Attention Duelling Arena pilots

[Shuffler]

How?  I am in a fight and he is not.  How are we in the same boat?

He has to find you just as you have to find him.

The AVA is not just 1 on 1 but one side against another. One way to be sure the other guy does not up and immediately engage you is to not venture so close to the other side's base. That is the same for the MAs. What is different is the fact that now both have to see eachother and then track as well as possible. Much easier said than done with no icons. If you keep thinking the other guys have the advantage on you then it is not 2 vs 1 but 3. You should know by now that you can be your own worst enemy.

Your other post earlier where you said you were here before me and will be here after me is interesting. I was not aware that you were here before 2000 and I'm not going anywhere. I have a huge stash of scotch for the powers that be.........

[Changeup]

I'm not sure my squad POTW would be happy to know that you have determined by their enjoyment of the no-Icon mode that they lack the willingness to out fight other players head to head.

Well, we would feel like a good fight was in order Bustr.  Filth, you get your boys and our boys will meet ya in the AvA, MA, DA any place ending in "A", lol....let us know.  No flaming necessary...just a good ole fight! 

Changeup

[bustr]

No good deed goes unpunished...........

[TheBug]

As I said, no argument other than we did it, how could we possibly be wrong?

Who the F is we?  I have nothing to do with how the AvA setup.  Personally I like the no-icon setup and would never take a stance to say you are wrong in your opinion, it is your opinion.  No matter your point you're being a jerk about it and for some reason think some great show of immaturity is going to sway the other side.

I get you don't like the current AvA settings, understand completely the reasons why.  But as of late it has been the best long term factor (hard to compete against the short term draw of a nice, new shiny map) to get some numbers in there.  

[gyrene81]

  I may not make any friends by saying this, but one thing Ive noticed over the years is the group of people who have a passion for simulated air combat, but arent quite as good at it as they would like to be. Some want nothing to do with an even fight.

   For me, noticing this started back in AW when the "Why cant we hit head-on?" crowd complained. They didnt want to gain the 6 of the enemy and defeat him. More issues through this game have been brought up from time to time. Always leaning toward the "but its more realistic " slant.

   No matter what the issue, it always boils down to "I want to surprise my enemy and kill him easier". Whether its no icons, or always flying planes that can escape, or turn off the F3 mode in the DA, those people arent so much about knife fights as they are being the guy in the tower with a scoped rifle.

   The little things like no icons may give an advantage to those with better systems they wouldnt have in a 1 on 1 fight with icons. You cant buy that. Its something you either get better at, or accept how you fly and be content, or try to influence others that what we have is unrealistic,gamey etc, and their way is better,to try and close the gap.

   Personally I dont remember any fights where I got bounced and killed (its happened many times) but I remember many fights that started out with the pilots seeing eachotherand dukin it out till one was dead. A fight that might not have happened if there was no icons. I just dont see the benefit of it sorry. Its bad enough we have lag issues to put up with. Expecting everyone to see the same way your system portrays the game is wishful thinking.

   If more effort went into setting up an arena where it was simply strat bombing and someone tracked tonnage on target through the campaign and the kills the escort and interceptors got, we'd have an arena most would play in.
Look for more ways to create great fights, not ways to sneak around.

Hate to say it Filth but you are so far off base on the reasons why no enemy icons works for those who enjoy it...even Dedalos is ahead of you in the curve.

I can tell you haven't been in the AvA since the enemy icons were turned off, there are only a small number of people who even try to hide in the bushes and they do the same thing in the other arenas. The dar settings make it nearly impossible to actually hide, most of the time there is a red dot on the clipboard map that shows your location to everyone on the other side, everywhere you go unless you're in a gv or flying under 100 feet.

A really good computer actually puts a player at a slight disadvantage in the arena due to the way objects are rendered, lower resolutions make it easier to spot things. You can test that out yourself.

Since you jumped on the realistic versus gamey boat, there is absolutely nothing realistic about a bunch of red letters that shows the dot you're looking at on your computer screen is a P-51 18,000 feet away from you. That information was included and is defaulted to on for everyone, because Aces High is a game where the majority of people playing it are mostly interested in the game aspect. If none of that information was there to begin with when you first started playing and you lasted long enough to consider yourself an expert pile-it, you would be complaining if people wanted to have that red letter information included. Yes the red letters are a gamey aspect as is the F3 mode in the DA, but in an environment where there is more than 2 sides battling it out in the same airplanes, the gamey stuff is necessary to accomodate as many people as possible.


I don't see you or anyone else who has railed their opinions about no enemy icons, taking the time to browbeat anyone who has gone through the trouble and expense to either build or purchase a sim pit. Oh wait, I know why people have sim pits, it's for the "immersion"...same as a the people who are enjoying no enemy icons in an arena where people fly for one of two sides and do the best they can to immerse themselves in simulated WWII air combat flying simulated WWII aircraft.

[Changeup]

Hate to say it Filth but you are so far off base on the reasons why no enemy icons works for those who enjoy it...even Dedalos is ahead of you in the curve.

I can tell you haven't been in the AvA since the enemy icons were turned off, there are only a small number of people who even try to hide in the bushes and they do the same thing in the other arenas. The dar settings make it nearly impossible to actually hide, most of the time there is a red dot on the clipboard map that shows your location to everyone on the other side, everywhere you go unless you're in a gv or flying under 100 feet.

A really good computer actually puts a player at a slight disadvantage in the arena due to the way objects are rendered, lower resolutions make it easier to spot things. You can test that out yourself.

Since you jumped on the realistic versus gamey boat, there is absolutely nothing realistic about a bunch of red letters that shows the dot you're looking at on your computer screen is a P-51 18,000 feet away from you. That information was included and is defaulted to on for everyone, because Aces High is a game where the majority of people playing it are mostly interested in the game aspect. If none of that information was there to begin with when you first started playing and you lasted long enough to consider yourself an expert pile-it, you would be complaining if people wanted to have that red letter information included. Yes the red letters are a gamey aspect as is the F3 mode in the DA, but in an environment where there is more than 2 sides battling it out in the same airplanes, the gamey stuff is necessary to accomodate as many people as possible.


I don't see you or anyone else who has railed their opinions about no enemy icons, taking the time to browbeat anyone who has gone through the trouble and expense to either build or purchase a sim pit. Oh wait, I know why people have sim pits, it's for the "immersion"...same as a the people who are enjoying no enemy icons in an arena where people fly for one of two sides and do the best they can to immerse themselves in simulated WWII air combat flying simulated WWII aircraft.

+1......I am really startin to like you Lethrneck.....

[CAP1]

you mentioned the f3 mode. that's available in the ma's in bombers.....whelp...all of the bombers, 'cept for our pee38's. when the hell do we get OUR f3? 

[Changeup]

you mentioned the f3 mode. that's available in the ma's in bombers.....whelp...all of the bombers, 'cept for our pee38's. when the hell do we get OUR f3? 

Yes sir it does...most bombers in WWII had 8 or more men in them...16 eyeballs.  Since we can't recruit gunners to fly with us, I suppose HiTech gave us a bit of a view to compensate for the missing 14 eyeballs....just a guess though.

Changeup

[CAP1]

Yes sir it does...most bombers in WWII had 8 or more men in them...16 eyeballs.  Since we can't recruit gunners to fly with us, I suppose HiTech gave us a bit of a view to compensate for the missing 14 eyeballs....just a guess though.

Changeup

why do you take gunners without eyeballs? that's just crazy. 

[FiLtH]

    First of all, what I said may not pertain to everyone in the AVA. I know many of you like to fight. Secondly I dont have anything to prove to anyone. I think Ive fought enough of ya over time so you know it would be a good fight, probably more so than some...SOME of you want. Thirdly, as far as the immersion, I think Im about as immersed in it as Id like to be. I told you I may not make friends with my comments, but its frankly how I feel about it.

   As far as the sim pits go..Ive seen some pretty cool ones, but most come off looking like a box surrounding a pc. Not my bag..a little TOO into for my taste, but hey, whatever ya know? And as far as learning without them, I suppose Id either have learned that way if I could see the planes, or said nah Ill play something else. Gyrene frankly I dont feel as though I need to be instructed by you on anything, nor deserve to be. I have played in the AVA no-icon.

   Lastly Im not a squad on squad guy as I normally am on my own. But I will accept any one on ones anyone would like to do in the DA. AND then go to the AVA, and when you see a noticable difference in my tracking ability, you will know why I posted these comments to begin with. Id just hate to see a handful of squeeky wheels change the game I like to play as is.

[Oldman731]

 Id just hate to see a handful of squeeky wheels change the game I like to play as is.

Filth, I was sorry to see that you, Dedalos and TC, in particular, didn't like no-icons; really, I'd thought they would appeal to all of you.  That said, the cold fact is that until we went to no-icons settings there generally were no people in the arena.  I would fly around for half an hour, sometimes an hour, by myself many, many nights, and the "Vacancy" sign was out on the pole for a very long time.  I recognize that no one wants to be the first in an arena (or even the second), and I don't blame anyone for not wanting to spend time here.  But now we actually do have people coming to the arena on a regular basis.  If it's a choice between disappointing those who prefer icons but don't come to the arena (for whatever reason), and those who will come because there are no icons, it really isn't any choice at all.

AND I still think the three of you haven't given the no-icons settings a fair chance, so there.

- oldman

[TequilaChaser]

AND I still think the three of you haven't given the no-icons settings a fair chance, so there.

- oldman

Heya Oldman,
 
I am happy that the "no icons" setting for enemys is bringing in players to the AvsA.......

but I would have to correct you on the not giving it a fair chance.....

I have showed up as "TC" and also under my daughter's account

I have even winged with Dawger, and had fun doing it,  and Dawger and I both had a blast. least I thought we did...

I have been in the AvsA with 15 to 30 people up playing.....

I have showed up being the only person there, waiting.....

I have showed up and the only person there at the time was Dawger, and I waited for him ( he was AFK on autopilot forever )

we had a few fights then more showed up.....  

I can fly in there with no icons just as good as I can with icons

I just prefer icons.....

and a 1 pixel dot or 2 pixel dot up to prob 12 pixels on my screen does not look anything like a sillouette of any WWII plane to me.....

I also think about it in a similar way to what Filth described above.... regarding the sniper analogy or escaping or hiding ... what ever.

the one thing I have read in this entire thread that I truly agree with is what Bustr typed, and I in times past always saw this in AH and the CT/AvsA:

Polite peer pressure has been one of the hallmarks of the CT/AvA staff and regulars that keeps me dropping in over the years. When there is a core group of them in the arena during a peak session, they politely remind players to play with some decorum, politeness and to keep the sides even. Thats actually how in AW and AH during those way back good old days the fights were kept fun and polite. More of the regulars cared enough to polietly remind wayward players about the rules and decorume involved because it kept the game freindly and lively.

even though I do not care for the "no enemy icons" setting in there these days..... there will be times I will prob drop in there...

is like one of my squaddies in the Damned, who did not like flying the  CT/AvsA back when the icon range was limited to less than 3K.

different strokes for different folks

as I said in that other thread, I wish the AvsA & AvsA Staff the best  

 

[jimson]

Classy post TC,

Thank you sir 

[FiLtH]

    No hard feelins toward you Oldman, your one of the best. I understand where your coming from. I was just getting tired of seeing everyone pile up on Dedalos for stating his opinions, and acting all "if ya aint no icon, ya aint shat!"
   
   

 

[bustr]

TC,

Did you know DAMND Slidr back in BD's early AW days?