Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: JunkyII on June 27, 2010, 01:23:29 PM
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Today on 200 there was a heated discussion about why planes like zeaks, hurris, and brewsters(the one in question) are easy mode.
There are 2 dweeby ways people fly these planes.
-Bottom Feeder, looking for people who are engaged by multiple cons or maybe by chance be in a good 1v1 which got to the deck low and slow. They avoid BNZers easily because all they have to do is pull hard on the stick and without even trying they are out of guns of the enemy. When they do spot an enemy low and slow they easily saddle up on said enemy and its almost impossible for him to get away. To go along with the avoid BNZers alot of times they will just turn around really quick and try to go for an HO on the person diving in.
-Alt Monkey turners, They climb one of the above mentioned birds(most likely not a zeak) above the furball and pick planes engaged in combat.....again almost impossible to get away from if the person has any type of skill.
Granted there are people who take these birds into furballs and just go straight into it and fight there way out but most do the above mentioned flying styles. The only challenge they have is getting away from a furball, and 5 words can easily fix that in a furball. "Can you help me here" .
IMO the extremely good turners are worse then the extremely fast planes because once they get coming on your six they are harder to avoid.
Seperate but similar issue.....Brewster needs to be nerfed or have its ENY lowered dramatically....8 would be good. Id love to see thee hurri to brewster ration ever since it came out....
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Ummm dont turn with them possibly?
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Id love to see thee hurri to brewster ration ever since it came out....
"Since it came out" makes no sense, as the Brewster FM has been tweaked recently. If you want to compare them, you have to look at the current tour:
Hurricane Mk IIC 3733 kills 3240 deaths 1.15 K/D
Brewster B-239 4030 kills 3914 deaths 1.03 K/D
Brewster vs Hurri: 87-64, K/D 1.36
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Ummm dont turn with them possibly?
I knew this would be the first response......Of course if your 1v1 with one of the above birds your not going to turn with him.....but what if your already being engaged by 3-4 and are slow.......gameover and a shamass kill for the person in the turny bird.
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"Since it came out" makes no sense, as the Brewster FM has been tweaked recently. If you want to compare them, you have to look at the current tour:
Hurricane Mk IIC 3733 kills 3240 deaths 1.15 K/D
Brewster B-239 4030 kills 3914 deaths 1.03 K/D
Brewster vs Hurri: 87-64, K/D 1.36
Wasnt aware it was tweaked, What about # of sorties?
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IMO the extremely good turners are worse then the extremely fast planes because once they get coming on your six they are harder to avoid.
But you can much better prevent them from getting there in the first place, especially if you have a fast plane & fly smart. A turnes usually has less choices. A Brewster flying into a red cloud has to fight to the bitter end... if the P-51 keeps some E, he's usually able to disengage after a few attacks.
You can't just take a single combat situation at one end of the scale and base an overall assement on it.
Overall, speed trumps turn. In a slow turner you basically need "willing" opponents.
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Wasnt aware it was tweaked, What about # of sorties?
If you tell me a way to get that number...
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When I played the 10k + zero sticks always made me chuckle :D
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IMO planes only need to be "nerfed" if the modeling is incorrect. From what I've read on these boards the Brewster is not overmodeled. Yes it's a bad arse little plane, but so what. The yoyo and lag displacement rolls was invented for just such planes. Also they can be easily roped if you set them up right.
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But you can much better prevent them from getting there in the first place, especially if you have a fast plane & fly smart. A turnes usually has less choices. A Brewster flying into a red cloud has to fight to the bitter end... if the P-51 keeps some E, he's usually able to disengage after a few attacks.
You can't just take a single combat situation at one end of the scale and base an overall assement on it.
Overall, speed trumps turn. In a slow turner you basically need "willing" opponents.
Or preoccupied ones
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IMO planes only need to be "nerfed" if the modeling is incorrect. From what I've read on these boards the Brewster is not overmodeled. Yes it's a bad arse little plane, but so what. The yoyo and lag displacement rolls was invented for just such planes. Also they can be easily roped if you set them up right.
I feel they hold E way to well.....I dont got stats on it but my question is this If it is so badarse....why did we stop using it in the War?
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Or preoccupied ones
But the picking happens with every plane in the set. Not just the turners
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Or preoccupied ones
Which fall the same to a fast picker with big guns. When I have an enemy turning low & slow with a friendly, I can easily pick him in a Typhoon while keeping my speed & E up.
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But the picking happens with every plane in the set. Not just the turners
No doubt about that, Im just stating that its alot easier because you can easily saddle up on any other plane in the list.
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I feel they hold E way to well.....I dont got stats on it but my question is this If it is so badarse....why did we stop using it in the War?
We (USA) needed planes for long range fighter escort and Jabo missions. The Brewster wasn't suited for our needs at the time to do that. The Finns used them quite successfully defending their homeland until they were just completely overwhelmed I believe.
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Not a dig at you Junky (I enjoy fighting ya) but cmon, is there anything we're not going to whine about recently.
So they've lowered the radar alt - unlucky, suck it up
So they've increased the range - unlucky, suck it up
People fly turny planes and kill me (not aimed at anyone in particular) - unlucky, make better decisions or suck it up
People fly fast planes and bnz and kill me (not aimed at anyone in particular) - unlucky, make better decisions or suck it up
This is a game gents, its meant to be fun - planes are free, you dont really die. Try and enjoy it, you only get 1 life in the real world, and its an adventure, not a solitary journey into oblivion.
Sheeesh!!
Wurzel (working nights, cranky and tired)
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No doubt about that, Im just stating that its alot easier because you can easily saddle up on any other plane in the list.
The trick with the Brewster Junky is not to stay low with it. Give yourself some room(alt) to dive away and regain your E back. Or have enough E down low to out climb them if need be. Maintain your SA especially when you're engaged.
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Not a dig at you Junky (I enjoy fighting ya) but cmon, is there anything we're not going to whine about recently.
So they've lowered the radar alt - unlucky, suck it up
So they've increased the range - unlucky, suck it up
People fly turny planes and kill me (not aimed at anyone in particular) - unlucky, make better decisions or suck it up
People fly fast planes and bnz and kill me (not aimed at anyone in particular) - unlucky, make better decisions or suck it up
This is a game gents, its meant to be fun - planes are free, you dont really die. Try and enjoy it, you only get 1 life in the real world, and its an adventure, not a solitary journey into oblivion.
Sheeesh!!
Wurzel (working nights, cranky and tired)
Wurzel,
Im having fun discussing this issue :D
What I try to do with my "whine" threads....none of which I am whining. I am trying to "convert" people to fight the good fight....more that see dweebyness in things like HOs, dropping FHs, NOE hordes, and BNZing in a Brewster....the more fun it will be in the MA...
:salute
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The trick with the Brewster Junky is not to stay low with it. Give yourself some room(alt) to dive away and regain your E back. Or have enough E down low to out climb them if need be. Maintain your SA especially when you're engaged.
Exactly what I do when I only have one Brewster. But when Im in a 152 roping a spit 16 and a LA7 and a Brewster comes in co alt there is nothing I can do other then try to kill the LA and Spit in time to be able to extend away....they are sneaky planes and should be used only for base defense other then that they are dweeby..
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Not a dig at you Junky (I enjoy fighting ya) but cmon, is there anything we're not going to whine about recently.
So they've lowered the radar alt - unlucky, suck it up
So they've increased the range - unlucky, suck it up
People fly turny planes and kill me (not aimed at anyone in particular) - unlucky, make better decisions or suck it up
People fly fast planes and bnz and kill me (not aimed at anyone in particular) - unlucky, make better decisions or suck it up
This is a game gents, its meant to be fun - planes are free, you dont really die. Try and enjoy it, you only get 1 life in the real world, and its an adventure, not a solitary journey into oblivion.
Sheeesh!!
Wurzel (working nights, cranky and tired)
Spot on.!!!
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they are sneaky planes and should be used only for base defense other then that they are dweeby..
So you are trying to tel other people how to fly what plane?
Get over it.
What would be the diff if a k4 came by and picked hmmm?
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I am trying to "convert" people to fight the good fight....more that see dweebyness in things like HOs, dropping FHs, NOE hordes, and BNZing in a Brewster....the more fun it will be in the MA...
:salute
More fun for who? The "good fight" people make up a small percentage of the overall population. I see hundreds of people "having fun" in the MA's every day.
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Exactly what I do when I only have one Brewster. But when Im in a 152 roping a spit 16 and a LA7 and a Brewster comes in co alt there is nothing I can do other then try to kill the LA and Spit in time to be able to extend away....they are sneaky planes and should be used only for base defense other then that they are dweeby..
Well that is a tough one. But the 152 is a high alt fighter. Better the anything you were fighting with altitude. You guys know i'm no eperten but I'd of took the LA7 up up up and created separation from the other 2 the best I could. The Brewster really shouldn't have been a factor as you can out dive and out climb him. The spit I'd of just HOed out of the way.
What alt were you at in the 152. I bet lower then it was meant for.
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So you are trying to tel other people how to fly what plane?
Get over it.
What would be the diff if a k4 came by and picked hmmm?
K4 is alot easier to avoid...horrible example for your point honestly which I understand..
K4 has the 30mm very easy to miss even if you hit with MGs. Has good turing at 300 MPH but still is most likely going 300 MPH....easy overshoot.
The difference IMO is that the Brewster is harder to get away from or kill when you have been fighting and are now slow because of its turning and the 4 M2s it has.
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Well that is a tough one. But the 152 is a high alt fighter. Better the anything you were fighting with altitude. You guys know i'm no eperten but I'd of took the LA7 up up up and created separation from the other 2 the best I could. The Brewster really shouldn't have been a factor as you can out dive and out climb him. The spit I'd of just HOed out of the way.
What alt were you at in the 152. I bet lower then it was meant for.
90% of the fights happen below 10K I think....Up High at like 20K I will just turn my 152 with everyone.
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K4 is alot easier to avoid...horrible example for your point honestly which I understand..
K4 has the 30mm very easy to miss even if you hit with MGs. Has good turing at 300 MPH but still is most likely going 300 MPH....easy overshoot.
The difference IMO is that the Brewster is harder to get away from or kill when you have been fighting and are now slow because of its turning and the 4 M2s it has.
I'd of rather had 3 Brewsters on me last night rather then the 1 K4 Grizz was in. :lol
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More fun for who? The "good fight" people make up a small percentage of the overall population. I see hundreds of people "having fun" in the MA's every day.
Who says I dont have Fun? I just like to increase my fun...
Pretty sure you dont know what the F your talking about with this "Good fight" crowd.
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90% of the fights happen below 10K I think....Up High at like 20K I will just turn my 152 with everyone.
Well IMO you picked the wrong 190 for that alt. I'd say a Dora would of been better for that fight.
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I'd of rather had 3 Brewsters on me last night rather then the 1 K4 Grizz was in. :lol
rare situation.....if you got a tator chucker behind you your screwed :D
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Well IMO you picked the wrong 190 for that alt. I'd say a Dora would of been better for that fight.
I fly a 152 for its awesome firepower, its eny needs to go up some more....above a brewsters..... :aok
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Pretty sure you dont know what the F your talking about with this "Good fight" crowd.
You might want to save your money and not make that bet. I know exactly who the "good fight" crowd is...you're one of them.
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You might want to save your money and not make that bet. I know exactly who the "good fight" crowd is...you're one of them.
:noid I guess, I dont call myself that though.
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Last night I had a fight that started at 15K with a Spit14, Spit16 and a Brewster. I killed the 14 and hurt the 16 where he wanted to rtb. The poor Brewster was following me around just begging for a fight :lol I know he was new and I could have easily ran away as I was in a 51, but decided to give the guy a fight as he was deserving of something rather then a running pony we all see too often. We played for a while and I got too slow and died. I bested a perk plane and gave the 16 all he wanted, so I didn't mind one bit to give the noob a kill. It was fun for me as I'm sure he felt good about his victory. I far as I was concerned I won that fight and allowed a new guy to land his 2nd kill. Sometimes making it home shouldn't be all that important.
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Junky, the solution to your OP is to not get saddled by these slow birds. Don't allow yourself to be checkmated. When you run across a 'turny bird', fight him using your German Iron's strengths, slowing the fight down, take it vert, roping him out, and slash at him until you inevitably kill him. If there is a better way to irritate a hurri/zero pilot and make him reconsider his plane choice, I cannot think of it.
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Last night I had a fight that started at 15K with a Spit14, Spit16 and a Brewster. I killed the 14 and hurt the 16 where he wanted to rtb. The poor Brewster was following me around just begging for a fight :lol I know he was new and I could have easily ran away as I was in a 51, but decided to give the guy a fight as he was deserving of something rather then a running pony we all see too often. We played for a while and I got too slow and died. I bested a perk plane and gave the 16 all he wanted, so I didn't mind one bit to give the noob a kill. It was fun for me as I'm sure he felt good about his victory. I far as I was concerned I won that fight and allowed a new guy to land his 2nd kill. Sometimes making it home shouldn't be all that important.
[hijack]
Uptown you were flying really well last night. <S>
[/hijack]
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Junky, the solution to your OP is to not get saddled by these slow birds. Don't allow yourself to be checkmated. When you run across a 'turny bird', fight him using your German Iron's strengths, slowing the fight down, take it vert, roping him out, and slash at him until you inevitably kill him. If there is a better way to irritate a hurri/zero pilot and make him reconsider his plane choice, I cannot think of it.
I use exactly that...whens it just a brewster and me...multi-on I have just been pulling 1 or 2 out away from the turner and fighting them.
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oh quit it.you're making me blush :o
TNX Grizz :) :salute
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multi-on I have just been pulling 1 or 2 out away from the turner and fighting them.
The spoils of cartoon furballing.
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Ain't no such thing as a shameful kill in the mains. It's a cage match Junky, anything goes! Break out the steel chair and whack someone when they ain't looking!
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Eh_4vcOeF_A/SrkkoDeipDI/AAAAAAAAECQ/VjZwCffb-Dw/s320/IMG_0511.jpg)
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Ain't no such thing as a shameful kill in the mains. It's a cage match Junky, anything goes! Break out the steel chair and whack someone when they ain't looking!
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Eh_4vcOeF_A/SrkkoDeipDI/AAAAAAAAECQ/VjZwCffb-Dw/s320/IMG_0511.jpg)
:rofl :rofl :rofl
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Ain't no such thing as a shameful kill in the mains. It's a cage match Junky, anything goes! Break out the steel chair and whack someone when they ain't looking!
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Eh_4vcOeF_A/SrkkoDeipDI/AAAAAAAAECQ/VjZwCffb-Dw/s320/IMG_0511.jpg)
MA=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNfnR4wucRU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNfnR4wucRU)
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MA=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNfnR4wucRU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNfnR4wucRU)
:lol
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they are sneaky planes and should be used only for base defense other then that they are dweeby..
Ahhh...another "Play as I want you to play" whine disguised as a "I want to improve the combat" thread.
ack-ack
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Ahhh...another "Play as I want you to play" whine disguised as a "I want to improve the combat" thread.
ack-ack
Ack-Ack trolling again......classic...get off my ankle
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Today on 200 there was a heated discussion about why planes like zeaks, hurris, and brewsters(the one in question) are easy mode.
-Alt Monkey turners, They climb one of the above mentioned birds(most likely not a zeak) above the furball and pick planes engaged in combat.....again almost impossible to get away from if the person has any type of skill.
Easy mode? Thats funny!!
Let me guess--some guy screaming down into a fight in a 190 blazing away only to climb back to his perch afterwards said that?
These guys are a huge problem in the game and something needs to be done.
All they are doing is taking the easy route, the less combat the better.
In short, these guys are avoiding combat and need to be dealt with.
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:rofl someone must of picked 1Boner to death today, and yesterday...the day before....the day before that....and the next......................
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Easy mode? Thats funny!!
Let me guess--some guy screaming down into a fight in a 190 blazing away only to climb back to his perch afterwards said that?
These guys are a huge problem in the game and something needs to be done.
All they are doing is taking the easy route, the less combat the better.
In short, these guys are avoiding combat and need to be dealt with.
A 190 screaming in on straight line trajectories going 400+ is easy mode yes, but a plane that can turn 180 degrees in less than 2 seconds isn't very hard to fly either now is it? All you did with your post is point out another easy mode style of play. You didn't disprove the OP's assertion.
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A 190 screaming in on straight line trajectories going 400+ is easy mode yes, but a plane that can turn 180 degrees in less than 2 seconds isn't very hard to fly either now is it? All you did with your post is point out another easy mode style of play. You didn't disprove the OP's assertion.
Shhh you'll ruin a good rant. ;)
Edit" now why would a bop be so vehemently opposed to this change? :headscratch:
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What I find curious and kind of funny is Junky, from his posts in the past, seems to think F4Us,109s,51s,38s are all easy mode :lol It's like everyone is in easy mode except him. :huh Now we can add all the "turny" planes to his easy mode list too. :lol
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What I find curious and kind of funny is Junky, from his posts in the past, seems to think F4Us,109s,51s,38s are all easy mode :lol It's like everyone is in easy mode except him. :huh Now we can add all the "turny" planes to his easy mode list too. :lol
HAHAHAHA got me. I used to say they were alot because of people like UglyStik's and VNE1's flying style. Always on top of the fight never fighting unless from an advantage.
I never said 109s were easy mode....
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HAHAHAHA got me. I used to say they were alot because of people like UglyStik's and VNE1's flying style. Always on top of the fight never fighting unless from an advantage.
I never said 109s were easy mode....
We'll wait until you start getting killed by them. ;)
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We'll wait until you start getting killed by them. ;)
I was fighting Grizz and SunsFan tonight in K4s.....They were killing me but the fights were good.
all the matters
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I guess the only plane you are now allowed to fly in the MA to avoid the "lame scoretarding easymoder" moniker is a throttled back P-40B at 500 ft with empty guns, making sure you do not have any advantages you could use against any enemy...
:airplane:
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I guess the only plane you are now allowed to fly in the MA to avoid the "lame scoretarding easymoder" moniker is a throttled back P-40B at 500 ft with empty guns, making sure you do not have any advantages you could use against any enemy...
Just tell them you fly with your feet.... now that is hard mode for sure.
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I guess the only plane you are now allowed to fly in the MA to avoid the "lame scoretarding easymoder" moniker is a throttled back P-40B at 500 ft with empty guns, making sure you do not have any advantages you could use against any enemy...
:airplane:
Finally! Someone gets it! :aok :D
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Another drama Queen thread I predict it will end as most of yours do. LOCKED.
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Shhh you'll ruin a good rant. ;)
Edit" now why would a bop be so vehemently opposed to this change? :headscratch:
Not sure Einstein,do tell.
Opposed?
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All i need to say is that my zeros are not easy mode when flown correctly. i have done maneuvers most wouldn't expect out of the a6ms. granted they aren't the best to get back to base with unless you are working as a team, but then why exactly can i have 3-8 kills in some flights with zekes? there are some easy maneuvers to use in the zero once you find them to turn the tide on the pilots ZnBing you also. most vets would probably guess these in a heartbeat
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As someone who uses the Hurri 2C as his main "ride", I've never understood the hatred of this bird.
Sure, the hispano's are heavy hitters, and it turns on a dime, but it's one of the slowest aircraft in the game, both in acceleration and top speed, you can't run from anything!
And just FYI, it's been my favorite aircraft since i was 8 or 9 and given a copy of this (which I still have)
(http://users.tpg.com.au/steelyj//hurri.jpg)
Salute
Steely
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The RAAF must have been real dweebs in WWII. All our aircraft are considered dweeby. P51, spit V, Spit VII, Brewser and the list goes on. What shananigans there will be if we get the Beau and the Boomerang.
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junky you really have fully morphed into an idiot..a slower bird does not have to "force an overshoot"..its the faster plane that has to adjust..i luv fly the early zeke..sure low cannon..but who cares when i dance the sky :D
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Let me guess--some guy screaming down into a fight in a 190 blazing away only to climb back to his perch afterwards said that?
Let me guess--your one of the turny bird flyers we're talking about, and you dont have the same ability to pull E out of your bellybutton that German planes do?
What do you want him to do? come down to coalt/co-e with flaps down and turn around with you?
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junky you really have fully morphed into an idiot..a slower bird does not have to "force an overshoot"..its the faster plane that has to adjust..i luv fly the early zeke..sure low cannon..but who cares when i dance the sky :D
I think Junky's trolling skills have surpassed Bipolar's. Bip is out of his prime though and Junky is only starting to blossom, so it might not be a fair comparison.
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I am the last to arrive at a fight.
I am the last to make it home.
I am the most likely to be caught.
I burn easily.
I have the worst cannon ballistics in the game.
I am EZ-Mode.
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As someone who uses the Hurri 2C as his main "ride", I've never understood the hatred of this bird.
Sure, the hispano's are heavy hitters, and it turns on a dime, but it's one of the slowest aircraft in the game, both in acceleration and top speed, you can't run from anything!
And just FYI, it's been my favorite aircraft since i was 8 or 9 and given a copy of this (which I still have)
(http://users.tpg.com.au/steelyj//hurri.jpg)
Salute
Steely
Careful posting that book on the Hurri Steely :)
Folks will read it and think there really was a Hurricane with a 2 stage Merlin that could perform like Gallico describes. Gallico makes Martin Caiden look like a professional historian with that book. A good read, but highly inaccurate :)
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I am the last to arrive at a fight.
I am the last to make it home.
I am the most likely to be caught.
I burn easily.
I have the worst cannon ballistics in the game.
I am EZ-Mode.
I equate zeros/hurris to a sphere with a set of guns sticking out of it that is free to rotate in any direction it so pleases. A rotating gun platform if you will. It requires no ACM to win 1v1, all it requires is someone willing to fight it.
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Careful posting that book on the Hurri Steely :)
Folks will read it and think there really was a Hurricane with a 2 stage Merlin that could perform like Gallico describes. Gallico makes Martin Caiden look like a professional historian with that book. A good read, but highly inaccurate :)
Totally agree with that, Gallico does use a fair bit of artistic license in that book, only posted as that was the one that made me the Hurri fanboi I am <g>
Salute
Steely
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(http://arworld.net/ims/JohnnyDrama.jpg)
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That's "Zeke". It's slang for "Ezekial".
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Tell me, which is more difficult, to fly a spit 16 HO anyone you see with 2 very good cannons.
Or to fly one of those "turny planes" that can't run from their own shadow much less most of the other planes in the arena?
There is more to flying those "ezmode" birds than most think. Ohhh you can get some kills in it, after all most love to swoop in and pick up an easy zeke kill. But to be able to get back out of a fight, now that can be very very hard.
Its not that any one "style" is inherently better than any other. After all how difficult is it to fly with a wingman in a P51d at 14k and pick up guys who are busy chasing someone else?
AH needs them all, and we have players of all skill levels flying at any given time.
What is with this seemingly new trend of putting down anyone who isn't doing it the "hard" way or "your" way?
What happened to the AH community's tolerance?
Diversity is a good thing. How long do you think you'd enjoy AH if every plane you meet was an F4u?
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Tell me, which is more difficult, to fly a spit 16 HO anyone you see with 2 very good cannons.
Or to fly one of those "turny planes" that can't run from their own shadow much less most of the other planes in the arena?
There is more to flying those "ezmode" birds than most think. Ohhh you can get some kills in it, after all most love to swoop in and pick up an easy zeke kill. But to be able to get back out of a fight, now that can be very very hard.
Its not that any one "style" is inherently better than any other. After all how difficult is it to fly with a wingman in a P51d at 14k and pick up guys who are busy chasing someone else?
AH needs them all, and we have players of all skill levels flying at any given time.
What is with this seemingly new trend of putting down anyone who isn't doing it the "hard" way or "your" way?
What happened to the AH community's tolerance?
Diversity is a good thing. How long do you think you'd enjoy AH if every plane you meet was an F4u?
Well said as always Sir
Steely
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Not sure Einstein,do tell.
Opposed?
op·posed [ ə pṓzd ]
1. against somebody or something: disagreeing with or taking an active stance against somebody or something
Yes, why? Can you string a few words together that do not just constitute a whine?
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I equate zeros/hurris to a sphere with a set of guns sticking out of it that is free to rotate in any direction it so pleases. A rotating gun platform if you will. I
For me, the Hurri IIC was the "Wirbel with wings" - until the Wirbel's turret rotation speed was cut in half, of course ;)
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I feel they hold E way to well.....I dont got stats on it but my question is this If it is so badarse....why did we stop using it in the War?
So you feeeeeel that way? Is it a bad feeeeling :P
I dont got stats on it but my question is this If it is so badarse....why did we stop using it in the War?
You (as in USN/USMC) didn't ever stop using it because you never had the variant we have in the game to begin with. Try to read up on the subject before making completely false statements.
Also, comparing the real war and our MA is about the poorest possible argument you can make.
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I was winging with A8Blood and Dunnrite last night. All of us in 51Ds. Habu55 was in a brewster high over our field as we were taking off. He moved out from our field as we climbed out in chase. Once we all were 13/14K he broke into us a to the deck he went. We all took turns swooping in, getting a piece here, a piece there. Him twisting and turning for all it was worth. A 4th 51 joined us taking his swipes as well. Dunnrite augered, Blood augered and the other 51 just plain got spanked down there with him. Next thing I know, a KI84, 109F and 109K4 are diving like crazed beasts on me (http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk121/TheAmish/Scared-1.gif)I thought Habu did one hell of a job to avoid attacks from every direction, buying him time for help to arrive. It couldn't have been easy because we were coming in a different angles, speeds and directions. One after the other.
It was kind of cool watching that ugly little plane take on the "hoarde" and come out on top. Sometimes, a lot of times, those little turny planes are needed in the game to those tarded pick tards. :D
<<S>> Habu55. Brewsters rock man :rock
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For me, the Hurri IIC was the "Wirbel with wings" - until the Wirbel's turret rotation speed was cut in half, of course ;)
I have referred to it as well as the "Flying Wirblewind", except it is not fair to the wirblewind, as the hurri can rotate its 'turret' 180 degrees much quicker than that tank can. We settled on "Rotating Gun Platform" as a more fitting name.
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I feel they hold E way to well.....I dont got stats on it but my question is this If it is so badarse....why did we stop using it in the War?
Do the names ... "Wildcat", "Hellcat", and "Corsair" ring a bell?
That's like asking ... Why did the Brits stop using the Swordfish? ... the heck with the Spits, Hurricanes, and Typhoons.
The Brewsters that the US flew were pigs and known as "flying coffins" ... they were grossly underpowered due to being grossly overweight due to the armor and fuel requirements that the Navy required in the Pacific. The Finnish air force got their hands on it and lighted it up and developed specific combat tactics for the Brewster's sweet spot and with that, pretty much handed the Russian Air Force their arse. So yeah ... they were bad arse when used and flown correctly.
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If possible, pick a plane for the situation.
Against turny birds, I try to bring a Hurri I, an I-16 or a Brewster. Zekes? For some reason, people seem to avoid Zeros.
Against the zoomers, I go for a Yak-9U or a C-205.
Against a mix, I spend a lot of time in the tower…
i luv fly the early zeke..sure low cannon..but who cares when i dance the sky :D
“Aces High Musical?”
You all don't want to see me in tights.
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(http://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww279/stodd602/cheesecat2.jpg)
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Shhh you'll ruin a good rant. ;)
Edit" now why would a bop be so vehemently opposed to this change? :headscratch:
There, that should make it easier for you to answer.
I'm not opposed to the change, I'm opposed to the reason it was changed.
Why would YOU think that I (as a BOP) would be opposed to it?
I wasn't asking for the definition of the word "opposed".
String a few words together? You're a pretty funny guy. No really.
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:rofl someone must of picked 1Boner to death today, and yesterday...the day before....the day before that....and the next......................
Lol, yeah it happens, but not THAT often!
Just gettin a little sick of wasting 10 minutes+ climbing to an alltitude to be on a somewhat even fighting level with girls who are supposedly looking for a "fight". Only to have them run away at the sight of a co-alt enemy plane.
Imho, THAT is more of a disruption to actual combat than noes ever were.
I'd much rather be actually "fighting" with guys who are truely interested in fighting, not "scoring" kills then running home.
I know I'm whining, but no more than the girls who've been whining forever about noes and a multitude of other things in this game.
Anybody got a tissue? :cry
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I equate zeros/hurris to a sphere with a set of guns sticking out of it that is free to rotate in any direction it so pleases. A rotating gun platform if you will. It requires no ACM to win 1v1, all it requires is someone willing to fight it.
Grizz, I would agree with you if; a) Every fight was on equal terms of E and Alt - and - b) I took Head On shots.
These two points make it impossible to agree however. If it were as simple as point and shoot I would have dropped this game years go for Duke Nukem.
Life in a Zeke is far more complex that that and even fights are rare indeed.... I just make it look easy =).
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My experience is:
being set upon by a typhoon, pony, k4, 38 and a hurricane or brewster. You can't extend or run for that matter, vertical is out (usually for me) so you start a few turns to make the faster aircraft overshoot and try to cut corners for advantage. Just as you think you may have a chance to turn the 2 or 3v1 in your favor here comes the brewster... now you're proper *#$ed. He catches you mid turn and poof, back to the tower. The brewster pilot thinks he's gods gift to pixel pilot land cause he's killed a much lower eny aircraft and youre half a second from a monitor replacement trip :cry
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The brewster pilot thinks he's gods gift to pixel pilot land cause he's killed a much lower eny aircraft and youre half a second from a monitor replacement trip :cry
or is that just the way you felt ? ... did the Brewster pilot come on 200 or PM proclaiming such ? ... I doubt it ... or did he really not give a rat's arse that he just killed you and from the second you went "BOOM" he was looking for the next target to kill or needed to avoid being a target himself ?
This is the type of mentality that gets people whining on 200 or PMing people. Do you really think that you are that special and whoever kills you must think that they have achieved the likes of scaling Mt. Everest ?
All you guys that piss and moan about the "turny" planes probably have no clue to the fact that if it's a real "turny" plane ... it can't get out if it's own way. Yeah it can turn on a dime, but disengage once the fight starts ... not an option. The "turny" planes needs to fight its way out ... in most cases there is never a chance to disengage with speed to reset the fight.
Those who die to the "turny" planes die because they entered (either on purpose or by bad decision) into the realm of the "turny" plane and forgot to use the strengths of their own plane
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Those who die to the "turny" planes die because they entered (either on purpose or by bad decision) into the realm of the "turny" plane and forgot to use the strengths of their own plane
I am a 3 year noob to this game and still learning daily. All other noobs pay attention to this, because it is truth.
Way
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or is that just the way you felt ? ... did the Brewster pilot come on 200 or PM proclaiming such ? ... I doubt it ... or did he really not give a rat's arse that he just killed you and from the second you went "BOOM" he was looking for the next target to kill or needed to avoid being a target himself ?
This is the type of mentality that gets people whining on 200 or PMing people. Do you really think that you are that special and whoever kills you must think that they have achieved the likes of scaling Mt. Everest ?
HAHA!!! cheese and rice man! calm down dude.... yes I have seen a few on 200 proclaiming their virtual greatness, not when they kill me really as it happens a lot but just in general. I mean this is an internets game.... played on the.... internet and you find it hard to believe that people talk smack?! Really? My mentality? lol. I guess my post was misunderstood, what I was attempting to say was that people probably complain about hurries and brewsters as easy mode because they get killed in the same manner I described. You have to admit that it is or would be frustrating if you were to die in a situation like that.
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this I know, if you get someone in a BnZ bird someone who really knows his Bird, and then someone of the same caliber in his "turny" bird it will be a stale mate, if each flies that perspective bird to it's strengths, as soon as the one or other try to play the others game it's over.
me personally as most will know I love the turny birds, when I get into a fast ride the closure rate screws with me. :lol I think it's harder in the BnZ planes.
also this "easy" mode is pretty much every plane if the stick knows it, and is good/awesome in it.
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Sorry for the hijack, but the "stuffonmycat.com" pic made me completely lose it. Good stuff. :rofl
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also this "easy" mode is pretty much every plane if the stick knows it, and is good/awesome in it.
This here is how I feel most of the time....
.although there are some guys out there who exploit the easier planes and then smack it up on 200...which is where in all fairness the op starts from(IMO)...not so much that these planes are easier or seem over modeled...more that guys who know better and cry when they get nailed in a plane more susceptible to quirks come back in them and claim their dominance in these rides smacking it up all the while.....fair enough it's their money..... Frustration just rolls over in these situations......and this is where it rolls out. because the text buffer in game really just isn't big enough
I remember one such time when I was in a.....oh nevermind...
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also this "easy" mode is pretty much every plane if the stick knows it, and is good/awesome in it.
not the plane the pilot :) AH would be really boring if all planes where similar.
As much as it stinks to be the fast plane roping the slow plane....the same can be said for the guy who is turning on the deck and getting picked by the "fast" plane. Simply stated, the higher plane shoulda checked for co-alt turny plane before trying to rope someone. The low slow turner, should have been looking over his shoulder. Add to that, the curious incidents where you do everything right and still lose. If your getting ganged, who cares, it is what it is.
On side note, the other night I had a fight with a brewster in my 38. long story, but in the end I decided to get nice and slow and turn fight him, even after having him on a rope etc. It was real fun, I lost, as I expected in that situation. I didn't get the kill, however, I had much more fun dying than I would have fighting in a manner that would have sealed his fate. I certainly wasn't upset with the guy for flying a "turny" plane, heck he made it fun.
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Lol, yeah it happens, but not THAT often!
Just gettin a little sick of wasting 10 minutes+ climbing to an alltitude to be on a somewhat even fighting level with girls who are supposedly looking for a "fight". Only to have them run away at the sight of a co-alt enemy plane.
Imho, THAT is more of a disruption to actual combat than noes ever were.
I'd much rather be actually "fighting" with guys who are truely interested in fighting, not "scoring" kills then running home.
I know what ya mean man. Tomahawk had me so pissed off the other night I could have chewed nails. He just refused to engage me 1on1, but more more then willing to jump in there when I was busy with a couple others.I guess that's one reason his fighter rank was 50 at the time and mine is 550 at least. But hey I reckon it's his 15 bucks.
It kind of makes me happy that I know that he knows, if he'd come and play with me on even terms his fancy rank wouldn't be so fancy afterall :)
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Lol, yeah it happens, but not THAT often!
Just gettin a little sick of wasting 10 minutes+ climbing to an alltitude to be on a somewhat even fighting level with girls who are supposedly looking for a "fight". Only to have them run away at the sight of a co-alt enemy plane.
Imho, THAT is more of a disruption to actual combat than noes ever were.
I'd much rather be actually "fighting" with guys who are truely interested in fighting, not "scoring" kills then running home.
I know I'm whining, but no more than the girls who've been whining forever about noes and a multitude of other things in this game.
Anybody got a tissue? :cry
I fluffluff'n hate that cowardly feces behavior too. All to often, people behave like that. Frankly, I don't get it, why pay 15 bucks if you don't wanna play? Then best is when you chase them to their base ack where they hide hoping to get a proxy kill from the ack. Its even more frustrating when its a halfway decent stick who decides to 'not play'. Maybe for some, the game is all about ego and winning. Win or loose, I just wanna play, if you don't want to play, fluff off, go take an undefended base or something, but don't wast the rest of our 15 bucks.
It's like if you had a soccer game and the other side said, "we suck and we know it, so instead of loosing and learning, I'm gonna go get 6 more of my buds and beat you with numbers & if I can't get 6 of my friends, I'm gonna run home and tell my friends and family we 'tied'" (even though this would violate the rules of the game).
To me the game is like a sport, its about the fight, if your trying to avoid the fight, your not playing your padding your ego and you deserve to get flamed on 200.
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(...) Frankly, I don't get it, why pay 15 bucks if you don't wanna play? (...) if you don't want to play, f off, go take an undefended base or something, but don't wast the rest of our 15 bucks. (...)
To me the game is like a sport, its about the fight, if your trying to avoid the fight, your not playing your padding your ego and you deserve to get flamed on 200.
Ahh... another "I'm telling you how to play, only my way to play AH is the right one, my money is more important than yours"
I will raise a glass on you the next time I'll drag a La-7 until he's running out of fuel and filling CH200 with rants that only are a testament to his own dumbness. :neener:
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Ahh... another "I'm telling you how to play, only my way to play AH is the right one, my money is more important than yours"
I will raise a glass on you the next time I'll drag a La-7 until he's running out of fuel and filling CH200 with rants that only are a testament to his own dumbness. :neener:
Luche, nice try,
I didn't say don't play, I said, I don't want to play with you if thats how you want to 'play'.
fluff off, go take an undefended base or something
No one would rant to you, after all most of us don't have a hard shell on our backs to hide in.
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I f**k'n hate that cowardly feces behavior too. All to often, people behave like that. Frankly, I don't get it, why pay 15 bucks if you don't wanna play? Then best is when you chase them to their base ack where they hide hoping to get a proxy kill from the ack. Its even more frustrating when its a halfway decent stick who decides to 'not play'. Maybe for some, the game is all about ego and winning. Win or loose, I just wanna play, if you don't want to play, f off, go take an undefended base or something, but don't wast the rest of our 15 bucks.
It's like if you had a soccer game and the other side said, "we suck and we know it, so instead of loosing and learning, I'm gonna go get 6 more of my buds and beat you with numbers & if I can't get 6 of my friends, I'm gonna run home and tell my friends and family we 'tied'" (even though this would violate the rules of the game).
To me the game is like a sport, its about the fight, if your trying to avoid the fight, your not playing your padding your ego and you deserve to get flamed on 200.
What keeps you & every one else coming back is the X factor. Most people don't even realise it. The X factor being I wonder what that other guy is going to do. If you want a space invader game with the same thing day in day out even if you won every time you would soon be bored of it.
The games strength is what am I going to have to deal with today & what is that guy going to do now. Hate it or love it. It will keep them coming back. :aok
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you should start using the editing buttons so you don't get banned in the mornin.
I'll log on and da with ya if you do :)
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What keeps you & every one else coming back is the X factor. Most people don't even realise it. The X factor being I wonder what that other guy is going to do. If you want a space invader game with the same thing day in day out even if you won every time you would soon be bored of it.
The games strength is what am I going to have to deal with today & what is that guy going to do now. Hate it or love it. It will keep them coming back. :aok
discussing the quote of yours in red.............Thats so wrong, I know exactly what is gonna happen, every time I log on, I know I will be ganged and horded :rock
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What keeps you & every one else coming back is the X factor. Most people don't even realise it. The X factor being I wonder what that other guy is going to do. If you want a space invader game with the same thing day in day out even if you won every time you would soon be bored of it.
The games strength is what am I going to have to deal with today & what is that guy going to do now. Hate it or love it. It will keep them coming back. :aok
What keeps me coming back is the good fights. As strange as it sounds, lets say I'm in a fight with 2 other cons and they are turning hard and trying to kill me. Then, someone comes down from 7k above and picks me, I see three things...
1) My SA failed me.. piss on me
2) I feel bad for the 2 guys who were playing with me, they 'deserved' the kill, aka the satisfaction for putting the effort in.
3) Shame on the guy who cleared his friendlies 12.
The issue here is the 'wrong' actions are encouraged. I don't see the people putting in the effort being rewarded, its backwards.
And I'm not talking about myself, I would much prefer it if the two people who were 'playing' with me to receive the credit.
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What keeps me coming back is the good fights. As strange as it sounds, lets say I'm in a fight with 2 other cons and they are turning hard and trying to kill me. Then, someone comes down from 7k above and picks me, I see three things...
1) My SA failed me.. piss on me
2) I feel bad for the 2 guys who were playing with me, they 'deserved' the kill, aka the satisfaction for putting the effort in.
3) Shame on the guy who cleared his friendlies 12.
The issue here is the 'wrong' actions are encouraged. I don't see the people putting in the effort being rewarded, its backwards.
As much as this got you upset what did you do next? I am guessing you got in a plane & went out to search for that fight again that is so elusive for you.
Even if you got the fight you wanted all the time it will eventually stale.
The human element of some one doing what ever it is that they do,lame or not is the games strength.
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As much as this got you upset what did you do next? I am guessing you got in a plane & went out to search for that fight again that is so elusive for you.
Even if you got the fight you wanted all the time it will eventually stale.
The human element of some one doing what ever it is that they do,lame or not is the games strength.
lol, I'm not upset, I just don't appreciate how the current structure isn't more 'sport' like. I was harsh because I felt it warranted it, its not a new issue at all, but its not addressed either. Furthermore, many members have kinda made 'clubs' if you want to call it that, where they play with each other, because them too are annoyed with the behavior of others.
I'll log on and da with ya if you do :)
any time bud, even if I don't get banned (fingers crossed).
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any time bud, even if I don't get banned (fingers crossed).
How about nao?
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How about nao?
I'm at work its only 5:28PST :(
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How about nao?
I'm your Huckleberry :D
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Easy mode? Thats funny!!
Let me guess--some guy screaming down into a fight in a 190 blazing away only to climb back to his perch afterwards said that?
These guys are a huge problem in the game and something needs to be done.
All they are doing is taking the easy route, the less combat the better.
In short, these guys are avoiding combat and need to be dealt with.
Hey I fight with my A8 (and dies alot) :D
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'Twas the RAF that named the Brewster the 'Buffalo Mk.I' when they bought the type and deployed it to the Far East during 1941. Far from a turn-fighter, it turned out to be an unreliable slow-climbing turkey when pitted against the IJAAF's Nates and Oscars over Malaya, Singapore and the Netherlands East Indies. Overweight, and with poor electrics due to tropical humidity and consequent condensation, it was a failure in that theatre. The F2A-3 version employed by the USN and USMC was even heavier, so same result when VMF-221 took on the Zeros at Midway.
The Finns bought the earlier, less-armoured version and ran up huge victory scores in conditions that were rather kinder to the Brewster: cool climate and poorly-trained and led Soviet opposition.
Shame the climate in AH is always perfect, eh?
When I was learning air warfare tactics, it was impressed on me that the crucial role of the fighter was to gain and hold local air superiority in order to enable the bombers/strike aircraft/recce to carry out their essential tasks with mininum interference and losses while denying the same freedom to the enemy. The objective wasn't to run up a high individual score at the expense of not carrying out the primary task - which is why the individual 'turn-'n'-burners' eventually gave way to formations of 'boom-'n'-zoomers', because air wars aren't won by flying in low, slow circles.
You pays your money and makes your choice in AH - long may it continue.
:cheers:
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I am a 3 year noob to this game and still learning daily. All other noobs pay attention to this, because it is truth.
Way
Really? You must have not read all my posts.....
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I think Junky's trolling skills have surpassed Bipolar's. Bip is out of his prime though and Junky is only starting to blossom, so it might not be a fair comparison.
I was actually winging with him the other day :D
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Do the names ... "Wildcat", "Hellcat", and "Corsair" ring a bell?
That's like asking ... Why did the Brits stop using the Swordfish? ... the heck with the Spits, Hurricanes, and Typhoons.
The Brewsters that the US flew were pigs and known as "flying coffins" ... they were grossly underpowered due to being grossly overweight due to the armor and fuel requirements that the Navy required in the Pacific. The Finnish air force got their hands on it and lighted it up and developed specific combat tactics for the Brewster's sweet spot and with that, pretty much handed the Russian Air Force their arse. So yeah ... they were bad arse when used and flown correctly.
Lets test your FM2 vs me in a Brewster.....not being cocky but Id like to see how that fight ends.
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So you feeeeeel that way? Is it a bad feeeeling :P
You (as in USN/USMC) didn't ever stop using it because you never had the variant we have in the game to begin with. Try to read up on the subject before making completely false statements.
Also, comparing the real war and our MA is about the poorest possible argument you can make.
Dont get butt hurt because I called your MAIN ride easy mode.....Theres a film of the EXACT thing I mention earlier with you in it. I belive Snaphook posted it....you ganged him after other cons already engaged him......and he was in a SBD...
nuff said there
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Another drama Queen thread I predict it will end as most of yours do. LOCKED.
If my mom didnt raise me not to tattle tell....I think you would have already been banned after all the posts in just my threads which broke rules...I may have to start using the report to mod button...
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this I know, if you get someone in a BnZ bird someone who really knows his Bird, and then someone of the same caliber in his "turny" bird it will be a stale mate, if each flies that perspective bird to it's strengths, as soon as the one or other try to play the others game it's over.
me personally as most will know I love the turny birds, when I get into a fast ride the closure rate screws with me. :lol I think it's harder in the BnZ planes.
also this "easy" mode is pretty much every plane if the stick knows it, and is good/awesome in it.
Very true.....like I said quoteing UpTown about other planes I call easy mode. What the difference to me is they are easier to make easy mode.
Ive seen how you fly your hurri......I dont consider you in my groups at all, but killing my 262 that one day with that impossible shot....might make me think otherwise :D
:salute
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Those who die to the "turny" planes die because they entered (either on purpose or by bad decision) into the realm of the "turny" plane and forgot to use the strengths of their own plane
Not always, hopefully Spikes will come in here and say what happened when he got my K4 in a brew the other night....I was laready engaged and he came in with some smash...no possible chance of extending even against a semi decent(Not talking about Spikes skill at all right now) noob who can barely aim......
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Not always, hopefully Spikes will come in here and say what happened when he got my K4 in a brew the other night....I was laready engaged and he came in with some smash...no possible chance of extending even against a semi decent(Not talking about Spikes skill at all right now) noob who can barely aim......
Ahhh....back to the steel chair! Cage match baby! Cage Match! :lol
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Ahhh....back to the steel chair! Cage match baby! Cage Match! :lol
It really doesnt have to be...
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It really doesnt have to be...
Where in the heck is the fun in that? I have always felt intimacy is better left to events, the da, or low lit italian restaurants. Just saying... :D
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I knew this would be the first response......Of course if your 1v1 with one of the above birds your not going to turn with him.....but what if your already being engaged by 3-4 and are slow.......gameover and a shamass kill for the person in the turny bird.
Same argument always. Don't turn with it. don;t go head on with it. Never mind that the poster described the scenarios he is talking about. They are always ignored and people are wondering why are you so stupid to turn with one or go HO with a hurri. I have no idea why it is so hard for them to understand what the poster writes :lol
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Same argument always. Don't turn with it. don;t go head on with it. Never mind that the poster described the scenarios he is talking about. They are always ignored and people are wondering why are you so stupid to turn with one or go HO with a hurri. I have no idea why it is so hard for them to understand what the poster writes :lol
Are you saying Im having a hard time understanding? If so you are completely false, the problem with most of the posts in the threads I have made is the people say the same thing over and over and over but arent making a legit arguement to the discussion at had especially after I said yea wheen its 1v1 NO watermelon MA isnt all 1v1s like most of the people said in many other threads....yall say the same thing over and over....
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Are you saying Im having a hard time understanding? If so you are completely false, the problem with most of the posts in the threads I have made is the people say the same thing over and over and over but arent making a legit arguement to the discussion at had especially after I said yea wheen its 1v1 NO watermelon MA isnt all 1v1s like most of the people said in many other threads....yall say the same thing over and over....
Nop, I am saying they ignored what you said and told you to not turn with one. As I said, now one reads :lol
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Nop, I am saying they ignored what you said and told you to not turn with one. As I said, now one reads :lol
Thank you finally someone sees it lol sorry to assume :salute
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junky you really have fully morphed into an idiot..a slower bird does not have to "force an overshoot"..its the faster plane that has to adjust..i luv fly the early zeke..sure low cannon..but who cares when i dance the sky :D
dance away hunter66 :aok those zekes should dance like butterflies
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I'm having a hard time reading your 7 posts in a row junky. :eek: That has to be some kind of post-count boosting record.
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Very true.....like I said quoteing UpTown about other planes I call easy mode. What the difference to me is they are easier to make easy mode.
Ive seen how you fly your hurri......I dont consider you in my groups at all, but killing my 262 that one day with that impossible shot....might make me think otherwise :D
:salute
:rofl dude you know how much it hurt pullin that horseshoe out my A $ $ after that shot? :rofl
:salute
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2 words.......insert quote
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Dont get butt hurt because I called your MAIN ride easy mode.....Theres a film of the EXACT thing I mention earlier with you in it. I belive Snaphook posted it....you ganged him after other cons already engaged him......and he was in a SBD...
nuff said there
Kind of hard to have any sort of logical discussion with the likes of you when your own comments doesn't follow any sort of logic.
You can call planes with names all you want. Calling the overall slowest plane (with the I-16) as such tells me more about the commenter than it does about the plane. Particularly it tells about the lack of SA and tactics.
What EXACT thing? That Brewster is easy mode? This game has had its public whiners for quite some time, unfortunately.
The fact that you keep saying how Brewster is overmodelled because "it wasn't used" late in the real war just tells more about your cluelessness than it tells about the Brewster. Offer me a single aerodynamical fact to which you base this assumption on?
I don't know you and don't usually fly in the same times as you. But if someone is constantly having trouble with slower planes in a much faster one it is an indication of rather poor SA. On the other hand, if someone does it deliberately and simply ignores the incoming enemies and concentrates on one, that is his own way of flying and his progative. Anybody can fly the sim exactly how they choose. But it isn't anyones progative to be automatically taken seriously/have respect when he starts crying about the deaths resulting from those "tactics" and the tactics of others on a BBS.
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Kind of hard to have any sort of logical discussion with the likes of you when your own comments doesn't follow any sort of logic.
You can call planes with names all you want. Calling the overall slowest plane (with the I-16) as such tells me more about the commenter than it does about the plane. Particularly it tells about the lack of SA and tactics.
What EXACT thing? That Brewster is easy mode? This game has had its public whiners for quite some time, unfortunately.
The fact that you keep saying how Brewster is overmodelled because "it wasn't used" late in the real war just tells more about your cluelessness than it tells about the Brewster. Offer me a single aerodynamical fact to which you base this assumption on?
I don't know you and don't usually fly in the same times as you. But if someone is constantly having trouble with slower planes in a much faster one it is an indication of rather poor SA. On the other hand, if someone does it deliberately and simply ignores the incoming enemies and concentrates on one, that is his own way of flying and his progative. Anybody can fly the sim exactly how they choose. But it isn't anyones progative to be automatically taken seriously/have respect when he starts crying about the deaths resulting from those "tactics" and the tactics of others on a BBS.
Heres me dweebing it up in your ride....remember some of those spits got 1000 feet better climb rate then the brewster on the deck.....doesnt seem so here. Also notice how I jump the LA...he ends up messing up but if his flak buddy wasnt there he was done..
http://www.mediafire.com/?t4y01udemmj
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I'm having a hard time reading your 7 posts in a row junky. :eek: That has to be some kind of post-count boosting record.
Dude Ive been up since 0430 yesterday.....Im lazy :)
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Heres me dweebing it up in your ride....remember some of those spits got 1000 feet better climb rate then the brewster on the deck.....doesnt seem so here. Also notice how I jump the LA...he ends up messing up but if his flak buddy wasnt there he was done..
It's not "my" ride and the climb charts show sustained climb. Look at the variometer in E6B on a sustained climb. You really don't know enough about the subject matter to be saying anything about Brewster's performance.
I have no desire to waste my time watching your films.
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WMaker is from Finland. I wouldn't rag on him for flying a Brewster no more then I would for Snailman flying a 190 or Bruv flying a Spitfire. It's their planes man. One of the coolest things about this game is talking to a guy that's flying a plane matching his native accent. If that don't make for true realism, I don't know what does. :rock
Who cares if it turns good or not.
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See Rule #4
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Lets test your FM2 vs me in a Brewster.....not being cocky but Id like to see how that fight ends.
Been there done that just the other day ... the Brewster definitely has the upper hand if all things are equal. I used every trick in my book and could not shake the Brewster for the life of me. After getting dispatched to the tower, I then flew out in a Brewster and the next ending was quite different ... :D
I have fought Brewsters in my FM2 when I have had alt advantage and I use an aggressive BnZ approach to beat them ... had I decided to get into their world, I most likely would have lost.
Now, if our Brewster was a US Navy Brewster, the FM2 would probably beat it hands down.
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Thank you finally someone sees it lol sorry to assume :salute
Well I read this ... and do agree that the "don't go 1 v 1 with them" was not the right response considering your previous posts and explanation.
I knew this would be the first response......Of course if your 1v1 with one of the above birds your not going to turn with him.....but what if your already being engaged by 3-4 and are slow.......gameover and a shamass kill for the person in the turny bird.
and I immediately thought this ...
I knew this would be the first response......Of course if your 1v1 with one of the above birds your not going to turn with him.....but what if your already being engaged by 3-4 and are slow.......gameover and a shamass kill for the person in the <insert any plane name>.
It's been my experience (let me emphasize "my") that I would replace <insert any plane name> with the premiere-timid go-fast planes ... BF-109s, FW-190s, P-51s, Typhoons.
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I think it retains E too well............
So you think it retains E too well and therefore should be "nerfed"? Wow, we are in the presence of a great genius when it comes to field of aerodynamics. HTC should hire you as a consultant so that they could get the flight models right.
If you wont watch the films then Dont comment you punk.....
Name calling won't get you anywhere. My comments had nothing to do with your film but with your comment regarding how planes climb in real life and in AHII.
I have heard many times that some planes charts are wrong in some way in another, So I refuse to use only them.
Because of, ahem, *many* reasons I'm not gonna start guessing what you have "heard". But if you have a problem with the climb charts, why don't you do some testing and find out if there any discrepencies between them and the game?
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JunkyII - A comment and a question...
First the comment..."There is no spoon."
(http://thetongsweb.net/images/Neo_No_Spoon.jpg)
AH translation: "There is no bnz or turny plane". I'll let you ponder that for awhile. You probably think that's a ridiculous statement but of course that just means you haven't reached Neo level enlightenment yet. Free your mind! ;) When you realize the truth of the statement you'll be on your way to AH Jedi-hood.
Second a question...please tell me, how do you know the Brewster holds energy too well? And I hope it's not because you've heard it on the intardnet ;).
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Ok here's the guy who pretty much started this all. the scenario with the 152 the brew that was me twice, in TT no less lots skill in those kills? NO. got a 152 with a brew? Yes. Ive flown this bird the whole month now got over 400 kills with it easy bird to fly? yes easy bird to turn? yes easy bird to escape after said dweebness? NO. I will start my fights all of them with alt. no more than 10k attack my initial tgt then just jump in amongst every one and get as many as I can before death, or till no ones left, then what you say well by this time theres 2 things waitn on me. A horde of upset folks lookin for payback oh wait that's all there ever is. Very rarely do I make it out. Its tough down right impossible alone. My fights are with 2 or more folks 3 outta 5 times, you must have excellent SA the keep track because you lose sight of one guy your done. If your lucky there will be enough backup to keep theses guys off your back long enough to make you escape. you hope. The brew cannot out turn the hurris or the zeke you have to engage and knock them outta the fight ASAP, especially if they know how to fly them. The guys I laugh at are you typical energy fighter or the bnz type I run into 2 kinds. Type 1 knows what hes doin and retains his E hes patient extends as far as needed lines up and trys again hes meticulous in his approach, the other get impatient quickly does not extend and pulls in the vert in which case I pull up and attempt to damage him in some way. Now oil rad pretty much anything you can get your hands on. and outta the guys I damage half of em still manage to get away with Superior speed. In closing use your brain and use your planes strengths, be patient the brew aint gettin away in fact he wants to fight most of the time he just wants you close enough. I go into a fight assumin Im gonna be picked so dont gripe when a brew drops outta nowhere and takes you wing you have no one to blame but yourself. :aok
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Ok here's the guy who pretty much started this all. the scenario with the 152 the brew that was me twice, in TT no less lots skill in those kills? NO. got a 152 with a brew? Yes. Ive flown this bird the whole month now got over 400 kills with it easy bird to fly? yes easy bird to turn? yes easy bird to escape after said dweebness? NO. I will start my fights all of them with alt. no more than 10k attack my initial tgt then just jump in amongst every one and get as many as I can before death, or till no ones left, then what you say well by this time theres 2 things waitn on me. A horde of upset folks lookin for payback oh wait that's all there ever is. Very rarely do I make it out. Its tough down right impossible alone. My fights are with 2 or more folks 3 outta 5 times, you must have excellent SA the keep track because you lose sight of one guy your done. If your lucky there will be enough backup to keep theses guys off your back long enough to make you escape. you hope. The brew cannot out turn the hurris or the zeke you have to engage and knock them outta the fight ASAP, especially if they know how to fly them. The guys I laugh at are you typical energy fighter or the bnz type I run into 2 kinds. Type 1 knows what hes doin and retains his E hes patient extends as far as needed lines up and trys again hes meticulous in his approach, the other get impatient quickly does not extend and pulls in the vert in which case I pull up and attempt to damage him in some way. Now oil rad pretty much anything you can get your hands on. and outta the guys I damage half of em still manage to get away with Superior speed. In closing use your brain and use your planes strengths, be patient the brew aint gettin away in fact he wants to fight most of the time he just wants you close enough. I go into a fight assumin Im gonna be picked so dont gripe when a brew drops outta nowhere and takes you wing you have no one to blame but yourself. :aok
I fly exactly the same way except 5 out 5 im ganged :D and the Hurri2C is my choice of plane. when I am hitting good there is a plane to be reckoned with :t
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I don't see why I would ever fear a Brewster or A6M or Hurricane when flying the Mosquito.....unless I had already messed up....
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I wish the Brewster carried ord that way I could bomb fighter hangars down. Then I would wait for a new thread on the BBS of Brewster's with ord killing my Fighter hangars has to stop.
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I don't see why I would ever fear a Brewster or A6M or Hurricane when flying the Mosquito.....unless I had already messed up....
mossie is appetizer before the meal :aok
only time I get killed by mossie is when they are in the red horde, don't get me wrong I know they turn well and have great guns, but 1vs1 me in my hurri and anyone in the Mossie....wait a minute I really should not say that because I suk at shooting and it would be my luck to miss the easily set up first shot and second and third, to allow them a gun solution after I get pissed at myself for missing EVERY shot and they eventually kill me....
seriously with the same ALT at start and all that, The well flown Mossie don't stand a chance against the well flown Hurri :aok
I would be more then willing to put this to the Test... :t
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Anytime I see a Brewster, I disregard them. But if they are co-alt or higher, I take notice. Generally Ill try to merge with them, and sucker them into trashing their E, which happens a lot from these Brewster drivers. I just hope I dont get hoed by one and get an insta pilot wounded.
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mossie is appetizer before the meal :aok
only time I get killed by mossie is when they are in the red horde, don't get me wrong I know they turn well and have great guns, but 1vs1 me in my hurri and anyone in the Mossie....wait a minute I really should not say that because I suk at shooting and it would be my luck to miss the easily set up first shot and second and third, to allow them a gun solution after I get pissed at myself for missing EVERY shot and they eventually kill me....
seriously with the same ALT at start and all that, The well flown Mossie don't stand a chance against the well flown Hurri :aok
I would be more then willing to put this to the Test... :t
A well flown mossie would rope that hurri up by it's ankles straight off the merge. The only way the hurri stands a chance is a deck merge at under 300mph. At 10k-13k co-alt merge that hurricane is in a world of hurt. :t
edit: from 3k both planes on 25% fuel the mossie can dive to the deck and zoom back up to 6k in a 1G pull quite comfortably. The hurricane struggles to reach 4.5k roughly from the same dive. So even at a 3k merge the best the hurricane can hope for in the vertical is a lucky long range shot that will cost it's life if missed. A smart hurri would turn low of the merge and play the defensive game. The hurri doesnt even out-gun this opponent, a well flown mossie really should be a hurricanes worst nightmare, 1 on 1. Willing to try it out, expect I would win every fight from 3k merge unless I screw up the merge or you hit me with something i have never seen before. Would be fun. :)
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I don't see why I would ever fear a Brewster or A6M or Hurricane when flying the Mosquito.....unless I had already messed up....
or im the a6m :D
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or im the a6m :D
Nope. Sorry. For you to have a chance at getting me I'd have to have messed up. The A6M's performance just makes it thus.
And I like the A6M, it is on my favorites list.
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The dichotomy is that slow planes ARE easy to avoid and very vulnerable to certain methods, but these are the same methods that many consider dishonorable and/or boring.
EDIT: I do agree with Junky's general statement, that alot of really dedicated t'n'b planes only get many kills because something faster in the MA has already engaged the bandit and prevented them from leaving. Being engaged by a Tempest/HurriIIC wingpair is going to make you feel there is some fundamental unfairness in the situation, I don't care who you are.
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I used to fly the yak 9t as my main fighter in the LW arena, I got kills with it, just fought it out and waited for the person to mess up, now that I have switched to the B 239, I find I get more kills, but its because i find it way easier to exploit other peoples mistakes with, and before everyone starts coming in and asking how much fun I have picking from above the furballs, most of my fights today were 1v1 at about 7 or 8k , and I won against almost all of the 0.5 eny planes the game had, all I had to do was wait for them to make a mistake, for example, I was fighting an La7, I got a shot off at him when he tried to turn with me, he broke off and was about 5k out, no possible way for me to catch him, then he turned back around and tried turning with me again. If you dont like brewsters becase they "turn to good" dont turn with them, that seems like the most logical thing to do to me.
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Nope. Sorry. For you to have a chance at getting me I'd have to have messed up. The A6M's performance just makes it thus.
so youre saying that if i have altitude on you that it is you messing up? the a6m can use a nice rudder-braking style dive to get on any enemy's 6 if a straight dive cannot work. And that if you miss me on the first pass and i quick roll back into you that that is another mistake you made?And I like the A6M, it is on my favorites list.
:D
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I do agree with Junky's general statement, that alot of really dedicated t'n'b planes only get many kills because something faster in the MA has already engaged the bandit and prevented them from leaving.
Hmmm ... most of my experiences are when I am working a con in my FM2, some late war monster hot rod feels it's necessary to drop off their perch and pick the guy off my 12.
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WMaker is from Finland. I wouldn't rag on him for flying a Brewster no more then I would for Snailman flying a 190 or Bruv flying a Spitfire. It's their planes man. One of the coolest things about this game is talking to a guy that's flying a plane matching his native accent. If that don't make for true realism, I don't know what does. :rock
Who cares if it turns good or not.
Good example. He is always the third guy into a fight.
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I wouldn't rag on him for flying a Brewster no more then I would for Snailman flying a 190 or Bruv flying a Spitfire.
Snailmans #1 "kills in" plane is a British one... unpatriotic traitor! :uhoh :noid
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Good example. He is always the third guy into a fight.
Ok ... which "he" are you referring to ?
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So you think it retains E too well and therefore should be "nerfed"? Wow, we are in the presence of a great genius when it comes to field of aerodynamics. HTC should hire you as a consultant so that they could get the flight models right.
Name calling won't get you anywhere. My comments had nothing to do with your film but with your comment regarding how planes climb in real life and in AHII.
Because of, ahem, *many* reasons I'm not gonna start guessing what you have "heard". But if you have a problem with the climb charts, why don't you do some testing and find out if there any discrepencies between them and the game?
If the FM is correct right now...the plane doesnt need a 30 eny....more like 15. People shouldnt get rewarded 6 perks for killing a spit16 that got alittle slower in a furball of many cons and a Brew/Hurri/Zeak come up and saddle up on them.
109G2 and a Brew are the same perk value. Brew has alot better guns, turns a ton better, and can dive with a G2. G2 yes is faster and can sustain climb better but it isnt on the extreme end of the spectrum like the Brew is with its turning.
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See Rule #4
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so youre saying that if i have altitude on you that it is you messing up? the a6m can use a nice rudder-braking style dive to get on any enemy's 6 if a straight dive cannot work. And that if you miss me on the first pass and i quick roll back into you that that is another mistake you made? :D
No, no.....what he is saying is that the Mosquito would not be at fault if it lost to a slow little plane through SA or ACMs, only the Pilot of the mosquito would be.
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Ok ... which "he" are you referring to ?
WMaker
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A well flown mossie would rope that hurri up by it's ankles straight off the merge. The only way the hurri stands a chance is a deck merge at under 300mph. At 10k-13k co-alt merge that hurricane is in a world of hurt. :t
edit: from 3k both planes on 25% fuel the mossie can dive to the deck and zoom back up to 6k in a 1G pull quite comfortably. The hurricane struggles to reach 4.5k roughly from the same dive. So even at a 3k merge the best the hurricane can hope for in the vertical is a lucky long range shot that will cost it's life if missed. A smart hurri would turn low of the merge and play the defensive game. The hurri doesnt even out-gun this opponent, a well flown mossie really should be a hurricanes worst nightmare, 1 on 1. Willing to try it out, expect I would win every fight from 3k merge unless I screw up the merge or you hit me with something i have never seen before. Would be fun. :)
I would love to put it to the test :aok
you are assuming the hurri will fall for the rope, which I would not do, well mostly I don't, if I miss judge my nme E state I might, but I have learned not to do that.
I would much rather be at 10K then on the deck I would not dive low on the merge I would set it up (the merge) to put guns on ya without you able to.
sad though I would probably just miss my shots :cry
ether way we should do this :aok
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WMaker
Considering the few engagements I remember between us, this is rather hillarious comment. :)
We've had good 1 vs 1 fights and situations where both sides have had numerical superiority.
So you are basically being a hypocrite here.
Your statement doesn't surprise me though, the guys who frequently and loudly whine on 200 when they die are usually totally lying about the situation they just were in. I'm sure it's sometimes "an honest" view from the whiner's side (the view would be different after calming down and watching the film) and the typing is done in the heat of the moment (which is just dumb in itself). But usually it's just
100% lies to make the whiner look good and to belittle the shooter's achievement and potray him as "unskilled". Just like what can be seen in here.
Unfortunately this forum has too many of these whining liars with egos the size of Texas. And all because of a video game...
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Considering the few engagements I remember between us, this is rather hillarious comment. :)
We've had good 1 vs 1 fights and situations where both sides have had numerical superiority.
So you are basically being a hypocrite.
Your statement doesn't surprise me though, the guys who frequently and loudly whine on 200 when they die are usually totally lying about the situation they just were in.
I'm sure it's sometimes times "a honest" view from the whiner's side (the view would be different after calming down and watching the film) and the typing is done in the heat of the moment (which is just dumb in itself). But usually it's just 100% lies to make the whiner look good and others in the fight look as "the unskilled mass". Just like what can be seen here.
Unfortunately this forum as plenty of these whining liars with ego's the size of Texas. And all because of a video game...
Haha, see what I meant on bats thread? The person getting called out always denies it happened and starts the name calling. If I remember correctly, your excuse was that your plane was too slow and that is why you kept being the 3rd in. After the engagement, you flew back behind the first two guys and waited.
It really puzzles me why people get so upset when they are called out on what they do, and their first action is to deny it at all costs. Only thing I can think of is that they know that they are doing something wrong. Otherwise, they would be here making their tactics public.
As I said, great example of how the turny plains can be used. BTW, you are a great opponent when you are alone in a brew.
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Haha, see what I meant on bats thread? The person getting called out always denies it happened and starts the name calling. If I remember correctly, your excuse was that your plane was too slow and that is why you kept being the 3rd in. After the engagement, you flew back behind the first two guys and waited.
It really puzzles me why people get so upset when they are called out on what they do, and their first action is to deny it at all costs. Only thing I can think of is that they know that they are doing something wrong. Otherwise, they would be here making their tactics public.
As I said, great example of how the turny plains can be used. BTW, you are a great opponent when you are alone in a brew.
I'm not doing any name calling on you particularly. Just stating the observations I've made during the ten years I've flown AH. I have to say I for the life of me can't remember having that sort of discussion. The two times I've flown against you in the "near past" (which is what I can remember) was in the MW and we had great fights there. Some 1 vs 1s and some with other people involved. And one other time in the LWMA when you were flying La-7 and I was flying Brewster. I could try digging up some films from those fight. I had a lot of fun in them. And therefore have hard time understanding your back stabbing.
Your call was that I'm always the thid guy into a fight. Considering the myriad of different combat situations found in the LWMA, that really can't be anything but utter BS...on anyone's case really. I mean if you really think about what you claimed.
And for the record I'm not upset, at least not because of the reasons you think.
We truly have some wonderful personalities in here. <sigh>
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I'm not doing any name calling on you particularly. Just stating the observations I've made during the ten years I've flown AH. I have to say I for the life of me can't remember having that sort of discussion. The two times I've flown against you in the "near past" (which is what I can remember) was in the MW and we had great fights there. Some 1 vs 1s and some with other people involved. And one other time in the LWMA when you were flying La-7 and I was flying Brewster. I could try digging up some films from those fight. I had a lot of fun in them. And therefore have hard time understanding your back stabbing.
Your call was that I'm always the thid guy into a fight. Considering the myriad of different combat situations found in the LWMA, that really can't be anything but utter BS...on anyone's case really. I mean if you really think about what you claimed.
And for the record I'm not upset, at least not because of the reasons you think.
We truly have some wonderful personalities in here. <sigh>
That is the one. Obviously, I can only talk from my experiences. Why is telling what happened, back stabbing? Sure they were fun fights. That is why I kept coming back, but you were constantly not the first one in nor did you stay out when I was in the middle of fighting others. Not saying you did anything wrong (you seem to think so). Just saying what happened and how it applies to the example.
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BTW, you are a great opponent when you are alone in a brew.
If you had a 1 vs 1 in one of the MAs with me (and we both know we've had several), how can I then me always the third guy in? :huh
So you are basically caught on a lie right here.
Why is telling what happened, back stabbing?
Throwing dirt on me on a public forum by saying things that are totally false. That is what I call "back stabbing" when the corresponce from both of our sides during those fights was positive. If you had an issue with my actions then, you could have said something.
Not saying you did anything wrong (you seem to think so). Just saying what happened and how it applies to the example.
If I didn't do anything "wrong" what is there to call out in the first place then??
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Must... resist... posting...
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Must... resist... posting...
Dont Id actually like to hear what you think about my topic honestly. Instead of saying the same thing over and over like many have maybe you would post something important(to the topic)
<S> Lute
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If you had a 1 vs 1 in one of the MAs with me (and we both know we've had several), how can I then me always the third guy in? :huh
So you are basically caught on a lie right here.
No, the others just died first lol
Throwing dirt on me on a public forum by saying things that are totally false. That is what I call "back stabbing" when the corresponce from both of our sides during those fights was positive. If you had an issue with my actions then, you could have said something.
I did, and you said that your plain was too slow to get there first. But, as I said, I could see you pulling back until I was committed to a fight.
If I didn't do anything "wrong" what is there to call out in the first place then??
Just stile. You are the only one thinking you did something wrong.
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No, the others just died first lol
Ok, I think it's time to dig the films up then...not sure if they work since I don't remember weather it happend prior or after the strat update. But I know that you know that this is pure poppycok.
I did, and you said that your plain was too slow to get there first. But, as I said, I could see you pulling back until I was committed to a fight.
Again, I have to try finding some films I guess.
Just stile. You are the only one thinking you did something wrong.
Hmm...then I think I have a language problem on what "calling someone out" actually means. But I think not.
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No, the others just died first lol
Well here's a film where you just come from your field so there no "others" that died first and I believe I wasn't the third guy into the fight.
The film itself shows nothing interesting except that it was a 1 vs 1 and not a 3 vs 1 that turned into a 1 vs 1 because "dedalos killed the rest".
I have nothing against you personally dedalos, but when someone starts talking baseless BS about me I want to put the facts on the table. I'm sure you wouldn't like it either if someone does it to you.
film (http://users.kymp.net/joonas.konttinen/dedalos_1330.ahf)
I can be anything from 1st to 10th guy into the fight depending on the situation and the size of the fight, just like everyone else in here.
One silly thread this is...
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so youre saying that if i have altitude on you that it is you messing up? the a6m can use a nice rudder-braking style dive to get on any enemy's 6 if a straight dive cannot work. And that if you miss me on the first pass and i quick roll back into you that that is another mistake you made? :D
Nope. Mossie doesn't need the altitude. As long as it is not both slow and on the deck it can get the separation it needs to reverse the situation. The A6M5 would be trickier than the Brewster, A6M2 or any Hurricane as the climb rate is about the same as the Mossie's. I am not saying the Mossie is invincible, just that it has a significant upper hand if it and any of the aforementioned aircraft are flown to their strengths.