Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Perrine on October 09, 2010, 05:54:14 PM
-
You know, having a single late war arena with 500+ people logged in.
Having that much people concentrated in one arena is the closest we can get to numbers seen in Battle of Britain, Battle of kursk and the Defense of The Reich, but on a daily basis. I think that makes total war (in WW2 fashion) interesting.
-
You know, having a single late war arena with 500+ people logged in.
That's exactly the reason why the arenas were split in the first place. We used to have a single MA until 4 years ago.
-
I'm still debating over whether the split arenas REALLY "fixed" the problems of the 500+ arena, or just spread the issues out across multiple smaller ones. I really never saw much change in the mentality, only in the number of planes in the air.
-
I'm still debating over whether the split arenas REALLY "fixed" the problems of the 500+ arena, or just spread the issues out across multiple smaller ones. I really never saw much change in the mentality, only in the number of planes in the air.
Not sure what fixed is, but I sure know that from my persepctive, Titanic Tuesday is the least enjoyable flying night. Amazing to see that many folks on, and no one really wanting to fight.
Easier to create a fight in the two arena set up from what I see
-
Why not?
If we are down for "Internets Premier WW2 Combat experience" I think we should adopt (or rather re-adopt) a single main arena with numbers the closest we can get to total war (in WW2 fashion) as seen in air battle over English coast and the massive, epic air and ground tactical battle at Kursk :aok Speaking of Kursk I doubt this massive air/ground battle will ever be topped in the 21st century.
-
Not sure what fixed is, but I sure know that from my persepctive, Titanic Tuesday is the least enjoyable flying night.
It's about the only night left for me to fully enjoy AH. If I want to see any level of activity that like the one i got a few years ago, I have to stay up to US prime, about 4am my time.
Currently the numbers at my prime are quite low, the arena cap is very much strangling the action for hours at my prime. Actually I never have seen so few players online at my time since I started playing AH.
I actually have tracked the numbers for a whole week. At last during the weekdays, total population of both LW arenas combined pretty low, going over 400 for a very short time only if at all. The only exception seems to be Tuesday... go figure ;)
-
The biggest problem with this: How will the world function with 7 Tuesdays? Businesses with halt, world militaries will fall apart, and religions won't know when to meet. At least we'll have plenty of time to play Aces High then!
-
Why not?
If we are down for "Internets Premier WW2 Combat experience" I think we should adopt (or rather re-adopt) a single main arena with numbers the closest we can get to total war (in WW2 fashion) as seen in air battle over English coast and the massive, epic air and ground tactical battle at Kursk :aok Speaking of Kursk I doubt this massive air/ground battle will ever be topped in the 21st century.
Because war isn't fun, and we're playing a game and in that game more does not always mean better. I understand that some of the European players sort of get the short end of the stick with the arena caps but I have to agree, that IMHO Tuesdays are the least enjoyable night of the week for me.
-
That's exactly the reason why the arenas were split in the first place. We used to have a single MA until 4 years ago.
Gameplay has never been the same since the LWA was split in two.
-
Amazing to see that many folks on, and no one really wanting to fight.
I agree it is amazing and to some degree happens most nights of the week. I just don't get it.
-
It's about the only night left for me to fully enjoy AH. If I want to see any level of activity that like the one i got a few years ago, I have to stay up to US prime,
I'd have to agree to the point where I find myself even bothering to play less because of the activity level.
Typically lately when I log on And Ill use a couple of nights ago for example. Bish and rooks were fighting each other and there was very little activity between Knits and either of them. Oh plenty of knits were up. but all it was was a landgrab against what was basically token resistance.
And when its not like that. often it seems like 5 billion to one Bish/rooks against knits landgrabbing us I dont particularly care for hording, Nor do I particularly care to be constantly horded or gangbanged. As much as I love the game. I find neither activity fun.
So I play less. After all. there isnt much point in playing if it isnt going to be fun.
The split arenas have also seemed to render the lager maps pointless And I love the big maps when there are enough players to fill them, (such as TT) But every other day lately when I log on it seems as described above.
Now I dont like arena caps or split arenas. I know its been explained as to why they are there and I understand that. Still dont like em though. But thats besides the point.
But if we are going ot have the split arenas and arena caps. then maybe we should dich the large maps for the medium sized ones and just save the large maps for TT.
On another rant. What is with everyone hiding in the field ack? Seems since they upgraded the field ack intensity as soon I run into someone where the numbers are about even or in a 1 V 1. As soon as they loose even a small bit of advantage. They go run and hide in the feild ack to try and collect proxies and only come out of it far enough to try and get you to chase them into it again. And Im not even talking about a horde situation. I'm seeing this more and more with even evenly matched fights.
Considering you dont get any points for a proxie kill. If your base isnt getting horded or your not being gangbanged. I just dont see the point
-
I actually have tracked the numbers for a whole week. At last during the weekdays, total population of both LW arenas combined pretty low, going over 400 for a very short time only if at all. The only exception seems to be Tuesday... go figure ;)
I've been noticing pretty much the same thing for a while now as well
For the amount of people who say they dont like TT. It does seem to be the most popular night of the week
-
Considering you dont get any points for a proxie kill.
You may not get perk points, but they are legit kills for score purposes ;)
-
You may not get perk points, but they are legit kills for score purposes ;)
LOL then proxie kill from field ack is a loophole that seriously needs to be closed. All it does is promote lame game play,
However. I DO think that if your fighitng someone and can get them to eat a tree, Kiss the side of a barn or loop them into the ground. you should not only get kills awarded to your score. but perkies as well LOL
that at least takes some degree of skill to accomplish
-
IMO when the arenas split, AH stopped being a sim and became an arcade game. Won't bother explaining what I mean. Those that feel the same already know.
-
LOL then proxie kill from field ack is a loophole that seriously needs to be closed. All it does is promote lame game play,
However. I DO think that if your fighitng someone and can get them to eat a tree, Kiss the side of a barn or loop them into the ground. you should not only get kills awarded to your score. but perkies as well LOL
that at least takes some degree of skill to accomplish
Stay away from the field and it will never happen. Let the guy get up and away from the ack if you want a decent fight. If he runs, then 180 and try somewhere else.
-
IMO when the arenas split, AH stopped being a sim and became an arcade game.
I may hate the caps, but I don't share that opinion ;)
-
Stay away from the field and it will never happen. Let the guy get up and away from the ack if you want a decent fight. If he runs, then 180 and try somewhere else.
LOL Well thank you captain obvious. LMAO kidding
That Is what I do. But what Im saying is all it does is reward people for not fighting. Which is kinda what this game is supposed to be about.
And Im not talking just about the guys that just up. im talking about guys that are also half a sector away from their base and outright refuse to fight unless then have some sort of great advantage. Orr the ones that all they do is hang around their base to try to lure people into the feild ack.
Its a loophole that should be closed
-
Why not?
If we are down for "Internets Premier WW2 Combat experience" I think we should adopt (or rather re-adopt) a single main arena with numbers the closest we can get to total war (in WW2 fashion) as seen in air battle over English coast and the massive, epic air and ground tactical battle at Kursk :aok Speaking of Kursk I doubt this massive air/ground battle will ever be topped in the 21st century.
But what if I want 1944-45 with all the latewar birds. The Axis then only gets brand new players while the Allied guys get all the vets and out number the Axis 10-1 or so every night. We're talking 10,000 sorties to 100 with vets against newbs. That's total war. Kinda doubt that would go over very well. You want Kursk? OK all those latewar rides are gone. You want English coast? That's an awful lot of Spitfires. Gotta believe the crowd would groan over that too. You willing to go with one death and you never play again? That's total war. Don't think HTC will make much of a profit that way however.
This isn't total war, it's a game where folks can do lots of stuff beyond rolling bases and 'winning the war'.
-
I think we should adopt (or rather re-adopt) a single main arena with numbers the closest we can get to total war (in WW2 fashion) as seen in air battle over English coast and the massive, epic air and ground tactical battle at Kursk :aok Speaking of Kursk I doubt this massive air/ground battle will ever be topped in the 21st century.
The closest you can get to this will never be the MA, regardless of player numbers. But you can find it in scenarios and FSO.
-
The closest you can get to this will never be the MA, regardless of player numbers. But you can find it in scenarios and FSO.
Amen
-
People are gonna play how they play whatever day it is...I enjoy TT the most
You log on...boom no decisions get into the arena and start fighting..
But the split arenas are here to stay I'm afraid
-
When the arena split happened many players cancelled
their account and many more have since followed.
It killed squads wholesale. How do I know?
I maintained a database of squads with email contacts.
Fully 20% are no longer in existence since the split.
Yea, I kept track.
A small handful of players might like it, but I'm convinced that
a majority only endure the repeated insults they receive as they
try to log in to play with their squaddies only to be met with
a "full" arena. To say this is irritating is an understatement.
Help me out here, when does irritating customers make sense in
business....any business?
Anyway, maybe you guys in the gangbangin' 80th are drinkin' the
Kool-Aid but I'm not...and I know I'm not alone. It has become the
single greatest complaint among current subscribers and for good
reason.
When I leave (and I've been contemplating it more and more lately)
it will be primarily because of the arena split. Having some spare
time to play with my squad and being greeted with a full arena is
something I can only put up with for so long.
BTW, in a somewehat related question, has any country won a map
since the arena split? Have any victory perkies been awarded?
I used to love how everyone's blood was up as we neared victory.
It was a real rush! Does that ever happen anymore? Or has
winning become politically incorrect in this chess game.
I'm glad I got a chance to play the original Aces High before
all these incremental changes were made though. I've been playing
since late 2000 and can clearly see what's it become and where its
headed.
I'm sad to say that this game used to be awesome but little by
little it has degenerated into a colossal arcade game: a contest
without end and where victory is deliberately made unattainable.
This game is no longer addictive gentlemen.
It's best days are definitely behind it.
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb209/StracCop/LCA/AdmitOneMoM6.jpg) (http://david.tenifer.com/aceshigh/LCA.MoM-Current.php)
-
It killed squads wholesale. How do I know?
I maintained a database of squads with email contacts.
Fully 20% are no longer in existence since the split.
Yea, I kept track.
But would they still be here without the split? Even before the split, only few squads did "survive" for more than a few years. Only 20% loss over the time of 4 years doesn't sound much to me.
BTW, in a somewehat related question, has any country won a map
since the arena split? Have any victory perkies been awarded?
Hundreds of times. Literally.
Even with the new, larger towns, the map was won. even in LWO.
I used to love how everyone's blood was up as we neared victory.
It was a real rush! Does that ever happen anymore?
Yes.
And it was not the split itself that caused a reduction of won wars over a given time. Actually, as a rule of thumb, many more wars are won in smaller, less populated arenas.
It was the new rules for winning the war (= capturing territory of both opponents, instead of just being the country with most bases total when one country was reduced to smoking rubble). And this change was absolutely necessary, and one of the most resonable gameplay changes in AH so far.
-
The biggest problem with this: How will the world function with 7 Tuesdays? Businesses with halt, world militaries will fall apart, and religions won't know when to meet. At least we'll have plenty of time to play Aces High then!
GOOD ONE! (Spell checker cannot differentiate 'with' from 'will'.)
-
When the arena split happened many players cancelled
their account and many more have since followed.
It killed squads wholesale. How do I know?
I maintained a database of squads with email contacts.
Fully 20% are no longer in existence since the split.
Yea, I kept track.
A small handful of players might like it, but I'm convinced that
a majority only endure the repeated insults they receive as they
try to log in to play with their squaddies only to be met with
a "full" arena. To say this is irritating is an understatement.
Help me out here, when does irritating customers make sense in
business....any business?
Anyway, maybe you guys in the gangbangin' 80th are drinkin' the
Kool-Aid but I'm not...and I know I'm not alone. It has become the
single greatest complaint among current subscribers and for good
reason.
When I leave (and I've been contemplating it more and more lately)
it will be primarily because of the arena split. Having some spare
time to play with my squad and being greeted with a full arena is
something I can only put up with for so long.
BTW, in a somewehat related question, has any country won a map
since the arena split? Have any victory perkies been awarded?
I used to love how everyone's blood was up as we neared victory.
It was a real rush! Does that ever happen anymore? Or has
winning become politically incorrect in this chess game.
I'm glad I got a chance to play the original Aces High before
all these incremental changes were made though. I've been playing
since late 2000 and can clearly see what's it become and where its
headed.
I'm sad to say that this game used to be awesome but little by
little it has degenerated into a colossal arcade game: a contest
without end and where victory is deliberately made unattainable.
This game is no longer addictive gentlemen.
It's best days are definitely behind it.
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb209/StracCop/LCA/AdmitOneMoM6.jpg) (http://david.tenifer.com/aceshigh/LCA.MoM-Current.php)
Well said! :aok
From the old chess game to all this sophisticated on line games there is a reason to fight for, a goal to achieve , unfortunately this was eliminated in AH, there's nothing left to fight for and promote the fights.
-
Well said! :aok
From the old chess game to all this sophisticated on line games there is a reason to fight for, a goal to achieve , unfortunately this was eliminated in AH, there's nothing left to fight for and promote the fights.
Rubbish.
Bases are still captured, war's are still won. In all arenas. It's just no reset every two days anymore in LW. It is now a more worthy goal than the old gangbang run for reset.
---------------
Quick explanation for all players that haven't been in AH 5 years ago:
Today,to win the war one country must have 90% of it's own bases and 40% of each enemy's bases.
5 years ago, the rules were much different. When one country was down to 5 bases, the war was over. The winner was simply the country with most bases at that time.
The result was a constant gangin of the "smallest" country, because you had to. It was actually a detrimental for the both bigger countries to fight each other most of the time. Hence they were always piling on the smallest one. Constantly. You can imagine what these rules meant for gameplay.
Today, at one point they absolutely have to fight each other, or they don't win.
So unlike 5 years ago, there is a country truly "winning" the war.
So if you wanna bring chess into it: It's more chess today than it was with the old rules.
-
The argument that hundreds quit woould seem to fly in the face of Hitech's responses to this most every time. I seriously doubt they'd have done the split if it was that disasterous for the player base.
My understanding is the numbers are better now in terms of subscribers.
-
Well said! :aok
From the old chess game to all this sophisticated on line games there is a reason to fight for, a goal to achieve , unfortunately this was eliminated in AH, there's nothing left to fight for and promote the fights.
While smaller maps would help I think it's the players themselves that have slowly killed the game play in the arenas. GHI has a style of game play that contributes to this. It's his $15 so more power to him, but as one of the "known" mission planners and best base takers in the game his missions draw a lot of people. For better or worst many players will emulate his mission style as well. So now we have more players looking to NOE bases, horde bases, hit and run when the going gets tough type missions. More and more people see the win the war/avoid the fight as the way to play the game. Why, because that is how they see other play the game. The game is no longer about fighting, it's about avoiding the fight.
Small maps force hording, big maps provide hiding spots for those that look to avoid the fight. Medium sized maps might help, but again, map making is a player function at this time. I wish HTC would give a map maker 3 months free subscription. Of course you'd have to have someone that was tops in the map making field to double check it so he would have to have some free time as well. This would ease the load on Skuzzy to get these maps into rotation.
In the old days, back in AH1 the game was more about the fight. Sure their were NOEs, but not 20 of them in a row, nor were there more than 10 guys in them. Missions were flown, and the attacks were to the end, stubbornly so some times. Until the player base swings back toward the "fight" as the objective of the game we will be stuck with this poor style of game play.
-
OK if we go with 7 days of TT then it need to be changed evryday.
Sacrificial Sunday
Maniacal Monday
Titanic Tuesday
Wacked-out Wednesday
Throw Down Thursday
Fearsome Friday
Search and Destroy Saturday
And on the days a major holiday comes into effect Hitech's Horriday.
LOL
-
My understanding is the numbers are better now in terms of subscribers.
Of course I can't say anything about subscriber numbers.
But I can says the numbers online at my usual (euro) timeframes are about the lowest I have ever seen in AH since nov 05, 1 year before the split.
There may be many different reasons for that, it's mostly beyond my capability to analyze that... but with low numbers, the caps surely do not help at all.
-
I'd like to have a Titanic Tuesday every day for good reasons: Monday would always have been yesterday and it would always be a total of 5 weekdays until next Monday which according this scenario would never come. Long live eternal Tuesdays!
-
LOL then proxie kill from field ack is a loophole that seriously needs to be closed. All it does is promote lame game play,
However. I DO think that if your fighitng someone and can get them to eat a tree, Kiss the side of a barn or loop them into the ground. you should not only get kills awarded to your score. but perkies as well LOL
that at least takes some degree of skill to accomplish
I would have to agree with that. A proxy kill as a result of someone being an Ack-Flower, should not count toward anything. However, if you can cause someone to lose control of their plane and crash, then you should be awarded the full perk and damage points.
-
Of course I can't say anything about subscriber numbers.
But I can says the numbers online at my usual (euro) timeframes are about the lowest I have ever seen in AH since nov 05, 1 year before the split.
There may be many different reasons for that, it's mostly beyond my capability to analyze that... but with low numbers, the caps surely do not help at all.
Last night around 10:30 PM EST LW Orange 198 players in arena. Players pretty evenly divided. On the entire map there was one sector that had a darbar that would indicate more then one plane.
NEVER used to see that at that time
switched to LW blue where there were two reasonable fights going on. Knits bish and bish rook. But nothing like Im used to seeing on a smaller map.
-
Search is your friend........
-
I'm still debating over whether the split arenas REALLY "fixed" the problems of the 500+ arena, or just spread the issues out across multiple smaller ones. I really never saw much change in the mentality, only in the number of planes in the air.
Ohh it fixed a lot of things. For example, before the split you could find hoards and small fights here and there. Now you have to either follow the horde or fly reconnaissance missions since with 200 guys on we only have enough for one hoard per country with a few guys being vulched :aok Maybe next patch we get some high resolution cameras and get some perks for pictures of the enemy fields?
-
Is it really 4 years since the arena split?
I've been playing this game too long.
-
1. Change all of the ack on airfeilds to manned ack.
2. Put the GV hanger in the town or between the town and airfeild but, no longer as part of the airfeild.
3. Increase the auto ack for the town and add manned guns to the town. One manned ack at the map room.
No more hiding in the ack at the airfeild and the town becomes the fortress it should oppossed to the airfeilds being fortresses which are never captured by dropping troops on them in AH2. Allow town ack to be resupplyed and allow the town to be captured by knocking down all the buildings then getting 10 troops in through the defensive fire to capture it anyway you can. Haven't you ever wished during an NOE 110 town hoard mission you could have been in a manned gun in town? Haven't you ever wished you had a 17 pounder to hold off GV from the town?
So what if bombers and jabo could now close down an airfeild faster because of no auto ack. Well? Organised squads drop the ack and GV hanger inside of 30 seconds and clean up whirbles within the next 2 minutes. How often do you watch bomber boxes fly low over a feild comitting suicide while carpet bombing? Or at 12-15k precision bombing the feild down? If the object to be captured is actually the town associated to an airfeild, make it an ack fortress and fight over it. As it is the combination of unlimited feild spawning whirbels and auto ack make airfeilds auto fortresses and promote poor gameplay in terms of aircombat. Put some puffy ack back around the town so you get targeted above 3k like a stationairy CV. After all the germans protected important towns with 88batteries historicly.
Make airfeilds less of a rat hole for players to hide in. It's a balance and the NOE Hoarder weenies from 6 months ago will probably milk it some how. But, as long as airfeilds are rat holes to hide in the ack, we will devolve into rat hole hugging cowards while patting ourselves on the back for our strategic cleverness. Heck even return us to the AH1 environment. It was more dangerous..... :)
-
Agree. Let's have 1 arena. No need for EW and LW. No one's in there anyway.
-
Agree. Let's have 1 arena. No need for EW and LW. No one's in there anyway.
No one in LW? :headscratch:
-
Agree. Let's have 1 arena. No need for EW and LW. No one's in there anyway.
Are you a socialist? :D
-
If I were forced to fly in the late war cesspool I would bid this game it's final adieu!
-
Take the caps off and you probably will end up with 500-600 in one spot everyday. :aok
-
And that would be bad Dr death. HTC has already determined that numbers over 400 on a consistent basis is bad for the subscription rates.
-
And that would be bad Dr death. HTC has already determined that numbers over 400 on a consistent basis is bad for the subscription rates.
And they also launched patch 2.21 Patch 3 without notice and it broke a whole lot of stuff! It's not the first time and won't be that last time either. HTC can do anything it wants as their is virtually NO competition! It's apparent that they do not have any beta-testing program for their updates (other than the paying subscribers). Now to get back on topic... When we only had one Main Arena, I was happy but as we progressed into several arenas, I found it better than having one single arena. I was miffed as heck when they split the arenas and I found that I had to adapt. Now I must state that I HATE the "ARENA CAP", that has screwed a bunch of the players. I now have to admit that I have started to hate what I call "Titanic Twit Day".
All the Best...
Jay
-
If I were forced to fly in the late war cesspool I would bid this game it's final adieu!
you'll comeback
This game is the ONLY one in the block. There's no competetion
Fighter Ace is dead
Warbirds is on life support like Terri Schiavo
IL2 is full of hacks
-
you'll comeback
This game is the ONLY one in the block. There's no competetion
Fighter Ace is dead
Warbirds is on life support like Terri Schiavo
IL2 is full of hacks
That is also why you will never see TT run all week. HTC will run the game as a money making enterprise. TT looses money, split arenas make money.
-
That is also why you will never see TT run all week. HTC will run the game as a money making enterprise. TT looses money, split arenas make money.
How? I very rarely see more than 400 people on if I add both arena populations. The few times it is over that it happens for a small amount of time. Do you think I will stay because I cant find a fight in huge map with 150 people in it or with 400? I ll take the 400 any time
-
That is also why you will never see TT run all week. HTC will run the game as a money making enterprise. TT looses money, split arenas make money.
4 years ago? Probably. Right now?
Not so sure, because the number of players online is considerably lower, but the caps are still the same. During the week, we hardly reach the "cesspool" numbers shortly before & after the split in 2006.
Particularly noticable is the drop at "European" times. There will be many different reasons contributing to that, but surely running into 130/100, 30/150 arena caps is not doing a good job in creating a "healthy" combat environment.
A typical monday:
(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/7403/monday.jpg)
See how both LW arenas are stuck with max 100 players for the whole euro prime time (1900-2400 hours = 1200-1700 CDT).
-
4 years ago? Probably. Right now?
Not so sure, because the number of players online is considerably lower, but the caps are still the same. During the week, we hardly reach the "cesspool" numbers shortly before & after the split in 2006.
Particularly noticable is the drop at "European" times. There will be many different reasons contributing to that, but surely running into 130/100, 30/150 arena caps is not doing a good job in creating a "healthy" combat environment.
A typical monday:
(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/7403/monday.jpg)
See how both LW arenas are stuck with max 100 players for the whole euro prime time (1900-2400 hours = 1200-1700 CDT).
Lusche and his cold hard graphs, good stuff :aok
Numbers are "behind the power curve" IMO.
I need targets and I need lots of them to improve my odds of hitting something! :x
-
How? I very rarely see more than 400 people on if I add both arena populations. The few times it is over that it happens for a small amount of time. Do you think I will stay because I cant find a fight in huge map with 150 people in it or with 400? I ll take the 400 any time
My statement is based off of what HTC said for the reasons they split the arenas. I'm sure it still holds true to this day (or one would think things would have changed again). I agree that today's population is different than it was back then. Maybe HTC are a bunch of optimists. Maybe they figure the economy is on a positive upswing and the numbers will climb right back up to where they were before so there is no reason to make any changes. Maybe they bought out Warbirds and will be shutting them down bringing in more subscriptions :noid
I agree that the Euro guys get the short end of the stick. I wish Hitech would comment or why they won't move the time for the cap system a bit later into the evening for the Euro guys. Maybe someone should call them, or get Pyro drunk at the CON and get a strait answer out of him. What happened to the idea Lusche and Hitech had going about a new setup for starting the cap system?
There are many questions begging for answers. I know flying on TT sucks. I try it now and then and it's just a waste of time for me, just too full of frustration. Some like it, but then again some like running in hordes, some like good dogfights, and some like capturing bases. It doesn't really matter what YOU like. It's HTC playground, they make the rules. We just try to find our bit of fun inside those rules.
-
I agree that the Euro guys get the short end of the stick. I wish Hitech would comment or why they won't move the time for the cap system a bit later into the evening for the Euro guys. Maybe someone should call them, or get Pyro drunk at the CON and get a strait answer out of him. What happened to the idea Lusche and Hitech had going about a new setup for starting the cap system?
Of course I don't know what HT is thinking, but I still see some problems with my own proposal (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,292342.0.html) myself:
It certainly would lead to the 2nd aren filling up much more quickly. But when looking at the numbers above, I wonder: At what time should the switch from daytime operation (one arena) to nighttime operation (2 arenas) happen? Does it make sense to shut down the non-prime arena and bring up the two prime time arenas just for like 4 hours or so? Because if you keep it to 12 hours daytime (1 arena) and 12 hours night/primetime (2 arenas), we would basically have the same problem again: 200 players split into 2 arenas.
Currently the only way I can keep the fun level up is flying as much as I can during US times... which isn't really good for my health :uhoh
Seeing the action slowly fade away in LWO at 7pm local time is quite depressing ...
Maybe they figure the economy is on a positive upswing and the numbers will climb right back up to where they were before
I think it's less economy related than to a number of other factors, but here I'm really more guessing than knowing ;)
-
All I know is that before the split I could find any type of fight I wanted. There were furballs, hoards, lone buffs, buff hunters, lone fighters, etc., etc. I could go sit in a GV at any base even if it wasn't under attack and in time it would be. Why? The maps were full. At that time I seem to remember the single MA consistantly running about 750 players during prime time (about the same as Titanic Tuesday now).
Now I log on and find one hoard against another hoard or else split hoards fighting lone players. The most people I seem to ever see in both LWA's combined is about 400. I haven't seen any improvement in gameplay and in fact, I think it's worse.
I know that RL is doing a lot to keep me from playing. So far this camp I've put in 20 minutes. But before I went back to work I spent ovet a year unemployed and my game time continued to decline to where it is today. Many nights, even though I have the time and inclination to play, I log on, look at the map and log back off and most nights I can think of 10 other things I'd rather do.
A have to agree that the glory days of AH and most likely WWII flight sims in general is behind us. I try to hold out hope but it becomes more fleeting each year/month/week.
Now we see the advent of smaller, player driven arenas coming once again and I can only surmise that the recent trend toward more, smaller, less populated arenas will continue. It will be a sad day when this entire community is splintered into pairs. I don't expect I'll be here for that day.
-
Gameplay has never been the same since the LWA was split in two.
Agreed. +1 :aok
-
Maybe that is what they are counting on. Get the mini arenas system up and running which could thin out the numbers in the mains. Then once the numbers stabilize they can switch it to a single main arena again. Again without any kind of announcement it's just speculation.
-
My statement is based off of what HTC said for the reasons they split the arenas.
Yes, to limit the cesspool. Personally, I find this insulting as a paying customer for 10 years.
I agree that the Euro guys get the short end of the stick. I wish Hitech would comment or why they won't move the time for the cap system a bit later into the evening for the Euro guys. Maybe someone should call them, or get Pyro drunk at the CON and get a strait answer out of him. What happened to the idea Lusche and Hitech had going about a new setup for starting the cap system?
There are many questions begging for answers. I know flying on TT sucks. I try it now and then and it's just a waste of time for me, just too full of frustration. Some like it, but then again some like running in hordes, some like good dogfights, and some like capturing bases. It doesn't really matter what YOU like. It's HTC playground, they make the rules. We just try to find our bit of fun inside those rules.
Just because HT does something, it does not automatically make it right. For one thing, it is also our playground. With out us, (the cesspool of paying customers) there is no play ground, and with out HT there is no play ground. There has to be a balance on what gets done. Treating it as only his play ground will lead to the playground being closed. There is already a decline in the number of people on line, no? Lets stop blaming the economy and try to find the real reasons and then fix them. I like the game, but not so match with 150 people on. Will like it a lot less with 100.
As far as TT goes, that is not my experience with it. With a lot of people on I can find small fights here and there. With 150 people on, all that is available is a hoarding attempt at a base and nothing else. Maybe if they played the game they would have a better idea fo what is and is not going on in it.
To this date, I don;t remember seeing a good reason for the split other than generalizations. I may have missed it though.
-
Maybe that is what they are counting on. Get the mini arenas system up and running which could thin out the numbers in the mains. Then once the numbers stabilize they can switch it to a single main arena again. Again without any kind of announcement it's just speculation.
I'm not entirely sure that is a planned strategy, but it really won't surprise me if that's what winds up happening. A lot of people seem to want smaller more controllable situations rather than open arenas, at least on the forums. When the player arenas get up, I am predicting a mass exodus to them.
Wiley.
-
I'm not entirely sure that is a planned strategy, but it really won't surprise me if that's what winds up happening. A lot of people seem to want smaller more controllable situations rather than open arenas, at least on the forums. When the player arenas get up, I am predicting a mass exodus to them.
At first certainly. But I don't think on the long run... unless the allowed number of players will be a surprising high one. In the long run, players are looking for big numbers and gameplay on a large scale, the numbers of LWO vs LWB testify to that.
IMHO the really large arena aspect of AH was always one of it's greatest strengths, putting the massive into MMO.
-
At first certainly. But I don't think on the long run... unless the allowed number of players will be a surprising high one. In the long run, players are looking for big numbers and gameplay on a large scale, the numbers of LWO vs LWB testify for that.
IMHO the really large arena aspect of AH was always one of it's greatest strengths, putting the massive into MMO.
Of course, when it's new, the shiny will be on it and people will go to check it out. It's gonna be running at capacity for the first week or so for sure.
I agree with your points, Lusche. However, I'm going to present a slightly different interpretation. Your interpretation is the one I hope for, the one I'm about to present is the one I fear. You've been around a lot longer than me, maybe you know a bit better what motivates the general playerbase based on what's gone before. I'm making some assumptions on how it's going to work here, but nothing too outlandish I think.
People head for the arena with numbers. The reason they fill up an arena is they're looking to get into a fight quickly, it's easier to do when there's numbers. Based on a lot of the board reading I've done the last little while, there's a decent number of people who want small, controllable fights. 1v1, 3v3, 5v5 type stuff.
If I'm a duelist, am I going to want to log into a populated arena, or am I going to want to log into a player arena where <insert big name player name here> is looking for a 1v1? Or if I'm into small scale squad fights, am I going to grab a squaddie or two and head over to fight where <insert big name squad here> is looking for some 3v3 action?
Or am I going to want to log into a 16v16 or 32v32 server that's using that new supercool map inside the caves with stalactites and stalagmites everywhere to get in the way that some guy made for small scale fights? (c'mon map builders, you know it's a good idea)
etc etc.
I've seen some of the racing maps people have set up. I'm really, really looking forward to that now and again, it looks like a blast and a nice change of pace from time to time.
I'm just afraid that people will go looking for their 'bite sized fights' in the player arenas and if there are enough that have that mentality instead of the desire to seek unpredictability in an open arena, the open arenas will become a ghost town.
Really depends how they set it up. A lot of people are used to the idea of 16v16 or 32v32 being the norm due to a lot of other online games like Halo, Counterstrike, and stuff in that vein. It might be a more familiar, more palatable thing for them to use. I'm worried the mentality that 'the only place to find a good clean (no HOs, no picking, yadda yadda yadda) fight is in the player arenas' will become the norm, regardless of whether it's true or not.
Now, the utopian vision is for the people who want fair fights to go to the player arenas and still leave enough people in the open arenas that are actually looking for unpredictable fights that the whining will stop completely. :pray ...I have my doubts this will come to pass.
Wiley.
-
I think it's more the DA than the MA'S that will take a hit.
We had player hosted arenas for years, and it always seemed to me most of those players that did not simply go away (H2H arenas were for free), went to the DA, particularly Lake Furball.
-
I'm with the group that doesn't like TT. I really don't like the large furballs that go on in TT (1. I like base taking and that's why I play, and 2. my computer has trouble sometimes running with 80 icons on the screen). I still fly TT becuase there are those small groups around the map that are taking bases. Even if we aren't base taking, sometimes I find a nice small fight between 10 people that is by far more fun than the 30 vs 30 fights. Those fights are the best where everyone is fighting very well (and fair), and when you see that "109G6" in the skies, you already know who is flying it and what to expect from them.
I love the split arenas because it gives you more options to choose from. If LWO doesn't have the fight you're looking for, then you can hop right over to LWB and fight there. When arena cap kicks in though it can get tough to join the other arena, but you can always go grab a snack, see whats on TV, play a track or two from your favorite bands, and then try to log on again. I always do this and arena cap usually evens out by then.
-
I have to agree, that IMHO Tuesdays are the least enjoyable night of the week for me.
Me too, but only because my sorry out-of-date computer and connection mean that the sheer numbers of people on all at once cause my framerate to rarely rise above 10.
Otherwise, TT is head and shoulders above almost every other night of the week because you never have to go looking for a fight... they're everywhere.
BOOOOO split arenas and arena caps
YAAAAAY Action!
-
I love the split arenas because it gives you more options to choose from. If LWO doesn't have the fight you're looking for, then you can hop right over to LWB and fight there. When arena cap kicks in though it can get tough to join the other arena, but you can always go grab a snack, see whats on TV, play a track or two from your favorite bands, and then try to log on again. I always do this and arena cap usually evens out by then.
Too bad when they even out only after 2h hours and then stay at 100 for the rest if your evening ;)
But just to clarify: I don't have problems with the split arenas as they are. (Not anymore, that is. :D) Actually I would like to become EW, MW, WW1 more attractive once again. (My dream would be about 100 in EW,MW, WW1, and 300 on a large map in LW - For me that would really mean having a choice!)
What makes me wonder sometimes are some gyus flying in TT Arena, complaining how bad the huge numbers suck (with only 300 players on a large map, LOL), but at the same time they stay there instead of playing in MW for example, with only 40-50 players.
One time I asked one why. He basically answered "too much dweebery in MW". Well, if there is too much dweebery with 300 players, but too much dweebery with only 40 players too - Are the numbers really your issue then? :headscratch:
-
I had to cancel my account recently for a bit because I just bought a house and am cramming in more school than I should (no money and no time), but I plan on coming back, so take my opinion for what it's worth (probably nothing until I'm paying again)...
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I liked the days before ENY restrictions and before the arena splits. No matter what I'm doing in life, I always have more fun when my back is to the wall. Also, and though I guess this is kind of a stupid reason, I have that human "scratch off ticket" mentality when it comes to perks, and I like to rack them up. I'd rather get ganged by ten 5-ENY rides than ten 20-ENY rides. I'm going to die either way, but I'll get to fly the cool stuff quicker by fighting the former.
I've gotten better over the years, but instead of only the risk being reduced by my hard work, the reward has been artificially lowered as well.
I miss the days where we'd be down to our last few bases and everyone was rolling Tempests, 262s, 163s and -4s to desperately try to survive. That was a thrill I haven't been able to find in some time... Maybe it happens, but it's much more hit or miss.
-
And that would be bad Dr death. HTC has already determined that numbers over 400 on a consistent basis is bad for the subscription rates.
Understand that is what HTC is thinking, but #1, has it ever been validated, #2, the customer demand for it seems to be there, and #3, there is obviously an ongoing issue with the cap system. The game is an immersion game and tries to simulate and portray the real thing. To accomplish that, what is better, 200-220 people scattered across 120 bases or 500-800 people in the same map?
From a business standpoint, I think what HTC may want to consider doing is to maybe conduct a few surveys to determine the best examples of what the customer is wanting, as any business needs to cater to the demands of the majority of there customers to remain successful r too grow. Especially being a small business which is operating at a global scale. Been playing the game off and on since probably 2001ish and never seen a customer survey. Maybe they do it at the conventions, but is that a true representation of your customers?? :salute
-
From a business standpoint, I think what HTC may want to consider doing is to maybe conduct a few surveys to determine the best examples of what the customer is wanting, as any business needs to cater to the demands of the majority of there customers to remain successful r too grow.
At this point I'm all on HiTechs side: The customer doesn't always know / ask for what he really wants. It's pretty easy to run a company by surveys and giving the customer what he votes for... and in the end having a product that sucks and turns customers away. ;)
Which of course doesn't stop me from telling HTC what I want day after day :lol
-
Looking at Lusche's graph, I believe I have a reasonable point to make. I realize I am not in possession of all the facts, but bear with me...
Up until the caps kick in, you've got ~150 total available people. They all appear to be crammed into LWO. Caps kick in, you get a slow climb in total numbers to 200. At this point, you've got one 100 person arena, and one arena that's slowly climbing to 100 over a period of 1.5-2 hours.
I believe 100 and less is really not enough to populate an arena, particularly one of the gigantic ones like we tend to have in LWO lately. We generally wind up with a horde on each side, with a few single guys off on their own doing their own thing hitting bases or whatever. I tend to see the most fun when I'm in an arena that has more like 200 people in it. There's more varied gameplay, maybe a couple hordes in different spots, a few smaller battles seem to crop up over the map instead of just one big one.
Ok, to be precise, I believe that splitting into two 100 person arenas is a bad choice when we could have 1 200 person arena with the wider varied gameplay for euro primetime, and then having the caps segue into 2 minimum 150s at the end of it, as population begins to climb. 200 is nowhere near the cesspool numbers I've seen thrown around, and it seems to me the better choice between the two.
Now granted, this is taken from a really small sample of data here, being one day, but if the quick spike from 23:00 to 1:00 is consistent, it doesn't take long for it to get pretty close to 300 total.
I hate myself for mentioning this, as I realize caps have been hashed around to death, but I believe it's a point I've never seen brought up before.
Wiley.
-
Now granted, this is taken from a really small sample of data here, being one day,
(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/7403/monday.jpg)
(http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/7563/tuesday.jpg)
(http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/2433/wednesday.jpg)
(http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/8799/thursdayn.jpg)
(http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/1346/saturday.jpg)
-
Heh, ok... Still statistically small, but by the ones Lusche has put up, maybe the 'magic number' I'm thinking of is 250 instead of 200. That way when they cap at 150 under my scenario it means they're both pretty close. There's also probably a point where the composition of those numbers change, from as the Euros begin logging off and are replaced by American time zone folk.
I guess the main point I'm making is, 200-250 is not cesspool numbers, but 100 and less is boring as all getout, and I believe it would be better if it remained uncapped until the 200-250 mark before splitting. 150 as a minimum seems to me to generate much better gameplay than 100 as a minimum. That difference of ~50 to a side as opposed to ~30 to a side is huge when it comes to generating better gameplay, IMO.
Wiley
-
Dude, just curious so do not take it the wrong way, but where do you get the data sets for the charts? Are you doing data analysis for HTC on the sly?? :salute
-
Dude, just curious so do not take it the wrong way, but where do you get the data sets for the charts?
Login screen ;)
I did Friday & Sunday too, but Friday was skewed by FSO - MA numbers were far lower than usual at US prime time due to like two hundred players in SEA.
-
Yes, to limit the cesspool. Personally, I find this insulting as a paying customer for 10 years.
I believe it was said the activity was turning the arenas into a cesspool, poor game play.
Just because HT does something, it does not automatically make it right. For one thing, it is also our playground. With out us, (the cesspool of paying customers) there is no play ground, and with out HT there is no play ground. There has to be a balance on what gets done. Treating it as only his play ground will lead to the playground being closed. There is already a decline in the number of people on line, no? Lets stop blaming the economy and try to find the real reasons and then fix them. I like the game, but not so match with 150 people on. Will like it a lot less with 100.
It has been posted that the reason they split the arenas was that poor play was creating a cesspool in the arena. This was causing people to NOT sign up for their subscriptions after the 2 week free trials. Subscription numbers either stagnated, or started to drop off. HTC split the arenas and added cap to allow not more that 400-450 in any arena. Low and behold the subscription numbers started to go up again.
Now we have to take HTC word for this as he has said there is noway he would release any info from the game, subscription numbers, aircraft flight model data, or even where they get the info is a very closely guarded secret and I for one have no problem with that. To me, I don't care how stubborn or pigheaded anyone is, if the change they made HURT their own business I'm pretty sure they would change it back quick. So we MUST go along with what is said.
HTC is a pretty shrewd businessman, from what I've seen. He has done this "business" a few times and this time has it going strong while all the others are falling by the wayside. I think that is a pretty good sign that he knows what he's doing when it comes to running HIS playground. Sure you CAN leave, but you haven't :devil
As far as TT goes, that is not my experience with it. With a lot of people on I can find small fights here and there. With 150 people on, all that is available is a hoarding attempt at a base and nothing else. Maybe if they played the game they would have a better idea fo what is and is not going on in it.
To this date, I don;t remember seeing a good reason for the split other than generalizations. I may have missed it though.
Pyro listed the main points of "why" they did the split. I don't have the thread saved.
There really isn't anything wrong with this game. The graphics are better than they use to be. The game mechanics are wide and varied. The vehicle/flight modeling is hard enough to make it challenging, while still having it so that it can "almost" be mastered. You can be a "fighter jock" or a "tanker", or a "ground mover". You can fly along, with a wingman, or a squad. You can just go out and kill, or you can capture bases and eventually "win the war".
The only problem I see is "HOW" people do these things. Over the last 5 years or so I've seen more and more people look for the "easy" way to do these things. The HO is the first move in 95% of fights because it's just to much trouble to learn to set up a real merge. Bombing is done "dive bombing carpet style", because even with our "lazer guided" sites its still too much trouble to calibrate and hit single targets. GVing is nothing but spawn camps or people who up a bunch at once to break it so they can....you guessed it set up their own spawn camp.
The problem with the game is the people playing it. Always looking for short cuts. It takes wayyyyy to long to learn how to play with out them. Funny thing is, that most of the people that use the short cuts spend so much time playing the game that if they spent half the time trying to get better they would be some pretty skilled players!
-
Understand that is what HTC is thinking, but #1, has it ever been validated, #2, the customer demand for it seems to be there, and #3, there is obviously an ongoing issue with the cap system. The game is an immersion game and tries to simulate and portray the real thing. To accomplish that, what is better, 200-220 people scattered across 120 bases or 500-800 people in the same map?
From a business standpoint, I think what HTC may want to consider doing is to maybe conduct a few surveys to determine the best examples of what the customer is wanting, as any business needs to cater to the demands of the majority of there customers to remain successful r too grow. Especially being a small business which is operating at a global scale. Been playing the game off and on since probably 2001ish and never seen a customer survey. Maybe they do it at the conventions, but is that a true representation of your customers?? :salute
I dont think anyone has so much problem with having split arenas as much as having a forced cap.
Some people really like large masses and some would prefer smaller fights. Given a choice between two arenas there will always be one that many of not most will want to get into, and others that will by their own choice choose one with smaller numbers.
I have always been a proponent of letting the players decide matters like this.But I would much rather see a base cap, that is capping the amount of planes that can up frm a base at any one time then an arena cap. This would be by far more realistic from an immersion standpoint then what we have now and would serve to spread out the fights over a larger front
-
It's thursday morning around 3am EST and it's still Titanic Tuesday. I hope it goes through the rest of the week. The numbers in the arena have not been so bad and everyone seems to be able to find a fight. The hordes weren't any more or less than what you would see in a split arena. :salute
-
It's thursday morning around 3am EST and it's still Titanic Tuesday. I hope it goes through the rest of the week. The numbers in the arena have not been so bad and everyone seems to be able to find a fight. The hordes weren't any more or less than what you would see in a split arena. :salute
I'm sorry, I have to disagree, I did not experience that at all. By 12:30PST it was dead. Perweeb and I were cruzing around looking for any fight we could find, and after 10 min of attacking virtually undefended targets, I logged out of boredom :( (there were only 2 people, if I recall correctly, defending a CV).
-
I'm sorry, I have to disagree, I did not experience that at all.
Bad times can happen with big arenas too. It's not that I have never logged out of a TiTue because somehow it all sucked ;)
But most of the time, for most players, the chances are much higher they find what they are looking for in an arena with 250 players than one with 100. Dying battles and having only occasional single cons here & there are pretty much standard when caps kick in.
the caps may have worked with the numbers we once had... both LW arenas were filling up more quickly, and reached satisfactory numbers relatively fast.
But now they are just splitting up 150-200 players into two arenas for many hours.
I just wanted to log on to get a bit of playtime before the caps kick in. We have 75 players in LWO. I have never ever seen number so low at this time before, not too long ago I would have expected about 150. Seeing that TT has finally ended, I guess it will get ugly again when caps kick in in about 2 hours... :uhoh
-
I'm sorry, I have to disagree, I did not experience that at all. By 12:30PST it was dead. Perweeb and I were cruzing around looking for any fight we could find, and after 10 min of attacking virtually undefended targets, I logged out of boredom :( (there were only 2 people, if I recall correctly, defending a CV).
So 1230AM PST is what 0430AM EST, on a Thursday morning?? How many people were on? How many people are normally on at 1230AM PST on a Wednesday night / Thursday morning when the LW is split? Also consider that there was no info or statements from the HTC gang that they were going to extend TT....
I was on from about 2030-2230 EST and had a blast with no issues finding a great fight. Between GV attacking and defending we were all having fun. I even took up a K14 and threw taters at some bombers.:rock When I logged in, there were about 395 in the TT and probably another 50 or so in the other arenas. :salute
-
What is this 'cesspool' that everyone's speaking of?
From my perspective, TT was always the most fun time of the week to fly. Flying with caps generally isn't that fun. It either: deprives you of a fight, prevents you from flying with a squad, prevents you from having fun, or prevents you from doing what you want to do in the game (and it should be pointed out that doing what we want to do in AH is why we play). I remember several occasions when I was in one arena with 30 people, with absolutely jack-all to do (except perhaps a few micro-furballs, which generally evaporated by the time you got to their location anyway), and all my squaddies were in the other arena saying how much fun it was. Seriously, wtf? Would it not make more sense to at least change the times the caps kick in?
As far as caps go, I'll withhold judgement until I work out what that abhorred 'cesspool' thingey is. But until then, I think Lusche pointed out something pretty interesting (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,298207.msg3815034.html#msg3815034).
-
I just wanted to log on to get a bit of playtime before the caps kick in. We have 75 players in LWO. I have never ever seen number so low at this time before, not too long ago I would have expected about 150. Seeing that TT has finally ended, I guess it will get ugly again when caps kick in in about 2 hours... :uhoh
It's worse than I expected. 7 pm and only 128 players on Ozkansas when caps kicked in (We used to have about 200). Gonna be a fun evening without AH ;)
(http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/3356/nowu.jpg)
-
What is this 'cesspool' that everyone's speaking of?
The basic gist of the 'cesspool' people refer to is at some point in the past, there was one LW arena. It was basically TT all the time. HTC wasn't retaining people like they'd like, and the reason they determined was because the arena had too many people in it. I'm not sure of the specifics, something along the lines of they didn't really have a chance to make good friends with anybody with that big of a crowd, or somesuch. It also apparently encouraged a 'cesspool of bad gameplay' that wasn't as bad with two smaller arenas. They split the arenas and implemented the capping system, and their retention
That's the reader's digest version, anyways.
Wiley.
-
2 LW Arena's = Better business for HTC :aok
-
It's worse than I expected. 7 pm and only 128 players on Ozkansas when caps kicked in (We used to have about 200). Gonna be a fun evening without AH ;)
yes, numbers down during the USA day , euro evening (= me), HTC, please push caps back, seriously, my patience is wearing thin on this.
-
Found some old data on the arena numbers from February 2009. I put them into a combined chart for comparison purposes.
Both sets of data were taken on a friday:
(http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/8251/thenvsnow.jpg)
As you can see, both in 2009 as well as now the LWO population is taking a hit when caps kick in, but in 2009 the numbers are recovering pretty quick, while today they stay low at 100.
-
There is good and bad in Titanic Tuesday really..................... And I appreciate both sides of it. Titanic Tuesday is basically a furball day, or so it seems. Look at the battle of V14/P15 (Knits/Bish) the last two days..... Nonstop over and over again. I personally lost 4 Tiger's there, 2 to Floatsup that bum. For 48 hours the battle just kept on going with 3 base takes in there. But that's the other side of the game right? Basetaking strategies? On Titanic Tuesday it is increasingly difficult for anybody who doesn't want to just furball to get enjoyment out of the game.
-
So 1230AM PST is what 0430AM EST, on a Thursday morning?? How many people were on? How many people are normally on at 1230AM PST on a Wednesday night / Thursday morning when the LW is split? Also consider that there was no info or statements from the HTC gang that they were going to extend TT....
I was on from about 2030-2230 EST and had a blast with no issues finding a great fight. Between GV attacking and defending we were all having fun. I even took up a K14 and threw taters at some bombers.:rock When I logged in, there were about 395 in the TT and probably another 50 or so in the other arenas. :salute
Sorry, 12:30 AM PST is 3:30 AM EST. so its only 30- 60 min difference between our observations. I don't have exact numbers but I have noticed a reduction in numbers from say, a year and a half ago, and that I find disturbing. There were around 100 in the TT arena (whom many didn't seem to be playing the game), and there was one 1 in the da.
In the past, there used to be about a 1 hour lul, around 11:30-12:30 PST, then the Australians, Japanese and some Eruo players would start logging in, but I don't seem them as much :(.
-
On Titanic Tuesday it is increasingly difficult for anybody who doesn't want to just furball to get enjoyment out of the game.
I absolutetly disagree. TT is the day I usually have the best and most diverese options in gamplay. Tanking, bombing, defending bases, helping to capture one, furballs, tankbustin' in my Hurri IID, or hunting high altitude buffs... having a choice about every sortie.
-
I absolutetly disagree. TT is the day I usually have the best and most diverese options in gamplay. Tanking, bombing, defending bases, helping to capture one, furballs, tankbustin' in my Hurri IID, or hunting high altitude buffs... having a choice about every sortie.
Luche, its all about timing. I have had the opportunity to occasionally log in at 6 PM PST and I have noticed exactly what you are talking about. For example, this weeks TT was a lot of fun around that time. Lots and lots of fights, enormous bomber runs, etc... but if you logged in later, you would find an empty arena with few people doing anything.
Maybe what is happening is we have maintained or even grew the customer base around the East coast of the US and possible western Europe but some how have been loosing customers in the western half of the world, such as Australia, Japan, S. Korea, etc... Frankly I have no idea.
-
I agree with Luche, TT usually has many different strategies playing out, a quick study of the map and you can find what floats your boat. :Last night there were a few squads trying to run a string of V bases with good determination. 5-7 rooks including me fought them hard and it was great fun for everyone. It all went away around 11:30 PM CST as people logged. I remember from the time I was in Squads the difficulty we all had with matching play time for folks in many countries. We never had much luck "passing on a successful campaign". No idea how to solve that problem keep it fun.
-
If the numbers are down, I say we make the bases harder to take, maybe that'll bring in more people. :aok
-
2 hours after cap kicked in..
100/100
30/150
:noid
-
only 130 total players? Luche, any idea on how many are actually actively playing vs logging in to secure a spot, etc... ?
-
only 130 total players? Luche, any idea on how many are actually actively playing vs logging in to secure a spot, etc... ?
Hard to tell. Usually theres about 50-60% in flight, but of course it's impossible to say how many of those not "inflight" are on prolonged afk or just looking at the empty map, looking for something to do.
But 100 LWO and 30 LWB at about 2.5 hours after caps kicked in.. I'd call that almost "dramatic". Is there any major internet breakdown I haven't heard about yet? :headscratch:
-
There is good and bad in Titanic Tuesday really..................... And I appreciate both sides of it. Titanic Tuesday is basically a furball day, or so it seems. Look at the battle of V14/P15 (Knits/Bish) the last two days..... Nonstop over and over again. I personally lost 4 Tiger's there, 2 to Floatsup that bum. For 48 hours the battle just kept on going with 3 base takes in there. But that's the other side of the game right? Basetaking strategies? On Titanic Tuesday it is increasingly difficult for anybody who doesn't want to just furball to get enjoyment out of the game.
Can you define what a furball is to you?
I hopped on last night and as one looking for a dogfight, I could only find one spot, at the middle isle where we had some decent fights for a time but that ended when the crowd decided taking the v-bases was much more important. Not that here weren't many other bases all around that big map for the taking. Other then that, there were two spots with either a very large green dar bar overwhelming a small red, or a very large red overwhelming a small green. I went to the small green first but hangers were down at any fields close and the CV was sunk. Made it a bit tough to up to defend.
If that's a furball by your description, then I guess we have different definitions.
-
LOL then proxie kill from field ack is a loophole that seriously needs to be closed. All it does is promote lame game play,
However. I DO think that if your fighitng someone and can get them to eat a tree, Kiss the side of a barn or loop them into the ground. you should not only get kills awarded to your score. but perkies as well LOL
I didnt think proxies always counted for score. But if I had to guess, this is why we they do. And I dont think there will ever be a way for the game to distinguish fairly, the difference between an ack proxie like you describe and one you caused by your "skillful" manuevers.
-
The mystery for me is simple. Luche has done many statistical queries and I assume Skuzzy and his gang are at least as good at it as luche. Granted data points usually don't tell you what to do , but they are pretty good at telling you to "Do Something". If TT is a response to data points in the first place then perhaps it's time to try a 3 day TT every 6 days and watch the data. I know this BBS doesn't sway many opinions but AH2 has not provided an alternative that is apparent to me.
-
I didnt think proxies always counted for score. But if I had to guess, this is why we they do. And I dont think there will ever be a way for the game to distinguish fairly, the difference between an ack proxie like you describe and one you caused by your "skillful" manuevers.
I know. Twas just wishful thinking on my part.
Proxies you didnt score hits on shouldnt count towards anything. Not kill count, not perks. Nothing. Either you shot the other guy down or you didnt.
-
I just wanted to log on to get a bit of playtime before the caps kick in. We have 75 players in LWO. I have never ever seen number so low at this time before, not too long ago I would have expected about 150. Seeing that TT has finally ended, I guess it will get ugly again when caps kick in in about 2 hours... :uhoh
And this is how the evening turned out:
(http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/81/todayv.jpg)
I can't remember having seen ever numbers that low without any special event or major login server failure. In fact, it's the first time I have even witnessed declining total numbers during an evening. I'm quite sure some players just logged off or turned around at the door due to the caps enforced low numbers. Today it takes 4 hours to get the momentum back, where not too long ago it took only 60 minutes. (See my historical comparison a few posts above).
Almost the whole euro evening we had 100 and 50 players only.
It's my firm belief that having exactly the same cap mechanism than we had with much more players is contributing to the problem. They may have been necessary once to avert an unhelathy gaming environment, but today they start to creating one.
But that's enough graphical nerdiness and feet stomping from me now ;)
I will make one final comprehensive post in the Wishlist tomorrow... and then I can only hope.
-
It will never happen again.
HTC subscribes to the marketing dicta that giving the consumer what thay want is counterproductive.
ROX
-
:banana:
-
I can't remember having seen ever numbers that low without any special event or major login server failure.
Any chance some of this is due to issues with the patch, like fields screwed up, taters not causing damage, etc?
-
Any chance some of this is due to issues with the patch, like fields screwed up, taters not causing damage, etc?
Doubt it very much. We had much greater issues in the past without any noticeable hit in numbers at all.
Also the decline (at least at us daytime) is going on for a longer time now.
And you can see when US evening begins, (00:00 on my graph), the numbers still rise sharply.
-
Lusch,
I understand your polling strategy and presentation to HTC through this forum.
I agree with your observations and sympathise with your position. Are you as a pollster performing any forcasting in terms that a very significant event is 3 weeks away for the entire United States and indirectly the world economy? Nov 3, 2010 may well see a happier U.S. population and a gradual increase in player numbers due to the impression that life as they know it may now be getting better. I suspect most U.S. based companies small to large are awaiting the outcome of this event and have response strategies in place for the outcomes. HTC would be no different in charting its future.
U.S. player numbers can probably be predicted with current unenmployment trends, consumer confidence numbers and future outlook pollings. Low U.S. player numbers right now are to be expected. Cultures and economies are always in flux but have general perameters of human activity that can be expected and charted as a human response to overal good or bad time based fortunes of the business cycles.
Are you working at a quarterly business cycle basis, six months or a year in trying to appeal to HTC to change the game? We all are waiting for Nov 3 here in the U.S.
-
Lusch,
I understand your polling strategy and presentation to HTC through this forum.
I agree with your observations and sympathise with your position. Are you as a pollster performing any forcasting in terms that a very significant event is 3 weeks away for the entire United States and indirectly the world economy?
No. :)
-
Everything goes full cycle:
I sign up
In early AW the arenas were limited to 50 people and it was good because we didn't know any better.
In later AW the arenas were limited to 150 people and it was great! Wow!
In early AH there were no limits and the numbers were even bigger and grew. This was heaven!
In AH now the numbers are smaller and falling.
Soon we'll be back to MA's of 50 people.
I sign off
-
The peak of the games social sewer problems and numbers looked like they also corrisponded with the high point in the world wide mortgage backed securities fraud.
Narcasism was rampant, people were working and money was available. I suspect Lusch has human nature and economic trending on his side to observe a need to change the arenas per his polling data. But, conservitively. This to would indicate the social control measures implimented due to the previous economic prosparity and poor human game conduct epidemic might be able to tollerate a measure of loosening. This would favor the promoting of more players in the same area to create less ability to avoid conflict.
Some of the processs of controlling the epidemic of bad player behavior have created environments condusive to avoiding conflict by social interaction due to distributing too few players across too large of territories. Two species that compete for similar food sources confied to a small territory will attempt to eliminate each other as a response. Increase the available resources and territory and they will avoid each other as a self preservation measure. The large hoard that currently takes bases at will is an example of self preservation avoidence leveraging the expanded territory to achive goals. The hoard currently has no reason to fight for anything.
I would venture all of 2011 will be a time frame that the previous styles of poor behavior would be controllable by the community itself as was true up to a few years ago. Call it a year long experiment in good behavior reward to generate more activity in the game and bring the community closer together.
-
Bustr I agree that it is time we tryed something different, just lose the caps for a month and see what happens. In fact I would add one more item to deal with bad behavior, turn off " kill shooter ". The easier we make it for bad behavior to go on without immediate consequences, the worse it will get. I would be careful using real would features and events to understand this carton world with it's sharp edged rules. Sort of using macro rules to understand micro events,( this almost always leads to wrong conclusions). Having said all that I agree that it is time for AH to loosen up the reigns a bit, we are all not children.
-
The restaurant industry and Aces High in spirit are products purchased for some of the same reasons and patronage dropped for some of the same reasons. During a down turn as patronage to restaurants drops off you will see similar drop offs in spending for online games. You can kill off patronage to restaurants by the management allowing too much of an atmosphere of inconvenience to develop versus enjoying the meal and a conjenial environment.
The social control processes put in place during the peak of the last economic bubble are now creating an atmosphere of incoveniance to enough of the remaining customers that their complaints to managment have begun to sychronize rather than diverge as would be the expected grousing during normal times. On the other hand, the results of Nov 3, 2010 may make all of this moot.
-
Bustr I agree that it is time we tryed something different, just lose the caps for a month and see what happens. In fact I would add one more item to deal with bad behavior, turn off " kill shooter ". The easier we make it for bad behavior to go on without immediate consequences, the worse it will get.
If you turn killshooter off, you will get the absolute opposite of what you are looking for. :)
-
If you turn killshooter off, you will get the absolute opposite of what you are looking for. :)
Yup. It's been a very long time since we had to deal with fraggers, would be nice to keep it that way.
- oldman