Rookie Pilot Seeking Help

[Soulyss]

People keep saying that the p38 is a good bnz but I don't see how, it has no boom since it compresses so fast. Anyone willing to set up a time to help me out? Oh and here's another film, obviously my gunnery sucks, but I wanna know how I could've survived at the end.

Clicky

I'll try and come back with a few more thoughts in the morning I just gave it a once through before bed here.  For a new player there's actually some good things going on, the P-51 bounced you and you got the fight slow (which is the right idea against a 51 in that situation) by forcing a scissors and gained his 6.  The primary problem was that when you gained his six you spend about 30 seconds there where you didn't look around at all and were just focused on the 51.  I know the kill is tempting, and you did get him but in the process you sort of sealed your fate as well. 

Being low and chasing someone is prime target for someone else coming into the fight because they are A) going to try and clear their teammate and B) hope that you'll be too busy to defend yourself.   A couple bad guys keyed on the low 38 and you were eventually overwhelmed.  This was just a lesson in situation awareness, or SA.  Like most things here it's an acquired skill, in the big fights like that you need to not only keep track of the bad guys but the friendlies as well.  In this case open up the film and advance it to 6:38 where the 51 makes his first attack, pause it and go to the "fixed" view and pan around, look at the number of friendlies, their ranges and do the same for the cons/bad guys.  Now advance it to the 7:46 mark, pause go to fixed view and do the same, a lot has changed, the Ki-84 makes you burn some E and then the F4U and Spit come in.

Like I mentioned before, there's a lot to learn and it isn't going to happen over night. Despite getting shot down there was good things in that clip as well, keep those in mind while you look at what lesson you can take away from this.  Slowly but surely you start to put the pieces together and things start coming together, hang in there.

[PuppetZ]

First off, it seems certain planes or players can pull 7-8gs and not black out because there are times when people will get on my 6 during a boom and I will break and black out and they will still cut inside my turn and hit me.

In my understanding, if you pull lead it cause range to close if your both going same speed(read about this on the trainer site : http://trainers.hitechcreations.com/pursuit/pursuit.htm ). If he's slower, it negate a bit of the speed difference. If the badguy was close in but slower, even if you were speeding away, he still can pull inside you for a lead shot before you get out of range all the while pulling less G than you are. Happened to me countless times.

The primary problem was that when you gained his six you spend about 30 seconds there where you didn't look around at all and were just focused on the 51.  I know the kill is tempting, and you did get him but in the process you sort of sealed your fate as well.

When I get into a big furball I'll give up a kill to defend myself. I don't mind getting shot down but I do what I can to prevent it nonetheless. If Someone is on to me inside of 1.5k he's the one I focus on.

[shiv]

First off, it seems certain planes or players can pull 7-8gs and not black out because there are times when people will get on my 6 during a boom and I will break and black out and they will still cut inside my turn and hit me.

Most likely the con has chopped his throttle and is flying lead pursuit  - he isn't flying the same speed and path as you and isn't pulling the same Gs.

[Hoff]

I wish films showed g's or blackouts because yesterday a p51 boomed me (this is what made me comment about getting boomed and still had him turn inside me) and was dead 6 at about 500 feet off the ground. I immediately roll right and pull the stick and go into a 7g flat turn for about 2-3 seconds. He managed to go from dead 6 with more speed that me and get a gun solution on my maneuver. I have no clue how in the world this happened.

[FLS]

Do you have the film?

[Hoff]

Oops, I thought I linked it in the last post, here it is. I watched it quite a few times from different views with trails on and such and I still don't see how he pulled inside me like that.



5:15 ish is where it starts.

Clicky


On a side note, I'm still looking to set up a time for someone to help me out if anyone is willing, I just have to schedule it around my classes. Otherwise I can just keep posting films if that is the preferred method.

[PFactorDave]

Oops, I thought I linked it in the last post, here it is. I watched it quite a few times from different views with trails on and such and I still don't see how he pulled inside me like that.



5:15 ish is where it starts.

Clicky


On a side note, I'm still looking to set up a time for someone to help me out if anyone is willing, I just have to schedule it around my classes. Otherwise I can just keep posting films if that is the preferred method.

I watched the film.  Here's what I think probably happened.

As you pulled hard to try and stay out of his guns, and tunneled down to black out, he was also pulling hard and since he had a good line on you he probably gave a sudden harder pull while he was shooting.  Sure his vision probably went black, but he knew where you were going and going to be.  He also knew that he only needed a hair more lead to get you into the bullet stream.  Sure he was shooting blind for a brief instant.  I have pulled like that to get a snap shot many times.  It doesn't always work, but it pays off frequently.

[FLS]

Hoff when can you be in the TA?

[Soulyss]

I wish films showed g's or blackouts because yesterday a p51 boomed me (this is what made me comment about getting boomed and still had him turn inside me) and was dead 6 at about 500 feet off the ground. I immediately roll right and pull the stick and go into a 7g flat turn for about 2-3 seconds. He managed to go from dead 6 with more speed that me and get a gun solution on my maneuver. I have no clue how in the world this happened.

I watched the film.  Here's what I think probably happened.

As you pulled hard to try and stay out of his guns, and tunneled down to black out, he was also pulling hard and since he had a good line on you he probably gave a sudden harder pull while he was shooting.  Sure his vision probably went black, but he knew where you were going and going to be.  He also knew that he only needed a hair more lead to get you into the bullet stream.  Sure he was shooting blind for a brief instant.  I have pulled like that to get a snap shot many times.  It doesn't always work, but it pays off frequently.

This scenario is very possible, I just poked my head into the TA for a couple minutes and ran a P-51D w/ 50% up to about 360mph or so and you can pull a pretty steady 6G there and keep it in the "tunnel view",  he could have pulled into full black out for the shot if the target had a predictable flight path. Maneuvering at speed is also one of the things the P-51 is very good at, probably better than the 38 in that regard. 

If I get surprised and find someone that close to me at those speeds I try to create as much of a speed differential as I can as quickly as I can, this case it would have been to come back on the throttle rather aggressively and possibly skidding the 38 into the turn.

[Guppy35]

This scenario is very possible, I just poked my head into the TA for a couple minutes and ran a P-51D w/ 50% up to about 360mph or so and you can pull a pretty steady 6G there and keep it in the "tunnel view",  he could have pulled into full black out for the shot if the target had a predictable flight path. Maneuvering at speed is also one of the things the P-51 is very good at, probably better than the 38 in that regard. 

If I get surprised and find someone that close to me at those speeds I try to create as much of a speed differential as I can as quickly as I can, this case it would have been to come back on the throttle rather aggressively and possibly skidding the 38 into the turn.

Yep, 51s are usually moving really fast.  Throttling back and watching them blast on by while you duck inside their shot is always good fun.  Of course there are some good 51 sticks who use the throttle too but most of em are going light speed and can't cut the corner when they need to.

[FLS]

I wish films showed g's or blackouts because yesterday a p51 boomed me (this is what made me comment about getting boomed and still had him turn inside me) and was dead 6 at about 500 feet off the ground. I immediately roll right and pull the stick and go into a 7g flat turn for about 2-3 seconds. He managed to go from dead 6 with more speed that me and get a gun solution on my maneuver. I have no clue how in the world this happened.

I watched your Way Too Fast film and I have a couple of comments. The P-51 starts a little outside your turn so he needs less initial angle and doesn't sustain the hard turn as long as you do, he pulls hard for the shot but it's a quick pull.

You also have to consider net lag and the fact that he was shooting you at your position on his computer.  The bandits shooting at you have a better angle than they appear to because your position information on their computer is slightly behind where you are on your computer, also the bandit is further ahead on his computer than you see him on yours. Those 2 slight differences in position add up to let a bandit hit you even when it looks like he doesn't have a shot. In order to really evaluate that shot you'd have to see a film made by the P-51.

In real life if the bandit is pointing right at you in a turn he doesn't have a shot until he pulls lead. Online if the bandit points at you on your PC he's probably pulling lead already on his PC. The bandits you shoot at on your computer are just where they appear to be but the bandit threatening you always has a better shot than he appears to have. You learn to worry sooner.

This is the same reason why a bandit can collide with you but you don't collide with him and vice versa.

[Hoff]

I'll be back home from class around 9pm central today.

[FLS]

That's too late for me but another trainer may be available. How about the weekend?

[Hoff]

I'm free on the weekend.

[Guppy35]

Hoff, if you are on later tonite, after 9 central, give a yell and you can wing up with any of the 80th guys on.