the farce has lasted long enough...

[lulu]

I can confirm,

By not so few planes and circumstances spit 16 can be
out-turned easily with not so much pilot skills.


 

[Hajo]

BnZ I will usually break when the spit goes up.  I keep the energy at a level that I can get some temporary room.

IE enough room to turn into the spitfire.  Also.....if the spit has a great deal more energy then the D11 it really

is easy enough to bleed the energy in the Jug faster then the spit can forcing an overshoot.  I toggle the wep

on and off hoping for a qhick snapshot because that's all I'll get.  If I miss at that point I'm down.

The point is that this is fun for me.  If I win I've accomplished something that should embarass the Spit driver.

BTW the D11 is fairly fast on the deck.  If I lose.....I get another D11 and rinse & repeat.

I'm not trying to embarass anyone with my remarks.  It's just how I feel and play the game.

[BnZs]

anytime get me an average pilot.

semp

Translation: Get me a clueless two-weeker who probably still has the stall limiter on.

[BnZs]

And the bottom line is folks still want to perk what is essentially a 1943 plane because it did things well and was pilot friendly. 

I don't care if it first rolled off the production line in 1843-performance, performance, performance.

Is it the clipped wing that is such a big deal? 

Yes. Unclipped Spits are moderately bad in the roll axis at high speeds. The XVI lacks even this weakness.

You have a game that is essentially a tactical airwar game that has it's air combat flown at the optimal altitude for an LFIX/XVI Spit.  There is a reason they put that engine in it, because the XVI was meant to be used down low.  If you are going to fight down low against an LF Spit, expect it's going to be good.

Last time I checked, every plane that is perked IS perked because it was "good" in some way, with the possible exception of the SpitXIV.

So are we going to make a list of planes to be perked cause we don't like fighting them?  Let's force everyone into birds that better suit our style of fighting?

No. We are going to make a list of planes whose combination of speed, maneuverability, e-building capacity, and lethality leave many, many rides in the arena with really no cards to play against it, while being very, very, easy to fly. If the SpitXVI were *less* than it is in even a single attribute-20mph slower or climbed like a P-47, or rolled like a Typhoon, or had an inneffective guns-I would not be in favor of a perk price.

[BnZs]

As a Pony driver you should be much more in fear of the 109K-4 than the Spit XVI.  I know as I fly both a lot.

I know that my Pony has virtually no chance against a *skilled* 109K4 driver.

But I also know it actually takes some time and thought to become dangerous in a K4...and that makes me feel better. Agent, Bunnies, Madda, et al-if they kill me in a K4, they earned it.

[BaldEagl]

I know that my Pony has virtually no chance against a *skilled* 109K4 driver.

But I also know it actually takes some time and thought to become dangerous in a K4...and that makes me feel better. Agent, Bunnies, Madda, et al-if they kill me in a K4, they earned it.

Ponies are my favorite targets while I'm in a K4.  They have absolutely no cards to play.  The K4 is faster, climbs better, turns better, accelerates better...  Roll rate might go to the Pony along with smoother control in a high speed dive but that's about it.

But this is a thread about the Spit XVI.  After flying the XVI as my primary ride from it's introduction to the game until a couple of months ago when I moved back to the IX my K/D in the XVI was always low compared to other planes (190A-8, 109K-4, etc.) that I also fly regularily.  The XVI lures you into a false sense of security.  It does everything so well that you feel you can take on the world and, sometimes you can.  I've been able to win in as many as 4:1 odds in one against decent pilots.That said all of the faster planes are faster and all of the better turning planes turn better.  The XVI is near the top of the class in every category but not THE BEST at anything.  You have to know what your strengths are to beat one and you typically won't have many to exploit.  It's that middle rung of "jack of all trades" planes that will have the most difficult time with a XVI.  The combination of a fast plane and a good turning plane is the most dangerous to face in a XVI because they can take away your primary advantages.

I think perking the XVI would be detrimental to the game.  As others have pointed out and from personal experience Spits will stick around to fight.  They are also good rides for new players and overall do not dominate the arena.  No need for a perk.

[guncrasher]

Translation: Get me a clueless two-weeker who probably still has the stall limiter on.

translation: i cant fight them so perk them.

semp

[Guppy35]

I don't care if it first rolled off the production line in 1843-performance, performance, performance.

Yes. Unclipped Spits are moderately bad in the roll axis at high speeds. The XVI lacks even this weakness.

Last time I checked, every plane that is perked IS perked because it was "good" in some way, with the possible exception of the SpitXIV.

No. We are going to make a list of planes whose combination of speed, maneuverability, e-building capacity, and lethality leave many, many rides in the arena with really no cards to play against it, while being very, very, easy to fly. If the SpitXVI were *less* than it is in even a single attribute-20mph slower or climbed like a P-47, or rolled like a Typhoon, or had an inneffective guns-I would not be in favor of a perk price.

As a 38G driver I know the 51 guys hold all the cards unless they make a mistake.  So be it.  I could argue that the P51 should be perked for your same reasons.  My options then are to fly a better bird, like a 51 or just shoot 51s that make mistakes.

But I live with the choice not to fly birds more uber.  Shouldn't penalize the guys who do, because it's detrimental to my cartoon pilot life

[guncrasher]

As a 38G driver I know the 51 guys hold all the cards unless they make a mistake.  So be it.  I could argue that the P51 should be perked for your same reasons.  My options then are to fly a better bird, like a 51 or just shoot 51s that make mistakes.

But I live with the choice not to fly birds more uber.  Shouldn't penalize the guys who do, because it's detrimental to my cartoon pilot life

well put guppy.

semp

[bcadoo]

Ah yeah but you know I'm never going to agree to that in Spit14's case 

14's weakness is going left against most other planes.  If I'm in a 16 v. a 14 I'm taking the fight to the left.  The slower we get the more advantage I have.

[lyric1]

No.

[B3YT]

ok spit XVI failings are

1) larger turn radius than spit IX , VIII , V
2) snap rolls at low speed
3) poor slow speed handling when compared to other full span spits
4) poor high speed turning  when compared to other aircraft (p51 , F4u )
5) small gun package
6) poor viability over the nose
7)  higher stall speed compared to other spits
8) small fuel load


Notice that when compared to other spits it loses some of it's advantages .  This doesn't happing with any other perk plane. Of note the spit XIV IS not another spit but is a different type of  fighter altogether (it's a different type of fighter) .

The only other spit that should ever be perked is the XII if it was introduced .     

[JUGgler]

All spits are pink on the inside   



JUGgler

[Guppy35]

ok spit XVI failings are

1) larger turn radius than spit IX , VIII , V
2) snap rolls at low speed
3) poor slow speed handling when compared to other full span spits
4) poor high speed turning  when compared to other aircraft (p51 , F4u )
5) small gun package
6) poor viability over the nose
7)  higher stall speed compared to other spits
8) small fuel load


Notice that when compared to other spits it loses some of it's advantages .  This doesn't happing with any other perk plane. Of note the spit XIV IS not another spit but is a different type of  fighter altogether (it's a different type of fighter) .

The only other spit that should ever be perked is the XII if it was introduced .     

The view over the nose is the same as the VIII and IX.  Gun package is considered better then the 4 303 and 2 20mm.  Fuel load is the same as the I, V, IX

No the XII should not be perked if we ever get it

[Greebo]

No need to perk the Spit 16.

I agree with Guppy, I like to see them because they do tend to stick around and fight. See a couple of spits... "ah ha, a fight". See a couple of 51's... "ok whos running where"  

Perking them would only cause them to fly less aggressive.

I completely agree with this statement. Most MA players won't engage properly without an advantage of some sort. If its not a Spixteen its a numbers advantage and I'd rather fight a single Spixteen than 2 or more enemies any day. Besides I have no real problem fighting them in my F6F anyway. I have more problems with the Spit 5, 8 or 9 than the 16.