introducing....

[LLogann]

   He's the reason why I didn't say SBD. 

the tbm if it's flown by snaphook

[SunBat]

SunBat

I stopped going in there regularly about a year ago for that very reason, along with pilots making UNBELIEVEABLE shots (another F3 story).   To tell you the truth, what made me move on was one night on one of the small fields with:  SunBat, MugZ, Grizz, Squat2, JunkyII, MtnMan, Kappa, Suns, Ardy123, ElBurro, Agent360, Hlbly, Flench, and Dodger.  I still have the video of it...first red guy you see is called out on open VOX and you get it on.  I had been a DA lake guy for the first year I played the game...every single night.  Why is this important?  In my 45 year old, new-to-online-gaming opinion, they embody the character of how the game should be played.  They had fun flying and dying...no egos seemed to be present, lots of questions (mostly me....SunBat, how are you able to be in a dive while climbing?) a ton of laughing and they all talked about having fun with the free planes and learning to fight low and slow and personal without it being personal;  all of them would answer any question you had.  No ankle humping here....I got smoked early and often but it was fun because of listening to them have a great time with NO VOX200 johnson-measuring...the guys that are good don't have to talk about it.

Point?  The only way anyone gets better is die a lot....you can't die a lot if you are hanging out at 25K AGL waiting on some noob to climb his way up to you or running to your gaggle of green fellas.  I love the 51 argument heard on VOX every night..."Im not gonna turn with a Spit, that is why I'm running"....I can think of a number of P51 drivers and other alt-friendly planes that turn with Spits everytime I see them...and I die every time...I guess at some point they made the decision to "fight" (and learn that plane).  Even in a game, people want "safe" instead of risk...that won't change until there is more value placed on skill than pride...I was lucky...I was accidently taught by those guys that skill matters and there isn't much skill needed to fight with a group of friendlies (Yes I do it too because going to find a fight generally means others are already there but I don't mind diving into a horde just to see how many I can kill before I see blood on the canopy or my lights go out) but running when you see a blob of red?  Does anyone really think that when its 9 v 1 that the one guy has no skill?  He has no OPTIONS and there's a difference...and that is when you learn IMHO.  I hate it too but really the only thing that pisses me off about that is that I have to fly all the way back to the fight after I die...and that takes too much time! lol

Changeup

  Changeup.  Well said.  There's a lot of truth in there. 

[SunBat]

I think I am starting to get it.

I definitely am.  Here's proof.  

 

EDIT:  Seriously though, IMO and to put in an oversimple manner, I think this "mindlessly" thing that we caricaturize is simple making the distinction between whether you try to stay alive or you just don't really give a damn and you fly into the mess and choose a guy to kill and work on him until you get picked.  You can enter the fight at the exact same altitude and one way you work with the entire situation and the other you just consider the smaller picture.  It depends on my mood as to which way I choose on any given day.     

[kilo2]

I fly at a high alt at first. To me coming in with an alt advantage and squandering it on the first low con you see is not intelligent. So I come in high make a few passes and evaluate the situation. Then I begin to catalogue the planes from, most of a threat, to least of a threat. That takes into account the planes relative altitude. From that I make a decision on which one to attack first. You attack that one until it is defeated maintaining you advantage at all times. Then you repeat the first step.

Too me this is the most effective way of controlling a base when you are alone. Now if you have friendlies about you can take more risks counting on if you get into to much trouble you will receive assistance. The point of that is not to avoid combat but become more effective while taking on the least amount of risk. This is the way I like to fly but is not the only way I fly. I think you need to be a balanced cartoon pilot to get the most out of the game. Use your head but do not be afraid to risk it.

Point is there is more to flying at alt than one would assume.

[Threeup]

Yeah, it's funny to me to look at the radar in the DA when there are a bunch of people in the arena and see blobs of red off of each base and a reluctance to move to the middle.  When you fly over to that blob you will find that many of the cons are between 15 and 20k.  The blob waits for one con to venture in then they dive on him like a flock of gulls after a french fry and compete with each other to see who can get the kill before the other one.  Once they have a massed an amazing 2 kills in their tempest, they run back and land and show how awesome they are for being the fastest gull to the fry.   

QFT - No. quoted for extreme truth.

[Changeup]

I would like someone to throw alka seltzer up to the gulls....do we have that?

PS - Corky said there was a place we can go to make friends?  Where is this heaven-on-earth? 

[grizz441]

Grizz - A fight includes extending a bit in their a/c and re-engaging sometime in our near future.  Jumping on VOX and proudly claiming their WW II historically correct, cerebrally perfect, extend-escape tactic does not.  Low on fuel, got it...no ammo, roger...pilot wound, cool...1/2 a wing missing, understood.  Small weinered, sackless historically correct runner = tinyjohnson.

Well, by your definition I embody all the traits of a fighter.  By some other's definition, I am a sackless timid picking dweeb. Of course those who call me that won't fight me 1v1, but that's another story. 

Is it wrong that I try to fight all of my fights with advantage?  If I see a high P51d that is b&zing me, I have the advantage.  If I see any coalt airplane, I have the advantage.  If I see 2 coalt airplanes I have the advantage.  If I am fighting 5 cons but I have alt on them, I have the advantage.  If a con is on my tail, I have the advantage.  Take a situation though like me engaging 4 at once coalt, I don't have the advantage, and I will not engage.  Three is iffy, kind of depends what planes.  So you see, I tend to always fly with advantage.  Any vet who looks for 1v1s in the MA under the notion they are looking for fair fights is fooling themselves.  There is nothing fair at all about killing seagulls one versus one.

[Changeup]

Well, by your definition I embody all the traits of a fighter.  By some other's definition, I am a sackless timid picking dweeb. Of course those who call me that won't fight me 1v1, but that's another story. 

Is it wrong that I try to fight all of my fights with advantage?  If I see a high P51d that is b&zing me, I have the advantage.  If I see any coalt airplane, I have the advantage.  If I see 2 coalt airplanes I have the advantage.  If I am fighting 5 cons but I have alt on them, I have the advantage.  If a con is on my tail, I have the advantage.  Take a situation though like me engaging 4 at once coalt, I don't have the advantage, and I will not engage.  Three is iffy, kind of depends what planes.  So you see, I tend to always fly with advantage.  Any vet who looks for 1v1s in the MA under the notion they are looking for fair fights is fooling themselves.  There is nothing fair at all about killing seagulls one versus one.

By my definition you are a fighter...yes.  In all of the cases you list, do you actually fight yes, with the exception of 1.  The ones that I speak of are looking specifically for a many-on-one situation...if you find yourself in that particular group....hmmm....but I don't think you are.

[kilo2]

By my definition you are a fighter...yes.  In all of the cases you list, do you actually fight yes, with the exception of 1.  The ones that I speak of are looking specifically for a many-on-one situation...if you find yourself in that particular group....hmmm....but I don't think you are.

Too me I don't see how being above 5 planes and being Co-alt with 5 planes is any different. Other than of course having less chance of making it out if you are co-alt.

[grizz441]

By my definition you are a fighter...yes.  In all of the cases you list, do you actually fight yes, with the exception of 1.  The ones that I speak of are looking specifically for a many-on-one situation...if you find yourself in that particular group....hmmm....but I don't think you are.

I fight outnumbered all of the time, just in a more effective way than turning in circles.  If I am on the deck with 5, it was a mistake due to over aggressiveness and greed.


MA 1v1.  Vet vs Avg MA player:

 
 

[Changeup]

Besides, that was a trick question....you never go anywhere alone and THAT is smart....and I resemble that picture.

Changeup