Author Topic: 1.10 – A step forward  (Read 471 times)

Offline poopster

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1.10 – A step forward
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2002, 12:48:31 PM »
Sorry Uncle Scramble  :)  I was refering to the same point that Apache made. The K/D thingy...

Which in a furball envirement is, well unusual to say the least :) And in no way suicidal.

;)

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2002, 01:37:26 PM »
Poopster & Apache - point(s) taken, but you're still a little off. Lazs and I fly with very different motives because we're very different people.
  • I like field capture and field preservation, and couldn't give a toejam about kills for their own sake. I also like to try out different planes, rather than flying my best plane - the P51D - all the time.
  • Lazs doesn't give a toejam about field capture, or field preservation, but cares only about kills per hour. He also flies only the one plane type - mainly the F4U-1, but occasionally the -1C.
If I were to fly the same plane the whole time, my k/d would be as good as his. As it is, my P51D k/d was better than 4:1 in the last tour. But notice that last tour I flew no fewer than 11 different plane types!  I can't be an expert in all of them, and I am a novice in quite a few.

Now what do you think of them apples, guys?  Time to rethink your argument(s)?

One thing I do have in common with lazs (apart from a big mouth) is that we both love the F4U :)

Offline Apache

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1.10 – A step forward
« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2002, 01:44:42 PM »
Gosh beet1e, how can I be a little off? I'm arguing your statement "it must be because you fly suicide missions,". Nothing more, nothing less.

As to the rest of the thread, I'm not entering into any type of furball vs. strat debate. I like furballin', you don't. Thats fine with me.

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #18 on: July 05, 2002, 01:57:40 PM »
Apache - well something is awry. If you get 2+ kills/sortie every time, and land them, then you should get a message of adulation from the server. It's not true to say there are no fights. Therefore, if the kill credit message is not coming up, either a) less than 2 kills per sortie are being won, or b) they are not being landed. I cannot think of any other explanation.

Offline Apache

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« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2002, 02:03:38 PM »
Beet1e, read my lips (sort of). I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing your suicide statement, not what lazs said about kills, lol.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2002, 02:07:03 PM by Apache »

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #20 on: July 05, 2002, 02:16:30 PM »
Apache - we have been rescued by tomato. Look for her on this board. She's my girlfriend and is here for the weekend. No more time for arguing, and no AH for the next few hours ;)

Offline Apache

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« Reply #21 on: July 05, 2002, 02:19:09 PM »
hehe, have a good time beet1e. :) Cya when ya get back, lol.

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2002, 02:34:47 PM »
beetle... i don't care who is more skilled but don't presume to know how I fly...   I seriously doubt that you could follow me into the same fights I get into flying only the -1a and then claim that your skill level is so much better tho.

you bailed 5 times  I don't have a key mapped to bail so add those to your death colum...    I don't get killed by planes much.   look at the expanded format and tell me which planes are killing me.   It is the pt boat or ack or gv.   High risk?   I bet i fly one hell of a lot more high risk than you.  

If I kill any planes at all in a sortie it is 2 or more 90% of the time.   I don't give a toejam tho if my name comes up in lights.    for you to say it is no harder to find 2 planes or more to kill in a sortie in this new map is bull.

The planes I have fought in this map mostly tried to HO me.... When I killed em, everyone of the guys I killed was unknown to me and most likely inexperianced.   I would have had a ten times harder fight with these guys if they would have been in a large fur with me.    As it was..... they were easy to simply work over since they couldn't get away.

I would say that just getting into the arena with as low a skill level as mine or, even worse, yours.... is tantamount to suicide.
lazs

Offline Wlfgng

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« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2002, 03:10:52 PM »
I see even virutal pilots have HUGE ego's    :D

and touchy too....

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #24 on: July 06, 2002, 04:30:37 AM »
Wlfgng, you are right. And lazs is more full of toejam than a Christmas turkey. Add 5 bails to the death tally? That is pure bull. Hell, the 109 ace, Franz Stigler (who I have met) bailed 17 times in the course of the war! But I don't care what lazs thinks. I'm learning the new terrains and finding the missions I want. Yesterday worked with AKWabbit to bomb a Vehicle field and kill the acks so he could get his M3 troops in. We got the field, and for me, that was a meaningful and rewarding mission. Did I get any kills? No. But for me, being instrumental in a field capture means much more than "just getting kills". From now on, when I see AKwabbit, I'll know he's a guy I can work with, and we'll remember that mission for a long time to come :)

As I landed that sortie, I noticed an enemy PNZR and an enemy FLAK at the town near our field. I was lucky the Osti didn't get me because I was low and didn't see him till very late. So I landed the F4U-1D and came back up with 2x1000. I had warned another Bishop of the presence of the enemy GVs. I think his name was Sharkbait, or something like that. He killed the Osti, and I came around and let the PNZR have it with the bombs. Mission accomplished, and field saved. And that is what is important to me. So, one kill in what, half an hour? I couldn't give a flying ***k about that.

I wont tell you my exact age, but I'm closer to 50 than 40 ;) And I have long passed the point of putting aside childish things. I just don't have that ego that some guys have. War was about the call of duty, and of self sacrifice - and not of personal glorification. The war was not won simply by guys like Col. Gabreski getting lots of kills. As I said to AKwabbit as I went down for the second ack, "I may get killed doing this", but it was worth the risk so that he could land his troops, as I think it would have been difficult to kill an ack from the M3 (trajectory etc).

Lazs - not claiming to be better than you, just different. The scoring system rewards people who fly like you, whereas the efforts made by missions like mine probably go unnoticed. It's OK. This is a game. I have enough (900 hours) of real flying experience for me to remember that at all times.

Apache! it was a very good night :D

Offline Mave

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UGH....
« Reply #25 on: July 06, 2002, 05:31:48 AM »
Stop hijacking good threads you potatos, next time I need to read through this crap again you owe me a keg of amberbock :)

Anyways...................... ....


Mave

Offline Hristo

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1.10 – A step forward
« Reply #26 on: July 06, 2002, 06:01:20 AM »
now if only we got hit sprites as God commands !

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #27 on: July 06, 2002, 08:55:05 AM »
bettle... little selective realism here eh?   What WWII pilot was ever NOT credited for his kills if he ditched or... even if he died?   When did they pass a rule in WWII that you had to get 2 kills and safely land to get credit or for anyone to know about it.   I don't give a toejam but I do like to see who killed who and when.  I can track people by their kills in the old version.

you also contradict yourself on having no trouble in finding fights but then admit that you are perfectly happy with a kill every half hour.   you call me a suicider but I have a higher K/D and K/S and K/T than you.   You claim that you could do well if you flew only one plane yet you don't do at all well unless you have planes a lot better than the mediocre.   Every time I fly a new plane I do better than I do in the -1A.   Are you saying that I would do worse in a P51 or lag7?

I am mediocre at best but you are even worse.   If getting your name in lights is a big deal tho that is fine with me but don't tell me about finding fights because we have completely different ideas of what a fight is.  
lazs

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #28 on: July 06, 2002, 11:36:35 AM »
Lazs,

We're starting to sound like a couple of old men. I think we're both tired of the issue.

You are quite wrong to say that I contradict myself. The statements "I have no trouble finding fights" and "So, one kill in what, half an hour? I couldn't give a flying ***k about that." are truths which are NOT mutually exlusive. The difference between us is that you fly the same old, same old... whereas I like variety. I don't just want to fly the same plane tour after tour after tour. So I'll fly something different. Yes, I like the F4U, and not only is it an excellent ground attack plane, it's a good fighter and is the one I normally choose when flying my favourite missions - operations off the carriers. Sometimes, defence of Bishland calls for an assault during which I might kill several planes in a sortie. At other times, like last night with AKwabbit, I'll fly a jabo mission. Sometimes defence calls for manning of the field guns or an Ostwind. I enjoy all those activities. I don't just want to fly the same plane day after day, year after year, doing the same old routine - killing cons for its own sake.

Now it naturally follows that you are always in current practice with your F4U, whereas by changing types I sometimes have to spend a period of readjustment. So your k/t k/d k/everything will be good. So they should be. You still lost 56% of your planes, and I was not much better, losing 52% of my fighters. (I score jabo separately) Now I could show you an old WB scoresheet in which I had 28 kills to only one death. It proves nothing. At the time I did that, I was testing my new rig and wanted to see how effective my LW guns were with the new processor. But for me, the flying was quite unnatural. I was just dweebing around, looking for hapless souls to kill. The only time I died was when an ack came back up underneath me, and pinged out my engine, and then some bastige shot me as I tried to ditch :(

Yes, we have a different view of fights. To you, this game is about the fights themselves. To me, the fights and kills are events which happen along the way to the ulterior objective.

I agree about the P51D. Maybe it is an easy ride in some ways. But I explained my reasons for flying it in this thread, in which I expressed disappointment with the lack of support shown by some of the other Bishops at that time, eg. being surrounded by ten friendlies and not receiving help to get a con off my six, never mind a 6-call.

Quote
I am mediocre at best but you are even worse.
I think you're making the classic error of trying to judge someone's ability by means of the scoresheet alone. The scoreboard provides only one perspective. Sit back so that your nose is no longer pressed against the monitor, wipe away the smudge mark, and try to see the big picture. And it really is a big picture with this pizza map!  I can see why you're having trouble :D

Look Lazs, me old fruit - we are old buddies, remember? When I thought I was going to have to quit WB because of the gun porkage of 2.6, I paid THIS tribute to some of my favourite guys:
  • To my unofficial purp squadron of the morning hours, when the MA was civilised with only 50-odd people on - these for me were the best times ever, and I shared them with folks like -save-, danish, ellobo, jekkyl, helllo, jjrebl, -lazs-, senna-, kilbot, and -japan Tnx for winging with me on some truly great missions.
That was in 1998/99. Sure, I was content with air to air combat sorties back then when we flew for purple. But I have progressed. Are you sure you just want to kill con after con ad finitum/ad nauseum? Don't you ever want to progress? If you don't, that's fine, but I think you're missing out.