Why True Peace will never be achieved

[redman555]

War will always be there, it always has been. When europe came over here to take land from the indians, that was war.  When my ancestors owned almost half of europe (Im 100% italian and family was there during roman empire), that was war. No matter how you look at it, you cant stop war.

-BigBOBCH

[BnZs]

"as long as there is man.. there shall be wars" - Albert Einstien.

It is a simple fact. Human beings are neither ignorant, nor bigoted (unless they go out of their way to be so). We are biologically programmed to dislike that which is different, and exterminate that which is seemingly inferior.

Really? I kind of like Mexican cuisine and Asian girls myself.

The majority will always step on the minority. Not to turn this into a political, racial or something of the like thread, but to use an example.

I haven't stepped on a Mormon or a flat-earther in years.

[Yossarian]

Really? I kind of like Mexican cuisine and Asian girls myself.

I haven't stepped on a Mormon or a flat-earther in years.

+1 on this, I'd go as far as saying that we're programmed to be wary of what is different, but definitely not to dislike it.  And as for exterminating 'inferior' things...well how come so many people keep pets?  They're clearly inferior species, yet we care for them like family.

[mechanic]

 When my ancestors owned almost half of europe (Im 100% italian and family was there during roman empire), that was war.

Don't mean to burst your bubble but there is a good chance your ancestors are more French or Austrian than Roman 
 

[Spikes]

Yes it is possible. Anything is possible. Will it happen? No.

[Yossarian]

Yes it is possible. Anything is possible. Will it happen? No.

You can't say that it won't happen for certain.  You can say it's unlikely from what we know now, but honestly we have no idea what will happen next year, let alone what will happen in 100 years from now.

[BnZs]

Let us not conflate the idea of peace with the idea that everyone has to like each other. It is beside the point. Peoples who genuinely dislike each other are capable of sitting at home peacefully in their own neighborhoods or even shopping at the same mall without pitched battles breaking out. (The less you try to FORCE them to like each other, the greater the likelihood of peace breaking out uncontrollably. But I digress...)

In fact, in many wars is it not the case that the combatants were hardly aware of each others' existence before their governments commanded them to go forth and die for whatever purpose it is this week?

Patriotism, duty, obedience to authority, and a willingness to pay your fair share of the tax burden-these are your seeds of war.

[F22RaptorDude]

[quote author=gyrene81 link=topic=314074.msg4071961#msg4071961 date=13068473
amazing, you seem so sure about that...i guarantee there are situations where you could and would...maybe not now, but within your lifetime. i thought the same thing a very long time ago.
[/quote]It would be different if someone tried to hurt me or my family or steal my personal stuff. But as of now the idea of killing anyone is none, where it should be.

[YGSM]

Something we talked about in camp today. I figure that its a human condition to have power over others or some means of power. The reason Peace can never be achieved without force is because as long as there are two people on the planet, someone is going to want to be better than the other and will use force to assure it. There's no simple "well if people really tried" Its bull. As long as humans are on the planet there will never be True peace without force. Also I know how outrageous 2 people being the last on the planet is, look at the point, not the probability.

  Not to have all brains here(cause I obviously don't) Do anyone of you think Peace is possible without force? If so explain. If not well that's alright too.

IMHO......peace is not attainable unless a force (country) has the material (techonogy) to reach out and strike with deadly force in a manner that efficiently renders the target will to fight in a smoking hole.  The country must have the willingness to strike a unilateral blow without consulting a group of nations or seek a diplomatic solution.  True peace is at the tip of a sword and always will be.  The other guy needs to be afraid of the result of stepping out of line.  Yes this is cruel way to look at it.  There has been several instances of regional wars or uprisings that could have been stopped or slowed with decisive blows to stop a slaughter.

[Motherland]

Really? I kind of like Mexican cuisine and Asian girls myself.

That's some exotic stuff right there. You're really stepping out of the normal cultural bounds of society.

[BnZs]

That's some exotic stuff right there. You're really stepping out of the normal cultural bounds of society.

Trying to keep it clean on the forums dear boy. 

They are different. It was alleged that we humans instinctively hate anyone and anything different enough to go to the trouble of arming ourselves and killing them. I say it ain't so, at least not in my case, or the case of many people I know.

I would never convert to Islam, or snake-handling, or pony fetish, or live like a New Guinea tribesman. I could probably name some things some people do that I find positively revolting, like watching reality TV. But somehow my desire to do anything to those people remains somewhat less than zero. The idea that it is written into human DNA to go to war (in the sense of two nation states having at it) doesn't pass the electric Kool-Aid acid test with me.

[Spikes]

You can't say that it won't happen for certain.  You can say it's unlikely from what we know now, but honestly we have no idea what will happen next year, let alone what will happen in 100 years from now.

There will always be cultural differences. there will always be unrest between these cultures on these differences. There will always be weapons. There will always be people to man these weapons until the world ends. Weapons will always be used against other human beings.

[Ardy123]

Define 'Peace'
I would have to strongly disagree here, the us versus them mentality among people is overwhelming, total homogeneity to a significant degree is the only way to get people off of each others' throats.

Total bs, we are humans and are intelligent enough to take responsibility for our actions, if we want peace we can make it happen. We are fully capable of putting our differences aside, if we want too...  But we are too busy trying to make ourselves 'feel' better (by categorizing followed by dehumanizing) and too ignorant to recognize it.

[Reaper90]

Victor Davis Hanson - a good read

Military history teaches us, contrary to popular belief these days, that wars aren’t necessarily the most costly of human calamities. The first Gulf War took few lives in getting Saddam out of Kuwait; doing nothing in Rwanda allowed savage gangs and militias to murder hundreds of thousands with impunity. Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, and Stalin killed far more off the battlefield than on it. The 1918 Spanish flu epidemic brought down more people than World War I did. And more Americans—over 3.2 million—lost their lives driving over the last 90 years than died in combat in this nation’s 231-year history. Perhaps what bothers us about wars, though, isn’t just their horrific lethality but also that people choose to wage them—which makes them seem avoidable, unlike a flu virus or a car wreck, and their tolls unduly grievous. Yet military history also reminds us that war sometimes has an eerie utility: as British strategist Basil H. Liddell Hart put it, “War is always a matter of doing evil in the hope that good may come of it.” Wars—or threats of wars—put an end to chattel slavery, Nazism, fascism, Japanese militarism, and Soviet Communism.

Military history is as often the story of appeasement as of warmongering. The destructive military careers of Alexander the Great, Caesar, Napoleon, and Hitler would all have ended early had any of their numerous enemies united when the odds favored them. Western air power stopped Slobodan Milošević’s reign of terror at little cost to NATO forces—but only after a near-decade of inaction and dialogue had made possible the slaughter of tens of thousands. Affluent Western societies have often proved reluctant to use force to prevent greater future violence. “War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things,” observed the British philosopher John Stuart Mill. “The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse.”

[Plawranc]

So do I as point of fact.

But at the same time, would you want these things as the norm, living with you, treating you like aliens? Because that is what is taking place in the USA and it is obviously causing major problems in terms of cultural perception and at the current rate, could indeed be reversed

I am not saying ALL of us are like this. Some of us have some collage of an understanding. But the majority do not.

To quote one of the most intelligent movie characters in history

"The individual is smart, PEOPLE are stupid, clumsy and panicky" - Agent K - Men In Black.