Author Topic: Gunnery Lethality (Read 1390 times)

Apar · « **Reply #60 on:** May 04, 2002, 07:26:34 AM »

Bug,

Don't complain about LW gun Lethality.

The .50's ARE very lethal in AH. I flew P38, f6f, f4u, p51 also and I'm always astonished (delighted) about there lethality even on buffs.

You and your lazer guns can take out a con at 1k (LW planes hardly ever, we HAVE to get close).

Practice off-line on drones, it helps.

BUG_EAF322 · « **Reply #61 on:** May 04, 2002, 07:30:50 AM »

i repeat i'm a bad shot
always will so practise offline won't do any help
it's not real to and offline is easy

ever blown up by two .50 rounds ?

BUG_EAF322 · « **Reply #62 on:** May 04, 2002, 07:36:57 AM »

Close maybe but hell one ping and it's done HO is the best way for a FW
Yesterday i was behind some FW's i had to follow them for "hours" to shoot it down and it took more than two hits too
speakin about flying tanks

RatPenat · « **Reply #63 on:** May 04, 2002, 09:26:12 AM »

I prefer something about someone kill me when 700 yds+ distance (i fly f4U) and i saw lots ponies, nikis, f6, f4u, p47, p38, la, spit, hurries or Zeros shooting my bellybutton down when i m 1k or more distance. It's more pathetic when they kill you with only a ping (la, nikis, spits, f4uc or p38 do it). Only guys usually didn't shoot are LW pilots because they know they wasting ammo.

What about reduce damage with distance??

Gadfly · « **Reply #64 on:** May 04, 2002, 09:39:23 AM »

Why are you guys assuming that AH has it "right"?

Toad · « **Reply #65 on:** May 04, 2002, 10:04:15 AM »

We aren't.

We're assuming no one does it better in a MMOL WW2 ACM game.

Beyond that, I personally got fed up with the "neutered guns so we can have a good long fight" policy when I used to dump most of a SpitIX 20mm load into a con at 250 yards and still not kill him.

Just do the physics.. muzzle velocity, ballistic coeficient, resulting trajectory.... as close to "real" as you can get with the data. Which I believe HTC does as well or better than ANYONE.

Then do your damage model.. which in any game is going to be subjective and open to argument.. as best you can.

And for those of you that don't think a heavy MG will crack an engine block or go right through a wing at 1000 yards, I suggest you do a little study on firearms and their effects.

The cam cover on my WW2 Ranger engine is magnesium and very light, just a few pounds.. drop it from waist high on a hangar floor and you'll probably crack it. What do you think a heavy MG would do to it at 1000 yards? (And when the cam cover goes, there goes all the oil.. at the minimum.)

Now.. hit sprites, range inside of 1000 yards.. stuff like that we could fool around with.

Gadfly · « **Reply #66 on:** May 04, 2002, 10:16:43 AM »

Personally, I think it is more of a damage model issue, anyway, no matter what sim we are talking about.

bowser · « **Reply #67 on:** May 04, 2002, 10:39:41 AM »

Not sure if I agree or not with you JAB, but you took a discussion about gunnery and expanded it to a discussion about all-round pilot skill. AH would probably do very little to improve actual flying abilities in real life, but in the specific area of gunnery...dealing with sighting, lead, dispersion, etc. it might. It's a speciality that really has nothing to do with flying. Maybe think of it in terms of the gunner on a bomber.

bowser

poopster · « **Reply #68 on:** May 04, 2002, 11:31:58 AM »

You can go round and round and..

First question is do the hit sounds accurately represent the number of rounds you've been hit with ?? If it is a "canned" sound file with out parameters, well then there you go. The old 1 ping death raises it's head when in reality you were lit up..

Lethal guns favor the new guy, who in a short time can kill somethin. Tamer guns don't help him, he's in the middle of an ACM learning curve. So out of the box, a new guy is up to speed.

Tamer guns favor the vet. He can shoot, he kills.

Quote

Why are you guys assuming that AH has it "right"?

That's the rub, and why it goes round and round. Everyone has there idea of what "feels" right.

And we have nothing to base it on other than "feel"

You can get it close with charts and graphs and weights and kinetic energy tables but..

With those in place, "feel" must be part of that equation. And "feel" is subjective.

Should I be able to kill a plane on a 400 yard crossing snap shot ??

After the homework is done, you work on that kettle of fish.

Or.. you don't

nopoop

Hornet · « **Reply #69 on:** May 04, 2002, 12:15:23 PM »

When people makes these claims of getting popped from 1,000 yards etc, is that referring to the distance you see from the icon when you get shot?

I was always under the impression that you should subtract 200-300 yards off the icon range to account for net lag.

Similarly, I thought the ping sounds we recieve were supposed to be a warning, "hey you're getting shot better move your ass", rather than an audio representation of each round hitting home.

So "1 ping" kills from 1k is an incorrect understanding of what's going on in-game.

Hooligan · « **Reply #70 on:** May 04, 2002, 12:16:59 PM »

Data is scarce but AH "feels" pretty good to me. I've looked into this quite a bit and this is about all I can find.

If memory serves: Approximately 5-10 20mm hits would be enough to kill a single engined fighter. Approx 20 x 20mm hits within a small area would kill a 4-engined US bomber. Heavy machineguns should be about 1/3 as effective as 20mm cannons and LMGs should be about 1/3 as effective as HMGs. Also, fighters tend to be very compact with critical components taking up a large portion of the whole: therefore it is unlikely that they can take many hits from HMG or bigger projectiles without suffering some sort of crippling damage.

The AH damage model does a better job of reflecting this than any other game I have played. When I last played WB a couple of years ago, aircraft could shrug off large number of hits with no ill effects and this was clearly bogus.

Hooligan

Apar · « **Reply #71 on:** May 04, 2002, 05:44:39 PM »

I think the P38 quallifies better for "Flying Tank" BUG,

easymo · « **Reply #72 on:** May 04, 2002, 08:57:10 PM »

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/8217/fgun/fgun-an.html

The characteristic of this phase is that the goal no longer was to destroy an aircraft by hitting the crew of vulnerable parts of its equipment. Especially the larger cannon were intended to destroy the structure of the aircraft itself: A 30mm hit could cut a fighter in two, and put a large hole in a heavy bomber

BUG_EAF322 · « **Reply #73 on:** May 05, 2002, 10:38:24 AM »

Its a friggin leofockepardwulf 30mm smoothbore gyroscopial laser aimed flying panzer tank.

It has no gear but retractable tracks.
The Focke Wulf a frigginly amazing flying vechile.

Designed by Kurt hhhhhhhhm TANK ??

Apar · « **Reply #74 on:** May 05, 2002, 10:46:00 AM »

Take your medicine BUG, and stay of the joints,