service... meaning the date it was delivered to active squadrons and/or date it was in operational use.  We use these service dates to help build our setups so that when we do add an aircraft to a particular FSO/SEA event/Etc the dates listed in this list and our historical dates include aircraft that were in use at that time.

We've been maintaining this list (well I have been anyways), for almost 7 years.  It was really due for an update.

So far I have:

Hurricane Mk I ... 4-40   *
Spitfire Mk IA ... 5-40   *
Spitfire Mk XIV ... 3-44 *

B-25C ... 1-41#
B-25H ... 8-43#
P-39D ... 4-41 #
F4U-1A ... 8-43   !
F4U-1D ... 8-44   !

Ar-234B ... 9-44@
(Thanks guys)

Still looking for:
P-39Q... ?
P-47M... ?
B-239 ...?
I-16 ...?
Sherman VC ...?
Wirbelwind ...?
T-34/85 ...?


Sources:
* Karnak
# Soulyss
! Saxman
@ USCH
« Last Edit: January 18, 2010, 08:41:01 PM by Mister Fork »
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Offline thorsim

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2010, 08:19:37 PM »
SERVICE DATE - means the date it went into service... meaning the date it was delivered to active squadrons and/or date it was in operational use.  We use these service dates to help build our setups so that when we do add an aircraft to a particular FSO/SEA event/Etc the dates listed in this list and our historical dates include aircraft that were in use at that time.

We've been maintaining this list (well I have been anyways), for almost 7 years.  It was really due for an update.

So far I have:

Hurricane Mk I ... 4-40  (Image removed from quote.) *
Spitfire Mk IA ... 5-40  (Image removed from quote.) *
Spitfire Mk XIV ... 3-44(Image removed from quote.) *

B-25C ... 1-41(Image removed from quote.)#
B-25H ... 8-43(Image removed from quote.)#
P-39D ... 4-41 (Image removed from quote.)#
F4U-1A ... 8-43  (Image removed from quote.) !
F4U-1D ... 8-44  (Image removed from quote.) !

Ar-234B ... 9-44(Image removed from quote.)@
(Thanks guys)

Still looking for:
P-39Q... ?
P-47M... ?
B-239 ...?
I-16 ...?
Sherman VC ...?
Wirbelwind ...?
T-34/85 ...?


Sources:
* Karnak
# Soulyss
! Saxman
@ USCH

"and or" meaning the first of either of the dates i assume ...

« Last Edit: January 18, 2010, 08:31:25 PM by thorsim »
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Offline thorsim

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2010, 08:30:50 PM »
me-262A-1a may 1944(Green: Famous fighters)

FW-190A-1 spring 41 (Green: Famous fighters) which begs a question, what should be done about introductory types that are not modeled in the game such as the 190As and p-51Ds ?

FW-190D-9 winter 43-44 (Green: Famous fighters)



THOR C.O. II ~JG-27~ Afrika-AH
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Quote from: any number of idiots here
blah blah Blah
Quote from: oldman
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Offline Simba

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2010, 08:37:40 PM »
The Hurricane Mk.I entered service with the RAF in January 1938, when No.111 Squadron began converting onto the type from its Gloster Gauntlets. The variable-pitch propeller and metal-winged upgrade became operational during the last few months before the beginning of the war, although many two-bladers were still in service; the same prop mod was made to the Spitfire during the same period. By the outbreak of war, 18 RAF squadrons were fully equipped with the Hurricane.

The first service Spitfire Mk.I was delivered on 4th August 1938 to No.19 Squadron RAF at Duxford, where that illustrious unit was flying Gloster Gladiators. The squadron was up to its full strength of sixteen Spitfires by the end of the year. Up to 3rd September 1939 the RAF had accepted delivery of 306 Spitfires, of which 187 formed the full equipment of ten squadrons (Nos. 19, 41, 54, 65, 66, 72, 74, 602, 603 and 611) and part of the equipment of one more (No.609).

The Griffon-engined Spitfire Mk.XIV entered service with the RAF in Spring 1944; No.610 Squadron at Exeter re-equipped during January and February, quickly followed by No.91 and 322 (Dutch) Squadrons. All three were fully operational by June, when the Germans opened the V-1 bombardment of London; together with No.41 Squadron flying Mk.XIIs, these became the most successful Spitfire units combating the 'doodle-bug' flying bombs.

Sources: Hurricane At War by Chaz Bowyer; 1974, Ian Allan Ltd., Shepperton, ISBN 0 7110 0564 8.
             Spitfire, A Complete Fighting History by Alfred Price, a collected reprint of Spitfire at War Vols. 1 and 2 published by Ian Allan Ltd;
                Bookmart Ltd., Leicester, ISBN 1 85648 015 1.
             The Spitfire Story by Alfred Price; 1982, Jane's, London, no ISBN.

Might be able to find the time for the others, I'll see.

Hope this helps - cheers!

 :cool:
    
« Last Edit: January 18, 2010, 08:40:36 PM by Simba »
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Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #34 on: January 18, 2010, 08:39:33 PM »
Some of my own research:

P-39Q ... 8-43 - can someone confirm?
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Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #35 on: January 18, 2010, 08:46:48 PM »
Fw-190D-9 .. 10-44 - Weapons of Warfare, V10, pp1064-1066.
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Offline thorsim

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #36 on: January 18, 2010, 09:12:33 PM »
SERVICE DATE - means the date it went into service... meaning the date it was delivered to active squadrons and/or date it was in operational use.  

green says jg3 had them and RAF confirms engagements winter 43/44
THOR C.O. II ~JG-27~ Afrika-AH
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Offline Motherland

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #37 on: January 18, 2010, 09:15:59 PM »
green says jg3 had them and RAF confirms engagements winter 43/44
There were never even any prototypes for the Fw 190D-9 until early 1944.

Offline Krusty

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #38 on: January 18, 2010, 09:20:02 PM »
The Hurricane Mk.I entered service with the RAF in January 1938, when No.111 Squadron began converting onto the type from its Gloster Gauntlets. The variable-pitch propeller and metal-winged upgrade became operational during the last few months before the beginning of the war, although many two-bladers were still in service; the same prop mod was made to the Spitfire during the same period. By the outbreak of war, 18 RAF squadrons were fully equipped with the Hurricane.

The first service Spitfire Mk.I was delivered on 4th August 1938 to No.19 Squadron RAF at Duxford, where that illustrious unit was flying Gloster Gladiators. The squadron was up to its full strength of sixteen Spitfires by the end of the year. Up to 3rd September 1939 the RAF had accepted delivery of 306 Spitfires, of which 187 formed the full equipment of ten squadrons (Nos. 19, 41, 54, 65, 66, 72, 74, 602, 603 and 611) and part of the equipment of one more (No.609).

A version of the spit1 and hurr1 were operational on those dates, maybe. But as you say, these were early models with 2-blade fixed pitch props, less horsepower, in the case of the hurricane fabric covered wings.

The Spit1 we have in-game has 100 octane fuel horsepower, which is specific to the BOB time frame, rather than the traditional 1939 date the early models became operational. As for the Hurr1 we have in-game I don't know what octane it has (other than it's over-modeled in a number of ways), but I suspect it's also more BOB-era, as our Spit1 is. That's why HTC put them in, for BOB!

Offline Lusche

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #39 on: January 18, 2010, 09:24:38 PM »
The first long nosed 190 was a rebuilt former FW 190A-0, which was first tested in May 1944, the second one in August.
The design drawings for the D-9 series were completed in March 1944.
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Offline Simba

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #40 on: January 18, 2010, 10:09:12 PM »
"A version of the spit1 and hurr1 were operational on those dates, maybe."

My word, don't you split hairs? They were operational on those dates, no doubt about it. I've used secondary information because I can't spare the time to visit Hendon to obtain primary data just to satisfy those who don't like to admit that the RAF had to hold the line for democracy until December 1941.

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Offline thorsim

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #41 on: January 18, 2010, 10:29:03 PM »
yea i usually go to bookie's as he has so many original documents and says sept 44  

http://fw190.hobbyvista.com/Index.html

but i assure you Green's book is as i have stated

scanning the internet i see support for both sets of dates but that does not really lend credibility to either ...

i always thought jg26 and jg51 got the new FWs first but Green says jg3 another source says jg2 ...

it is somewhat a mess which was my point all along in this thread, how do you decide ...

that is why i suggested enemy contact, although in the case of the D9 there is quite possibly confusion over whether it was a production d9.  however i think prototypes engaging in combat over the channel very suspect ...

can anyone find a RAF report of a long nose as early as fall winter or spring 44?

there is also confusion caused by the introduction of the TA-152 and the D-9s treatment as a transitional airframe.



« Last Edit: January 18, 2010, 10:34:22 PM by thorsim »
THOR C.O. II ~JG-27~ Afrika-AH
Axis Co-Op
Quote from: any number of idiots here
blah blah Blah
Quote from: oldman
Good call.  Ignore the people who actually flew the real planes against each other.

Offline Saxman

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #42 on: January 18, 2010, 10:41:48 PM »
Fork,

Reread what I said about the F4U-1D. I can find no records of STATESIDE squadrons receiving them until September, 1944 at least. VMF-124 and 213 were the first squadrons to operate Corsairs from carriers, and THEY weren't operating in the war zone until the beginning of 1945.

I can find NO record of F4U-1Ds assigned to active squadrons (read: squadrons that were actually deployed IN the engagement area) prior to January 1945.
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Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #43 on: January 18, 2010, 11:09:44 PM »
Fork,

Reread what I said about the F4U-1D. I can find no records of STATESIDE squadrons receiving them until September, 1944 at least. VMF-124 and 213 were the first squadrons to operate Corsairs from carriers, and THEY weren't operating in the war zone until the beginning of 1945.

I can find NO record of F4U-1Ds assigned to active squadrons (read: squadrons that were actually deployed IN the engagement area) prior to January 1945.
Neither can I.  W&W lists them entering testing mid 1944 and delivery there-after but no date on service entry... hmmm.
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Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Aircraft and Vehicle Service Dates - get ur pencils out
« Reply #44 on: January 18, 2010, 11:10:39 PM »
The first long nosed 190 was a rebuilt former FW 190A-0, which was first tested in May 1944, the second one in August.
The design drawings for the D-9 series were completed in March 1944.
Correct - as does W&W state.  It entered active duty in October 1944.
"Games are meant to be fun and fair but fighting a war is neither." - HiTech