Tank question

[wulfie]

Re: Ostwind - true about reloads. However, the ammunition should also be exploding shells with fuses, which would not require a direct hit on an aircraft to damage it.

3.7cm FlaK 43 of Ostwind didn't need to reload every 6 rounds either. It had a bigger magazine and was an amazing gun - 150% ROF increase over earlier 3.7cm FlaK gun used by Germans.

Mike/wulfie

[Pyro]

Thanks for the info guys.  I did some digging through a bunch of books today but couldn't find it.  Could one of you guys cite a source for the 14 deg/sec?  

Mitsu, that gun was fed by clips but that did not require it to cease firing while another clip was loaded.  Rather, the clips were simply inserted onto a feed tray(IIRC the tray could hold 2 clips at a time).  As long as the loaders could toss clips on the feed tray faster than the gun fired them, there was no interruption.  In fact, the Ju 87G illustrates this to some degree as it also used the six round clips but used two of them together for 12 rounds per gun.  They just didn't have the luxury of somebody sitting out there slapping more clips into place as rounds were expended.

[Mitsu]

Pyro, Thank you for explaining.
so these cannons didn't have a reload action lags...ok I understand.

Thanks.

[devious]

I don't mean to be annoying, but don't forget the cited 14°/s were for manual traverse. Powered traverse would be much faster - unfortunately, I'm 350km from my books ATM. If none of the other guys has the detailed data by Friday, I'll dig it up.

Did I say much faster ? The electric turret traverse system was deleted in Ausf. J (we got the model before, Ausf.H), so I guess it wasn't that fast

[Turbot]

Google says the data is on this page - but the data fields come up blank in my browser (but I have foriegn languages turned off too)

In any case nice pictures diagrams and cut-aways, places for the data which I am pretty sure is there but I was unable to see:

http://www.chez.com/mythicpanzers/Panzer_!_Le_Mythe/Panzers/2-MediumPanzers/2-Pz.Kpfw_IV-2.html#Ausf.H







Extra Stuff:

Gun data - everything except traverse of course, other than to note 360° (manual and electric) and interestingly however that gun elevation was manual only:  (also all sorts other datas such as Max grade 67%  Max level road speed 24mph etc etc etc.)

http://afvdb.50megs.com/germany/pz4.html#AusfH

Penetration Performance and Armor thickness

http://members.rogers.com/admfisher/html/pz4.html

[muckmaw]

Well, this is everything I could find: Of course, Traverse speed is missing, but it was powered by a seperate engine:

Ausf A, B, C, D, E, F1 Ausf F2, G, H, J
Crew Commander, gunner, loader, driver, radio operator Commander, gunner, loader, driver, radio operator
Physical Characteristics    
Weight A: 39,683 lb, 17.3, 18.4 tons
B: 17.7, 18.8 tons
B, C: 41,887 LB
C: 19, 20 tons
D: 44,092 LB, 20 tons
E: 46,297 LB, 21 tons
F1: 49,163 LB, 22.3 tons 52,000 LB
F2: 50,706 LB, 23, 23.6 tons
G: 23.5, 23.6 tons
H, J: 25 tons
Length w/gun A: 18' 4.5", 18' 8", 5.6, 5.7 m
B-F1: 19' 5.25", 5.92 m
B, C: 5.87 m
D, E: 5.91 m
F1: 5.93 m  20' 10"
F2, G: 18' 5.5", 5.62, 6.63 m
G: 19' 4", 5.9, 6.62 m
H, J: 23' 3", 7.02 m
Length w/o gun   F2: 5.93 m
G: 6.63 m
H, J: 5.89 m
G, H, J: 19' 4"
Height 8' 8.5"
A: 2.65 m
B, C, D, E, F1: 2.68 m
A-C: 2.59 m
D-F1: 2.68 m 8' 6"
F2-J: 8' 9.5", 2.68 m
Width A: 9' 6", 9' 8", 2.9 m
B, C: 9' 3.25", 2.83 m
D, E, F1: 9' 4", 2.84 m
A-C: 2.85 m
D, E: 2.86 m
F1: 2.88 m  9' 7"
F2: 9' 3.75", 2.84, 2.88 m
G: 9' 7", 2.9 m
G, H, J: 2.88 m
Ground clearance A-F1: 40 cm F2: 40 cm
G, H, J: 1' 3"
Ground contact length A-F1: 3.52 m F2-J: 3.52 m
Ground pressure A: 9.67 psi, 0.65 kg/cm2
B: 0.66 kg/cm2
B, C: 10.95 psi
C, D: 0.75 kg/cm2
D: 11.81 psi
E: 12.94 psi
E, F1: 0.79 kg/cm2
F1: 12.52 psi F2, G: 0.84 kg/cm2
G: 13.23 psi
H, J: 0.89 kg/cm2  
Turret ring diameter A-F1: 1.65 m F2: 1.65 m
Armament (mm)    
Main 75 mm KwK 37 L/24 F2: 75 mm KwK 40 L/43
G: 75 mm KwK 40 L/43 or
75 mm KwK 40 L/48
H, J: 75 mm KwK 40 L/48
Secondary    
MG A, D, E, F1: 7.92 mm MG34, coaxial, hull
B, C: 7.92 mm MG34, coaxial 7.92 mm MG34 coaxial, hull
Side arms    
Quantity    
Main A: 122
A, B, C, D, E, F1: 80 87: HEAT, smoke, APCR, APCBC, HE
F2-J: 87  
Secondary    
MG A: 3,000
B, C: 2,400
D, E: 2,700
F1: 3,000, 3,150 F2: 3,200, 3,000
G: 3,000, 2,250
H, J: 3,150
Side arms    
Armor Thickness (mm)    
Hull Front, Upper A: 15@7°
B, C, D: 30@7°
E: 30+30@7°
F1: 50@10° F2, G: 60
F2: 50@10°
G: 50 or 50+30@10°
H: 80@10°
J: 80@8°
Hull Front, Lower A: 15@12°
B, C, D: 30@12°
E: 50@15°
F1: 50@12° 25
F2: 50@12°
G: 50 or 50+30@12°
H: 80@14°
J: 80@15°
Hull Sides, Upper A, B, C: 15@0°
D: 20@0°
E: 20+20@0°
F1: 30@0° F2, G, H, J: 30@0°
Hull Sides, Lower A, B, C: 15@0°
D: 20@0°
E: 20+20@0°
F1: 30@0° F2, G, H, J: 30@0°
Hull Rear A, B, C: 15@10°
D: 20@9° & 10°
E: 20@10° & 15°
F1: 20@9° & 12° F2: 20@0° & 20°
G: 20@9° & 12°
H: 20@8° & 11°
J: 20@10°
Hull Top 11
A, B, C, F1: 12@85°-90°
D, E: 12@84°-90° F2, G, H, J: 12@85°-90°
Hull Bottom A, B, C: 5@90°
D, E, F1: 10@90° F2, G, H, J: 10@90°
Turret Front A: 15@10°
mantlet: 15@round
B, C, D, E: 30@10°
mantlet: 30@round
D, E mantlet: 35@0°-29°
F1: 50@11°
mantlet: 50@0°-30° F2, G: 50@11°
mantlet: 50@0°-30°
H, J: 50@10
mantlet: 50@0°-30°
Turret Sides A, B, C: 15@25°
D: 20@25°
E: 20@24°
F1: 30@26° F2, G, H: 30@26°
J: 30@25°
Turret Rear A: 15@0°-25°
B, C: 15@0°-24°
D: 20@0°-24°
E: 20@14°
F1: 30@16° F2: 30@16°
G: 30@10°
H, J: 30@15°
Turret Top 10@83°-90° F2, G: 10@83°-90°
H: 15@84°-90°
J: 12@86 & 26@90°
Engine (Make / Model) Water cooled
A: Maybach HL 108TR
B, C: Maybach HL 120 TR
C, D, E, F1: Maybach HL 120 TRM F2, G, H: Maybach HL 120 TRM, Water cooled
Cylinders 12 12
Net HP A: 230
320 320
Transmission A: Synchromesh, ZF SFG 75, 5 forward, 1 reverse
B-F1: Synchromesh, ZF SSG 76, 6 forward, 1 reverse F2-J: ZF SSG 77, Synchromesh, 6 forward, 1 reverse
F2: ZF SSG 76, Synchromesh, 6 forward, 1 reverse
Fuel type Gasoline Gasoline
Octane B, C, D, E, F1: 74 74
Capacity 105 gallons
A-F1: 470 liters
A: Fuel usage per 100 km of road: 313 liters
B-F1: Fuel usage per 100 km of road: 235 liters F2: 105 gallons
F2-H: 470 liters
J: 680 liters
126 gallons
F2-H: Fuel usage per 100 km of road: 235 liters
J: Fuel usage per 100 km of road: 235 liters 227
Performance    
Traverse 360°, electric 360°, electric
J: hand
Max Speed A: 18.5, 19.3 mph, 30, 31 kph
B, C, D: 40 kph
E, F1: 42 kph
B, C, D, E, F1: 25 mph 25 mph
F2, G: 40 kph
H, J: 38 kph
Cross Country A: 17 kph
B: 11 mph
C-F1: 20 kph  11 mph
F2-J: 16 kph  
Road radius A: 150 km
B-F1: 200 km
C, D, E: 125 miles
A: Cross country: 100 km
C-F1: Cross country: 130 km  F2-H: 200 km
G, H: 125 miles, 210 km
J: 200 miles, 300 km
F2-H: Cross country: 130 km
J: Cross country: 180 km
Turning Radius A-F1: 5.92 m F2-J: 5.92 m
Elevation Limits -11° to +21°
A: -19° to +30°
B, C: -10° to +20°
D, E, F1: -8° to +20° -11° to +21°
F2, G, H: -8° to +20°
Fording depth A-C: 80 cm
D-F1: 1 m
C, D: 2' 7.5" F2, G: 1 m
H, J: 1.2 m
G, H, J: 3'
Trench crossing C, D: 7' 7"
A-D: 2.3 m
E, F1: 2.2 m  F2, G: 2.2 m
H, J: 2.35 m
G, H, J: 9'
Vertical Obstacle A-F1: 60 cm
C, D: 2' F2-J: 60 cm
G, H, J: 2' 6"
Suspension (Type) Leaf springs Leaf springs
Wheels each side 8x2 8x2
Return rollers each side 4x2 4x2
J: 3x2
Track length    
Tires    
Track width 15.75"
A-E: 38 m
F1: 40 cm 15.75"
F2-J: 40 cm  
Track centers/tread A-E: 2.39 m
F1: 2.45 m  F2: 2.45 m

[Turbot]

I have an Ostwind Question in Aircraft and Vehicles if anyone is in the know

http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=72419

[SirLoin]

Originally posted by Pyro
Thanks for the info guys.  I did some digging through a bunch of books today but couldn't find it.  Could one of you guys cite a source for the 14 deg/sec?  


Pyro,try http://www.battlefront.com BBS....Those guys from Combat Mission are hardcore WW2 vehicle junkies and can answer most any question.

[JB73]

Originally posted by Turbot
Google says the data is on this page - but the data fields come up blank in my browser (but I have foriegn languages turned off too)

In any case nice pictures diagrams and cut-aways, places for the data which I am pretty sure is there but I was unable to see:

http://www.chez.com/mythicpanzers/Panzer_!_Le_Mythe/Panzers/2-MediumPanzers/2-Pz.Kpfw_IV-2.html#Ausf.H
 

not empty fields.... just pure WHITE text LOLOL

the moron who made that site should be shot

[Jack55]

Pyro,

For questions regarding Armored Fighting Vehicals, a good source for information and recommended source material would be the forum at the address listed below.

http://63.99.108.76/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=AFV+Forum&number=13&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=

[Pooh21]

With a tray system going over  bumpy ground at 25 miles an hour youd think thered be 37mm rounds bouncing all over creation and falling out of their stupid little tray. Another thing when I put a few magazines through my 12 gauge the thing gets rather hot, But I had an ostwind the other day just held his trigger down at me for over a minute, As I was circling around him in my sturmovik. Must have went around him 6 complete times in circle 3k out from him and he sprayed the whole time. Shouldnt the accursed thing melt or start cooking off rounds or something?

[Fariz]

Originally posted by Mitsu
yes, if it's modelled, the ostie would be weakening, but it also would make the new tactics.

I'd like to see it.

Like this idea. 6 out, then some reload time. Great idea imho.

[Shiva]

Originally posted by Pyro
Mitsu, that gun was fed by clips but that did not require it to cease firing while another clip was loaded.  Rather, the clips were simply inserted onto a feed tray(IIRC the tray could hold 2 clips at a time).  As long as the loaders could toss clips on the feed tray faster than the gun fired them, there was no interruption.

For those of you who need a more visual reference, here's a picture:

[straffo]

Originally posted by Fariz
Like this idea. 6 out, then some reload time. Great idea imho.

Instead what about having a key for reloading (and having a max of 2 clips loaded)

[Shane]

i wanna know where the Osti had room for 1,000 rds?  towed trailer? people running around outside the vehicle to transfer mags? (and the implications of this when it's under a straffing run).