Upgrading My Beer Making Stuff

[L0nGb0w]

how much money would you be spending to get a system set up for brewing <5 gallons at a time? or is it just worth it to brew in larger quantities

[VonMessa]

Around here, you can get a starter kit and ingredients for a 5 gallon batch for < $100.

Fermenting bucket with lid and airlock
Siphon
Sanitizer
Bottle capper
Bottling wand and bucket
Hygrometer

Buy "The joy of homebrewing" by Charlie Papazian.  Brewing explained in very simple terms without being patronizing.

[dirtdart]

OK... so here is the plan...

I am going to take my existing boil pot and insert a "HERMS".  This HERMs will have a Y valve on it and serve both as the heat exchanger to preserve the mash temp and as my wort chiller. 

Thoughts?

I spent the better part of yesterday planning it out.  As long as the attachment points for the coil can be removed for cleaning, and the coil has enough separation from the center for stirring, it should work.  MTF.....

Wrote my first receipe yesterday for a scotch ale.  Is next in the queue.  In figuring grain weight, I do not really understand how to determine the lbs of grain when targeting a range of SG.  Every other piece, IBU etc, I figured out.  The grain piece is kicking my fourth point of contact. 

[dirtdart]

how much money would you be spending to get a system set up for brewing <5 gallons at a time? or is it just worth it to brew in larger quantities

I spent a bit up front, just because in most hobbies you end up buying the low end of what you need and then you get it here and there.  The "decider for me" was the wort chiller.  My brother in law brews and was using an ice bath.  Not the worst thing I suppose, but his beer never tasted too good.  So, as I read on in beer making books, such as the one messa recommends, I learned that you want to cool your wort quickly without risking contamination.  A wort chiller seemd like a good way to do it.  I spent 300 bucks I thin, including the burner I bought (turkey fryer kit from walmart).

[VonMessa]

OK... so here is the plan...

I am going to take my existing boil pot and insert a "HERMS".  This HERMs will have a Y valve on it and serve both as the heat exchanger to preserve the mash temp and as my wort chiller. 

Thoughts?

I spent the better part of yesterday planning it out.  As long as the attachment points for the coil can be removed for cleaning, and the coil has enough separation from the center for stirring, it should work.  MTF.....

Wrote my first receipe yesterday for a scotch ale.  Is next in the queue.  In figuring grain weight, I do not really understand how to determine the lbs of grain when targeting a range of SG.  Every other piece, IBU etc, I figured out.  The grain piece is kicking my fourth point of contact. 

Did you get my PM?   

[VonMessa]

I spent a bit up front, just because in most hobbies you end up buying the low end of what you need and then you get it here and there.  The "decider for me" was the wort chiller.  My brother in law brews and was using an ice bath.  Not the worst thing I suppose, but his beer never tasted too good.  So, as I read on in beer making books, such as the one messa recommends, I learned that you want to cool your wort quickly without risking contamination.  A wort chiller seemd like a good way to do it.  I spent 300 bucks I thin, including the burner I bought (turkey fryer kit from walmart).

I also have "How to Brew" by John Palmer (also free PDF here) http://www.howtobrew.com/

"Designing Great Beers" by Ray Daniels

"Radical Brewing" by Randy Mosher

and my newest

"New Brewing Lager Beer" by Gregory J. Noonan  (very technical not recommended as 1st read or if one is not fond of chemistry and the entailing math/chemical calculations involved in it) t has an awesome section on decoction mashing though which is the traditional German way of running a mash schedule, used successively by the monks before thermometers were invented.

[dirtdart]

Did you get my PM?   

I sure did, many thanks.  Shoot me your street address, I will shoot you a paddle....

What are your thoughts on the single strike water/boil pot notion?

I am going to have to get off my butt and figure the math part out.  I defer to the earlier, if you don't understand it, destroy it. 

[VonMessa]

I sure did, many thanks.  Shoot me your street address, I will shoot you a paddle....

What are your thoughts on the single strike water/boil pot notion?

I am going to have to get off my butt and figure the math part out.  I defer to the earlier, if you don't understand it, destroy it. 

How about a rake?  (My mash tun(s) are square and don't have a grain bed deep enough for a paddle)  I'll send you the dimensions of them 

I though about the same exact thing.  You will need 2 pumps.  One to push wort in one direction, the other to recirculate hot/cold water through or around your chiller.    I got mine from here http://www.dudadiesel.com/heat_exchangers.php  I will never use an immersion chiller again.  A counterflow chiller may work just as good perhaps, but you can't beat the small footprint of the plate chiller.  At one point, I toyed with the idea of  making a "radiator" from soft copper tube that would be  encased in a block of ice in the freezer and have glycol running through it.  That would require a second pump (not necessarily a March, though) to recirculate  the glycol.

I tried to use my immersion chiller as my HERMS coil, but it is 3/8" soft copper tube and was too restrictive.  I could have filled my mash tun faster by pissing in it...
I went with 20' of 1/2" soft copper tube and, although still a bit more restrictive than the 5/8" tube, it flows at a decent rate and, at full blast, is still slow enough to pick-up heat from the HLT.


NOTE:

When purchasing copper TUBE, the size is the OUTSIDE diameter, unlike copper pipe which is the inside diameter.

3/8" copper tube has an OD of 3/8" and ID of  ~ 5/16"

1/2" copper pipe (which is what I plumbed my rig with) has OD of 5/8" and ID of 1/2"

I wish I had told my brother that when I sent him for the HERMS coil.
The "helpful' plumbing "specialist" at the local home store sent my brother home with 3/8" tube after hearing what my brother was going to do with it after I told him I needed 1/2" tube 

In case I didn't mention it, I use all flare fittings for my connections.  (all threaded fittings are 1/2", but flare side is considered 5/8" as the copper PIPE has a 5/8" OD.

I like the flare connections (like an automobile radiator has) over compression fittings (which aren't necessarily meant to be taken apart and put back together over and over) and over quick disconnects (which have more nooks and crannies for nasties to grow and wouldn't work for me as everything is hard-plumbed).

[dirtdart]

Yeah, shoot me the specks for the rake.  I have tons of oak.  I have some walnut too, but I think you might pick some flavors off of that. 

I think I can get away with one pump, just because I can use the household water supply through the immersion chiller.  I saw the links to those plate chillers, pretty sexy I must say. 

If I can build one pot that does a couple of things it reduces my footprint, which in my case is a bit of a deal. 

Here is the numbers the widget  spit out for me.  I will adjust over time.  I am going for a little woody, kiss of peat and smoke. 

Islay Scotch Ale

Type: All Grain
Date: 3/9/2011
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Brewer: The Dirtdart
Boil Size: 6.41 gal Asst Brewer:
Boil Time: 60 min Equipment: Brew Pot (7.5 gal) and Igloo Cooler (10 Gal)
Taste Rating(out of 50): 35.0 Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00

Ingredients

Amount Item Type % or IBU
12.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) UK (3.0 SRM) Grain 90.57 %
1.00 lb Brown Malt (65.0 SRM) Grain 7.55 %
0.25 lb Peat Smoked Malt (2.8 SRM) Grain 1.89 %
1.00 oz Target [11.00 %] (30 min) Hops 26.4 IBU
0.50 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] (6 min) Hops 1.8 IBU
1 Pkgs Scottish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1728) Yeast-Ale

Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.071 SG
Measured Original Gravity: 1.010 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.020 SG Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 6.69 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 0.65 %
Bitterness: 28.3 IBU Calories: 43 cal/pint
Est Color: 11.8 SRM Color: Color

Mash Profile

Mash Name: Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge Total Grain Weight: 13.25 lb
Sparge Water: 4.11 gal Grain Temperature: 72.0 F
Sparge Temperature: 168.0 F TunTemperature: 72.0 F
Adjust Temp for Equipment: TRUE Mash PH: 5.4 PH

Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge Step Time Name Description Step Temp
45 min Mash In Add 16.56 qt of water at 174.9 F 158.0 F

 

[VonMessa]

[VonMessa]

Well, I guess fair is fair  


BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Killuminati Pale Ale
Brewer: Daniel A. Messa
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 10.00 gal      
Boil Size: 13.20 gal
Estimated OG: 1.078 SG
Estimated Color: 7.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 67.9 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 69.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes
Estimated ABV %  8.5    

Ingredients:
------------
Amount        Item                                               Type         % or IBU      
34 lbs        Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM)              Grain        94.44 %      
2 lbs         Carared (20.0 SRM)                                Grain        5.56 %        
2.00 oz       Chinook [13.00 %]  (Dry Hop 7 days)       Hops          -            
2.00 oz       Nugget [13.00 %]  (60 min)                    Hops         39.0 IBU      
2.00 oz       Amarillo Gold [8.50 %]  (Dry Hop 7 days)  Hops          -            
1.50 oz       Nugget [13.00 %]  (30 min)                   Hops         22.5 IBU      
1.00 oz       Amarillo Gold [8.50 %]  (15 min)             Hops         6.3 IBU      
1.00 oz       Amarillo Gold [8.50 %]  (5 min) (Aroma HopHops          -            
1 Pkgs        California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) [StartYeast-Ale   2 liters)              


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 36.00 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Light Body, Batch Sparge
Step Time     Name               Description                         Step Temp    
75 min        Mash In            Add 11.25 gal of water at 164.6 F   150.0 F      


Notes:
------


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Babalonian]

How about a rake?  (My mash tun(s) are square and don't have a grain bed deep enough for a paddle)  I'll send you the dimensions of them 

I though about the same exact thing.  You will need 2 pumps.  One to push wort in one direction, the other to recirculate hot/cold water through or around your chiller.    I got mine from here http://www.dudadiesel.com/heat_exchangers.php  I will never use an immersion chiller again.  A counterflow chiller may work just as good perhaps, but you can't beat the small footprint of the plate chiller.  At one point, I toyed with the idea of  making a "radiator" from soft copper tube that would be  encased in a block of ice in the freezer and have glycol running through it.  That would require a second pump (not necessarily a March, though) to recirculate  the glycol.

I tried to use my immersion chiller as my HERMS coil, but it is 3/8" soft copper tube and was too restrictive.  I could have filled my mash tun faster by pissing in it...
I went with 20' of 1/2" soft copper tube and, although still a bit more restrictive than the 5/8" tube, it flows at a decent rate and, at full blast, is still slow enough to pick-up heat from the HLT.


NOTE:

When purchasing copper TUBE, the size is the OUTSIDE diameter, unlike copper pipe which is the inside diameter.

3/8" copper tube has an OD of 3/8" and ID of  ~ 5/16"

1/2" copper pipe (which is what I plumbed my rig with) has OD of 5/8" and ID of 1/2"

I wish I had told my brother that when I sent him for the HERMS coil.
The "helpful' plumbing "specialist" at the local home store sent my brother home with 3/8" tube after hearing what my brother was going to do with it after I told him I needed 1/2" tube 

In case I didn't mention it, I use all flare fittings for my connections.  (all threaded fittings are 1/2", but flare side is considered 5/8" as the copper PIPE has a 5/8" OD.

I like the flare connections (like an automobile radiator has) over compression fittings (which aren't necessarily meant to be taken apart and put back together over and over) and over quick disconnects (which have more nooks and crannies for nasties to grow and wouldn't work for me as everything is hard-plumbed).

Actually "copper pipe" is technicaly classified as "Type K Copper Water Tube", so it's all copper tubing.  It's just sized differently (standard) than most other types of copper water tubeing standards.  And you're correct, the O.D. of 1/2" type K is 0.625", however the I.D is not 0.5" but must be at a minimum of 0.5270" (with a minimum wall thickness of 0.049 for 1/2" and 3/4" size standards, this leaves it's actual actual I.D. at ~0.5275-0.5280" since I've never known a copper manufacturer to be generous with material thickness).  Next time, I'd go with employing an irrigation system designer/specialist that does hydrolic calculations most days of the week over your poor inocent brother, lol.   


[Quick edit, forgot to x2 the WTs, today was an oak tree survey/report day, had the hydrology switch turned off.]


Hey, Messy, you should be able to get 3 gallons a minute out of that without compromising effeciency.  If there's a desired rate you're looking to achieve then give me an idea, I'll let ya know what size pipe you should be wanting to use to achieve this.

Roughly:
GPM  -  Size (type K copper)
 0-3  -  Up to 1/2"
3-5  -  5/8"
5-7  -  3/4"
7-12  -  1"
12-19  -  1-1/4"
19-26  -  1-1/2"
26-46  -  2"
46-72  -  2-1/2"
72-96  -  3"

[VonMessa]

Cool, thanks 

Seems to be good, now.  It was horrendous with the 3/8"  It would have taken more than a half-hour to drain 15 gallons out of the hot water tank at the rate it was going 

[dirtdart]

Ok, so I mapped out my plan for the swiss army pot, going to try to modify the pot this weekend (that is unless my stuff from austin homebrew shows up).  I quick comment on them, I like the fact that they package their grain in dunk bags, so you dont have to buy one.  A nice touch, seeing as how a large grain bag is indeed a few bucks other places. 

[dirtdart]

Hefe... this tasted really good coming out of fermentation.  I hope it tastes better after some bottle conditioning. 



My rig, 10 gallon cooler, 7 gallon pot.  Pump s run by a drill (lol) march pump hopefully for fathers day....



HERMs coil.  I ran it tighter at first, transfer was not great.  I hugged the walls of my pot and now it runs good.  This will be my chiller as well.  First run on this today with a new belgium abbey ale clone