Author Topic: Helmet & Seat Belt Laws (Read 1631 times)

SOB · « **on:** December 31, 2002, 03:50:42 PM »

I don't feel strongly either way, but I do lean toward supporting them. Purely from a monetary standpoint tho'...it costs money to get brains scooped off of pavement, and I would think that anyone not using these devices would be more likely to sustain serious injuries than those using them. Does insurance pay for all the costs involved - police, traffic backups, freeway closures (when fatalities are involved).

Whaddya think?

SOB

AKDejaVu · « **Reply #1 on:** December 31, 2002, 03:54:28 PM »

I'm for them because of the medical cost issues too. But I do realize that people may or may not like them for one reason or another and may chose not to observe that particular law. More power to them.

However... when they're in my car... I impose my views.

AKDejaVu

Sandman · « **Reply #2 on:** December 31, 2002, 04:24:12 PM »

Pretty much the same way DJV... if you're in my car, you're in a belt... or we're not moving.

It's not about anyone else's safety but my own. When/if I do get in an accident, I don't want any passengers flying into me.

I'm a firm believer in belts. I wouldn't be here if I didn't use them.

Airhead · « **Reply #3 on:** December 31, 2002, 04:48:47 PM »

I always buckle up, but I'm not so sure I should be fined by the Gov't. based upon the potential cost to society if I don't buckle up. Where do we draw the line? Do we start fining people because they're too fat or are wrecking thier livers with cheap booze?

Miko made this point in the "freedom" thread, and in the case of helmet laws, seat belt laws or other running with scissors laws I tend to agree with him. (Just not his right to pollute my air with his cigarette smoke.)

Sandman · « **Reply #4 on:** December 31, 2002, 04:57:52 PM »

Oh... guess I should add... If you would rather not use safety equipment, I'm all for personal choice and I disagree with helmet and safety belt laws...

It'll make the gene pool just that much deeper when you smear your brains all over the asphalt. That goes for your kids too. If you're not smart enough to strap 'em in, you shouldn't have 'em.

AKDejaVu · « **Reply #5 on:** December 31, 2002, 05:03:10 PM »

There isn't a line to draw. Its simply impossible to do so.

BTW... my views were predominately for seatbelt laws... for helmets I don't care because you're not really adding up medical bills but saving on them. Every scar I've ever had a motorcycle rider show me they got while wearing a helmet.

For seatbelts... I do think its the case. Its a low impact adjustment at worst. Besides, its tough to drive home child seatbelt regulations when allowing the adults to be unbuckled. And when it comes to people's children, I have no mixed feelings about it. If you want to piss me off on the highway, drive by me doing 70 with your kid standing up in the front seat.

I'm also not a proponent of stopping people for seatbelt violations. It should only be something that can be cited if the vehicle was stopped for another reason.

But that's just my take on it. I can't clearly define a "these things should be allowed and these shouldn't", but I do think that seatbelt laws are for the most part better.

AKDejaVu

hawk220 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 31, 2002, 05:38:01 PM »

I'd rather NO ONE wore seatbelts or helmets and drove really fast with a cocktail in one hand and a cell phone in the other. So when this moron blasts into a tree or over a cliff.. there's a higher chance of my donor pager going off saying I get his kidney.

morbid? yes.. welcome to my life.

capt. apathy · « **Reply #7 on:** December 31, 2002, 06:35:59 PM »

seatbelt/helmet laws suck. the gov't shouldn't be involved. they should be making laws to protect us from others not ourselves.

I wear a seatbelt every time I get in the car, and if you want to avoid walking you better buckle yours too. but thats my bussiness because it's my car. and your bussiness because it's your life but the gov't can butt the hell out.

helmet laws are another thing all together. helmets are dangerous, and I would never wear them on the street given a choice. but I can't really go any further than that today. it's new years, I don't want to open up that can of worms and start the new year on a rant.

beet1e · « **Reply #8 on:** January 01, 2003, 04:09:22 AM »

I think the seatbelt laws are a good idea because before they became a legal requirement here (on this day in 1983) only about 20% of people wore them. I was in the 20% because I never heard a convincing argument against them. Helmets became mandatory here in 1976. We used to have about 5000 deaths a year on the roads. With belts, helmets, better cars etc. that's down to about 3000. But remember! There's no substitute for safe driving. One of the best tips given in the IL driver manual that I had to study to get my US license, and I still remember it and apply it today, was "the right of way is a thing that should always be given, and never taken. If another driver makes a mistake or does not give way, give up your right of way rather than causing an accident"

Capt. Apathy I think you're overlooking the fact that if someone sustains injuries that could have been avoided by the wearing of a seatbelt, they may well be tying up medical resources which could have been usefully deployed elsewhere - hospital bed, surgeon etc.

One of the things that frustrated the hell out of Lee Iacocca, the former CEO of Chrysler, was that people were never prepared to pay for safety. If belts/airbags were offered as optional extras, the take up would be small. I think it was he who was instrumental in the development of airbags. He got a letter of thanks from a female motorist whose life was saved by the airbag.

AKDejaVu - Well, I think we've found something we can agree on! But I'm surprised you don't consider the helmet and belt laws as products of a nanny government.

capt. apathy · « **Reply #9 on:** January 01, 2003, 06:11:44 AM »

i didn't really over look it. it's just that in some way every action/decision we make effects every other one of us on some level or another. at some point we have to let people take responsability for themselves.

It's my opinion that alot of the moronic things people do is because they are so used to being told by authority (parents, teachers, law) what to do and what not to do they have no judgement skills of their own. how could they have these skills if they are never allowed to use them.

good decision making comes from experience, a lot of that comes from bad decision making

Ping · « **Reply #10 on:** January 01, 2003, 06:21:15 AM »

As regards seat belts:
I detest Government involvement in protecting us from ourselves, However, If you were to invent something today that caused or allowed so many fatalities in its use, It would never be allowed to market.
Manufactures should be required to make sure that their products are safe allowing for normal use.
You cant tell if you are going to hit black ice, deer, errant motorists. Shucks..you may even unwittingly take a corner a tad fast and hit the soft shoulder.
Seatbelts and airbags really arent so muct to protect us from ourselves as they are to allow for unforseen circumstance.

As someone else mentioned, I personally dont want to get hit by a 130-200 pound missile in an accident.

My take on it.

lazs2 · « **Reply #11 on:** January 01, 2003, 10:57:31 AM »

I believe that seatbelts should be provided in cars... I believe that if someone wants me to wear a belt in their car that I should. I believe that helmets should be mandatoryu for children for bikes and scoots. I believe as an adult that I am capable of making my own decision. I personaly find that the current 'shoulder belt' sucks... It rubs me raw in the neck and is distracting. I have lap belts and use em in both my cars but that is my decision. I quit riding motorcycles before helmets became mandatory. If I take a motorcycle around the block or for a short ride I don't wear a helmet. I never wore a helmet and was involved in several (or more) motorcycle accidents that required ambulance rides... I never sustained a head injury... In all that time rideing I never knew of anyone sustaining a serious head injury that didn't heal faster than a broken leg or.... simply kill him.

The cost? be careful... I don't care about the cost. I don't want the government put in charge of any more facets of my life...I find that they simply run amuck and do an unfair and piss poor job everytime. I wouldn't trade the "cost" of the government running peoples lives for the "cost" of medical increases or decreases. So far as I know.... not one study has shown a savings in medical expenses for motorcycle injuries in states that have helmet laws.
I have about one ticket a year for driving without a seat belt. I make my kids wear seat belts when they are with me.

I don't know but I would say that the "cost" in taxes, for government programs... is far higher than the "cost" in medical expenses, for people to make their own decisions about their lives.... I mean.... look at england.
lazs

eskimo2 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 01, 2003, 11:11:35 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by hawk220
I'd rather NO ONE wore seatbelts or helmets and drove really fast with a cocktail in one hand and a cell phone in the other. So when this moron blasts into a tree or over a cliff.. there's a higher chance of my donor pager going off saying I get his kidney.

morbid? yes.. welcome to my life.

Are you serious (about needing a kidney)?

If so, I hope that you get one soon.

eskimo

beet1e · « **Reply #13 on:** January 01, 2003, 11:22:05 AM »

Lazs -

Quote

I personaly find that the current 'shoulder belt' sucks... It rubs me raw in the neck and is distracting.

How tall are you? I have a slight problem with my Beetle seat belt, but modern cars like the Golf have a diagonal belt whose height can be adjusted. I prefer to set mine quite low so that the belt flows over my shoulder. Look on the bright side, Lazs - at least neither of your cars has that idiotic system whereby the belt is connected to the door frame and runs round a track... lol!

lazs2 · « **Reply #14 on:** January 01, 2003, 12:18:40 PM »

neither of my cars has the idiotic factory shoulder harness.

I think helmet laws are a huge infringement of personal freedom by a nanny government. I believe they should butt out.

I believe it all started with womens sufferage and that we need to end womens sufferage now.
lazs