refresh my memory why aircraft can see gv icons?

[JUGgler]

just think of me as an environmentalist seeking to preserve the total war ecosystem
you want to add depth to the gv fight let them hide without icons from circling vultures above.

+1000


It's easy enough to spot GVs without the BIG RED ICON winking you in the face, I say get rid of enemy GV icons   




JUGgler

[68ZooM]

Hmmmmm  why can they see an Airplane from 5k out? seems to me that looking up in the sky one would see it approaching or circling, the features been in the game for as long as i remember and all of a sudden it's an issue 

[moot]

Seeing an airplane against the sky is the same whether you're in a vehicle or in an airplane.  Seeing an airplane on the ground has its icon obscured because the icon's underneath it. 

Given that GVs are so easy to spot and ID, why give them the billboard treatment unlike what NOE planes get?  You can see that hard black dot that stands out from the rest of the terrain from a ways out already, and the only time it'd be unfair for GVs to not have an icon pointing em out would be when you're just wheels up or when you spawn - but then you would know to check from the tower for the GV's position because the base alarm is tripped.

[killb8]

The icons are kind of superfluous.  I can spot GVs from a distance long before the icon shows up, and can recognize what the model is, right around the time the icon shows up.

My thoughts exactly. I think its a good idea. I may feel different afterwards, but I would be okay with disabling all enemy icons like AVA but w/out national plane set restrictions.

[Krusty]

Hmmmmm  why can they see an Airplane from 5k out? seems to me that looking up in the sky one would see it approaching or circling, the features been in the game for as long as i remember and all of a sudden it's an issue 

Quite so... More of the GV whining we saw from Red Storm/Krupp Steel, no doubt.

Moot, it's not so easy to spot and ID GVs. They are all square little boxes of pixels with treads. Unless you get in under 500 yards and use max zoom actually making out a profile while flying is nearly impossible.

On top of that you only get icons showing up right as you're in lethal guns range. Further, most times I'm spotting GVs at a spawn point that are attacking my field, I have to circle several times. The icons stay relative to your screen so if you are tilted the icon can dig into the ground. It is also obscured by trees. That means not only do you have to get close, often you have to stay close to figure out how to read that icon.

It's FAR from the sitting duck wounded target you portray it as being.

Also: Keep in mind GV's zoom from the main gun is much stronger magnification than the zoom from a plane's cockpit, last I recall. On top of that, the zoom/view systems are all being redesigned by HTC and your entire point may be moot anyways.

[Krusty]

You know what? My 190A8 is a sitting duck to any other plane in the game. I want my icon removed as well. I don't want people to see me so they have a harder time killing me, regardless of whether I'm flying through a giant enemy horde or not.

It follows your precedent, so it must be valid, right?

[Citabria]

It's not a circle of life. It's not an eco system. Any one of those 3 elements can feed on any of the other three. It's not a hierarchy where the system breaks down if one of the "points on the circle" is lessened.

only bombs and large bore cannons can kill tanks. tanks can not kill fighters and pure fighters carrying only mg and small cannons can not kill tanks. by nature of their mission they are at opposite ends of the food chain.

the hybrids of this are indeed the flaks and jabos. but the hybrids are vulnerable to their natural predators. the pure tanks and fighters.

when I made Ozkansas my theories behind what I posted above were employed in the design of the map. Its objectives were to facilitate situations where all elements of the game would converge for fantastic explosions and layered fights involving all classes of ground vehicles and aircraft.

your saying I have no idea what I am talking about when I say a sustained combined arms virtual war follows the same tendencies of other natural cycles and phenomenon?

[68ZooM]

only bombs and large bore cannons can kill tanks. tanks can not kill fighters

i see tanks killing planes, either they point there main gun and shoot or use the MG that's on the main gun to shoot at you, heck i shot down two planes with a jeeps 50Cal, so to say tanks they cant kill them is just not accurate at all

[waystin2]

i see tanks killing planes, either they point there main gun and shoot or use the MG that's on the main gun to shoot at you, heck i shot down two planes with a jeeps 50Cal, so to say tanks they cant kill them is just not accurate at all

True dat bro...

[JUGgler]

You know what? My 190A8 is a sitting duck to any other plane in the game. I want my icon removed as well. I don't want people to see me so they have a harder time killing me, regardless of whether I'm flying through a giant enemy horde or not.

It follows your precedent, so it must be valid, right?

This is possibly the silliest and most dishonest comparison in regards to this issue I've seen yet!

Removing enemy gv icons would not take away from the game at all, although it coiuld quite poissibly enhance it for many.



JUGgler

[moot]

it's not so easy to spot and ID GVs. They are all square little boxes of pixels with treads.

That's right, that squareness sticks out like a crenelated square zit on a vegetable landscape.  Hard black/brown-peppered black dots on an otherwise homogeneous because perfectly repetitive landscape.  

Unless you get in under 500 yards and use max zoom actually making out a profile while flying is nearly impossible.

Hyperbole.  The only difficulty is that some pieces of brush sometimes have the hard black look of a vehicle.  But if you zoom in or fly up to it, it's not hard to ID it as a plant way before 3K distance.

Also: Keep in mind GV's zoom from the main gun is much stronger magnification than the zoom from a plane's cockpit, last I recall. On top of that, the zoom/view systems are all being redesigned by HTC and your entire point may be moot anyways.

What does that have to do with anything?  What argument in this thread hinges on tank turrets' zoom relative to planes'?

You know what? My 190A8 is a sitting duck to any other plane in the game. I want my icon removed as well. I don't want people to see me so they have a harder time killing me, regardless of whether I'm flying through a giant enemy horde or not.

It follows your precedent, so it must be valid, right?

Yeah, the 190A8 is a GV.

i see tanks killing planes, either they point there main gun and shoot or use the MG that's on the main gun to shoot at you, heck i shot down two planes with a jeeps 50Cal, so to say tanks they cant kill them is just not accurate at all

With two equally average skilled but trained players, that's not gonna happen.  Pintle guns have a big conic hole in coverage above them.

[Wiley]

That's right, that squareness sticks out like a crenelated square zit on a vegetable landscape.  Hard black/brown-peppered black dots on an otherwise homogeneous because perfectly repetitive landscape.  Hyperbole.  The only difficulty is that some pieces of brush sometimes have the hard black look of a vehicle.  But if you zoom in or fly up to it, it's not hard to ID it as a plant way before 3K distance.

I am perfectly willing to admit the possibility that I suck, and that my eyesight sucks.  Red/green color blind on top of it.  However, with that said I would ask you to consider the possibility that you might be above average, or possibly as first went across my mind, 'freakishly above average'?

With the landscape moving by below me, the ground clutter jams up my ability to see GVs more often than not.  Once I see them, I can track them ok-ish if I stay close, but to ID one from 3k out is for me personally, to say the least highly optimistic.

Wiley.

[Lusche]

That's right, that squareness sticks out like a crenelated square zit on a vegetable landscape.  Hard black/brown-peppered black dots on an otherwise homogeneous because perfectly repetitive landscape.  Hyperbole.  

I suspect it's depending a lot on graphics card & AH graphic settings how much that "square zit" really stands out. Under most circumstances, I have a very hard time spotting enemy GVs beyond icon range.

[grizz441]

To expand on Greebo's comment, I think the most effective and realistic way to tailor to all things considered would be for the icon range to change based upon different factors.  For example:

1. Tank Firing: Icon @ 2.5k for up to 5 seconds after last burst of ammo fired.
2. Tank Moving: Icon @ 1.5k for up to 5 seconds after last movement.
3. Tank Not Moving Nor Firing: Icon @ <500yds.

Exact ranges are up for debate but this would be the best system.

[moot]

I'll take some screenshots.