I hope we'll never have an EZ mode here

[easymo]

 Please just dont mix them. Its like playing chess and checkers on the same board at the same time. Both games are valid, and you can excell at either. But you shouldnt be playing them both at the same time.
 BTW . the spit AND the p51 are ezmode planes.

[This message has been edited by easymo (edited 05-26-2000).]

[Apache]

BTW, I am not an advocate of ez mode in a mixed arena. I flew ez mode when I first started WB for about a month, then switched to non-ez mode and was glad I did & never looked back. I was simply pointing out the fact that HTC would have to incorporate an ez mode to increase client base.
Guys, (& Gals?), WB & AH are difficult games to learn. Remember how it was? Was for me anyway, 'cept my brother Comanche (The jerk  ).
Anywho, wanted to clarify that.

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Apache
The Blue Knights

[RAM]

I have to disagree with you ,Apache.

First time Icame into AH I had no idea on even how to take off. I was a complete newbie I didnt know anything.

That was in January. Now I suck but at least I can do some nice fights sometimes...in a 190 it is tricky, believe me.

As I said in AGW board, if HTC wants to throw me outta the game they only need to put EZ mode in it. I wont fly in EZ because I think it is sissy. But If I have to fly against Fly-by-wire, Autotrimming, Helicopter-like-hanging-on-prop Spitfires, 109s or Hawgs in my fw190, I guarantee you that I wont wait nor whine. I'd delete my account at once.

Pyro, HTC, let it as it is. Who said flying is easy?. So far I love the realism in this game. If ANY kind of EZ that brings advantages over other people comes into AH I am done. Sorry to say it but I will go.

I dont mind Autotakeoff. IT doesnt kill me. I DO mind about ANY EZ flying advantages on other people. THey CAN kill me.

My 0.02$ here

[Beegerite]

Well my friend, the operative word seems to be "former business owner".  I hope that implies retirement. I'm a present business owner and I suspect I will be a long time business owner because I temper my desire for success with consideration for the views of those customers that supported me when I didn't have two nickels to rub together.  I also have those potato customers who will jump for a nickel (I'm in the transport business which is totally deregulated) but gratefully they are few and far between primarily cause we don't price ourselves cheap but give our customers service above and beyond.  
One thing I really liked when I first came to AH was the involvement of the management and what I perceived as a true desire to be involved with their customers.  I'm not saying this has changed but one thing that really disturbs me is Pyro's "we don't know".  One thing I've learned in 35 years in business is that the first thing to do is test the waters when a change is planned.  Since I've not seen him say this before I take it as a request for input so here's mine.  
Go right ahead and offer relaxed arenas for those that want them but keep them totally separate.  And, while you're considering changing your business model to meet the demands of the masses, perhaps you may consider $9.95/month like my old sim that didn't give a squat about their customers' wishes and jammed so many in a room that the play was atrocious.  Now! that would be a great combination!  Low pricing AND the quality of AH. Somewhere there is a formula to determine just how many customers are needed to provide both but that formula has to keep the welfare of the present customers in mind.  One last thing I might pass on, in our old sim we had a squad of 24 and only 3 came to AH.  The rest are still there squeaking, moaning, screaming and cussing but religiously paying their $9.95 per month like sheep going to slaughter.  I suspect there is a relationship between low pricing and being able to take anything the management dishes out.  On the other half there is the other group willing to pay 3 times as much for quality.  Please keep the quality there and don't go corporate on us.
Thanks
Beeg

 

Originally posted by Apache:
In ref. to Pyro's statement:
That my friends, is spoken from a "business" point of view.
As a former business owner, I made decisions to benefit my company. If I lost 5 old customers but gained 15 new cutomers due to that decision, then so be it. My loyalty was to my company, not a select few customers who would drop you in a heart beat once they found something they perceived as better for the dollar. If ya don't think they will, start a business and find out for yourself.

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[This message has been edited by Beegerite (edited 05-26-2000).]

[Apache]

Nope, it implies selling the business and resting on my laurels. I resent your implication, "my friend".

[This message has been edited by Apache (edited 05-26-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Apache (edited 05-26-2000).]

[figaro]

Ripsnort:

Nope,

I will not leave.

Most of the discussions are interesting, the sim looks great, and a lot of the names are old friends and masters.  I also hope there will be a mac version soon.  Maybe I will read it here first.

Now and then, somebody says something that is just untrue, and I point it out, like in citabria«s post.

At other times, somebody posts something really rude, childish, and unnecessarily offensive.  Then I just feel a bit sorry for an otherwise fine community, knowing that it also includes people like yourself (they are all over I guess).  

And if you are looking for dividers of communities, the two of you need not look far at all.

By the way, the lack of Ez mode in this sim seems to me a very, very good thing.

Cheers (to the adults)


figaro

[Torque]

Well we do have EZ-mode here it's called $30 a month that's EZ fer me.

[Citabria]

last time I played in WB MA the structural limits were disabled.

and they were.

when did they change that?

I know they still have the...

"Wallet Drain-O-MinuteMatic" over there  

[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-26-2000).]

[bloom25]

I don't mind having an EZ mode, as long as there is an EZ arena and a regular FR arena.  As long as they don't mix the two I'm happy.    Actually I think that an EZ mode would be a good way to teach newbies the game.  Maybe in the TA or HTH you could select EZ or FR.  In the MA however, FR only is my opinion.

I wonder why a company would ever mix the two in the main arena?  No matter what you will have FR people unhappy that other's planes can do things they cannot.  Eventually you would see people leaving, while others also switched to EZ to remain competitive.



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bloom25
THUNDERBIRDS

[Gadfly]

Hey Rip, I will give a hearty, "Blow ME" to add to Snakeeyes.  I been flying this game since day one of the beta all the way through May 15 when I cancelled my paying account.  Note also that I didn't drop the account because I don't like the game;  I just don't have time to fly both AH and WB and have a life at the same time.

What I notice is the roar of the silence in answer to my query about the AH "EZMODE" features, except for Pyro, who not only doesn't deny them, but admits that there will probably BE an EZ mode in AH(As well there should).

I will repeat it for you since I know you are a lil' slow:

I have nothing against any of the existing EZmode features of AH, and in fact don't give a ratz bellybutton if they fly EZ mode in the Main in WB.

As my Daddy always told me, "Worry about YOUR deal, not what the other guy does".


Lizking

[SnakeEyes]

Pyro is exactly right that there is a place for an EZ mode, and that it is a significant tool in broadening game appeal.  

Having said that, I think it's important that any EZ mode designed not confer any advantages in any significant areas of flight (except takeoff and landing, we most people seem to accept) or combat.  Moreover, I'd argue that the effects of EZ mode be fully disclosed to the players, and that it be subject to a thorough playtesting review by a cross section of players.

The biggest problem with the WB EZ mode is that:

a) The portions of the flight models that were simplified were only known generally (broad statements) rather than specifically, allowing players to only guess at what was truly different and its impact.

b) Whenever people questioned if it conferred advantages, they were brushed-off with flat denials by development that these changes did not affect combat (because they knew the reaction to the truth).

c) That the alterations actually did confer advantages in certain situations... but that those situations were both noticeable and important in terms of air combat.

IMO, as long as a reasonable amount of work is done to ensure that EZ mode does not provide any significant advantages, and as long as players are knowledgeable about those simplifications and development obtains the buy-in of the community through interaction, EZ mode in the main arena can work.

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SnakeEyes
o-o-o-
=4th Fighter Group=

[This message has been edited by SnakeEyes (edited 05-26-2000).]

[Citabria]

"shall we play a game?"

yes, lets play chesskers.

1 player plays using the rules for checkers while the other one plays using the rules for chess.

this is also called cheating back in the real world.

separate arena for ez mode? great more power to ya   go newbies!

mix it up and everyone walks away disgruntled. the newbies and ez mode users either get a huge advantage from no trim or torque or have such a limited Angle of attack that they cant even maneuver.  

I just dont care to see 190s flick rolling into infinity 5 feet off the deck with no fear of loosing control while I fight with a realistic flight model... after all isn't the reason box games suck so bad is because the AI plays by different rules?  

[Nash]

"IMO, as long as a reasonable amount of work is done to ensure that EZ mode does not provide any significant advantages, and as long as players are knowledgeable about those simplifications and development obtains the buy-in of the community through interaction, EZ mode in the main arena can work."

Put like this, I guess I wouldn't have a problem with it. The question is... Is it possible to give a plane EZ mode characteristics while not giving this plane any advantage?

Oh... and if this ever were to happen here, kill messages should read:

"Victory by <handle> IN EASY MODE"  

[NO_UNCLE_CM]

IF THEY WANT THE EZ MODE GO FLY FIGHTER ACE ON THE ZONE...THIS IS THE BOMB HERE. CLOSEST TO THE REAL THING. WISH MY PIPER TRI PACER FLEW LIKE THIS. BUT ILLEGAL TO PUT GUNS ON IT...RATS!!

UNC...OUT!!!

[Thorns]

The Musketeers are a "full real" combat flight sim squad.  We don't mind if you have e-z model to attract new customers, just don't try to combined them in one arena.  We the Musketeers love AH and what Pyro and HiTech have created with their time and money.  Thanks.  I have seen some of the best cyber flyers and it's a joy to be a part of it.  E-z model flight sim is more like quake that looks like a combat flight sim.  Most of the people I see in the main arena are hardcore flight sim people, which know how to push buttons and create the image in their minds of a real WWII combat airplane of another era.  The "full real" of this image is what we like. New people don't know what to do,so we teach our newbies how to teach themselves....which is to practice.  The more they practice the better they become and the thirst for a more real physics is wanted.  We love the era of WWII prop combat airplanes, and want the "full real" effects of those airplanes.  Please don't mess this up.  Thanks again.

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[This message has been edited by Thorns (edited 05-26-2000).]