Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Raptor on September 16, 2009, 03:21:40 PM
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This is not a Jeep Cherokee!
(http://jeepgrandcherokee.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/2010.jpg)
Chrysler’s big debut at the New York Auto Show this year is the 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, which has been fully redesigned from the ground up. The new SUV is built on a proven rear-wheel-drive unibody platform sharing the same underpinnings as the Mercedes-Benz ML-Class
Rear wheel drive in a Jeep? Now that's just wrong
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Travesty
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So, it is a Jeep Pacifica.
Ouch.
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Looks similar to this:
(http://blog.marketplace.nwsource.com/nwautos/052809_MercedesSUV_604x372.jpg)
Still waaaay over my salary cap...I'd have to live in the thing for 5 years.
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Did they put back the headroom they yanked out in 2005?
Dumb #$!@#$!s
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My wrangler would make it up the hood of that thing very easily.
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The Grand Cherokee has never been one of Jeep's true off road vehicles. It's always been the cushy cruiser with the badge of the bad boys. I've got no issues with them going whole hog with the concept instead of half-***ing it.
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That's a horrible chop. Is that really the new Grand? Jeep needs only two vehicles- a Wrangler, and a Cherokee- a real Cherokee. These glorified mallrat shortbuses are all crap, I don't care whose platform they use. It's a shame, really- the XJ platform set the stage for the SUV in America, and now they're reduced to just making copycats.
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HORRIBLE!!!!!!
see i hated it when they changed it in 05, but my sister/brother-in-law got a brand new one last year 09 i believe is the model, but it might have been an 08, and have since fell in love with them! i want an 05 (since it will be the only one in my price range ATM) with the dark tan/brown color exterior. it has to have a moonroof and leather, so im up to the limited at least.
by my god that it absolutely horrible! i absolutely hate when they make SUV's have the roof slant down like that...
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the 08, 09 versions looked more like the Cherokee I am use to (first car was a 95, they brought back the boxy look).
The 2010 looked like am explorer with a jeep's front, but still better than the 2011...
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you must mean the 2011 Jeep is FWD, as I recall current and past Jeeps have always been RWD or AWD.
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These are SUVs...everything else is soccer mom scrap metal:
(http://www.server7.com/images/BSG/special/z2008pres1.jpg)
(http://www.cargurus.com/images/2008/03/28/07/50/pic-47937.jpeg)
(http://z.about.com/d/4wheeldrive/1/0/s/T/1/Chuck_TX_76ChevBlaz_1RR.jpg)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nYfxIfAHoRc/SaL-Ixt4nrI/AAAAAAAAAis/d4xCYR3tUiI/s400/scout2.JPG)
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1970-1990s - SUV = Super Uber Vehicle
-- to 2009 - SUV = Suddenly Useless Vehicle
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Rear wheel drive in a Jeep? Now that's just wrong
Ummm? OK? Cherokee's have always been RWD and unibody what's the difference? :huh
RWD is fine, It's the unibody construction that I've never liked in the Chrysler era Jeeps. That and the less than stellar reliability of the Chrysler drivetrains, and the shoddy suspension and linkage components in the Wranglers (unless you spent and extra $7,000 for the Rubicon)
I'd love an old CJ5, or Willys, but I've never been impressed by the Chrysler Jeeps, speaking in terms of there off-road capabilities, and reliability. Which I guess may not matter since many people just buy them for the looks.
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anybody notice that the whole front bumber, grill, and side panels are all joined? thats going to suck when you get into a fender-bender and all you would have to replace is just the bumper...
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[quote I'd love an old CJ5, or Willys, [/quote]
Those are only "Jeeps" because they currently "Own the name"...
THIS is a JEEP!!! 72 CJ5 Renegade, 360v8, all the hotrod goodies... Gets about 4 miles per gallon!!! LOL!!!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/GMpassside1.jpg)
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I have a 2 wheel drive jeep. It does great and gets decent gas mileage.
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anybody notice that the whole front bumber, grill, and side panels are all joined? thats going to suck when you get into a fender-bender and all you would have to replace is just the bumper...
Thats a composite photo, notice no reflection in the window. Its not a real vehicle.
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[quote I'd love an old CJ5, or Willys,
Those are only "Jeeps" because they currently "Own the name"...
THIS is a JEEP!!! 72 CJ5 Renegade, 360v8, all the hotrod goodies... Gets about 4 miles per gallon!!! LOL!!!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/GMpassside1.jpg)
Suspension lift, or body lift? That's diddlying nasty either way.
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It has a 2 1/2 inch suspension lift, and a 3 inch body lift... Springs are 9 leaf front, and 11 leaf rear, very rare.
I didn't want to go any higher, for many reasons..... Mostly because my wife is 5'4", and my girlfriend is 5'1".. So, If it was any taller, they'd need stirrups to climb in... Stirrups and steps, are stupid looking IMO... Also, it has the 80inch wheelbase, these tend to flip endwise if you go silly high... (its a "real Jeep" thing)
All original Jeep body too... Spent countless hours welding and grinding all the drill holes, and cracks..
Was worth it for the end result tho!!!
I took the springs to the springshop, (Wrightway Spring- Tacoma WA) to be recurved and bound, they wanted to trade for a new set of those junker 6" Superlift springs, LOL!! I'm too old to fall for a sucker play like that!!!
When they quit making the CJ, in 83 I think, the true "JEEP" bloodline ended...
They just use the name for marketing reasons now...
RC
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Ummm? OK? Cherokee's have always been RWD and unibody what's the difference? :huh
RWD is fine, It's the unibody construction that I've never liked in the Chrysler era Jeeps.
My 91 Cherokee certainly had frame rails.
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HORRIBLE!!!!!!
see i hated it when they changed it in 05, but my sister/brother-in-law got a brand new one last year 09 i believe is the model, but it might have been an 08, and have since fell in love with them! i want an 05 (since it will be the only one in my price range ATM) with the dark tan/brown color exterior. it has to have a moonroof and leather, so im up to the limited at least.
by my god that it absolutely horrible! i absolutely hate when they make SUV's have the roof slant down like that...
A total utility vehicle for sure :confused:
Anyone looking for a carpet for a TJ ?
I took mine out the day I bought it.
It's in mint condition ..............
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Ummm? OK? Cherokee's have always been RWD and unibody what's the difference? :huh
RWD is fine, It's the unibody construction that I've never liked in the Chrysler era Jeeps. That and the less than stellar reliability of the Chrysler drivetrains, and the shoddy suspension and linkage components in the Wranglers (unless you spent and extra $7,000 for the Rubicon)
I'd love an old CJ5, or Willys, but I've never been impressed by the Chrysler Jeeps, speaking in terms of there off-road capabilities, and reliability. Which I guess may not matter since many people just buy them for the looks.
I'm sorry that you have that opinion of their capabilities.
Not all of us buy them as garage queens.
Mine has been washed ONCE since I bought it, and that was by my friend when he wanted to borrow it. (He said it needed to be clean for his wife) My daughter was PISSED for washing off her birthday mud. (We went wheeling on her B-day)
When my friend came back with the Jeep cleaned, my daughter went to her closet and brought a skirt down and asked my buddy if he wanted to borrow that too :rofl
(http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff107/tymekeepyr/0515091555.jpg)
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IMO, if you want off roading capabilities...only one way to go
(http://www.roversnorth.com/web/mediagallery/wallpaper/image/kalimantan96047.jpg)
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Roads are just one more useless waste of government spending
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Mostly because my wife is 5'4", and my girlfriend is 5'1"..
:lol
When my friend came back with the Jeep cleaned, my daughter went to her closet and brought a skirt down and asked my buddy if he wanted to borrow that too :rofl
Good girl. :D
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Mostly because my wife is 5'4", and my girlfriend is 5'1"..
:huh :confused: Wait...say that again? Must have an interesting side show going on there...some place I can find videos? :D
My 91 Cherokee certainly had frame rails.
91 Cherokee had 1/2 frame rails connected to the unibody rail slots...not sure if it was just the XJ model or all of them.
IMO, if you want off roading capabilities...only one way to go
(http://www.roversnorth.com/web/mediagallery/wallpaper/image/kalimantan96047.jpg)
OK...so tell me that an average working Joe without a major grant funded expedition going on or some other way of replacing the thing is going to pay 50k for a new Land Rover and then proceed to take it off roading like he would a 75 Chevy Blazer. Probability factor of .0001.
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I'm sorry that you have that opinion of their capabilities.
Not all of us buy them as garage queens.
Mine has been washed ONCE since I bought it, and that was by my friend when he wanted to borrow it. (He said it needed to be clean for his wife) My daughter was PISSED for washing off her birthday mud. (We went wheeling on her B-day)
:aok
Love all these "Real Jeep Owners" Comments. Of course half of them think "wheeling" is climbing the curb at the Wal-Mart parking lot.
Bottom Line, The new JK is one of the most capable off Road Jeeps ever produced period. I'd love to see any of these so called "real jeepers" out with us.
(http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs161.snc1/6014_1216259967683_1264355985_30625887_749962_n.jpg)
(http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs161.snc1/6014_1216255007559_1264355985)
(http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs181.snc1/6014_1216248847405_1264355985_30625848_3869151_n.jpg)
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:aok
Love all these "Real Jeep Owners" Comments. Of course half of them think "wheeling" is climbing the curb at the Wal-Mart parking lot.
Bottom Line, The new JK is one of the most capable off Road Jeeps ever produced period. I'd love to see any of these so called "real jeepers" out with us.
(http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs161.snc1/6014_1216259967683_1264355985_30625887_749962_n.jpg)
(http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs161.snc1/6014_1216255007559_1264355985)
(http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs181.snc1/6014_1216248847405_1264355985_30625848_3869151_n.jpg)
To be honest, that photo is one of the first times I have seen a JK covered in mud. Around here, for the most part, they all have nice shiny wheels and no "custom pinstriping" It looks a lot less like a soccer mom's grocery getter :D
My wife's boss just traded in his TJ for a JK and keeps talking about lifting it, going wheeling with me, etc. I have yet to see him in with it in anything but a spotless, pristine state.
EDIT: I don't know where you live, but we are making a run in the New Jersey Pine Barrens next Saturday :D
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OK...so tell me that an average working Joe without a major grant funded expedition going on or some other way of replacing the thing is going to pay 50k for a new Land Rover and then proceed to take it off roading like he would a 75 Chevy Blazer. Probability factor of .0001.
Actually you can pick up a mid to late 90 Discovery 1 or 2 from anywhere between 3k-5k.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/White-Land-Rover-Disco2-Tan-Leather-inter-roofrack_W0QQitemZ130331479939QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_Cars_Trucks?hash=item1e585c8f83&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245
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To be honest, that photo is one of the first times I have seen a JK covered in mud. Around here, for the most part, they all have nice shiny wheels and no "custom pinstriping" It looks a lot less like a soccer mom's grocery getter :D
My wife's boss just traded in his TJ for a JK and keeps talking about lifting it, going wheeling with me, etc. I have yet to see him in with it in anything but a spotless, pristine state.
EDIT: I don't know where you live, but we are making a run in the New Jersey Pine Barrens next Saturday :D
Thanks, I am in PA and we wheel year round here and in VA
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r213/joanfstel/112.jpg)
These two friends of mine are massivley built "School Buses (Unlimiteds)" One has already goten the 6.1 Hemi Conversion and Dana 60's Front and Rear
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r213/joanfstel/230.jpg)
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r213/joanfstel/IMG_1581.jpg)
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"Climbin the curb at the local Walmart?" Thats funny, LOL!!! That must be where ya found those tinkertoys...
If those weenie rigs are your speed, then you should stay in PA.... They'd be found wanting around here!!!
Local 4x4 guys are always dragging those late model rigs out of the woods with major pieces missing, lol!!!
A couple of those "clubbers" upside down at the bottom of a hill, or 50ft down a ravine, is always good for a laugh... Especially when their buddies have to come into town, looking for help to drag them out...
RC
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Just by your writing and distain for new model equipment, I can tell in second you are not the real deal.
It don't matter out here whether you run an old Flattie, CJ, TJ, JK, M or whatever. We all wheel togther and work on each others rigs just the same.
Tell you what myself and a bunch of my other friends with these wennie rigs are coming out west for EJS in Moab in April. More than happy to have you join us, so you can show us all up.
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Nice pics rstel, that black Rubicon is sweet :aok
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My 95 Jeep Cherokee may not have been a complete off roading vehicle, but it sure has gotten me out of some sticky situations. Coming from the mountains of NC, I was always one of the few vehicles driving all the way home and not parking at the bottom of the hill because of ice.
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Tell you what myself and a bunch of my other friends with these wennie rigs are coming out west for EJS in Moab in April. More than happy to have you join us, so you can show us all up.
I will never go to EJS, here's why.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkKuf43Ehao
Bunch of drunk, crude a--holes. Now I know that not everyone at EJS acts this way, in fact I would bet they are in the minority, but they are the ones that ruin it for people like me. I much prefer to go wheeling in small groups or alone, I want to enjoy solitude in nature, not get yelled at by a bunch of drunkards.
As for late model Jeeps, they have become very trendy, and I despise trendiness. :cool:
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IMO, if you want off roading capabilities...only one way to go
(http://www.roversnorth.com/web/mediagallery/wallpaper/image/kalimantan96047.jpg)
You're kidding right? There are places I can take my JK Wrangler or my CJ-5 that a Range Rover Discovery couldn't get to without being airlifted. Brother, unless you're into off road adventures, the Discovery may seem capable. But, not without spending a great deal of money to upgrade just about everything.
My regards,
Widewing
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anybody notice that the whole front bumber, grill, and side panels are all joined? thats going to suck when you get into a fender-bender and all you would have to replace is just the bumper...
Not exactly. Parts can be attached to one another with weak points. Such as the hood having a weak point by the middle. It can have other materials or paints over it to make it smooth and a higher MPG %.
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To be honest, that photo is one of the first times I have seen a JK covered in mud. Around here, for the most part, they all have nice shiny wheels and no "custom pinstriping" It looks a lot less like a soccer mom's grocery getter :D
My wife's boss just traded in his TJ for a JK and keeps talking about lifting it, going wheeling with me, etc. I have yet to see him in with it in anything but a spotless, pristine state.
EDIT: I don't know where you live, but we are making a run in the New Jersey Pine Barrens next Saturday :D
To see my JK today would be to assume it never sees mud or dirt. Of course, I spent four hours cleaning it this morning to remove the mud from yesterday's run through the Pine Barrens out in Calverton.
I even washed the underside (a brush on an extending handle). However, there's still some mud remaining. prior to washing it, I put an oscillating lawn sprinkler under it early this morning... The driveway was a river of mud.
The biggest pain in the neck is getting the mud stains off of the plastic flairs.. I found a plastic cleaner that works, albeit with some effort. After washing, I waxed it and shined up the tires. Looks like the perfect mall crawler now... :o
It's getting new springs and gas shocks in the next week or two... Courtesy of Jeep, who screwed up on the original build. I should have the same suspension as a Rubicon, per my build sheet. However, they only installed the Rubicon springs in back, with standard duty suspension springs on front. It was supposed to have Rubicon's gas shocks... Yeah, they missed that too. The factory rep tried to downplay the screw-up. That only pissed me off more and I suggested that we resolve the issue in small claims court. Then they wanted to negotiate. I told them that there is nothing to negotiate, I have the build sheet stating what was supposed to be installed and what I paid for. End of discussion. So, now I'm demanding the correct suspension be installed and that some other means of compensation be agreed to. After all, had I not discovered the error, I'd have been screwed out of $400 in hardware, which I paid for.
So, how did I figure this out? The VIN number tells much about a Jeep. My VIN number should have had a G as the 4th digit. Instead, It has a F, indicating standard duty suspension. The dealer ran the spring and shock part numbers, which confirmed this. Thus, the heavy duty suspension option was not installed during the build.... My dealer is also unhappy.. A pissed off customer is not what they want, especially one that buys from them very 4 or 5 years since 1979 (we bought from them in 1979, 1982, 1986, 1991, 1994, 1999, 2003 and 2008).
Apparently, more than 300 Wranglers built in February and March of 2008 did not get the heavy duty suspension installed as they were supposed to. It seems that incorrect VIN and option codes were entered into the production system, and the factory builds by scanning the bar code on the build sheet. That, at least, was the rep's explanation.
My regards,
Widewing
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"Climbin the curb at the local Walmart?" Thats funny, LOL!!! That must be where ya found those tinkertoys...
If those weenie rigs are your speed, then you should stay in PA.... They'd be found wanting around here!!!
Local 4x4 guys are always dragging those late model rigs out of the woods with major pieces missing, lol!!!
A couple of those "clubbers" upside down at the bottom of a hill, or 50ft down a ravine, is always good for a laugh... Especially when their buddies have to come into town, looking for help to drag them out...
RC
And your off road rig is......?
My regards,
Widewing
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1970-1990s - SUV = Super Uber Vehicle
-- to 2009 - SUV = Suddenly Useless Vehicle
:rofl, you nail it on the spot.
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And your off road rig is......?
My regards,
Widewing
Which one?? I have many offroad vehicles, LOL!!! If ya mean my Jeep, Check the top of the second page in this thread, there ya go.... :D
Hey widewing, ya see your sig, thats no joke... With my Jeep, I can do that to ppl for REAL!!! When I tell someone to hang on, they better DO IT, or they go flyin, LOL!!!
rstel, why would I wanna go to a dry, nasty, crusty place, like Moab Utah, UGH? Especially when I live sandwiched between the Pacific Ocean and Oly National Park, surrounded by a thousand square miles of virgin wilderness.. For 99.9% of clubbers, 4x4'in is a weekend ditty that they do.. But, I LIVE IT, Every day!!
I don't have a Jeep, because its "cool"... I have it, because I NEED it!!! Thats as "Real", as it gets..!
And one of those late model "FeyJays", (as my wife calls them), just won't cut the mustard!!
Man, even in this day and age, ppl head up into the woods around here, and just disappear.. Till some local guy like me, years later, finds their rig at the bottom of a cliff, or their frozen bodies stuck in the boughs of a giant fir tree.. I did the "explorer search and rescue thing" for many years.. Seen it all!! But, I'm gettin a little too old to be searchin for lost dingleberrys in the woods anymore... So, now its, "No skin off my nose, they went too high, and got what they asked for!!" Life goes on, and they should'a stayed on the flatland!!!
Besides, I'm not the yuppy clone type of Jeep owner, so I doubt if I'd fit in with the rest of those "Real Jeepers" in Moab, LOL!!!
LOL, I'm not real? Holy smokes, LOL!!! I'm very "real", just not a dilettante!!!
RC
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This smiley is so handy...ahh.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff255/OOZ662/rolleyes.gif)
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Which one?? I have many offroad vehicles, LOL!!! If ya mean my Jeep, Check the top of the second page in this thread, there ya go.... :D
Hey widewing, ya see your sig, thats no joke... With my Jeep, I can do that to ppl for REAL!!! When I tell someone to hang on, they better DO IT, or they go flyin, LOL!!!
rstel, why would I wanna go to a dry, nasty, crusty place, like Moab Utah, UGH? Especially when I live sandwiched between the Pacific Ocean and Oly National Park, surrounded by a thousand square miles of virgin wilderness.. For 99.9% of clubbers, 4x4'in is a weekend ditty that they do.. But, I LIVE IT, Every day!!
I don't have a Jeep, because its "cool"... I have it, because I NEED it!!! Thats as "Real", as it gets..!
And one of those late model "FeyJays", (as my wife calls them), just won't cut the mustard!!
Man, even in this day and age, ppl head up into the woods around here, and just disappear.. Till some local guy like me, years later, finds their rig at the bottom of a cliff, or their frozen bodies stuck in the boughs of a giant fir tree.. I did the "explorer search and rescue thing" for many years.. Seen it all!! But, I'm gettin a little too old to be searchin for lost dingleberrys in the woods anymore... So, now its, "No skin off my nose, they went too high, and got what they asked for!!" Life goes on, and they should'a stayed on the flatland!!!
Besides, I'm not the yuppy clone type of Jeep owner, so I doubt if I'd fit in with the rest of those "Real Jeepers" in Moab, LOL!!!
LOL, I'm not real? Holy smokes, LOL!!! I'm very "real", just not a dilettante!!!
RC
LOLOL Ya gotta love a guy with a CJ-5.... My '63 had a hood though... ;) Buick 231ci Turbo, welded roll cage, suspension lift, 2" body lift, 36" Cepeks. Rancho shocks and damper. Only rolled it once in the dunes. No real harm other than dumping my cooler. I was finding sand in it 6 months later. LOLOL It was about as stable as Charlie Manson....
Getting lost, breaking down or simply screwing up in the woods is common.. Which is why we never venture into the forest alone. Usually a sizable group. One friend has a VHF radio.
My regards,
Widewing
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You're kidding right? There are places I can take my JK Wrangler or my CJ-5 that a Range Rover Discovery couldn't get to without being airlifted. Brother, unless you're into off road adventures, the Discovery may seem capable. But, not without spending a great deal of money to upgrade just about everything.
Haven't spent nearly as much as some of the Jeepies...good set of tires, different springs, rear diff has an ARB...no airlift required for this Jeep Recovery Vehicle. Maybe there's 4500 in the whole truck. But like most of the Jeep guys I know, they are only open to their rides, too bad their egos are as big as some of their tires.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/n1328645816_30133875_7989.jpg)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/3002_1067232684237_1328645816_30219.jpg)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/3002_1066366782590_1328645816_30217.jpg)
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Yeah, goin out into territory that is completely foreign can be dangerous, especially around here.. A radio is a good idea, but there aren't many that monitor anymore.. Just make sure its a stout unit, 100watts min, or you'll be pissin in the wind, tryin to get a signal out of the canyons hereabouts...
That jeep is a blast, the genuine glow green paint, turns you green if you stand near it, LOL!! My wife and girlfriend like to cruz around town shopping, doin the Daisy Duke thing, (Short short cutoffs, and Halter tops) I get a kick out of watchin the guys drool... Jeep guys in particular, when these two hot chicks come blazin up in a gnarly CJ5, and all they have is their little weenie ?J's.. Their ego's get shriveled up pretty quick, LOL!! Last June, on my birthday, I was down at the bar, having a beer lunch.. It was a saturday, so the Tav was packed with tourists and bikers cruzin the Olympic Hwy 101 Loop.. My honeys come roarin up to the beergarten in the GreenieMeenie, with flowers and balloons, jump down, knockers bouncin, run up and lay some big lipstick kisses on me, sit on my lap while I finish my "lunch"... There were lots of green faces, green with envy!!! Cat calls, and bikers tryin to buy the girls drinks, LOL!!! Gettin turned down!!! LOL!!! The bar owner is an friend, so I stowed my streetbike in his garage, and I finally let them drag me back home (before any fights started) so they could give me my "Birthday Present" :D :devil
If I said, "Life is good", it would be a MASSIVE understatement, LOL!!!
:salute all
RC
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To see my JK today would be to assume it never sees mud or dirt. Of course, I spent four hours cleaning it this morning to remove the mud from yesterday's run through the Pine Barrens out in Calverton.
I even washed the underside (a brush on an extending handle). However, there's still some mud remaining. prior to washing it, I put an oscillating lawn sprinkler under it early this morning... The driveway was a river of mud.
The biggest pain in the neck is getting the mud stains off of the plastic flairs.. I found a plastic cleaner that works, albeit with some effort. After washing, I waxed it and shined up the tires. Looks like the perfect mall crawler now... :o
It's getting new springs and gas shocks in the next week or two... Courtesy of Jeep, who screwed up on the original build. I should have the same suspension as a Rubicon, per my build sheet. However, they only installed the Rubicon springs in back, with standard duty suspension springs on front. It was supposed to have Rubicon's gas shocks... Yeah, they missed that too. The factory rep tried to downplay the screw-up. That only pissed me off more and I suggested that we resolve the issue in small claims court. Then they wanted to negotiate. I told them that there is nothing to negotiate, I have the build sheet stating what was supposed to be installed and what I paid for. End of discussion. So, now I'm demanding the correct suspension be installed and that some other means of compensation be agreed to. After all, had I not discovered the error, I'd have been screwed out of $400 in hardware, which I paid for.
So, how did I figure this out? The VIN number tells much about a Jeep. My VIN number should have had a G as the 4th digit. Instead, It has a F, indicating standard duty suspension. The dealer ran the spring and shock part numbers, which confirmed this. Thus, the heavy duty suspension option was not installed during the build.... My dealer is also unhappy.. A pissed off customer is not what they want, especially one that buys from them very 4 or 5 years since 1979 (we bought from them in 1979, 1982, 1986, 1991, 1994, 1999, 2003 and 2008).
Apparently, more than 300 Wranglers built in February and March of 2008 did not get the heavy duty suspension installed as they were supposed to. It seems that incorrect VIN and option codes were entered into the production system, and the factory builds by scanning the bar code on the build sheet. That, at least, was the rep's explanation.
My regards,
Widewing
Don't get me wrong Widewing, I know there are plenty of guys that don't keep them as garage queens, just not around here. There aren't to many places near Philly where one really needs something as capable in bad conditions as a Jeep, until winter. Even then, I wish most 4x4 owners around here would just buy something else and stay the hell off of the road when it snows. Having a 4x4 and no bad weather diving experience just gives most people false confidence and enables them be able to get stuck worse than normal.
I also don't want to be offensive but, at first, (the JK's) seemed very strange looking, but I'm getting used to it :)
I'm glad you got your dealer squared away :aok
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Haven't spent nearly as much as some of the Jeepies...good set of tires, different springs, rear diff has an ARB...no airlift required for this Jeep Recovery Vehicle. Maybe there's 4500 in the whole truck. But like most of the Jeep guys I know, they are only open to their rides, too bad their egos are as big as some of their tires.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/n1328645816_30133875_7989.jpg)
That's a perfectly adequate 4x4 for not much expense. I'm sure you have a lot of fun with it. It isn't, however, really remarkable by any measure. I don't think it can compete with this, a rather typical JK set up for serious off road playing. However, to back up your argument, this rig probably carries a $45k investment, with a $32k vehicle price and the balance in upgrades. It had better be spectacular off road...
(http://www.viewbug.com/media/mediafiles/2009/08/02/192210_on_the_way_home__1_copy_680x680_.jpg)
My CJ-5 was ridiculous in its ability to go virtually anywhere I dared to take it. That Jeep had less than $6,000 invested. My YJ Wrangler had a very mild lift, just to clear the bigger tires I wanted for beach use. My JK Wrangler, when fitted with the 33" M/Ts, has just shy of 11" of ground clearance. 10.3" with the 32" Goodyears.
That said, the latest Wranglers are the most capable ever. Even a well optioned base model has astounding capability. A few simple upgrades are all they need. Order the Trac-Lok LSD. Combining the Trac-Lok with the Brake Lock Differentials and several traction control algorithms, it is extremely capable right off the showroom floor.
I don't envision lifting my JK. It doesn't need it for what I use it for. The 33" tires I invested in for trail runs have just enough clearance at full articulation and steering angle (but they only get limited use). I've added what I consider adequate armor. Rock rails, front end/steering gear skid plate, evap canister skid plate and stronger differential covers for those hidden boulders. I bought a set of sway-bar quick disconnects, but haven't installed them yet. Other mods are driver's side mirror relocation (to keep a sideview mirror with the doors off), K&N high flow air filter, passenger grab handles, custom recovery kit, compressor, trauma kit, fire bottle and so on.
Here's my JK hasn't been upgraded for extreme wheeling. It never will be. My interest in that peaked 20 years ago with my CJ-5. Still, my JK is very capable... Especially in snow. My brother's heavily modded 2005 Rubicon TJ had trouble with some steep snow covered hills that my nearly stock JK went up with ease. The marvel of modern technology at work...
My regards,
Widewing
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Ummm? OK? Cherokee's have always been RWD and unibody what's the difference? :huh
RWD is fine, It's the unibody construction that I've never liked in the Chrysler era Jeeps. That and the less than stellar reliability of the Chrysler drivetrains, and the shoddy suspension and linkage components in the Wranglers (unless you spent and extra $7,000 for the Rubicon)
I'd love an old CJ5, or Willys, but I've never been impressed by the Chrysler Jeeps, speaking in terms of there off-road capabilities, and reliability. Which I guess may not matter since many people just buy them for the looks.
What do you wheel? Reliability? WTF? If you don't "wheel", what's the point of having 4WD? When you "wheel" and buy "cheap chit", you "have a higher chance of breaking". Buy Rubicon Express and you waste money. Buy Clayton, BDS and Teraflex and you can rest easier.
Cherokees most certainly were NOT always "unibody".
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Most people assume, when you say "Cherokee", that you are referring to the XJ platform. "Cherokee" has been associated with a few Jeep platforms now- some confusion is to be expected. Go into any parts store and refuse to answer the query "Grand or...?"
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That's a perfectly adequate 4x4 for not much expense. I'm sure you have a lot of fun with it. It isn't, however, really remarkable by any measure. I don't think it can compete with this, a rather typical JK set up for serious off road playing. However, to back up your argument, this rig probably carries a $45k investment, with a $32k vehicle price and the balance in upgrades. It had better be spectacular off road...
My regards,
Widewing
Land Rover Discovery Series II's are very adequate. If you're gonna go Land Rover though Copr. The ONLY choice is quite possibly the greatest "off the shelf" 4WD vehicle ever made, next to the 66-77 Ford Bronco's........the Land Rover Defender 90 (2 door) or Defender 110 (rare 4 doors). The Defenders are cherished for a happy medium of "wheelbase, excellent approach/departure angles and torque". This is a vehicle that might return to the US and has ALWAYS sparked rumors of such, because of it's reputation.
Copr, don't even bother with the Disco, be a step ahead with the D90. I'd easily match a Stock D90 against a Stock Rubicon. In most cases, I'd go with the D90. The 3.5L V8 is a breeze to work on and there is ALWAYS plenty of torque on hand, for any possible scenario.
As for the Camel Trophy. In 1980 they used Jeep CJ-6's. :D
I cannot criticize the Series II Disco's as they are not plagued with the Electrical issues of the Series I. But either is a VERY capable vehicle off-road. But, most buy them for "status symbol" instead of function. Goto www.safarigard.com and have fun surfing Lifts. Goto Atlantic British and peruse more, then hit "Bear Valley Land Rovers of Atlanta" and wet your whistle Copr.
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Most people assume, when you say "Cherokee", that you are referring to the XJ platform. "Cherokee" has been associated with a few Jeep platforms now- some confusion is to be expected. Go into any parts store and refuse to answer the query "Grand or...?"
He didn't say "Grand" and the Cherokee (SJ) was a full-framed vehicle up from 1974-1983. It refutes his statement, more than adequately. My 1995 Grand Cherokee does excellent off road so far. Open up front, with a LSD in the back.
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I'm just saying that depending on when and where you were born, "Cherokee" means SJ, or XJ, or KJ- same name, distinctly different Jeep.
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I'm just saying that depending on when and where you were born, "Cherokee" means SJ, or XJ, or KJ- same name, distinctly different Jeep.
Isn't the KJ the Liberty?
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Yep- but over there, they call it a Cherokee. Yes, blasphemous to be sure, but that's marketing for you.
To illustrate (and pic potato)
My Cherokee
(http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii244/AHhub/New%20shoes/RT18002.jpg)
Cherokee when I was a squeaker
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3259/3376737520_d11782c0a9.jpg)
Cherokee for Eurosqueakers
(http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2007/11/cherokee.jpg)
Cherokee for Europeans or Ozzies who have squeakers
(http://images.drive.com.au/drive_images/Editorial/2004/10/06/6jeepCherokee1_m.jpg)
Correction- 4 platforms. Can't remember what the newest platform is tagged- I hate it.
I hate sales people of all nationalities, vintages, and persuasions.
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Yep- but over there, they call it a Cherokee. Yes, blasphemous to be sure, but that's marketing for you.
:furious
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:D
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Land Rover Discovery Series II's are very adequate. If you're gonna go Land Rover though Copr. The ONLY choice is quite possibly the greatest "off the shelf" 4WD vehicle ever made, next to the 66-77 Ford Bronco's........the Land Rover Defender 90 (2 door) or Defender 110 (rare 4 doors). The Defenders are cherished for a happy medium of "wheelbase, excellent approach/departure angles and torque". This is a vehicle that might return to the US and has ALWAYS sparked rumors of such, because of it's reputation.
Copr, don't even bother with the Disco, be a step ahead with the D90. I'd easily match a Stock D90 against a Stock Rubicon. In most cases, I'd go with the D90. The 3.5L V8 is a breeze to work on and there is ALWAYS plenty of torque on hand, for any possible scenario.
As for the Camel Trophy. In 1980 they used Jeep CJ-6's. :D
I cannot criticize the Series II Disco's as they are not plagued with the Electrical issues of the Series I. But either is a VERY capable vehicle off-road. But, most buy them for "status symbol" instead of function. Goto www.safarigard.com and have fun surfing Lifts. Goto Atlantic British and peruse more, then hit "Bear Valley Land Rovers of Atlanta" and wet your whistle Copr.
When we spend time on the beaches out in the Hamptons, you can usually find a few mid '90's vintage D-90 Defenders on the sand. You even see the occasional G-Wagon too. Nonetheless, my JK gives up nothing to the D-90 on the beach. Indeed, Jeep's electronics result in superior traction in sand... If I were to drag race one of those D-90s on the beach, my JK would kick its butt... Ditto in snow. Zero wheel spin, maximum traction. It's almost spooky. Drive-by-wire throttle. Floor the gas pedal in 10" of snow, the computer takes over power application. The LSD locks, BLD distributes torque with all four wheels getting no more power than traction will allow. Traction is adjusted 500 times a second. I'll reiterate... It is remarkable. In snow, from a standing start, my brother's 2005 TJ Rubicon can't keep up. I simply drive away, without so much as a wiggle. Meanwhile, the TJ is going sideways as much as forward, its open differentials contributing to its lack of bite (he would do better in 4-low with the diffs locked, but low range has speed limitations). The driver can't regulate power anywhere near as well as the computer can. It's like ABS in that regard, only more dramatic and vastly smarter. Like modern fighter aircraft, high tech electronics simply provide much more capability than previous generation hardware can ever manage.
As to the Discovery.. Capable, but not stellar. Needs major upgrading to get to that level. That is expensive, and repair costs for Land Rovers are very high. Better off with mid 90's YJ. Spend about $3k in suspension, wheel and tires and you have a very able rig. More importantly, you can find parts anywhere and they are far less expensive than for the Discovery. Likewise for a mid 80's CJ-7.
Some amusing D-90 videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWDv8ZQNeFk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWDv8ZQNeFk)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JoTJBRIhdA&NR=1&feature=fvwp (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JoTJBRIhdA&NR=1&feature=fvwp)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMhOhT5nwZk&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMhOhT5nwZk&feature=related)
My regards,
Widewing
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What do you wheel? '99 Isuzu Rodeo with minor modifications. When I was looking for a mid-size SUV I considered Rodeos, 4runners, and Cherokees. I nixed the Cherokee because I don't think the Chrysler drivetrain would be as reliable or durable as Toyota/Isuzu. And the resale prices of 4runners were to high for my budget. So I got Rodeo and have no complaints. Reliability? Not really a complete question there. WTF? In the refrigerator. (If you mean where's the food?) If you don't "wheel", what's the point of having 4WD? I live and grew up on a farm, you need 4WD on the farm quite often. I also "wheel" a couple times a month for fun, but I'm not that hard core. When you "wheel" and buy "cheap chit", you "have a higher chance of breaking". Buy Rubicon Express and you waste money. Buy Clayton, BDS and Teraflex and you can rest easier.
Cherokees most certainly were NOT always "unibody". My mistake, I apologize if I misled anybody.
It seems like a touched a nerve there, relax, just because I'm not a Jeep fan and you are doesn't mean we have to get all angry. It IS just a matter of opinion after all. And this world would be a boring place if everyone agreed all the time.
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Was just noticing the scenery behind all your Jeep pics... Ya gotta admit, terrain is everything when it comes to offroading, right? I mean, what kinda rig you have, depends on the terrain you operate it in, right?
This is why I don't even bother with any of the late model stuff, it always ends up brokedick!!!
I just don't think we have a common frame of reference here!!!
LOL, this is what it is like around here... It's like this everywhere, until you get above the treeline...
I've been breakin trail thru this stuff for most of my life... It'll break your heart in return!!! Or take your life!!!
My 5/8 mile long driveway! Only way in or out!!! Turn left or right, and see how far you get!!! LOL!!!
A Tank wont make it far into this terrain... When I'm talkin woods, I mean WOODS!!!
And then, when the well known PNW rain starts, Hmmm well, you'd have to experience 4wheelin around here!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/MyDriveway.jpg)
And wait till one of these things gets blown down by the wind, and blocks your way out!!!
This is a particularly large one near my north border.. But My property is covered with 10 and 15 footers, (thick)!! Essential eq around here is a CHAINSAW!!! A big one!!! LOL!!!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/BigFirontheBack40.jpg)
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It seems like a touched a nerve there, relax, just because I'm not a Jeep fan and you are doesn't mean we have to get all angry. It IS just a matter of opinion after all. And this world would be a boring place if everyone agreed all the time.
You touched "nothing", you just show your lack of knowledge with your asinine statements. Keep it up!
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When we spend time on the beaches out in the Hamptons, you can usually find a few mid '90's vintage D-90 Defenders on the sand. You even see the occasional G-Wagon too. Nonetheless, my JK gives up nothing to the D-90 on the beach. Indeed, Jeep's electronics result in superior traction in sand... If I were to drag race one of those D-90s on the beach, my JK would kick its butt... Ditto in snow. Zero wheel spin, maximum traction. It's almost spooky. Drive-by-wire throttle. Floor the gas pedal in 10" of snow, the computer takes over power application. The LSD locks, BLD distributes torque with all four wheels getting no more power than traction will allow. Traction is adjusted 500 times a second. I'll reiterate... It is remarkable. In snow, from a standing start, my brother's 2005 TJ Rubicon can't keep up. I simply drive away, without so much as a wiggle. Meanwhile, the TJ is going sideways as much as forward, its open differentials contributing to its lack of bite (he would do better in 4-low with the diffs locked, but low range has speed limitations). The driver can't regulate power anywhere near as well as the computer can. It's like ABS in that regard, only more dramatic and vastly smarter. Like modern fighter aircraft, high tech electronics simply provide much more capability than previous generation hardware can ever manage.
As to the Discovery.. Capable, but not stellar. Needs major upgrading to get to that level. That is expensive, and repair costs for Land Rovers are very high. Better off with mid 90's YJ. Spend about $3k in suspension, wheel and tires and you have a very able rig. More importantly, you can find parts anywhere and they are far less expensive than for the Discovery. Likewise for a mid 80's CJ-7.
Some amusing D-90 videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWDv8ZQNeFk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWDv8ZQNeFk)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JoTJBRIhdA&NR=1&feature=fvwp (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JoTJBRIhdA&NR=1&feature=fvwp)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMhOhT5nwZk&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMhOhT5nwZk&feature=related)
My regards,
Widewing
I'm talking about wheeling WW, not cruising a beach where even I would still air down and 90% of people don't. I'm talking about Rocks, Mud, off cambers, the D90 smokes Jeeps and I own a Jeep.
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Haven't spent nearly as much as some of the Jeepies...good set of tires, different springs, rear diff has an ARB...no airlift required for this Jeep Recovery Vehicle. Maybe there's 4500 in the whole truck. But like most of the Jeep guys I know, they are only open to their rides, too bad their egos are as big as some of their tires.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/n1328645816_30133875_7989.jpg)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/3002_1067232684237_1328645816_30219.jpg)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/3002_1066366782590_1328645816_30217.jpg)
Is that your Disco Copr?
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I'm talking about wheeling WW, not cruising a beach where even I would still air down and 90% of people don't. I'm talking about Rocks, Mud, off cambers, the D90 smokes Jeeps and I own a Jeep.
Did you watch the last video, where the Land Cruiser equaled the Defender when tested off road? Any one of my Jeeps, including the JK is much superior to a Land Cruiser. Vastly more maneuverable than either.
I'll agree that the Defender is legendary... However, technology has overtaken those old dinosaurs and you haven't been able to buy a new Defender here in more than a decade, with no prospect of one coming in the future.
As to "wheelin'", perhaps bashing down muddy trails in the wood is wheelin' in Michigan. Yet, many of the rigs built for that will positively suck on deep, soft sand. My JK is better in the sand than my totally modded CJ-5 was. How about a 200 mile expedition across the Arizona desert? That's what we're planning for the autumn of 2011. We did a similar tour in 2002, with a rented Rubi TJ (the expedition company provided the vehicles if you preferred and don't mind spending the premium $$). These days you can rent a new JK. We will drive there next time and use our own Wrangler. I'll have to rig the JK for this, not unlike this Unlimited...
(http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9da34b3127ccec68aadd5b84100000010O01AbNWTdozasQe3nwE/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/)
My regards,
Widewing
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Did you watch the last video, where the Land Cruiser equaled the Defender when tested off road? Any one of my Jeeps, including the JK is much superior to a Land Cruiser. Vastly more maneuverable than either.
I'll agree that the Defender is legendary... However, technology has overtaken those old dinosaurs and you haven't been able to buy a new Defender here in more than a decade, with no prospect of one coming in the future.
As to "wheelin'", perhaps bashing down muddy trails in the wood is wheelin' in Michigan. Yet, many of the rigs built for that will positively suck on deep, soft sand. My JK is better in the sand than my totally modded CJ-5 was. How about a 200 mile expedition across the Arizona desert? That's what we're planning for the autumn of 2011. We did a similar tour in 2002, with a rented Rubi TJ (the expedition company provided the vehicles if you preferred and don't mind spending the premium $$). These days you can rent a new JK. We will drive there next time and use our own Wrangler. I'll have to rig the JK for this, not unlike this Unlimited...
(http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9da34b3127ccec68aadd5b84100000010O01AbNWTdozasQe3nwE/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/)
My regards,
Widewing
My ZJ will be fine in a Desert. I don't understand why "sand" is an issue here? Come to Silver Lake in Mears, Michigan and go up "test hill" which is known Worldwide. The "old" Defenders are still proven and have no issues.
Also, lifting a Disco 3" with an Old Man Emu lift is the same price as any "Wrangler" marque. The Caravan motor is not even close to the 3.9L V8 of the D90's and I will not even discuss it, as it doesn't need to. My 83 CJ-7 had Front and Rear Detroit Lockers and would have had no problems on ANY surface. There comes a point to where you "build a rig up" and become numb "to the ease" of wheeling.
I don't understand the "bias", but I guess I don't want to even try. I guess Cappa even "acknowledging" it, is nothing as well. :rofl
But yes, "wheeling" in most States is not just cruising a beach. If you break on the trail, you fix it and hope you don't break again. Mud, tank traps, standing water, snow up to the hood, etc are what Legal Wheelers, such as myself do. I served on the Board of Directors for the Great Lakes Four Wheel Drive Association and only promote Legal Wheeling. I do drink alcohol on the trail and don't flail my arms outside of windows. I practice what I preach because I'm a reflection as a former BoD member. Heck, I've seen many people practice "unsafe vehicle recovery". Most don't even realize that all you need is a stick and two straps in a pinch. :)
This past January, our Club "Soldiers of Fortune Off Road" here in Michigan hosted our 3rd Annual "SnoFari" event sponsored by GLFWDA and 11 others. We had snow depths that swallowed 35" tires and left some on 40's........pulling cable or strap. I'm talking TJ's with 6.1's in them. One of the participants had a ZR-2 Tracker on Dana 44's and Hummer wheels/tires with an Exo-Cage. His 26 year old son designed it and was the talk of the 2007 United Four Wheel Drive Association Annual Meeting in Colorado. Our event is not quite to the stature of "Sno-Blind" which is run in the same area as our event, by the Mudchuggers Jeep Club and is known throughout North America. But our Club (avg. age of 30) is the most Active Club in the State of Michigan and we are gaining on them. We clear 60+ miles of trail in both the Spring and Fall. We do this because of commitment to the Hobby.
But in closing, I offer ANYONE from this BBS the opportunity to Participate in this Event. Registration will open soon and we have a 60 rig limit. Dan, Nate, or anyone else. It'll be January 9th & 10th, 2010.
I will not allow Land Rovers to be bashed, because they are VERY capable off road rigs, Range Rover Classics included. But the Defender's are in a class by themselves and no Jeep is close.
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Is that your Disco Copr?
It was, I sold it to for the funds to build this (see below). But I am looking for another Disco again. I enjoy projects more than anything.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z235/nathanyoung1980/Mustang-1.jpg)
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Hell, getting stuck and breaking your friends' balls while you are pulling them out (or vice versa) is half the fun.
If my rig was too capable and never got stuck, or never suffered carnage on the trail then it would only be half as fun. I would spend most of the day pulling people out.
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Hell, getting stuck and breaking your friends' balls while you are pulling them out (or vice versa) is half the fun.
If my rig was too capable and never got stuck, or never suffered carnage on the trail then it would only be half as fun. I would spend most of the day pulling people out.
Yep.
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I will not allow Land Rovers to be bashed, because they are VERY capable off road rigs, Range Rover Classics included. But the Defender's are in a class by themselves and no Jeep is close.
I completely disagree, and I'm certainly not alone..
Especially when a more road oriented Jeep JK Sahara 2.8 Diesel easily matches a brand new Defender in a head to head test off road, and clobbers it everywhere else. Read this test: http://zool.xsion.gr/blog/wp-content/uploads/JK/wranglervsdefender.pdf (http://zool.xsion.gr/blog/wp-content/uploads/JK/wranglervsdefender.pdf)
My regards,
Widewing
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Hell man, they all work!!! All a little different, depending on what you use it for....
There seems to be two general schools of thought, oldschool simplicity, or newstyle technowhiz...
I'm just an oldschool guy at heart, and there isn't anything else with wheels, that is narrow enough, light enough, short enough, tite turning enough, to thread the needle back and forth between the trees here... And have enough power to plow thru the heavy bush, and torque enough to pull itself out of the huge holes between the root balls.. Up and down into those stinkin holes, endlessly!!! LOL!! A good old CJ5 is the only answer..
Seen late model rigs, get the whole wheel, steering knuckle, axle and control arms ripped completely OFF!! Or folded under.. From dropping into those holes between the roots, and the rigs momentum just keeps on goin, RIP!!! Oops!!! LOL!!! Bigger and wider rigs, just forget it..
This is me, with my Rockstar hair!!! LOL!!!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/GreenyMeeniex600.jpg)
Nice fresh 360, little cam, nice and simple, and yes the Holley has a slosh kit for no steep angle problems, LOL!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/engine2.jpg)
All stainless hardware, custom made dash, Qball shifter knobs, blah blah..
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/Dash2.jpg)
Honda Prelude seats are comfy, and keep a secure grip on your butt...
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/inside.jpg)
Of course, Little Bill will take me where NO wheeled vehicle can go!! And alot quieter while doing so!!
Got rid of my long hair last spring, wife says I look younger!!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/MeonLittleBill.jpg)
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I completely disagree, and I'm certainly not alone..
Especially when a more road oriented Jeep JK Sahara 2.8 Diesel easily matches a brand new Defender in a head to head test off road, and clobbers it everywhere else. Read this test: http://zool.xsion.gr/blog/wp-content/uploads/JK/wranglervsdefender.pdf (http://zool.xsion.gr/blog/wp-content/uploads/JK/wranglervsdefender.pdf)
My regards,
Widewing
I said the 3.9L :) There is no replacement for displacement and the low end torque of that Engine. Mind you, I'm talking say a 97 D-90. Not whatever inline 4 or 6 they are putting in them now.
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Of course, Little Bill will take me where NO wheeled vehicle can go!! And alot quieter while doing so!!
Got rid of my long hair last spring, wife says I look younger!!
(http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv226/RipChord929/MeonLittleBill.jpg)
Surely, Little Bill is hard to beat... Except maybe for a good Trials bike.. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6730771388245386911# (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6730771388245386911#)
My regards,
Widewing
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. I'll have to rig the JK for this, not unlike this Unlimited...
(http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9da34b3127ccec68aadd5b84100000010O01AbNWTdozasQe3nwE/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/)
My regards,
Widewing
(http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9da34b3127ccec68aadd5b84100000010O01AbNWTdozasQe3nwE/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/)
I love those rims and got turned onto them from this "overland" JK that Mopar Underground did
(http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c261/rstel/jp.jpg)
They are actually a Steel Spare Tire Rim off the 06/07 Grand Cherokee. I run my Goodyear MTR/Kevlars in 305/70/17 (34 inch) on them. The rim has a recessed valve stem that rides behind the other outer holes. They weigh a ton though! Almost 70lbs per rim+the 40lbs of tire, make them a bear to get on and off. Needless to say, I welded EVO's C2 Axle Gussets to the Axle this weekend to stregnten the heck out of the "C"'s for the extra weight.
BTW, I only run 2 inches of lift with the 34's and no real issues. Granted my skids are pretty hammered, I've also peeled the diffs before up armoring them. That's an older pic with the single steering damper (I changed to a RC Twin) beacuse even with the relocation kit I used to hammer it with the frame at full travel.
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Sold my 77 Chief Cherokee back in 2001, that thing was a tank, certainly miss taking it to the beach, in the woods camping, I was only limited by the law where I could drive it.
Seen a picture in this thread of a Cherokee and brought back some memories.
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Sold my 77 Chief Cherokee back in 2001, that thing was a tank, certainly miss taking it to the beach, in the woods camping, I was only limited by the law where I could drive it.
Seen a picture in this thread of a Cherokee and brought back some memories.
How's this?
(http://image.trucktrend.com/f/18400990+w750+st0/163_0908_21z+2009_moab_mopar_underground+Jeep_SJ_Mopar_Madness.jpg)
My regards,
Widewing
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Ahhh, the old Chief..............
:D
:aok
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Instead of buying my CJ-7, I almost bought an 89 Waggy. F/R Dana 44's and the overhead computer still worked (rare as most don't). But the 360 had two fluffied up cylinders and the Transmission linkage was fluffied. Rockers were rusted in the right spots, the 6" BJ's off road lift would have fit 35" BFG muds without a hitch. I sometimes regret not getting it.
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Instead of buying my CJ-7, I almost bought an 89 Waggy. F/R Dana 44's and the overhead computer still worked (rare as most don't). But the 360 had two fluffied up cylinders and the Transmission linkage was fluffied. Rockers were rusted in the right spots, the 6" BJ's off road lift would have fit 35" BFG muds without a hitch. I sometimes regret not getting it.
I just gave away a 360 a few months ago. :cry
Block was cooked, bored .010 to freshen it up, ported and polished the heads myself when I was working at the Tool & Die shop.
Ready for reassembly. I was going to shoe-horn it into my 64 Valiant, but I don't have a garage anymore and with this plate in my arm, wrenching for long hours like that is not in the cards anymore. I put the car/engine/heads........the whole 9 yards on Craig's List for FREE.
It was gone that night.
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:cry
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How's this?
(http://image.trucktrend.com/f/18400990+w750+st0/163_0908_21z+2009_moab_mopar_underground+Jeep_SJ_Mopar_Madness.jpg)
My regards,
Widewing
Very nice, and in good shape, you have taken good care of it for sure.
My truck didnt look as perdie, since it was used most of the time off road it was all primer gray, not afraid to rub some bushes, little rust here and there, but solid and had a strong 401-V8, drove and rode like a tank.
Nice pic :aok
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Very nice, and in good shape, you have taken good care of it for sure.
My truck didnt look as perdie, since it was used most of the time off road it was all primer gray, not afraid to rub some bushes, little rust here and there, but solid and had a strong 401-V8, drove and rode like a tank.
Nice pic :aok
It's not mine..... I wish it was.
My regards,
Widewing
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It's not mine..... I wish it was.
My regards,
Widewing
:rofl In that case, those rims would have to go..... :rofl