Wep and cooling.......

[hazed-]

Originally posted by Dowding
I understand that they are different and the figures concerning this issue. But...

Hazed - so you don't actually have any evidence to contradict the current modelling?

er Im not asking for any change to the current model concerning HP etc and im ok with keeping 10 minutes boost.(thats naudet hijacking as usual )

this question is ENTIRELY about cooling times.


 

There is no reason why the cooling dynamics of the P-51 engine compared to the 190 engine should be the same. Same goes for any other plane in the game.

Er this is also a point i made earlier. if you'll check AH models all weps apart from 190s as 5 minutes wep for 10 minutes cooling as far as i can tell.
Only 190s have 10 minutes wep and 20 minutes cooling


 

Clearly HTC has some reason for creating a difference... it's entirely possible they have data that you don't have or have not seen and the difference is entirely justified.

again have you read this post? I have asked for exactly this information, whether HTC has something entirely different.A simple 'we have data that says different' and that would be an end to it.Why do we have this forum if not for precisely this reason? when people show HTC a document they have found and it disagrees with HTC's model they usually dont tell us where they get their information, Although we know they have told us where they got some from(those american reports,NASCA?? or something?) and possibly an explanation of some kind.(Although i have seen issues ignored )

[Urchin]

Well... I think the 109G-10 might be different than the 190 then, cause I got 10 minutes of WEP, let it rest for 5 minutes, then got 5 more minutes of WEP.  

I'd assume this means the 109G-10 gets 10 minutes of WEP, then it takes 10 minutes to cool down.  

Incidentaly, that plane climbs like a damn rocketship lol.  Went from 4,300 feet (takeoff) to 33,500 feet before WEP ran out.  Course, the next 5 minutes off WEP and 5 minutes on it only got me to 38k lol.  I'm sitting at 40k right now trying to see how fast it goes that high.

Lol... dove from 40k straight down.  Hit 600 MPH or so (didnt film it, I guess I should have, ah well).  Managed to PULL IT OUT at around 8k by trimming out of the dive.  Ol 109 held together well to, some groaning but nothing came flying off.  I guess 600mph-ish is the 'terminal velocity' for a 109, since I was doing 600 for about 15,000 feet lol.

[Urchin]

190A5 is 10 minutes of WEP and 20 minutes of cooling.  

That IS kind of odd.  How come the 109 doesn't take 20 minutes to cool down?

[Wilbus]

All 190's have same. All 109's have same (shorter then 190). Different engines but don't think there was much difference in R/L

[Urchin]

But it doesn't make any sense that the 190s take twice as long to cool down if the 109s dont.  

I can see taking 10 minutes to cool down if you have 10 minutes of WEP, that seems to make sense.  But I don't get why it takes 20 minutes for the 190s to cool down.  

Of course, I also don't understand why the 109s and 190s get twice as much WEP as all the other planes do.

[Crazyflier15]

it makes sense anotherthing that might be considered is altitude at higher alt the temp is much cooler which would allow an increase in cooling rate. Also, speed the faster you go when you idle the most air cirsulates thus allowing a drop in cooling time.

[Naudet]

Folks you all start to speculate again.

What we know through test is this:

FW190 has double WEP time, but also needs twice the time to cool down from the same temperature as all other planes.

Bf109 seems to have double WEP time, but cools as fast as all other planes down.


Now HTC has to step in and tell why that is so, as noone of us has any idea if there is any form of "cooling model" in AH and nnone knows which factors (i.e. radiator size, air temperatur etc.) has any effect on it.

[hazed-]

Exactly naudet.

but unless HTC deems fit to throw us rabid dogs a bone we will forever be doing it! lol

The story so far:

190A/F 10 mins wep 20 mins cool
190DD9 10 mins wep 20 mins cool
P51D 5 mins wep 10 mins cool
109G10 10 mins wep 10 mins cool


anyone care to add some more?


EDIT:

added 109G2:

109g2 10 mins wep 10 mins cool

heres a different one:

Hurricane II C 5 mins wep 15 minutes cooling!

bang goes the 1min wep=2mins cooling theory

[hazed-]

PUNT

[hazed-]

so theres never going to be a reply from HTC?

at first i was curious but now im beginning to get pissed off with this.

Ive posted info in the past about the 190a8 not matching data and i was told that 'its not the same one as in  AH'
I posted stuff about the 190a5 and im told 'its not the same 190a5'
now what? the dora we have 'is not the same' as the ones in all the books??????????

This is BS.Whenever something is brought up that cant be explained away by claiming the data or test is wrong anyone who USUALLY are the first to cry names at anyone questioning the LW planes ignore it and hope it just fades away!.

well this is one time im not going to let it drop.If i have to punt this thread for 5 years ill do it

HTC: why is it like it is please? I'd like an explanation.I dont need to see the figures, I just want to know if theres something on the dora which would make it cool down 2 times slower than a P51d?.

if the model is wrong then please just say you'll look into it.Its not asking much just to have a few words on the subject.Im becoming very disillusioned with this BB.whats the point in having it if threads are ignored?

[Shiva]

Of course, I also don't understand why the 109s and 190s get twice as much WEP as all the other planes do.

All aircraft can be run at War Emergency Power (WEP) -- pushing the engine past its normal 'full power' setting at the expense of pushing the engine closer to overheating. The 109 and 190 both had tanks containing a fuel additive that further increased their engine power -- either water/methanol or GM1 nitrous. They could fly with either WEP or additive or both active. Rather than expend the time necessary to implement two separate functions  for engine boost, HTC implemented the additional boost capability by doubling the standard WEP duration

[Wilbus]

And as you notice this fluid wasn't in use early in the war, thus 110 C and 109 E only have about 5 minutes, if even that.

[hazed-]

so as mentioned why does it take twice as long to cool?

and any idea why hurricane IIC takes 15 minutes to cool?

Does anyone have any idea about this or do i have to wait for HTC to answer?

[hitech]

An argument about reality where none exist. Anyone have any idea what the temp is supose to be on the fw's? If you realy wish I can change the gauge to read higher on the fw so it looks like it's cooling the same rate as the p51. But in the end all that would change is the lable on the dash board.

The way the wep system works.

/*
** Update Eng Wep
*/

for(i=0;i{
   if(Plane->Ctrl.EngWep.Value)
   {
      Engines.WepTempPer += Plane->UserSim->TimeSlice * Plane->PlaneModel.PlaneParams.WepHea tPerSec;
      if(Engines.WepTempPer >= 1.0)
      {
         Engines.WepTempPer = 1.0;
         svSetState(&Plane->Ctrl.EngWep,0);
         Engines.TotalWepTime += Plane->UserSim->TimeSlice;
      }
   }
   else
   {
      if(Engines.WepTempPer > 0)
      {
         Engines.WepTempPer -= Plane->UserSim->TimeSlice * Plane->PlaneModel.PlaneParams.WepCoo lPerSec;
         if(Engines.WepTempPer < 0)
         {
            Engines.WepTempPer = 0;
         }
      }
   }
   Engines.WepTemp = Engines.WepTempPer * 0.25; // 0 - 0.25 Normal Temp 0 - .75
}

/*
** Flip wep off with pull back of throttle
*/

if(Plane->Ctrl.EngWep.Value)
{
   if(Plane->ControlInput.ThrottleInput[0] < 0.95 ||
      Engines[0].TotalWepTime >= Plane->PlaneModel.PlaneParams.MaxWep Time)
   {
      svSetState(&Plane->Ctrl.EngWep,0);
   }
}

[Wilbus]

Think we just wanted to know WHY the 190 has slower cool down rate then all (almost) other planes Hitech, no need to give us your code, if you keep giving out the code like this I'll soon have all AH source code