TU-2S, the best Bomber in the game.

[BuckShot]

Getting a little better defensive performance going to side aircraft, I have a mini control pad that allows me to switch aircraft, and rolling to get the attackers into my sight. Im at the point now where Im damaging every single that attacks me, most of all 262s. But I just cant seem to put most of them down. Im not even starting to think about shooting until they are 600 away and often wait until 400. With my gunnery improving I think I'll be able to defend against a single or a double, but yeah, its no B26. Funny tho it has a far better K/D then the 26, "GV killing no doubt".

Since I level bomb in Historical correct ways I depend on speed and avoid the conga line into the targets, 2 pass and haul az$.

How do you switch bombers? I thought the only way to switch planes was to bail, and then end up in another.

[Lusche]

How do you switch bombers?

You can jump planes in gunner position only, ctrl-1,2,3

[artik]

I would say Tu-2S isn't the Best bomber... it is the most efficient as long as you are willing to return to the base and not having a fast ride home when 10 fighters rip you apart at 10K over an enemy town.

I'll explain.

When you fly a bomber one of the most important factors is how many targets you can destroy/drop bombs at important target for a given amount of time.

To fly B-17/B-24/Lancaster efficiently (with good chance to return home) you need to climb high enough, accelerate in a friendly environment, setup your course to relevant targets, i.e. get information about what is still needed to be destroyed - which hangars/town and hope that the data would be still relevant when you over a filed), pass over your target destroy what needed make sure you look around, escape safely and land to go for the next target.

For correct B-17/B-24/Lancaster bomber flying each turn around would take at least 30-40 min. Because, climb takes time, acceleration etc. In many cases the information wouldn't be up to date because: hangars were rebuild or already destroyed, the base captured so you need to turn to another field hoping that the bombs would actually be useful (i.e. there is an attack on the field)


Now when I look on Tu-2... in comparison to the all the bombers I mentioned above:

1. It climbs much faster
2. It cruises much faster
3. It has similar bomb load

It significantly shortens turn around time. In the time B-17 runs one sorties I'll complete two. Having higher speed is much better defense than having better weapons (Ar-234/Mosquito XVI). If you navigate correctly have enough altitude and speed the chances of being intercepted are much lower. And even if somebody  gets to intercept you, most likely he would be in your rear zone.

So it becomes very efficient plane for pilots who wants to live.


BTW my favorite bombers are (not in particular order):

Tu-2S, Ki-67, Boston, Mosquito XVI, Ar-234.

If you take a look on Boston vs Tu-2S performance charts you'll how similar they are in their performance, but Tu-2S has better bomb load and better defense armament.

They are all great in getting to the target without being intercepted, make a damage and escape (and to it without get bored)

[BuckShot]

You can jump planes in gunner position only, ctrl-1,2,3

Thanks Lusche! That's what I love about this game; still learning things about it after several years.

[firemike]

It is of course, hilarious to kill 190's hoing you with those deadly nose 20's

[save]

And hopefully not a Bf-410 with a 50mm HOing that B-29

[XxDaSTaRxx]

TAKE THIS TU-2 DWEEBS!

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,359920.0.html

Let's see your TU-2 do that!

 

[SmokinLoon]

The only thing 50kg bombs can destroy at strats are gun emplacements.  The Tu-2S' two 1000kg bomb and two 500kg/four 250kg loadout is functionally as good at strat smashing as anything the Ju88A-4 can take.

wanna bet?

If I can get to the strats in a fully loaded and fueled formation of Ju88's, not only can I bring the ordnance factory down to to 70%-ish, I can also destroy 10 city blocks.  I'd make three passes total, 2 on the ordnance factory and 1 on the city.

The Tu-2 can't do that.  While the weight may be there it is too concentrated. The larger splash area of the 2/1000kg bombs and 2/500kg bombs do not make up for the 4/500kg bombs and 20/50kg bombs.  With all that being said, the Tu-2 has a much higher probability of getting home, and equally important is getting the job done faster. 

There is a reason I like the Ar234, Mossi B Mk 16, and other such fast movers and it isn't for survivability: the job gets done faster.  I can get there, get the job done, and RTB faster than chuggin' along in a behemoth 4 engine bomber, B29 included. 

[Volron]

The only thing 50kg bombs can destroy at strats are gun emplacements.  The Tu-2S' two 1000kg bomb and two 500kg/four 250kg loadout is functionally as good at strat smashing as anything the Ju88A-4 can take.

Not true.  The 50kg's are more than capable of doing the job.  How you salvo them out is the problem.  The Tu-2s is a poor choice for strat runs vs the Ju-88.

[Karnak]

wanna bet?

If I can get to the strats in a fully loaded and fueled formation of Ju88's, not only can I bring the ordnance factory down to to 70%-ish, I can also destroy 10 city blocks.  I'd make three passes total, 2 on the ordnance factory and 1 on the city.

The Tu-2 can't do that.  While the weight may be there it is too concentrated. The larger splash area of the 2/1000kg bombs and 2/500kg bombs do not make up for the 4/500kg bombs and 20/50kg bombs.  With all that being said, the Tu-2 has a much higher probability of getting home, and equally important is getting the job done faster. 

There is a reason I like the Ar234, Mossi B Mk 16, and other such fast movers and it isn't for survivability: the job gets done faster.  I can get there, get the job done, and RTB faster than chuggin' along in a behemoth 4 engine bomber, B29 included. 

I wouldn't take the two 1000kg and two 500kg load on the Tu-2S to strats.  I'd take the two 1000kg bombs and the four 250kg bombs. That gives six city structures at least, more if you place the 1000kg bombs well.

[SmokinLoon]

I wouldn't take the two 1000kg and two 500kg load on the Tu-2S to strats.  I'd take the two 1000kg bombs and the four 250kg bombs. That gives six city structures at least, more if you place the 1000kg bombs well.

Not a problem.  Any way you compare the two bombers in terms of spread out damage (remember, you only need 312 lbs dmg for factory buildings and 832 lbs [?] for city blocks), the Ju88 wins.  It is much the same as comparing the Mossi B Mk 16's single cookie to a B26's 4/1000 bombs. You're going to get a larger damage area with the 4/1000 lb bombs than the 1/4000lb cookie.

Again, obviously there are many more traits to look at when comparing the two bombers that brings merit to what each have to offer.  With exception to the bomb load comparison while attacking the strats, the Tu-2 is superior to the Ju88 in most measurable attributes.  In terms of attacking a field for the purposes of taking out hangers, they are equal (4 hangers down in 2 passes, etc).  Bombing a town?  I'd give the edge to the Ju88 just like I would the strats.

[Widewing]

Not a problem.  Any way you compare the two bombers in terms of spread out damage (remember, you only need 312 lbs dmg for factory buildings and 832 lbs [?] for city blocks), the Ju88 wins.  It is much the same as comparing the Mossi B Mk 16's single cookie to a B26's 4/1000 bombs. You're going to get a larger damage area with the 4/1000 lb bombs than the 1/4000lb cookie.

Again, obviously there are many more traits to look at when comparing the two bombers that brings merit to what each have to offer.  With exception to the bomb load comparison while attacking the strats, the Tu-2 is superior to the Ju88 in most measurable attributes.  In terms of attacking a field for the purposes of taking out hangers, they are equal (4 hangers down in 2 passes, etc).  Bombing a town?  I'd give the edge to the Ju88 just like I would the strats.

If HTC models bombs based upon the percentage of explosives to weight ratio, the 4,000 pound bomb will have a much greater total weight of explosives than four 1,000 pound bombs combined. This is due to the 4,000 lb Cookie actually having 3,040 lb of explosives. Four 1,000 lb bombs will have just over 1,300 lbs of explosives combined. This is because the Cookie has a total weight to explosives ratio of 76%. In other words, 76% of the Cookie's weight in explosives. A typical 1,000 pound general purpose bomb has a total weight to explosives ratio of 33% (333 lb of explosive material, usually Amatol 60/40 or RDX/TNT 60/40).

So, if modeled correctly, the Cookie will do far greater damage than four 1,000 lb bombs, regardless of how distributed.

[Lusche]

So, if modeled correctly, the Cookie will do far greater damage than four 1,000 lb bombs, regardless of how distributed.

In AH, the 4k cookie does about 2350lb of max damage, but at a significantly increased blast radius. Which in turn makes it very effective against large are targets - towns and factories. Maximum damage value doesn't matter that much, as those objects only take 313lbs to be destroyed.

[SmokinLoon]

If HTC models bombs based upon the percentage of explosives to weight ratio, the 4,000 pound bomb will have a much greater total weight of explosives than four 1,000 pound bombs combined. This is due to the 4,000 lb Cookie actually having 3,040 lb of explosives. Four 1,000 lb bombs will have just over 1,300 lbs of explosives combined. This is because the Cookie has a total weight to explosives ratio of 76%. In other words, 76% of the Cookie's weight in explosives. A typical 1,000 pound general purpose bomb has a total weight to explosives ratio of 33% (333 lb of explosive material, usually Amatol 60/40 or RDX/TNT 60/40).

So, if modeled correctly, the Cookie will do far greater damage than four 1,000 lb bombs, regardless of how distributed.

And that is the kicker, isn't it.  HTC takes certain liberties in the name of game play and rightfully so.  The cookie and GP bombs are two different monsters, ultimately.  I'm sure I don't have to remind anyone that the amount of TNT/explosives does not actually relate to the amount of destruction it can cause.  Meaning, the cookie didn't really have anything to disperse in terms of shrapnel in itself, it fully relied upon the target it hit to be fragile enough to be its own shrapnel or not withstand the force of the explosion.  General purpose bombs provided their own means of destroying its target.  So, it isn't as black and white as your last statement says, it isn't about the weight of the explosives as much as it is the role of the ordnance and the target in which it is dropped on.  All one has to do is look at how the British used the 4000 lb cookie and how they used the GP bombs.

Thankfully, HTC has recognized the differences in the hard cased, GP, and SAP/AP ordnance.  I sometimes wonder if the bonus/penalty is enough for each category. I would like to think that the HC bombs would be even less effective vs hardened OBJ than they are, and AP bombs would be even more devastating than they are.  But, HTC has their damage scales for a reason.   

[SmokinLoon]

In AH, the 4k cookie does about 2350lb of max damage, but at a significantly increased blast radius. Which in turn makes it very effective against large are targets - towns and factories. Maximum damage value doesn't matter that much, as those objects only take 313lbs to be destroyed.

Have you tested bombing accuracy with the HC bombs, namely the British cookie?  I'm not so sure the cookie is as "accurate" as say a typical finned bomb.  Though I have not actually tested this I wonder if HTC has modeled a larger variable in the flight path of the 4000 lb cookie.  Just paying attention while I do drops vs factories I have not noticed any difference.  

Also, I'm curious how you came up with 2350 lb of damage for the 4000lb cookie.  I have max damage at 2343 lbs. Prior damage was 3125lbs, but with 75% damage of GP bombs it is now 2343 lbs, but with a 125% splash area of what a "normal" GP 4000 lb blast area would be.