Crash this weekend at my airport.

[Slash27]

On the plane on plane incident.

The red plane had started his take off roll.

From the run up spot on runway 35 it was impossible to see planes on short final due to trees. I used to spend extra time before taking runway to make sure that the blind spot was clear. You could see downwind base and long final with out a problem.

Obviously there also must have been some type of communication issue that the red plane did not hear the landing plane make his final call.

After the incident they removed a lot of trees to clear the blind spot.

HiTech

That place has had a bad run here lately.

[minke]

I thought Hitech had just bought his own airport and we were all invited to stay over..........
 

[hitech]

52F is one of the busiest small airports around. I think is has around 600 aircraft based there.

About 2 months ago, there was an engine outage on take off causing a fatality.

And 1 month ago, one plane based out of 52F crashed with all killed in west Texas. (my guess was weather, never heard final report)



HiTech
 

[Oldman731]

And 1 month ago, one plane based out of 52F crashed with all killed in west Texas. (my guess was weather, never heard final report)

Sounds like an engine problem, coupled with someone trying to make that impossible turn:

On September 22, 2012, about 1330 central daylight time, a Piper PA-28R-180 airplane, N4567J, impacted terrain and trees approximately one-quarter mile south of the Northwest Regional Airport (F52), Roanoke, Texas. The commercial rated pilot and certificated flight instructor (CFI) were fatally injured and the airplane sustained substantial damaged. The airplane was registered to and operated by a private individual. Day visual meteorological conditions prevailed and no flight plan was filed for the 14 Code of Federal Regulations Part 91 personal flight.

Initial reports from witnesses indicate that the airplane departed the south runway; however, the takeoff roll was noticeable longer than airplanes typically perform, with an unusual engine sound. The airplane was observed to start a left turn, before it descended towards a grove of trees and disappeared out of sight.

The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) and National Transportation Safety Board responded to the accident site. The airplane impacted several trees off the south end of runway 17. Both the left and right wings separated near their roots and remained suspended in the trees. The fuselage was located about 60 feet beyond the wings, nestled amongst the base of several trees.

After documentation of the crash site, the airplane was retrieved for further examination.

http://www.aopa.org/asf/ntsb/searchResults.cfm?identifier=52F&helicopter=BOTH

[CAP1]

Spotting other aircraft can be very difficult. Spotting aircraft in the pattern (while you are still on the ground) is easier than spotting other aircraft while in the air, but both can be challenging. It is very possible the red plane on the bottom didn't even bother looking before jumping out on the runway, though. I don't want to assume anything as I have not read any reports on the accident.

 on 2 occasions, i had people pull out on the runway in front of me while i was on short final. i was lucky though, as i was in position to power up, and go around.....

[fuzeman]

<snip>
A few years ago this happened at the other end of the runway.

http://www.airport-data.com/images/aircrafts/small/180/180913.jpg
No one was injured.

After which they finally cut down the trees that blocked your view when taking the runway for take off.

HiTech

What this picture doesn't show is off to the left are the two pilots arguing about the collision model.

 

[ebfd11]

What this picture doesn't show is off to the left are the two pilots arguing about the collision model.

 

Actually it is how spitfires are made>>>

[hitech]

Sounds like an engine problem, coupled with someone trying to make that impossible turn:

On September 22, 2012, about 1330 central daylight time, a Piper PA-28R-180 airplane, N4567J, impacted terrain and trees approximately one-quarter

Different incident then the one killed in west texas it was a Bonaza. The Piper you speak of was an engine out on take off.

This is the 2nd one I am speaking of.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/denton/Bad-weather-may-be-factor-in-plane-crash-173047891.html

HiTech

[Traveler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xU2HxqXUtk

What the film does not say is also there is a big pilot screw up. That runway has a 500 foot displaced thresh hold. The pilot was landing well short of the end of the runway.

The road is the reason for the displacement.

http://maps.google.com/maps?z=14&q=33.0498447+-97.2322375&ll=33.0498447+-97.2322375&iwloc=near


HiTech

Anyone notice that a low time student was landing down wind.   That may account for his batched approach and total lack of the displacement.

[colmbo]

Anyone notice that a low time student was landing down wind.   That may account for his batched approach and total lack of the displacement.

Not really enough wind to matter either way...and a tailwind will make you land long, not short.

[B4Buster]

Anyone notice that a low time student was landing down wind.   That may account for his batched approach and total lack of the displacement.

I'm more curious as to why he was making a no-flap landing.

[Slash27]

Different incident then the one killed in west texas it was a Bonaza. The Piper you speak of was an engine out on take off.

This is the 2nd one I am speaking of.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/denton/Bad-weather-may-be-factor-in-plane-crash-173047891.html

HiTech

Did you know about this one a few weeks ago?

[colmbo]

I'm more curious as to why he was making a no-flap landing.

Why not?  You get a flatter glide and your timing doesn't have to be as good in the flare as with full flaps.  There is plenty of runway there for a no flap landing.  When I learned to fly I was taught a normal pattern is 10 degrees of flap for landing, full flaps only for a "short field".

However, a no flap approach  means a higher deck angle vs using flaps.  With a good power off approach and full flaps the nose is low allowing a much better view of the approach end of the runway and your intended touchdown point  --  something which might have prevented this accident.

[B4Buster]

Why not?  You get a flatter glide and your timing doesn't have to be as good in the flare as with full flaps.  There is plenty of runway there for a no flap landing.  When I learned to fly I was taught a normal pattern is 10 degrees of flap for landing, full flaps only for a "short field".

However, a no flap approach  means a higher deck angle vs using flaps.  With a good power off approach and full flaps the nose is low allowing a much better view of the approach end of the runway and your intended touchdown point  --  something which might have prevented this accident.

I'm not sure why he would intentionally come in faster and chew up more runway gliding down it with no flaps. Those 172s will float in ground effect for a long time if flaps aren't used.

[Traveler]

  When I learned to fly I was taught a normal pattern is 10 degrees of flap for landing, full flaps only for a "short field".

You were taught wrong.  I say that with 30 years of giving flight instruction.