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Author Topic: Ja sind unsere Kinder in guten Händen.  (Read 2384 times)

Offline midnight Target

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Ja sind unsere Kinder in guten Händen.
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2003, 11:34:10 AM »
Too many liberals on this board now...

Makin me sound ........   ordinary.

What apathy said BTW.
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Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2003, 11:39:38 AM »
Just because he didn't recite the pledge doesn't mean someday he may not be fighting for the constitution.

Reciting the pledge and waving a flag doesn't make you more American than this kid... it doesn't make you more anything except obnoxious when you think every one in America needs to do it or else they aren't American.
-SW
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Offline SaburoS

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« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2003, 11:58:45 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Raubvogel
I say they make the kid stand outside the country while they exercise the Constitution.


Please show me where in the Constitution the passage of any citizen having to pledge allegience.
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Men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth -- more than ruin -- more even than death.... Thought is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, thought is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. ... Bertrand Russell

Offline SaburoS

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« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2003, 12:12:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by H. Godwineson
Give him a free ticket to whatever country he would prefer to live in.

Shuckins


Why in the world should he move? He is exercising his basic rights and freedoms. Trust me that American Democracy will not fall just because a few citizens decide that they wish not to pledge allegience to the flag.

***********
"I believe the flag is a symbol of the government, and I think it's corrupt and I don't agree with some of the choices it made," he said.
***********
Kearney disputed Laven's claim. She contended that when her son presented a packet of information about students' rights to refuse to say the pledge, Laven threw the materials into a trash can and said he didn't care what the law is.
***********

Of the above two statements, which do you feel is the more dangerous position (for American Democracy) for one to take?

1) One exercising his rights?
or
2) One not caring what the law is?

Not a good thing for a teacher to demonstrate to the students that they shouldn't have to care what the law is.
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Men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth -- more than ruin -- more even than death.... Thought is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, thought is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. ... Bertrand Russell

Offline weazel

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« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2003, 12:28:31 PM »
"Kearney disputed Laven's claim. She contended that when her son presented a packet of information about students' rights to refuse to say the pledge, Laven threw the materials into a trash can and said he didn't care what the law is."



Heil Chimpler!  :D

Keep up the fight Saburo.
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Offline SaburoS

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« Reply #20 on: January 15, 2003, 01:05:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by capt. apathy
why is it when people exercise their rights as an American they are labled 'unAmerican'?  I find people who let their or others rights be violated much more unAmerican than your average trouble maker.

this little dipshit has a right to not do the pledge.  he has a right to be treated with respect and common curtesy inspite of his decision.  no matter how much you want to slap him, he is within his rights as an American.  and he has a better grasp on what it is to be an American than this teacher who thinks people should be punished or ostracized for expressing their beliefs.


Ok, who are you and what happened to capt. apathy?!

Hehe   S!

"this little dipshit has a right to not do the pledge.  he has a right to be treated with respect and common curtesy inspite of his decision."

Hehe ;)
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Men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth -- more than ruin -- more even than death.... Thought is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, thought is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. ... Bertrand Russell

Offline AKIron

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« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2003, 01:14:02 PM »
Help me understand, a history teacher, maybe a bit over zealous in his/her patriotism should be fired for sending a student out of the room for refusing to say the pledge of allegiance? Who's over reacting here?
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Offline capt. apathy

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« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2003, 01:19:17 PM »
no but there should be some form of disciplinary action for civil rights violations.

btw- in every school I attended (we moved a lot, so I have a fairly wide frame of reference) the history teachers also taught civics.  he should have known better.
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Offline Dead Man Flying

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« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2003, 01:25:26 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
lemme see now... i wont pledge allegence to the flag ,but i want protection for MY constutitional rights............


Not pledging allegiance to the flag is a protected constitutional right.  It's amazing that you're unable to see this.

-- Todd/Leviathn
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Offline AKIron

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« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2003, 01:27:14 PM »
Well, I guess we don't want our teachers passing on any of their values or morals to our kids do we?

What we really need are sterile, uniform, state designed cirriculum fed to them by unbiased computers, right?
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Offline SaburoS

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« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2003, 01:27:38 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by AKIron
Help me understand, a history teacher, maybe a bit over zealous in his/her patriotism should be fired for sending a student out of the room for refusing to say the pledge of allegiance? Who's over reacting here?


I would label the history teacher a fanatic, not a patriot. I personally don't feel the teacher should be fired, just edjucated about the laws that he should abide by. I consider the 8th grader to be more of an American patriot than the teacher. He is exercising his rights. The teacher was breaking the law/regulations.
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Men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth -- more than ruin -- more even than death.... Thought is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, thought is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. ... Bertrand Russell

Offline SaburoS

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« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2003, 01:32:14 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by AKIron
Well, I guess we don't want our teachers passing on any of their values or morals to our kids do we?

What we really need are sterile, uniform, state designed cirriculum fed to them by unbiased computers, right?


What values? That it is okay to disregard laws we don't agree with? I personally would like our kids to be taught the values of respect. Respect of others, the laws, the Constitution, etc.
The teachers are there to teach about the subject the class is there for. Leave the teaching of 'morals' for the parents.
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Men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth -- more than ruin -- more even than death.... Thought is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, thought is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. ... Bertrand Russell

Offline SaburoS

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« Reply #27 on: January 15, 2003, 01:36:28 PM »
Here's a simple Constitutional test for you all:

Is it lawful for one to burn the American flag in protest of what ever they're protesting?

Not saying one cannot, or should not feel angry about a protester's actions of flag burning, but is it legal?
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Men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth -- more than ruin -- more even than death.... Thought is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, thought is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. ... Bertrand Russell

Offline AKIron

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« Reply #28 on: January 15, 2003, 01:37:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SaburoS
What values? That it is okay to disregard laws we don't agree with? I personally would like our kids to be taught the values of respect. Respect of others, the laws, the Constitution, etc.
The teachers are there to teach about the subject the class is there for. Leave the teaching of 'morals' for the parents.


Since when is it illegal to say the "Pledge of Allegiance" in school? Since when is it illegal for a teacher to send a disruptive student out of class?

Ok, so you would prefer the computers, you may get your wish.

Time to turn the "Sig Heil" around on you libs.
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Offline AKIron

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« Reply #29 on: January 15, 2003, 01:38:44 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SaburoS
Here's a simple Constitutional test for you all:

Is it lawful for one to burn the American flag in protest of what ever they're protesting?

Not saying one cannot, or should not feel angry about a protester's actions of flag burning, but is it legal?


Not in school it isn't.
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