51 Pilots and 190 Pilots

[DmonSlyr]

I also agree with FX1


LEARN SOME DEFENSE MOVES DAMNIT.

The fight is sooo boring if you run away all the time.

[bozon]

I cant stand them.. Timid flying taken to a new level. I am getting really bored seeing good pilots go to waste because of the desire to only pick or run.

You think they are bad? How about the brewster and zeke pilots? they keep turning all the time. How about they fly straight for a bit and pick up some speed that is higher than my stall speed so we can have a fight?

the 190s were never meant to turn. Kurt Tank designed them to take off from a rear field, attack the bomber stream, then land at a forward base directly ahead, get rotated on the far end of the runway 180 degrees by the ground crew, take off again to attack the bombers as they are flying back, and land at its field of origin.

[Kovel]

Would you prefer to see those P51 and 190 pilots in La7s and Yak3s , instead?...  I promise you won't

[FX1]

I have no issues with LA7 or Yaks. I always run across good pilots in either one. Long close in fights unlike the 51's need for a 5k separation after each pass. Just my observation of the current game play in both planes.

[GScholz]

Kurt Tank designed them to take off from a rear field, attack the bomber stream, then land at a forward base directly ahead, get rotated on the far end of the runway 180 degrees by the ground crew, take off again to attack the bombers as they are flying back, and land at its field of origin.

Tank did no such thing. The bomber stream didn't exist in 1937 when he started designing the 190.

[Crash Orange]

the 190s were never meant to turn. Kurt Tank designed them to take off from a rear field, attack the bomber stream, then land at a forward base directly ahead, get rotated on the far end of the runway 180 degrees by the ground crew, take off again to attack the bombers as they are flying back, and land at its field of origin.

What did they do when the wind was blowing the wrong way?

[Kovel]

I have no issues with LA7 or Yaks. I always run across good pilots in either one. Long close in fights unlike the 51's need for a 5k separation after each pass. Just my observation of the current game play in both planes.

Fly a 190 for a month and fight against planes you usually fly (La7, yak3, Spit16, F4U4)and be greedy. Tell us what happens.

[FX1]

I fly alone and most of the time in a defense role. Both of those planes are not what i would consider to be a good fit or fun to fly. Maybe a 190a5...

[shift8]

Im sorry but this is a silly complaint IMHO. Running, BnZ, picking etc. Whatever you want to call it, it a legitimate tactic. Being smart and only engaging when you have altitude or speed advantage is just plain good tactics. This is how actual ww2 pilots flew, especially when the kinematic characteristic of their plane called for this.

The biggest thing that irritates me about this is that whenever this is said it seems to be ignored that it is all relative. Exactly when is running acceptable? And Why on earth should I engage in a dogfight with a plane that has a much better rate or radius when I can choose to fly to my planes strengths? TBH: If you dont want people to run you may as well just remove every plane except the zero from the game, as nothing can out turn it and almost anything can run from it.

Can you imagine how silly it would be of me to complain from my P-51 or 190 that "all those brew pilots do is turn! How dare they use their performance against me!"

What you are basically asking for is that pilots of faster but less agile planes do one of two things:A-only fly planes that can turn or B-commit suicide by mixing it up on purpose when they are flying the wrong plane for it.

PS: just because someone picks and runs DOESN'T meant they dont know how to mix it up.

[shift8]

Part II lol....

What I would argue is that those of you have disdain for people fast planes MAY be missing some fundamentals when it comes to general air combat. In both AH and in real life, large furballs over 3x3 are more or less a crap shoot. Pilot skills rapidly becomes less and less of a factor the more planes you add into the mix. Those left standing at the end are more the result of luck then good BFM. If you dont believe me on this, just as the USAF, which still trains this today. Same thing happened in ww2.

Being high and fast can be controlled. Making smart choices about how you engage and when you engage CAN be controlled. A 15 plane mix up is just chaos. At that point even proper team work is almost completely gone. The only thing matters is just who accidentally ends up on whose six and manages to fire before some other chump in turn blasts him....and so on and so forth. For this reason, dogfights should be avoided by ALL AIRCRAFT. One you engage you are generally committed. If someone else shows up you are screwed if both enemy pilots know what they are doing. The dogfight is a last resort when you either have no other option or you have made a mistake that landed you there. In other words, if you are fur-balling on purpose: you are doing it wrong.


PS: if you furball for fun by all means do whatever makes you happy. This is a game after all, and even I admit dog fighting is fun. Im not arguing you cant play the game how you like.

[FX1]

You have made a solid point. Their are some good pilots that i would love to have a 3 min white knuckle fight with. My goal is to have a good fight with every player in the game. I just dont see that with certain 51 and 190 pilots unless i force the fight with major alt advantage.

[shift8]

Thanks for the compliment on my point

The dueling server is more suited to the sort of Co-E fights people seem to desire. In the MA, people should be flying to exploit every ounce of advantage they can wriggle from whatever air frame they can choose.

[BuckShot]

Hmmmm, run much?

I turn from runners and look for another fight. If they come back, I feighn an attack and then watch them run again.

[Randy1]

I watched a particular 190 player last night.  It was quite funny.  He set above the field at a safe altitude while his comrades took the risk to deack the field.  Once deacked he vulched.  Then, when their fighter cap started to collapse, he ran home to land his kills leaving his comrades to be chewed up.

One key to avoiding some of these kind of players is checking the status of town.  Vulchers like the one above are rarely interested in base capture, just in their score. If the town is up most likely it is a points gathering, vulch.

[shift8]

Hmmmm, run much?

I turn from runners and look for another fight. If they come back, I feighn an attack and then watch them run again.

So I guess in your view we should just eliminate all but the tightest turning planes? Or perhaps you think I should just kill myself by dog fighting your spit 16 with a 190?