My opinion on your test

[Devil 505]

Clearly the others did not choose to use / do not know how to use AH Film viewer then. Had that been me and seen this happening for an extended period - I'd be hunting your prettythang down in a heartbeat

How is exiting the game to use a secondary utility an acceptable solution? You clearly demonstrated why GV dar, longer range GV icons, and GV map icons are all needed.

[Wiley]

gv icon range was shortened to help gvs "hide". Now that we have all these trees why not get rid of the gv dar box and return the icon range back to what it was. Add a third darbar to indicate gvs in the sector.

I think the main problem with the longer GV icons is you can search, identify a target at range by icon, and bomb it easily in one pass.  That might be a bit too much of an advantage.

I've been thinking on GV dar since the small squares appeared.  People against it keep saying the flash was fine.  I realized I have no idea whatsoever how big that flash radius is on the map.  I wonder if an acceptable compromise would be to go back to the flash but have a marker that shows the area the vehicle is in.

As far as the dar tests, these are the changes I noticed in gameplay:

- Alt monkeying became rampant.  People could see the enemy coming and knew they could be seen, and they didn't have the confidence to go in lower anymore.  Way more people would grab to 15-20k before going into a fight.
- People would move away from bandits constantly when they'd see a bandit headed toward them.  Drag and bag became nearly impossible, same with bouncing people.  You could see what they were dragging you to.
- It killed singleton strat runs.
- GV dot dar for enemies just made it far, far too easy to find GVs.
- Generally, doing anything alone was much more difficult.  Not much happened unless it was in a group.
- Hunting singleton bombers became harvesting them.  It took away a ton of gameplay between bombers either not going on strat runs or going in at 35k+, and also took away the game of looking for them.

Just in general it seemed to destroy peoples' confidence to do anything except horde up because they seemed to feel too exposed.

Wiley.

[Lusche]

I think the main problem with the longer GV icons is you can search, identify a target at range by icon, and bomb it easily in one pass.  That might be a bit too much of an advantage.

I've been thinking on GV dar since the small squares appeared.  People against it keep saying the flash was fine.  I realized I have no idea whatsoever how big that flash radius is on the map.  I wonder if an acceptable compromise would be to go back to the flash but have a marker that shows the area the vehicle is in.

As far as the dar tests, these are the changes I noticed in gameplay:

- Alt monkeying became rampant.  People could see the enemy coming and knew they could be seen, and they didn't have the confidence to go in lower anymore.  Way more people would grab to 15-20k before going into a fight.
- People would move away from bandits constantly when they'd see a bandit headed toward them.  Drag and bag became nearly impossible, same with bouncing people.  You could see what they were dragging you to.
- It killed singleton strat runs.
- GV dot dar for enemies just made it far, far too easy to find GVs.
- Generally, doing anything alone was much more difficult.  Not much happened unless it was in a group.
- Hunting singleton bombers became harvesting them.  It took away a ton of gameplay between bombers either not going on strat runs or going in at 35k+, and also took away the game of looking for them.

Just in general it seemed to destroy peoples' confidence to do anything except horde up because they seemed to feel too exposed.

Wiley.

Interesting. That's similar to the old increased base radar range test results, just seemingly much more amplified.
The higher the general intel level, the more cautious players become.

[FESS67]

The higher the general intel level, the more cautious players become.

Perhaps it was just more obvious.  For many years there have been players who are unwilling to go beyond their radar ring unless in a horde.  They happily grab alt and wait for the fight to come to them.  Perhaps with the all seeing radar they did not change their behaviours but it simply was there for all to see.

[ccvi]

Interesting. That's similar to the old increased base radar range test results, just seemingly much more amplified.
The higher the general intel level, the more cautious players become.

Most fun flying was (long time ago) on a country highly outnumbered (before eny-balancer) while HQ was diwn.

[Wiley]

Perhaps it was just more obvious.  For many years there have been players who are unwilling to go beyond their radar ring unless in a horde.  They happily grab alt and wait for the fight to come to them.  Perhaps with the all seeing radar they did not change their behaviours but it simply was there for all to see.

Generally speaking, I notice other planes at alt and I generally check the area before I start working the crowd from the top down.  I saw way more fighters at 20k in a furball than I've ever seen at once before.  I also noticed them trying to turn up there and flopping likely because they weren't familiar with it before diving to ack.  The ones that generally are up there looking for an advantage don't bother with the turn and just head for the deck when they see something co-alt.

Wiley.

[Lusche]

Perhaps it was just more obvious.  For many years there have been players who are unwilling to go beyond their radar ring unless in a horde.  They happily grab alt and wait for the fight to come to them.  Perhaps with the all seeing radar they did not change their behaviours but it simply was there for all to see.

More players are doing it because the effects are much more pronounced.
I found myself in that very situation with the increased dar rings. Hunting goons and bombers when a horde came in was suddenly extremely diffcult for me as a lone wolf, unless I was in a 262.
Enemy dar cover meant I couldn't go out there at med/low alt and hope to be overlooked, everyone could vector in on me all the time.
Which meant I mostly stopped it.
I also experienced less strat raiders and those that still flew went in much higher, because they knew they would be on dar earlier and more often.

The more players know about you, the higher the risk is getting when flying alone. That will be adjusted for by the player. Players are less inclined to mix it up with an enemy at the edge of a hostile horde's visual range when they know they are still on dar all the time - which massively increases the chance of getting jumped while still dogfighting.

Basic human behaviour

[caldera]

I wish more options were tried.  Such as:

- All-seeing radar in the tower but standard dar in flight. 

- GV sector darbar, just like aircraft darbar.  Not icons on map or darbar in a specific spot.


All icons being identical is much more fair for bomber pilots.  And +1 on hardening radar towers or make a lot more of them.

[SlipKnt]

I wish more options were tried.  Such as:

- All-seeing radar in the tower but standard dar in flight. 

- GV sector darbar, just like aircraft darbar.  Not icons on map or darbar in a specific spot.


All icons being identical is much more fair for bomber pilots.  And +1 on hardening radar towers or make a lot more of them.

I do like the idea of going back to the dots for radar or remove the dots all together and stay with bardar only and go with the gv sector dar.

The from tower radar blips for aircraft could be a good idea also.  But I'd still prefer to keep gv restricted only to sector far and no blips.

Had merit! 

[yipi]

Was wondering if we will get to see the results of the Radar test. I thought it was a great idea to try something to get new players interested. They complain if your not doing anything to increase numbers or if your doing something "sheesh"

[Wiley]

I do like the idea of going back to the dots for radar or remove the dots all together and stay with bardar only and go with the gv sector dar.

The from tower radar blips for aircraft could be a good idea also.  But I'd still prefer to keep gv restricted only to sector far and no blips.

Had merit!

What I think might be a good middle ground is to have dot dar from the tower in friendly territory, but once you get say 12 miles past the front toward the enemy, you don't get dot dar there.  That would prevent the easy bomber bum rush and give them a chance.

For GVs, I'd like to see what it's like if you get rid of GV dar boxes and just have a circle showing the radius of the flashing area, so you know the area the GV is in when the town flashes.

Wiley.

[Dundee]

Was wondering if we will get to see the results of the Radar test. I thought it was a great idea to try something to get new players interested. They complain if your not doing anything to increase numbers or if your doing something "sheesh"

I hope the data also show number of players gained/lost that's the test in a nutshell

[Dundee]

What I think might be a good middle ground is to have dot dar from the tower in friendly territory, but once you get say 12 miles past the front toward the enemy, you don't get dot dar there.  That would prevent the easy bomber bum rush and give them a chance.

For GVs, I'd like to see what it's like if you get rid of GV dar boxes and just have a circle showing the radius of the flashing area, so you know the area the GV is in when the town flashes.

Wiley.

They won't do that because we were taking down the HQ's with out flashing it......

[Wiley]

They won't do that because we were taking down the HQ's with out flashing it......

I'd also like to see a place start flashing as soon as it's hit too.  The fact you can shell any facility in the game without a notification going out is dumb.

Wiley.

[SlipKnt]

Implementing a 2 to 5 minute delay on dot radar particularly for GVs could be a viable option also.  That way the GV that moves is harder to locate vs. the GV that shuts down under a tree then goes AFK...