No Enemy Icons, The new standard

[FiLtH]

I really wished Valkyrie had picked another title for this thread. So many who peruse the forums once and a while read the thread title and get worked up. Replies of CM's get buried and unless someone wants to read dozens of replies they really don't know what the Admin CM's have said.

As far as a poll, maybe. I like polls, but really the only poll that would hold a 100% weight with me would be one that HTC would have to setup for the 500 FSO players log in and have to take one concerning icons. A poll in the FSO forums would only weigh the opinion of those who read the forums. I am guessing 2/3 at the most of the FSO participants, might be closer to 1/3.

Again, just to be clear I have no intention of turning off all the icons in FSO. Some Admin CM's may opt for enemy icons off, or maybe a shorter range for enemy icons and longer for friendly, or maybe just keep it as is. It is up to each CM how they design their event. Enemy icons off is NOT a new FSO standard.

Some of you hate icons off. Some of you love it. I get that. Some of you think it is more 'realistic', some call it more challenging. Some think it is totally unrealistic and others think it is 'gamey'. My PM box abounds with opinions, just like this thread. Some of you will not participate in FSO if the icons are off. I get that. No different than a squad that has lower attendance because they get saddled with a ride they don't want and a couple guys decide not to fly that night. So long as squads keep in the +2 or -2 they will never hear from me.

   I know our squad has had a lot of lousy FSOs this past few months. And mostly due to a few things. Tampering with icon ranges, adding winds, and manual calibration. We need to stay on course with what has been the FSO years previous. There is no need to experiment with these areas.  The problem wont be maintaining a +2/-2 and getting warnings of participation, it will be whole squads planning to spend friday nights in the MA...and worse..just not caring about it.

[AKKuya]

Just out of curiosity where do you guys come up with these numbers? I'm not going to deny that a larger monitor can have a marginal (maybe more IDK I haven't tried it) effect on identifying dots out of icon range, but during the combat challenge I could tell 109's from Spitfires easily from outside of friendly icon range (3.0K) on my 22" monitor (which I know is bigger than average...).

This is more a technical issue in regards to players having different video card, monitor sizes, resolutions, internet connection, and other stuff.  What it really comes own to how well the eyeballs work.

I have a 17inch monitor and would really like to have one alot bigger.  Maybe one day I will.

[daddog]

Icons short means 3k.

It was an error on my part when it was set to 1k. That is what I get for trying to do 8 things at once including help with the setup. 

Anytime a setup says short icon range it means 3k. If it is anything other than 3k (short), it will be listed/addressed in the write up. If it is not what the write up said then we made a mistake.

For those of you that think CM's will just list short and not tell anyone what short means your sadly mistaken and really miss the mark on what CM's try to do for the events community.

[Valkyrie]

Its time to end this. I picked the title to get attention. Its worked. Now turn the damn icons off and put the old men to bed. 11:00 eastern is past all their bed times anyway. I'm really sick of people opining who were not there and did not see it, but bash it they do. Its the mark of a fool. And we seem to be living in the age of the fool.

Move on and lets join the 21st century
Vlkyrie1

 

[Nefarious]

Its time to end this. I picked the title to get attention. Its worked. Now turn the damn icons off and put the old men to bed.

LOL, that's sig material there.

[Shifty]

Its time to end this. I picked the title to get attention. Its worked. Now turn the damn icons off and put the old men to bed. 11:00 eastern is past all their bed times anyway. I'm really sick of people opining who were not there and did not see it, but bash it they do. Its the mark of a fool. And we seem to be living in the age of the fool.

Move on and lets join the 21st century
Vlkyrie1

 

Hmm just when I thought this thread was about to run out of steam. 

[Krusty]

Hmm just when I thought this thread was about to run out of steam. 

He's just a troll.

Or totally ignorant.

Either way, don't feed him. 

[Shifty]

He's just a troll.

Or totally ignorant.

Either way, don't feed him. 

Yeah I closed the fridge and locked the pantry.

[Vulcan]

Its time to end this. I picked the title to get attention. Its worked. Now turn the damn icons off and put the old men to bed. 11:00 eastern is past all their bed times anyway. I'm really sick of people opining who were not there and did not see it, but bash it they do. Its the mark of a fool. And we seem to be living in the age of the fool.

I was there and I did see it. I don't want to see FSO turned into a Warbirds arena just because some snot nosed kid tweaking on red bull wants his icons off. FSO has grown to be a truely awesome event, this one 'adjustment' could easily destroy it.

[gyrene81]

I was there and I did see it. I don't want to see FSO turned into a Warbirds arena just because some snot nosed kid tweaking on red bull wants his icons off. FSO has grown to be a truely awesome event, this one 'adjustment' could easily destroy it.

Please enlighten us with your wisdom...how would turning enemy icons off destroy FSO or be similar to Warbirds in any manner? If you personally need enemy icons for some reason other than as a crutch then speak up...I'm guessing you had a hard time trying not to get shot down and don't want to have to face that situation again.

Bad news for you (and some others)...I don't like the possibility that I might have to be allied for an event, or being assigned to a bomber, or ordered to carry bombs for a dive bombing mission...and most of my squad feels the same way but the only thing that stops us from participating is the occasional real life issue that pops up...otherwise we fly what we are assigned and do what we are assigned to do...that is how adults do things.

[Krusty]

Constantly putting yourself on an abritrary pedestal and calling everybody else weak fools for "needing" icons is only going to get your proverbial forum arse kicked, son.

Might want to take a huge dose of wisdom, humility, and understanding (in any order) and realise how baseless your insults really are.

Everybody has explained to you why icons are here and why "no icons" is as far from realistic as possible, yet you and your 3 other fellow crusaders keep harping about it and insulting anybody who doesn't agree.


Nice....

Smooth.

[BigR]

Icons short means 3k.

It was an error on my part when it was set to 1k. That is what I get for trying to do 8 things at once including help with the setup. 

Anytime a setup says short icon range it means 3k. If it is anything other than 3k (short), it will be listed/addressed in the write up. If it is not what the write up said then we made a mistake.

For those of you that think CM's will just list short and not tell anyone what short means your sadly mistaken and really miss the mark on what CM's try to do for the events community.

Fair enough. These days with the new settings I'm sure it can be hard getting it all straight. However, It would be nice if instead of "short icons" in the setup, the CMs would list the actual range no matter what it may be. With the new settings, "short" really doesn't mean much anymore. It is going to lead to a lot of confusion to people who dont know that it means 3k.

[ghostdancer]

And that is what I am going to do from now on .. give the setup CMs the exact value for icon ranges from now on and also in my description denote it as 3K yards (9000 ft).

[j500ss]

   I know our squad has had a lot of lousy FSOs this past few months. And mostly due to a few things. Tampering with icon ranges, adding winds, and manual calibration. We need to stay on course with what has been the FSO years previous. There is no need to experiment with these areas.  The problem wont be maintaining a +2/-2 and getting warnings of participation, it will be whole squads planning to spend Friday nights in the MA...and worse..just not caring about it.

You would pull your squad from FSO because of winds and bombing calibrations?     Seems extreme to me, so many here want some realism, and the forces of mother nature is one good way to do it.  So far as bomb calibration, just not really a big deal to me, do it a couple times, and its all good, maybe you won't hit a 100%, but bet your butt, you'll have a better hit % than most all real life WWII bombardiers, cause the only guaranteed hit they were getting was, hitting the ground.  

 

[Motherland]

Everybody has explained to you why icons are here and why "no icons" is as far from realistic as possible,

If you mean using the same well groomed, long prepared rhetoric that has manifested itself here without question (including from me) for years because no one has actually tried anything to the contrary, I would agree.