B-17F

[SectorNine50]

Well, I ask you to go tell all the LW fanatics they should have only one version of Bf 109 because the versions differ only slightly visually, cmon...  

What?  Each one of the 109's performs very differently.

Based on what has been said in this thread, that is not true for this B-17, unless the performance differences just weren't brought up.

[Tyrannis]

Well, I ask you to go tell all the LW fanatics they should have only one version of Bf 109 because the versions differ only slightly visually, cmon...  

keyword. looks isent everything about an aircraft.

each 109 performs differently. and not every one has the same gun package options.

example: the k4 doesnt have the gonzola 20mm option like he g14 does.

and the f4 doesnt have 13mms.

[Guppy35]

if the E version got put in, it could be in early war.

Oh how I wish folks would do a little  research first.  Define early war.  1942 seems midwar to me. E and F were 42-43 with a few F's soldiering on into 1944 but the G was the main production model from late 43 on.

Would it be nice to have the E and F?  Sure, just like it would be nice to have the P38E, F and H to go with the G.  But performance wise there is little difference to show and visually they aren't that different.

Do I hope HTC gets around to it someday?  Absolutely.  Is it  a priority with so many other birds not modeled at all?  Nope.

[Tyrannis]

Oh how I wish folks would do a little  research first.  Define early war.  1942 seems midwar to me. E and F were 42-43 with a few F's soldiering on into 1944 but the G was the main production model from late 43 on.

Would it be nice to have the E and F?  Sure, just like it would be nice to have the P38E, F and H to go with the G.  But performance wise there is little difference to show and visually they aren't that different.

Do I hope HTC gets around to it someday?  Absolutely.  Is it  a priority with so many other birds not modeled at all?  Nope.

was built&entered service in 1941. had its first combat mission in 1942. meaning it could be included in early war just like the p38G is.

could be a lightly perked bomber in early war. and since it can be included in early war it makes it a priority. because the early war planelist is VERY short and needs to be filled.

http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=2452

[Motherland]

if we have 4 different versions of Bf 109G (which is fine, got to say this before I get all the Luftwaffles blowing on my neck )

It may be worth noting here that we only have 3 versions of the Bf 109G, and that many more were built than B17s, and that it was in large scale front line service from 1942 until the end of the war.

We have 1 version of the Bf 109G-6 which was built in comparable numbers to the B17.

[Guppy35]

LOL yer not listening

Would it be nice?  Yes.  Is it a priority? No.  If you are worried about early war, then I suggest making sure the Beaufighter, Ki-43, He111, Mohawk and any number of Russian and Italian birds get in game first since we have NO examples of those.

[Tyrannis]

LOL yer not listening

Would it be nice?  Yes.  Is it a priority? No.  If you are worried about early war, then I suggest making sure the Beaufighter, Ki-43, He111, Mohawk and any number of Russian and Italian birds get in game first since we have NO examples of those.

listening to what?
that the b17E isent a priority?
of course im not going to listen to you then. because thats your OPINION. and its an opinion that seems to be coming from someone who doesnt care for EW. (because ive never seen you in there, i could be wrong tho)
so of course im not going to listen to you when your saying its not a priority just because YOU dont think it is. early war has the least amount of planes on its list than any of the other arenas. and i THINK early war planes should be the focus right now. atleast until we have them close to the amount mid war has.

[Ack-Ack]

and its an opinion that seems to be coming from someone who doesnt care for EW.

His opinion comes from knowing vast more about WW2 planes than most anyone else on these boards, including you. 

ack-ack

[Guppy35]

listening to what?
that the b17E isent a priority?
of course im not going to listen to you then. because thats your OPINION. and its an opinion that seems to be coming from someone who doesnt care for EW. (because ive never seen you in there, i could be wrong tho)
so of course im not going to listen to you when your saying its not a priority just because YOU dont think it is. early war has the least amount of planes on its list than any of the other arenas. and i THINK early war planes should be the focus right now. atleast until we have them close to the amount mid war has.

So how bout we cut through the crap and get right down to it.  This isn't about what early war needs, or history.  You want a 4 engine heavy in EW for your own purposes, not the betterment of the game as a whole.

If early war is your priority, then as I said, start howling  for the He111, Do-17, Wellington, Hampden, Whitley, Ki-43, Mohawk, Beaufighter, all those Italian and Russian birds from 40-41.

But don't BS us into thinking you are out for the welfare of the EW arena. 

[Tyrannis]

So how bout we cut through the crap and get right down to it.  This isn't about what early war needs, or history.  You want a 4 engine heavy in EW for your own purposes, not the betterment of the game as a whole.

If early war is your priority, then as I said, start howling  for the He111, Do-17, Wellington, Hampden, Whitley, Ki-43, Mohawk, Beaufighter, all those Italian and Russian birds from 40-41.

But don't BS us into thinking you are out for the welfare of the EW arena. 

no, i rarely fly the lanc in early war. im perfectly happy with the b25 in there. i just feel that there needs to be a 4 engine heavy in there that would fit in to the timeline more than the lanc does.(ik the lanc was around, but it just feels out of place in EW to me)
and im a personal fan of the E version.
HE111? if we're talking for EW purposes ONLY. the he111 would be low. the ju88 can do its job better than the he111 can.
everything else? sure.
but you still havent named a reason WHY the E shouldnt be included in early war.

naming off other planes that deserve to be put in EW aswell isent a reason why the E shouldnt be added too.

[Guppy35]

I rest my case.  You want it for your own reasons, not what is best for EW.  Nothing wrong with that.  Again as I said, it would be nice, but it most surely is not a priority

My favorite WW2 bird of all time is the Spitfire XII.  My interest goes back 30 years now.  Would I like it in AH?  Sure.  I can give you all kinds of reasons why too.  But in the end, it's not a priority.  Other birds are much more needed to fill out the plane set to help the Scenario/FSO/ Snapshot folks so that for those events they can bring as much history to the game as possible.

Do understand that in the overall scheme of things, like the Spitfire XII, the B17E was a small time player with limited use very early in the ETO and PTO but quickly replaced by the 17F which was then replaced by the 17G with the 17G doing most of the heavy lifting from the end of 43 on.

Hopefully someday we'll get an E and F.  But it's not top of the list by any means in my opinion with all those other birds waiting to have any variant at all in game.

[Ack-Ack]

no, i rarely fly the lanc in early war. im perfectly happy with the b25 in there. i just feel that there needs to be a 4 engine heavy in there that would fit in to the timeline more than the lanc does.(ik the lanc was around, but it just feels out of place in EW to me)
and im a personal fan of the E version.

The Lancaster was in action long before the B-17, it does have a place in the EW plane set.

HE111? if we're talking for EW purposes ONLY. the he111 would be low.

That would depend on the pilot's tactics and not dicated by the plane.  The He 111 was a medium to low altitude bomber, one that was very good in its roll.

the ju88 can do its job better than the he111 can.

Not really, you should look up both planes and do some research.

but you still havent named a reason WHY the E shouldnt be included in early war.

You should go back and read when Dan wrote again, he listed a few reasons why.  The problem is that you're ignoring the reasons because they don't mesh with yours.

naming off other planes that deserve to be put in EW aswell isent a reason why the E shouldnt be added too.

Yes it is.  He's naming the other planes that the EW plane set needs more than the B-17E and he's correct.  There are many more EW planes that are needed before any thought of adding the B-17F or E models.

ack-ack

[B-17]

The Lancaster was in action long before the B-17, it does have a place in the EW plane set.

not sure i agree with that entirely. the B-17 flew july '35, was delivered in june '39, and in action by 1940 or so was the B-17C i believe. the lancaster (manchester III at the time) was flying january '41.

[Tyrannis]

not sure i agree with that entirely. the B-17 flew july '35, was delivered in june '39, and in action by 1940 or so was the B-17C i believe. the lancaster (manchester III at the time) was flying january '41.

the b17 entered SERVICE before the lancaster did.true.

but the lancaster saw combat service, or as akak put it "Action" before the b17 did.

[Guppy35]

RAF bad early B17Cs that proved to be a failure in combat due to any number of reasons.  Only a squadron, but that was July 41 when they first dropped a bomb in anger