Author Topic: Casey Anthony Trial  (Read 4710 times)

Offline jimson

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #60 on: July 06, 2011, 12:59:54 AM »
The evidence just wasn't there.

No definitive cause of death, no time of death, no murder scene, kind of flimsy motive "She wanted to party more?"

All they had was her behavior and some web searches for chloroform that they couldn't definitively pin on her.

"Who else could it have been?" isn't proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

It sucks, but the jury had no choice but to acquit.

There was more evidence in the OJ trial, including a past history of violence, and also some evidence of jury nullification.

Offline oakranger

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #61 on: July 06, 2011, 01:18:58 AM »
The evidence just wasn't there.

No definitive cause of death, no time of death, no murder scene,


This is the key point of the case. 


All they had was her behavior and some web searches for chloroform that they couldn't definitively pin on her.


Having search recoreds of "neck breaking" or "chloroform" dose make her more giulty....but once again "No definitive cause of death, no time of death, no murder scene". 

Her day is coming.  She will most likly be set free by July 7th but her life will be hell from this point on out. 
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Offline Masherbrum

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #62 on: July 06, 2011, 06:51:51 AM »
Their presentation was a bit sloppy and all over the place,

You've echoed these sentiments a couple of times, from the OP until this current post.    If the "defense was sloppy", the outcome would have been different.    The reason she was found not guilty are simple, the prosecutor didn't gather enough evidence.   Circumstantial Evidence gets you no where in a "capital murder" trial.    It's the simple "Burden of Proof Continuum".   

If ANYONE "was sloppy", my hat is off to the Prosecution for it.   Mind you, she is probably looking at a Life in Prison charge in the future.   So don't think she is "off the hook".    She simply cannot be charged with 1st degree murder again.   
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Offline Penguin

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #63 on: July 06, 2011, 08:25:18 AM »
I don't agree with the sentiments of "our justice system sucks" or "she's guilty in my book".  If we put her away, it would be an indellible stain on the reputation of our courts.  Furthermore, it would set a precedent that all it takes to convict someone is public opinion and circumstantial evidence.  It would usher in an age of witch trials and political prisoners on a scale unimaginable.

Also, if there was no evidence that she killed her daughter, then why do almost all of you cling to the belief that she did it?  What if you just grabbed some poor guy off the street and accused him of the murder?  Our justice system was founded upon the principles of assumption of innocence and the blindness of justice.  To replace those extremely noble ideas with 'trial by mob' is insane.

To conclude, I'm certain that if you were in her position (and knew that you did not do it), you wouldn't feel any remorse in being exonerated by lack of evidence.  That is the very core of our justice system.  If you cannot prove that someone committed a crime, they walk.  It would be impossible to prevent unjust imprisonment if it were otherwise; it is logically impossible to prove a negative.

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #64 on: July 06, 2011, 09:08:11 AM »
This reminds me of the law abiding citizen.  We can say she did it until our faces turn blue.  Gotta prove it in court.  I wish whoever did this would pay.   

So... do you think she is innocent? That may explain why she did not report her daughter missing for 31 days. Oh and her partying all the time afterward.
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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #65 on: July 06, 2011, 09:10:31 AM »
I don't agree with the sentiments of "our justice system sucks" or "she's guilty in my book".  If we put her away, it would be an indellible stain on the reputation of our courts.  Furthermore, it would set a precedent that all it takes to convict someone is public opinion and circumstantial evidence.  It would usher in an age of witch trials and political prisoners on a scale unimaginable.

Also, if there was no evidence that she killed her daughter, then why do almost all of you cling to the belief that she did it?  What if you just grabbed some poor guy off the street and accused him of the murder?  Our justice system was founded upon the principles of assumption of innocence and the blindness of justice.  To replace those extremely noble ideas with 'trial by mob' is insane.

To conclude, I'm certain that if you were in her position (and knew that you did not do it), you wouldn't feel any remorse in being exonerated by lack of evidence.  That is the very core of our justice system.  If you cannot prove that someone committed a crime, they walk.  It would be impossible to prevent unjust imprisonment if it were otherwise; it is logically impossible to prove a negative.

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Stain on the courts... hmmm did you know that you can enter into a contract with someone and a judge can completely change the wording and your still held to what the judge changes it to.....


As long as you remember that laws are made by lawyers to keep them in money you'll be half way safe.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 09:12:09 AM by Shuffler »
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Offline 2bighorn

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #66 on: July 06, 2011, 09:25:30 AM »
it is logically impossible to prove a negative.

Wrong. One of the principles of logic is law of contradiction ie provable negative.

Offline icepac

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #67 on: July 06, 2011, 09:57:15 AM »
The wrongful death, child neglect... or criminally negligent manslaughter charges she could have been tried on were probably offered in a plea bargain at some point and the defense declined.

Offline ACE

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #68 on: July 06, 2011, 10:08:53 AM »
Shuffler, I didn't say she was innocent.  But you have to look a it from both sides.  If she did do it she's very lucky and got away with murder.  "Its not what you know its what you can prove in court"
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Offline TonyJoey

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #69 on: July 06, 2011, 10:16:59 AM »
You've echoed these sentiments a couple of times, from the OP until this current post.    If the "defense was sloppy", the outcome would have been different.    The reason she was found not guilty are simple, the prosecutor didn't gather enough evidence.   Circumstantial Evidence gets you no where in a "capital murder" trial.    It's the simple "Burden of Proof Continuum".    

If ANYONE "was sloppy", my hat is off to the Prosecution for it.   Mind you, she is probably looking at a Life in Prison charge in the future.   So don't think she is "off the hook".    She simply cannot be charged with 1st degree murder again.  

I watched the trial from start to finish. Jose Baez was sloppy, it's as simple as that. He missed deadlines, had witnesses testify about things not in their reports or in thier depositions (At one point he was threatened with contempt), didn't have very effective cross with many State witnesses, and evidently hadn't prepared his own witnesses well enough as many of them seemed to be turned for the State by the end of their testimony. The defense won on closing where they created a lot of reasonable doubt in almost all aspects of the case, not because the rest of the trial was stellar. You said it yourself; the reason she won was lack of evidence.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 10:36:55 AM by TonyJoey »

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #70 on: July 06, 2011, 10:18:24 AM »
Shuffler, I didn't say she was innocent.  But you have to look a it from both sides.  If she did do it she's very lucky and got away with murder.  "Its not what you know its what you can prove in court"

Understood.

Maybe some think her car did it on it's own.

I'm extremely irritated that trash like that gets to walk.
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Offline Penguin

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #71 on: July 06, 2011, 10:42:07 AM »
Wrong. One of the principles of logic is law of contradiction ie provable negative.

That is only if one can pin everything down.  Let me give you an example:

Bob left for a party at 19:00, and Alice went shopping at 20:00.  Alice was not seen again until her body was found floating in a river at 12:00.  Bob was not seen again until the next day at 8:00 when he showed up to work and worked until 16:00.

Unless Bob has an alibi for every minute of the thirteen hours between 19:00 at 8:00, one cannot prove that Bob did not kill Alice.  However, if one can find out exactly what he did, then one can use the law of contradiction.  Unfortunately, it can become impossible to do this on the timescale present in this case.

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Offline 2bighorn

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #72 on: July 06, 2011, 11:07:00 AM »
Are you dyslexic or what?

"it is logically impossible to prove a negative." is a negative in itself. If you prove it true, it wouldn't be true.

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #73 on: July 06, 2011, 11:10:07 AM »
Are you dyslexic or what?

"it is logically impossible to prove a negative." is a negative in itself. If you prove it true, it wouldn't be true.

This is true... umm negative... uh negatively true.... umm   ohhh  snap forget it. :p
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Offline Tac

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Re: Casey Anthony Trial
« Reply #74 on: July 06, 2011, 11:19:22 AM »
So... do you think she is innocent? That may explain why she did not report her daughter missing for 31 days. Oh and her partying all the time afterward.

I don't think she is innocent.. but I do not know either if she did it all on her own or if it was the result of some other situation.

As I said before, the only item that links the murder to the Anthony family is the duct tape. It is a brand found and sold only in Ohio where the family moved from so that means that the murderer is one of the Anthony's or someone who was very familiar with their home (since most people keep duct tape in their garage).

Personally, I don't believe that Casey killed the kid on purpose despite her behavior and what the prosecution said in closing arguments is very true: nobody would cover up an accidental death by making it look like murder.

So that opens two scenarios in my opinion:

1- It is known Casey was into drug parties and lots of alcohol. Chloroform is a recreational drug that does the same effects as alcohol without the hangover and it is also used to make harder drugs... so, Casey and some other person were doing this at home and somehow the kid died (I doubt it was intentional) and knowing they would be charged with murder they disposed of the body the way they did and why all the lies. The flaw in this is the tape itself: I doubt Casey or this 2nd person would go to the garage and find the duct tape to put on the kid's body (unless that tape had been inside the home and easily accessible...but then again who keeps a 4 +year old duct tape in their kitchen?).

2- Casey's father is involved. Probably same scenario as #1 except he found the kid dead and Casey drugged up and the child abuse charges are true. Thats a powerful motivation to turn an accidental death into a murder scene. This is a possible scenario because the man has decades of murder investigation experience and it is -very- unusual for a body to be kept in the trunk of a car for 10 or so days and then dumped. This is all unusual and does not make sense unless you consider that if the kid died from drug overdose and if the kid had been abused by the father then the evidence is all in the flesh and then it would make a ton of sense to purposely hide the body until the flesh is gone.

What's interesting is that all forensic textbooks describe that it takes about 10 days for a body to fully decompose in FL like weather. Also the car was kept near a garbage dumpster to hide the smell... and a corpse will start stinking after just 3 days in FL so I doubt Casey was involved in dumping the body because if she had it would not have been in the car after the 3rd day nor would the car had been hidden near a dumpster (I would think only someone who has seen bodies found near garbage dumpsters would know off the top of his head that the smell is muffled there).

In this scenario it would be Casey's best interest to avoid murder conviction and probably death penalty (drugs+dead kid=easy murder conviction) by lying (which she did best apparently) and misleading while her father would avoid conviction of abuse by disposing of the body after the incriminating flesh was gone.

A lot of things point as Casey's dad imo: The duct tape (it was his house and I would say only a man in his house would beeline for the duct tape in the garage), the knowledge of the timing needed for decomposition, knowledge of how to hide the smell, knowledge of the criminal/forensic investigation procedures and what the legal system can and cannot prove with given evidence. The man's only mistakes in this scenario was to use his own duct tape... I doubt it crossed his mind that his duct tape was of a brand found only in Ohio... and not realizing his daughter would snap under the stress and party her brain out (denial of reality).... or that her pathological lying would bring so much media attention to the case.

In any case, I doubt the case is dropped. Casey could not be found guilty of murder but you can bet that the investigators will keep at it until there is justice for this child.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 11:23:02 AM by Tac »