Author Topic: Bomb in Jerusalem (Read 2265 times)

babek- · « **Reply #30 on:** March 04, 2002, 03:46:28 AM »

Caligula - your historical essay is extremely wrong.

The Islam conquered the lands in the middle East by assimilatiting the people who lived there for centuries. Their most effective weapon was their new religion who fascinated the people living in the region and who became tired of their corrupt rulers.

These people were allowed to convert to Islam and to become Arabs (maybe you should check, what this word means - it helps).

The Egyptians - a high culture who built the pyramides became Arabs. They didnt moved in Egypt - they were there centuries before and just adopted the new religion, language and culture.

Also the Syrians - another high culture of the region - became Arabs.

And also many other of the races in the region.

They adopted the new language, writing and religion.

There were countries and cultures who refused to be assimilated - like Iran for example. They defended their territory, their non-arab language and culture. Even when they lost the war and were occupied they saved their own language and finally drove the Arabs out of Iran. They even changed the religion and built the Shi- ite Islam - an Islam which is much influenced by the old persian pre-islamic religion.

But back to the palestines:

The Palestines - like the Egypts - lived in their region when they adopted the new islamic religion and became Arabs.
They didnt moved in the territory with the Arab conquest - they just were there and became assimilated. So they are everything - but surely not foreigners like the jewish hordes who colonized their stolen land under protection of some superpowers after WW2 because of a pervert and highly illegitime UNO-order.

The jews who arrived in the "new (stolen) land" were the foreigners. Not the palestines...

So - again - acoording to your own definition the palestines have the right to fight for their rights and their land.

Eagler · « **Reply #31 on:** March 04, 2002, 08:10:20 AM »

Caligula

seems u are surrounded by pro palestiners inthis thread

guess udie and mrfish have a truce ....

I have to side with Israel. They have been our allies, now and in the past, and the only country in the region that doesn't wish every American death. I applaude their patience. If Canada gotta hair up its arse and started suicide bombing the US, how long do you think til we rolled tanks and flattened every one of them?? Our land, their land, whatever... they'd be gone...

Seems there is zero control/government onthe Palestine side. Just a bunch of radicals, usually young and dumb, which would rather die a "martyr" than try to live in any kind of peace. To bad they have to kill women and children to prove their point

straffo · « **Reply #32 on:** March 04, 2002, 08:27:02 AM »

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the only country in the region that doesn't wish every American death

The question is : what was their attitude toward American before the greation ab nihilo of the Israel state and the suport of Isreal by USA ?

Before the creation of Isreal it was often more safe for jews to be in an islamic country like Tunisia Morrocco (even Iran) than any "Catholic" country like Poland Russia and lot of other Euros country ...

In fact the term "progom" isn't arabic at all ...

I know it's like the egg and Chicken story ... who started first the Palestinian of the Jew ?

I'm perthaps biased but I do think that the sionist started it first ...

babek- · « **Reply #33 on:** March 04, 2002, 08:47:33 AM »

I agree with you, straffo.

Before the land of the palestines was stolen, the arab nations were quite positive or at least neutral to the USA. (In fact most of them didnt knew that there was something like the USA

)

Because of the history they mistrust the old colonial powers - like France or UK or Turkey - but they had no reason to hate the USA.

After WW2 the mad decision to construct Israel brought them to side with the USSR and so they became part of the cold war.

Its normal, that a country ignore crimes done by one of his own
allies.
Even today the USA is ignoring many of the terroristic acts of the
terroristic government of Israel - although some of the crimes have the "quality" of the Nazi massacres of WW2.

But its also normal, that the palestines and the arabs are not ignoring the fact that the USA - the so called fighter of world-wide-terrorism - is supporting (Israeli) terrorism.

This is a sad example how hate could be fueled to the madness we have all seen in September 2001.

Eagler · « **Reply #34 on:** March 04, 2002, 09:01:26 AM »

that said ... if Israel were to vanish into thin air this afternoon, do you think the Palestines would then enbrace Americans with open arms?

I don't think so, they hate us now and forever, even after any reason is forgotten. Sometimes I think they like the fight as they don't seem to have anything else to do? What do they produce as a national product? Anything beside terror and hate??

Their "fight" gives them "cause" to live ... what a waste..

straffo · « **Reply #35 on:** March 04, 2002, 09:16:03 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Eagler
that said ... if Israel were to vanish into thin air this afternoon, do you think the Palestines would then enbrace Americans with open arms?

Not today ... it take a lot of time ...
For exemple :
my grand-parent just HATE the German
my parent are not German friendly but don't hate them
I don't care of German people at all I just HATE any one who is not french (Just kidding

)

It took a least 2 generation and a comon enemie (Varsovie pact) to overcome hate and I don't think that 100% of the French share my neutrality to the German I'm pretty sure it would be easy to find some French of my generation who hate the German more than my grand-parent ...

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I don't think so, they hate us now and forever, even after any reason is forgotten. Sometimes I think they like the fight as they don't seem to have anything else to do? What do they produce as a national product? Anything beside terror and hate??
[/B]

Well actually they can't produce anything without land nor trading (correct use of the word ?)

In fact when we look at the last Arab-Israel war the main factor was not religion or Cold War ... the main factor was :WATER of the Joudain

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Their "fight" gives them "cause" to live ... what a waste.. [/B]

On both side sadly

babek- · « **Reply #36 on:** March 04, 2002, 09:40:21 AM »

Hi straffo.

You in France and I in Germany had the luck that our nations had great leaders like de Gaulle, Adenauer, Mitterand and Kohl.

These great politicians won over the hate between our people and were successful to build a stable friendship between the modern France and Germany.

In a few generations, when both countries have been fully integrated in the new unified Europe the hate of our grandparents will become a sad historical note.

Vive la France - lang lebe Deutschland

Its sad that in Israel/Palestine there are no such great and intelligent leaders who get such positive results for their people.

So the results are logical: German TV just reported that isareali military hordes killed 5 children and a woman with air-to-ground-fire.
In the next days we will surely get the next info how a palestine suicide fanatic killed some israeli children. And so on...

straffo · « **Reply #37 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:01:33 AM »

I'm still astonished by what Adenauer and de Gaulle have done .

They were able to overcome almost 1 century of hate between our 2 country.

(The fact that the real French enemy is England helped IMO (J/K

)

Staga · « **Reply #38 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:12:31 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Eagler

I have to side with Israel. They have been our allies, now and in the past, and the only country in the region that doesn't wish every American death.

LOL !
Hey Eagler, was that thing with Israel killing U.S troops in "USS Liberty" just a funny story or was it real incident?
If it is true you really don't need any enemies when your ally takes care of your ships and soldiers

Staga · « **Reply #39 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:23:02 AM »

Couple links just for Eagler...

http://home.cfl.rr.com/gidusko/liberty/ and http://www.ussliberty.org/

Nice allies you have

This ship sure looks like old egyptian horse transport ship

Eagler · « **Reply #40 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:32:16 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Staga
Couple links just for Eagler...

http://home.cfl.rr.com/gidusko/liberty/ and http://www.ussliberty.org/

Nice allies you have

thanks Staga
I think the British were once America's enemy too as were Germany, Italy, Japan to name a few ...

At some point, you cut your losses, regroup and go forward ....

Nice to see who sides with terrorism, aka suicide bombers of women and children, and who doesn't. Wierd how Europe sees America as racist and backwards but can't seem to get itself past a basic hatred of Jews... how long have you guys felt this way?

Staga · « **Reply #41 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:42:25 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Eagler Nice to see who sides with terrorism, aka suicide bombers of women and children, and who doesn't. Wierd how Europe sees America as racist and backwards but can't seem to get itself past a basic hatred of Jews... how long have you guys felt this way?

If you think I'm racist or jew-hater you've been smokeing something else than Marlboro. Are you so blind you can't see whats happening over there?
Wake up and smell the coffee...

CptTrips · « **Reply #42 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:47:33 AM »

>but can't seem to get itself past a basic hatred of Jews... how
>long have you guys felt this way?

http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/2130/

Wab

straffo · « **Reply #43 on:** March 04, 2002, 10:54:51 AM »

If we search a bit Wabbit we will find some jew who hated the jew ...

Quote

Originally posted by Eagler

thanks Staga
I think the British were once America's enemy too as were Germany, Italy, Japan to name a few ...

At some point, you cut your losses, regroup and go forward ....

Nice to see who sides with terrorism, aka suicide bombers of women and children, and who doesn't. Wierd how Europe sees America as racist and backwards but can't seem to get itself past a basic hatred of Jews... how long have you guys felt this way?

1st I've nothing against the jew 2nd I don't see all american has racist some are some not (like some French)

Quote

At some point, you cut your losses, regroup and go forward ....

That the point IMO ...when will it finally happen in middle east ?

I don't see any Adenauer nor de Gaulle in middle east

Quote

Nice to see who sides with terrorism, aka suicide bombers of women and children, and who doesn't

I've heard that eating fish is good to preserve memory ...

Staga · « **Reply #44 on:** March 04, 2002, 11:27:24 AM »

What a sorry case you are AKWabbit. Why wonät you also check casualties of that group... They were good men fighting against russians.

Now Eagler and Wabbit: Here's something you boys should read if you think what I belive you're thinking:

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The Second World War and Finnish Jewry
During the Finnish-Russian War of 1939-40 (the Winter War), Finnish Jews fought alongside their non-Jewish fellow countrymen. During the Finnish-Russian War of 1941-44, in which Finnish Jews also took part, Finland and Nazi-Germany were co-belligerents. Despite strong German pressure, the Finnish Government refused to take action against Finnish nationals of Jewish origin who thus continued to enjoy full civil rights throughout the War. There are many interesting anecdotes from this period, concerning, among others, the presence of a Jewish prayer tent on the Russian front virtually under the Nazi's noses and the food help given to Russian-Jewish POWs by the Jewish communities of Finland.

Quote from "Jewish Virtual Library; A Division of the American-Israeli Cooperative Enterprise"

Quote

In World War II, Finland was allied with Germany, and Finnish troops fought against the Soviet Union in an effort to regain the territory it lost in the Russo-Finnish War (1939-40). Fulfilling their obligations as loyal citizens, Finnish Jews answered the call to arms. Twenty-three of them lost their lives in the fighting, and most are buried in the Jewish cemetery in Helsinki. In gratitude for their heroism and loyalty in Finland's darkest hour, the country's leader, Marshal Mannerheim, paid a visit to the synagogue in Helsinki and presented the Jewish community with a wreath which is preserved to the present day as one of the most treasured heirlooms of Finnish Jewry.

Quote is from World Jewish Congress.

Quote

Finnish Jewry was spared the horrors of the Holocaust, in part due to the resolute stand of the Finnish authorities who refused to surrender Finnish Jews to the Germans.
When Himmler demanded that Finnish Jews be turned over to the Germans, Prime Minister Rangell is reported to have said that the Jews of Finland were decent people and loyal citizens whose sons fought in the army like other Finns.

Quote is from World Jewish Congress

btw one of the most beautiful girl I've ever met is a jew...