Arado Ar-234

[FLS]

And Erin Brown never said there were guns on an Arado.

Can't argue with that. 

Capt Eric Brown, Jeff Ethel and Alfred Price, all have books stating that some Arados had guns mounted.

No, the evidence has been tainted by two authors that retracted their evidence, but it was too late. Everyone writing about the Arado had already run off with the guns idea and its been epidemic ever since. It's urban legend now.

The authors you mentioned never offered and retracted evidence of guns, they retracted a statement they couldn't verify 50 years after the war.

[MiloMorai]

Can't argue with that. 

Capt Eric Brown, Jeff Ethel and Alfred Price, all have books stating that some Arados had guns mounted.

Yes, the 4 engined versions.

[Chalenge]

Can't argue with that. 

Capt Eric Brown, Jeff Ethel and Alfred Price, all have books stating that some Arados had guns mounted.

The authors you mentioned never offered and retracted evidence of guns, they retracted a statement they couldn't verify 50 years after the war.

Nope. You're wrong. Purely urban myth. The only way to establish the guns were ever used is to find photographic evidence, or field orders. All of the authors you listed referenced the same book as evidence, and those authors retracted their claim. The Arado simply never had rear guns.

[FLS]

Nope. You're wrong. Purely urban myth. The only way to establish the guns were ever used is to find photographic evidence, or field orders. All of the authors you listed referenced the same book as evidence, and those authors retracted their claim. The Arado simply never had rear guns.

You don't know what you're talking about.

[Chalenge]

I think you have that reversed. You are simply refusing to accept that this airplane is a fantasy in Aces High, and that it never was equipped with cannon in real life. All of the facts point to that as fact, but it's you that will not accept it. Sorry, but you're wrong.

[FLS]

You are making up "facts" to support your position. 

[MiloMorai]

I want the Me109K-4 to have MG151/20 20mm cowl guns and a Mk103 30mm engine cannon. Many books say it did.

[Chalenge]

You are making up "facts" to support your position. 

All you have is misprints and lies perpetuated over the years. Instead of posting a single sentence from a single book, post the orders for the aircraft or one single picture with the cannons in place for a single combat mission.

[Scca]

IMHO this is much ado about nothing... 


Getting all  about a infrequently used aircraft with an option possibly not available that is used in a miniscule amount of kills just seems to be a bit over the top... 

Put it in the wishlist, and 

[Denniss]

Again, where's the fact production Ar 234B used these guns?
The RLM aircraft manual released 12/44 neither contains a part 8A (gun/cannon armament) nor does it mention them as Rüstsatz (optional equipment) nor has it load plans with these guns.
The Arado manual from 6/44 does not mention them either, the Exerzierkarte from 10/44 mentions only bombs as armament
Optional equipment listed in both manuals is recon cam, bomb aiming device (Lotfe), autopilot and aux fuel installation

We all know the guns were planned for the Ar 234A/B but did not made it into production, it was again planned for the Ar 234C and may have been used there.

[lyric1]

 it was again planned for the Ar 234C and may have been used there.

[Scca]

I was clearing out my storage unit and I came across a book called "Hitler's Luftwaffe".  Half of the book is a history of sorts by campaign and year range.  The other half is pictures and detail of various WWII planes in the Luftwaffe.    It's a coffee table book with lots of cool pictures written in the 70's and was written by Tony Wood and Bill Gunston. 

I turned to the AR234 page and sure enough there is a cut away drawing of the 234 complete with rear facing MG151/20 cannons. 

I know it's not the beat all end all of this situation, but I find it kind of odd someone drew them in if they weren't actually there....

[Lusche]

I know it's not the beat all end all of this situation, but I find it kind of odd someone drew them in if they weren't actually there....

It's a very old book, and old books often carry outdated information that has been corrected by research since then.

I think I have the very same book, and it also states the MK 103 and two cowl MG 151/20 as armament for the Bf 109K-4. This is just another myth that had been repeated over many years, especially in encyclopedic compilations like this one, which do not contain much primary research but are to a large extend just carrying over their data from even older literature.

[MiloMorai]

Is this the drawing?

[BuckShot]

I have a book that says the Dora had a 30 mm hub gun..