Some days are better then others but tonight was awful

[froger]

I guess my point in this thread is why do some pay $15 dollars a month to up a plane to ram, then up another plane to ho/ram again.  Is there a point in the game to do this if you have no concept of getting better/improving in the game.  What's the reason if there is no room for improvement why would you even play?


I get rammed every frikin day and that is just my stupid refusal to not merge head on with the other guy.
when i duck, the seasoned stick will let me by in hopes to get a fight but after i get a few guys breaking there necks to dump cannon spray on me as i try to avoid the HO, that just makes me wanna take every shot i can.

getting better is relative to who you come up against.

is flying around in a chog at 20k and picking the crowed for score a game improvement ?
is upping with the hoard just to have mass numbers on your side and improvement ?
is getting into a duel in the MA (win or lose) and then have the tard flame you on 200 calling you a HO or timid or a runner or a picker.... an improvement ?
is milking bases in EW /MW or evan main arena in the middle of the night just to get a better score
an improvement ?

I just dont care, there is a lot to be said for the words (it's my 15 bucks i'll do what ever i want) and you can flame me all you want. I will continue to improve in my own way.


All i am saying is it is not up to you, me or anyone else to say what improvement is to someone else.
this type of thread plays out day after day here...over n over again.

just fly your own game, take what you dish out and get on with it.



that is all

froger
  

[bustr]

I can understand Jumper and the latest crop of newbies and the HOing. Many are furball lake graduates where the cannon bird HO rules. Hopefully the trainers can get some of them to take ACM calsses in the TA.

You obviously have not spent an evening with GHI furballing in an IL2 using F3 mode. He flys about 100ft off the deck. Watches you from god mode dive down to him, or level behind him to get under his rear gun, then noses into the buses at the instant you open fire. If you follow you collide so you pull up or turn away and he pulls up or turns behind you and hoses you with 37mm. Very often you have slowed down to his speed to saddel up and you cannot pull away fast enough to survive. All the while he's watching in F3 mode. I hear some DAers fly in F3 mode during duels.

So Tndep it's a choice if you want to keep going back against a person that irritates you. I finaly got even with GHI. He was so fixated on me coming in at 20ft off the deck through the trees while watching in F3 mode he forgot to check his altemeter. When he nosed down I pulled up and watched him plow into the ground because he had matched alt with me to make his overshoot work. That told me he noses down while in F3 god view mode.

I've stopped worrying about being HO'd. If the HO can kill you in this game and HiTech says its as much a part of the game as any other tactic. Then isn't the gamey attitiude wanting to force everyone to not HO rather than you polish your skills to the point that a HO is irrelevant?

Mary, jesus and joseph I'm sounding like a muppet. Wheres the holy water to wash my mouth out with...arrrgggghhhh.........

[SAJ73]

I am thinking back about 3years when I first started playing AH2, (or any flight sim for that matter) I did not even have a stick. I upped on bish base in furball arena with my mouse for flight control, and looked for something to shoot down. I did not even try the offline mode before I jumped into my 2week trial.
I flew several sorties before I finally got a kill, and offcourse it was a ho I did. I thought I did good, and after that kill I tried to copy the move again. Only frustrating thing for me was all those timid guys that did some "miracle move" and disappeared from my sight only to kill me from behind???   

I got lucky and ho killed some more guys, and got accused for hoing.. Hoing?? Never heard of.. 

I think my first week I was all about hoing, that was the only way I could get rounds at someone. And I still had no clue what the people accusing me of hoing were talking about. 

Then I finally had to ask, what is a ho??

Ok, that was not a popular thing to do... At that point I learned that this game actually was not all about "the kill", but about the fight. Next thing I learned was that I needed a stick and some serious training to learn the 3D feel of the game. At that point I was totally 2D and all I could do was flat turns..  No wonder I was killed alot!




My thoughts when I get hoed is that the hoer probably is at the point I was back then, or if he has been around for awhile he just has not been so well taken care of and helped out as I did. I was asking alot of questions in the beginning, I really wanted to learn to fight on the terms of the big community. And I got alot of good help improving my skill until I felt I was ready to get out of the nest and spread my wings alone again.

I am still learning day by day, and offcourse I get a little mad sometimes if say I engage a better turning plane than my hog just to see how long I can stay alive, and all I get is a ho shot blowing me to pieces.. 

But after getting hoed enough I have learned to dictate the merge into my favour instead, or atleast I try to. Or if I KNOW who I am fighting and I know the pilot is a no-hoer for sure. Then I can merge almost head on and really close just to even the odds and see who's the better stick after that. 

But I like the thrill of not knowing what you are up against, that's really the spice in this game. Especially in the MA arenas, were you always run into new guys you've never fought before. 

Randomly some of them are hoers, but in general I try to approach them just like I allready knew that.

[4deck]

 

Who gives a crap.

BTW "in"

[TnDep]

I guess my point in this thread is why do some pay $15 dollars a month to up a plane to ram, then up another plane to ho/ram again.  Is there a point in the game to do this if you have no concept of getting better/improving in the game.  What's the reason if there is no room for improvement why would you even play?


I get rammed every frikin day and that is just my stupid refusal to not merge head on with the other guy.
when i duck, the seasoned stick will let me by in hopes to get a fight but after i get a few guys breaking there necks to dump cannon spray on me as i try to avoid the HO, that just makes me wanna take every shot i can.

getting better is relative to who you come up against.

is flying around in a chog at 20k and picking the crowed for score a game improvement ?
is upping with the hoard just to have mass numbers on your side and improvement ?
is getting into a duel in the MA (win or lose) and then have the tard flame you on 200 calling you a HO or timid or a runner or a picker.... an improvement ?
is milking bases in EW /MW or evan main arena in the middle of the night just to get a better score
an improvement ?

I just dont care, there is a lot to be said for the words (it's my 15 bucks i'll do what ever i want) and you can flame me all you want. I will continue to improve in my own way.


All i am saying is it is not up to you, me or anyone else to say what improvement is to someone else.
this type of thread plays out day after day here...over n over again.

just fly your own game, take what you dish out and get on with it.



that is all

froger
  

very good points froger.....point well taken

[TnDep]

I can understand Jumper and the latest crop of newbies and the HOing. Many are furball lake graduates where the cannon bird HO rules. Hopefully the trainers can get some of them to take ACM calsses in the TA.

You obviously have not spent an evening with GHI furballing in an IL2 using F3 mode. He flys about 100ft off the deck. Watches you from god mode dive down to him, or level behind him to get under his rear gun, then noses into the buses at the instant you open fire. If you follow you collide so you pull up or turn away and he pulls up or turns behind you and hoses you with 37mm. Very often you have slowed down to his speed to saddel up and you cannot pull away fast enough to survive. All the while he's watching in F3 mode. I hear some DAers fly in F3 mode during duels.

So Tndep it's a choice if you want to keep going back against a person that irritates you. I finaly got even with GHI. He was so fixated on me coming in at 20ft off the deck through the trees while watching in F3 mode he forgot to check his altemeter. When he nosed down I pulled up and watched him plow into the ground because he had matched alt with me to make his overshoot work. That told me he noses down while in F3 god view mode.

I've stopped worrying about being HO'd. If the HO can kill you in this game and HiTech says its as much a part of the game as any other tactic. Then isn't the gamey attitiude wanting to force everyone to not HO rather than you polish your skills to the point that a HO is irrelevant?

Mary, jesus and joseph I'm sounding like a muppet. Wheres the holy water to wash my mouth out with...arrrgggghhhh.........

yeah some of the da pilots fly f3 mode which give them a better shot on snap shots.  Very true about all your points bustr and I agree. 

[TnDep]

SAJ ya I remember doing the same thing.  The guys name was Jumper, I don't know if he was knew or not but if he is I completely understand and I have learned a lot from all of the responses from everyone in the thread.  I didn't start this thread to dish anyone but just to find some understanding.  Some people got to bash you everytime you start a topic but some of you guys put some great points down and I respect that and let it sink in. 


I've worked with a dozen or so guys helping with acm and I enjoy that.  I might put an application in to be a trainer to help some of the new guys wanting to learn and get better. 

Good 2 c an old dueling buddy 

[froger]

  Dep,


froger

[dev41]

Saj73 - You pretty much summarized about where I am. I came into this game four or five months ago and didn't have a clue what I was doing. I Killed a couple of B-24's flying with my mouse after about a week. Most of my first week was flying (into the ground) and getting killed (actually that would summarize my entire experience pretty well, too) then proceeded to HO everyone in sight (I think that was after I figured out the bad guys had red icons). Anyway, it took me a couple of months to realize that I have a huge amount of learning to do. Since then I have been reading up on BFM, ACM, tactics, etc.

One thing I would point out is that I would expect that most new flyers read the HTC info on plane types, etc. In some of those write ups they talk about taking head on shots, BnZing, etc. It certainly leads a new person to believe that these are acceptable tactics. At any rate, I try not to HO anymore, but it sure is hard not to when I see another plane heading straight at me and knowing that half of them will HO me. But after reading a lot of posts on other threads I am working on learning to avoid the HO (so far not too successfully) although stalling is a bigger problem for me right now.

A lot of guys have given me tips or helped me out and I am sure that it seems that I am a slow learner, but I have never played a game that I have enjoyed so much. I have seen experienced guys Ho and it seems like everyone plays differently, I can't answer regarding the psychology of what this thread is asking but I guess that some people get their kicks in different ways.

[TnDep]

Saj73 - You pretty much summarized about where I am. I came into this game four or five months ago and didn't have a clue what I was doing. I Killed a couple of B-24's flying with my mouse after about a week. Most of my first week was flying (into the ground) and getting killed (actually that would summarize my entire experience pretty well, too) then proceeded to HO everyone in sight (I think that was after I figured out the bad guys had red icons). Anyway, it took me a couple of months to realize that I have a huge amount of learning to do. Since then I have been reading up on BFM, ACM, tactics, etc.

One thing I would point out is that I would expect that most new flyers read the HTC info on plane types, etc. In some of those write ups they talk about taking head on shots, BnZing, etc. It certainly leads a new person to believe that these are acceptable tactics. At any rate, I try not to HO anymore, but it sure is hard not to when I see another plane heading straight at me and knowing that half of them will HO me. But after reading a lot of posts on other threads I am working on learning to avoid the HO (so far not too successfully) although stalling is a bigger problem for me right now.

A lot of guys have given me tips or helped me out and I am sure that it seems that I am a slow learner, but I have never played a game that I have enjoyed so much. I have seen experienced guys Ho and it seems like everyone plays differently, I can't answer regarding the psychology of what this thread is asking but I guess that some people get their kicks in different ways.

dev I'd be glad to do some 1v1's with you and see if I can help you out.

If you got proper distance to advoid the ho I always enjoy doing a barrel roll within there plane.  It's a very tight barrel roll and very little loss of Energy. You need to be at the top of your barrel roll before they hit 1.0k Firing distance out of the barrel roll to a point where your wings are almost level but your still traveling left or right according on which direction you started the barrel roll. They waste ammo everytime and I don't think I've ever been hit with a single bullet if it's performed correctly.  If you don't understand We'll get in the TA and I'll show it to you 

[grizz441]

dev I'd be glad to do some 1v1's with you and see if I can help you out.

If you got proper distance to advoid the ho I always enjoy doing a barrel roll within there plane.  It's a very tight barrel roll and very little loss of Energy. You need to be at the top of your barrel roll before they hit 1.0k Firing distance out of the barrel roll to a point where your wings are almost level but your still traveling left or right according on which direction you started the barrel roll. They waste ammo everytime and I don't think I've ever been hit with a single bullet if it's performed correctly.  If you don't understand We'll get in the TA and I'll show it to you 

Film might be best for a thing like this.  I'd like to see the move you speak of.

[TnDep]

Film might be best for a thing like this.  I'd like to see the move you speak of.

I'm off work tomorrow I'll make a short vid of the maneuver against another plane and put it up here.

[WMLute]

Film might be best for a thing like this.  I'd like to see the move you speak of.

Me too.

Sounds like it might be "ok" to avoid an nme ho but does zero for you position wise for the rest of the fight.

IF you plan on flying past the nme and keep going it would be viable. 

IF you plan on actually fighting the nme though...

[MORAY37]

Before this becomes a ho thread let me say this I personally love the fights to be clean and let acm do the talking.  Most of the time I win and some I lose.  Tonight I met a guy named Jumper and everytime he hoed/rammed you with his hurri 2c.  If you tried to break he'd push his stick down left or right and spray.  This happen on 3 consc. sorties and he hoed/rammed squaddie's as well.  I had to get off to go to bed anyway but it leaves me disguested with the game.  You have so many to put up a good clean fight and some that ruins the game.  

Is it his $15 dollars - Yes

he can do what he wants - I know

Is he and some others destroying the game - Yes

I get my butt handed to me back some a lot in duels.  Tonight me and TJ done some duels in the DA and I lost 90% of them and I love that as it helps me to learn.  


I guess my point in this thread is why do some pay $15 dollars a month to up a plane to ram, then up another plane to ho/ram again.  Is there a point in the game to do this if you have no concept of getting better/improving in the game.  What's the reason if there is no room for improvement why would you even play?

Answer this question only and I'm going to start it off

To make me ask questions - Yes  

Tn,

If, prior to the merge, you know what he is doing and where he is going to be, your engagement sequence and his death as the outcome should already be determined.

Yes, he may get a lucky spray in on you. But, 99% of the time if your opponent is this predictable, you should be working to use this as the mistake to capitalize upon.  The number one rule I follow is to be unpredictable. 

[SAJ73]

I think a good way to avoid ho shots is (if the distance is adequate enough) pretend to go for a straight head on until just before guns range, just keep it in a shallow dive to keep the speed up. Then right before getting in guns range dive off to left or right, the hoer is now in the middle of his aiming process and will get surpriced as you change the course. He will now have to add some lead to his shot.. Then turn as low as you can into him, try to get under his nose, this will be a very hard shot to get as he will probably red out if trying to aim for you.. And you will have your speed up to go high after you pass him, or do whatever. Make a high yoyo with another turn to surprise him even more perhaps.. Number of ways to be unpredictable and try to get lost from his view for just long enough to make him go straight for a sec or two looking for you before turning.. Then you might have a shot at him before he get turned again if lucky.