As I feared, the fatal flaw in the new Perk system shows up.

[culero]

Originally posted by Grizzly
It's about wanting to fight with planes using ACM. Base grabbing is the antithesis of this.

Not necessarily, depends on your own POV.

Vulching gangbanging and landgrabbing are arguably very realistic in a "real world warfare" sense. The first two, at least, require two sides fighting each other, in planes. Are these planes not using ACMs in their fighting? Are our own miltary pilots not taught to use these tactics when possible?

IMO, you're avoiding the real subject, which is most easily stated "different strokes for different folks". You'd like an arena where people could duel in planes, on terms that are fair, or at least manageable. That's OK, but other people like to simulate warfare, and warfare isn't about set piece dueling.

culero (likes baiting bears)

[Saurdaukar]

As I feared, another post about a numbers whine.  (and from a knight no less, what is the world coming to)

[jonnyb]

Mighty1, it is also very dependent on the plane you fly.  If you up the late war monsters, you don't earn perks as fast as you do landing kills in the early-war rides.  I regularly fly the P51B, and although I'm far from being a good stick, I always get at least 4-5 perks per sortie.  This can range upwards of 40-50 depending on how many and what kind of kills I manage to land.

I also very rarely use my perk points.  The only times you'll see me in a perked ride is when I up with guys from the squad for a "let's see how many guys we can get into a conga line behind us" sortie.  Nothing like driving a 262 low on the deck and watch everyone drop what they are doing to come shoot you down.  It's worth losing the 200 perks to see so many people do so many silly things .

[Grizzly]

Originally posted by culero
Not necessarily, depends on your own POV.

Vulching gangbanging and landgrabbing are arguably very realistic in a "real world warfare" sense. The first two, at least, require two sides fighting each other, in planes. Are these planes not using ACMs in their fighting? Are our own miltary pilots not taught to use these tactics when possible?

IMO, you're avoiding the real subject, which is most easily stated "different strokes for different folks". You'd like an arena where people could duel in planes, on terms that are fair, or at least manageable. That's OK, but other people like to simulate warfare, and warfare isn't about set piece dueling.

culero (likes baiting bears)

Bait away purdy boy  >=o)

But I don't disagree with a syllable you wrote.

Certainly in real life one would try to destroy the enemy without opposition, and that's perfectly appropriate in this game. But it is a game, and there are many ways to play to suite the players.

A capture the flag type game is great. Some like GV battles. I like the sea battles, especially at night. Some people enjoy going head to head with the enemy in fighters, some 1 on 1, others like furballs. Then there is the combination of flag capture and dogfighting where they fight over one or more bases using ACM. I suppose bomber types enjoy setting up a mission on strategic targets, laying a blanket of bombs across a group of factories... I can dig it.

My point was that if a country, even with greater numbers, isn't well organized to work together for the common objective of winning a reset, it could be because many of the players don't care about that and are spending their time playing a different type of game. It's all good... just like you said, different strokes for different folks.  =o/

[Grizzly]

Response to Culero continued:

I failed to expound on the antithesis thing.

In capture the flag (arena reset) play, the ends usually justify the means. The idea is to capture more bases faster. The best means by which to do this is not dogfighting, but avoiding dogfights to damage the base quicker. Certainly fights between airplanes occur, but it's better if they can be avoided. If you want to grab a base quick, I can think of two ways. One is to attack bases that are poorly defended, and the other is to use all your forces to overwhelm the opposition.

In game play where players use ACM to fight over a base, the means is the objective and base capture the reward. Though they both involve base capture, the entire character of the two types of game play is different, thus the antithesis.

But I do have a whine about all this. You especially enjoy scenario type play... a sort of aerial role playing immersed in realism. This is great too... but would be very hard to do in the same arena where others are playing capture the flag (you can't control the interferance, and when someone gets close to winning, the arena is porked). They're all good, just that flag capture can be intrusive. So bait me on that  >=o)

[culero]

Originally posted by Grizzly
In capture the flag (arena reset) play, the ends usually justify the means. The idea is to capture more bases faster. The best means by which to do this is not dogfighting, but avoiding dogfights to damage the base quicker.

snip

OK I see what you mean now - given that base captures happen the fastest when the opposition is either non-existant or successfully suppressed.

I just remember fondly the days in AW Big Pac when you steenking assed Az and those cowardly Bz would try to agress upon glorious Cz Land with sneak attacks designed to steal our fields, and us courageous Cz fighters would all have fun defending against the hordes. We liked to think that outnumbered or not, we were using our superior ACM skills to repel your foul advances


But I do have a whine about all this. You especially enjoy scenario type play... a sort of aerial role playing immersed in realism. This is great too... but would be very hard to do in the same arena where others are playing capture the flag (you can't control the interferance, and when someone gets close to winning, the arena is porked). They're all good, just that flag capture can be intrusive. So bait me on that  >=o) [/QUOTE]

Bah, arena whines, who cares? Arenas are just practice for scenarios anyway

culero

[TheCage]

The perk system works for me.....doesn't cost me a thing for my P38 .