Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Imowface on October 26, 2010, 12:02:52 PM
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As the spitfire Mk.XIV is the only perk Spit in the game, I propose to add something to make the perks a bit more worth it,
aside from being a dream at high alt, one thing that would set it apart from the other Spitfires would be to give it a bubble canopy, out of the 900 Mk.XIV's made, 400 of these were equipped with it, I think it would be a good addition for aces high, as it would give the already great spit an even better rear view, and set it appart visually from the other Spitfires.
Discuss
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I disagree. It does not need a hit to its already poor directional stability.
What I think would be good is to give it 150 octane fuel and run it at +21lbs boost on WEP.
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Has HTC ever stated what Octane fuel we have in AH? does it use a universal fuel?
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The plane is uber. Leave it as is. Would you want HTC to add a bigger engine to the K4? What I thought.
perdweeb
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Would love for the K-4 to have a bigger engine :devil
but operationaly, a bubble cannopy was an option for the XIV, as it already costs perks, I dont see why this should be over looked
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As the spitfire Mk.XIV is the only perk Spit in the game, I propose to add something to make the perks a bit more worth it
I propose to simply drop the perks. :old:
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Has HTC ever stated what Octane fuel we have in AH? does it use a universal fuel?
It is using 100 octane. HTC doesn't have to say anything for that to be easy to determine. It's climb and speed capabilities tells us that, even if we didn't trust the gauges telling us it is at +18lbs boost.
The plane is uber. Leave it as is. Would you want HTC to add a bigger engine to the K4? What I thought.
perdweeb
The Bf109K-4 isn't perked. If it were, you might have a point.
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id have to disagree the spit is good as is, if you dont like the spit 14 grab another plane. Need a new plane, id like to see more carrier based aircraft
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Your numbers are misleading as many of those bubble top XIVs were postwar. It just doesn't make that much difference visibility wise and performance would be the same so why waste the programming time when it can go to other birds?
And yes I like Spits, but would prefer other things get done first.
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Yea drop the perks. While we're at it, add a 20mm P-51, oh and if we can find room a B-29. Let us not forget the F4U-4C and also the Sea Fury.
And please leave the 190A-8 and its incorrect model which has been admitted by HTC.
perdweeb
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The spit 14 is a very special plane in AH. If you know how to use it you will survive in it far more better than a 262. I've only lost 1 or 2 in about 4 years. Everytime I run into a spit 14 it gets owned within 1 min by me or another person. I like the spit 14 better than the tempest but one of the down sides is fuel.
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Yea drop the perks. While we're at it, add a 20mm P-51, oh and if we can find room a B-29. Let us not forget the F4U-4C and also the Sea Fury.
And please leave the 190A-8 and its incorrect model which has been admitted by HTC.
perdweeb
:huh
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I'd like a Spitfire FR.XIV just for the extra fuel and the bubble canopy. Since a good many of them had clipped wings, it would be SO unstable but it would have pretty decent performance!
Never going to happen but it's nice to have a longer-ranged high-performance Spitfire.
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The spit 14 is a very special plane in AH. If you know how to use it you will survive in it far more better than a 262. I've only lost 1 or 2 in about 4 years. Everytime I run into a spit 14 it gets owned within 1 min by me or another person. I like the spit 14 better than the tempest but one of the down sides is fuel.
Yeah, I have never really noticed a problem from any spit14's I run into.
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Would you want HTC to add a bigger engine to the K4? What I thought.
So you agree to adding a bigger engine to the K-4?
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And please leave the 190A-8 and its incorrect model which has been admitted by HTC.
perdweeb
What did he admit was wrong about the FW 190A 8 and do you have a link to the thread?
ack-ack
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Ack-Ack,
I seem to recall a thread about Fw190A-8 weights and Pyro suggesting they'd look into it. That is the closest I can recall of any admission that it was in error.
Why are we talking about Fw190A-8s and Bf109K-4's in a Spitfire Mk XIV thread?
Oh yeah, Luftwaffe fans hate talk of Spitfires....
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14 Is fine just add this the MK VII :neener:
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/DP845x4.jpg)
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14 Is fine just add this the MK VII :neener:
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/DP845x4.jpg)
+1
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prototype Spit XII, TB....XII! :)
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Ack-Ack,
I seem to recall a thread about Fw190A-8 weights and Pyro suggesting they'd look into it. That is the closest I can recall of any admission that it was in error.
Why are we talking about Fw190A-8s and Bf109K-4's in a Spitfire Mk XIV thread?
Oh yeah, Luftwaffe fans hate talk of Spitfires....
Im a Luftwhiner thats why!! :P
perdweeb
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it still puzzles me when spit 14 is perked... its performance is almost equal to that of 109K
i say de-perk spit 14!
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Yea drop the perks. While we're at it, add a 20mm P-51, oh and if we can find room a B-29. Let us not forget the F4U-4C and also the Sea Fury.
And please leave the 190A-8 and its incorrect model which has been admitted by HTC.
perdweeb
Yet more evidence corroborating with the wholly apparent Allied conspiracy. :noid
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it still puzzles me when spit 14 is perked... its performance is almost equal to that of 109K
i say de-perk spit 14!
IIRC, it climbs better at most altitudes, accelerates slightly better (by a margin of 1 second or less), and is equipped with the 2 weapons that have, argueably, the flattest trajectories in the game. Not to mention its visibility is undeniably superior, and its nose is not made of a glass/cardboard composite. That could be why it's perked.
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Disregard, double post.
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IIRC, it climbs better at most altitudes, accelerates slightly better (by a margin of 1 second or less), and is equipped with the 2 weapons that have, argueably, the flattest, and thus the most desireable, trajectories in the game. Not to mention its visibility is undeniably superior, and its nose is not made of a glass/cardboard composite. That could be why it's perked.
The 14 has only half the WEP time of a K-4 and has no significant climb rate advantage at all. It's fragile as any Spit. It may have 2 Hizookas, but it's one of the worst, unstable weapon platforms in the game. It's prone to some nasty stalls at slow speed. Roll rate quickly drops to almost zero at high speed dives. Speed & power really shine only at very high atlitudes, at usual AH combat altitude it's slower than the ususual suspects.
And last but not least, it has no "unbalancing impact" on the arena whatsoever, despite the low perk price, it's about the the rarest AND least successful perk ride we have.
In AH, it's a difficult to fly, overpowered Spit. In some ways, it's more a challenge than a gratification ;)
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The 14 has only half the WEP time of a K-4 and has no significant climb rate advantage at all. It's fragile as any Spit. It may have 2 Hizookas, but it's one of the worst, unstable weapon platforms in the game. It's prone to some nasty stalls at slow speed. Roll rate quickly drops to almost zero at high speed dives. Speed & power really shine only at very high atlitudes, at usual AH combat altitude it's slower than the ususual suspects.
Meh. For the experiences AH player, the K4 might be a more sucessful ride, but I can't help but feel that a less knowledgeable player would have an easier time with a Spitfire 14 than in the K4.
Feel free to bust out a bar graph at any point during my Luftvhine. :)
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I fly the 14 in the DA sometimes, its good fun.
I'd like to see it unperked in the MA, so i could fly my fav ride with my squad.
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IIRC, it climbs better at most altitudes, accelerates slightly better (by a margin of 1 second or less), and is equipped with the 2 weapons that have, argueably, the flattest trajectories in the game. Not to mention its visibility is undeniably superior, and its nose is not made of a glass/cardboard composite. That could be why it's perked.
and don't forget that 109K has 10 minute wep and only 5 minute wep for spit 14
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/genchart.php?p1=64&p2=1&pw=1>ype=2)
Does this look like a plane that deserves perk?
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/genchart.php?p1=64&p2=1&pw=1>ype=0)
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Just for the record: Last tour the XIV ended up with a K/D of 1.01, in tour 127 with 0.9... :lol
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and don't forget that 109K has 10 minute wep and only 5 minute wep for spit 14
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/genchart.php?p1=64&p2=1&pw=1>ype=2)
Does this look like a plane that deserves perk?
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/genchart.php?p1=64&p2=1&pw=1>ype=0)
So you have proven that a K4 has a speed advantage. I could easily rebutt with the fact that the Spit14 has a solid turn rate advantage.
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So you have proven that a K4 has a speed advantage. I could easily rebutt with the fact that the Spit14 has a solid turn rate advantage.
So that makes a plane perk worthy?
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It is still as perk-worthy as before, it's simply that nobody wants to talk about perking the 2 planes that perform just as well or better than the 14, that have since been added. And yes IMO those hispanos do account for part of the perk... Were it a less lethal package (4x .50s for example?) you'd definitely see no perk, no matter how well it climbed/ran.
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I'd like a Spitfire FR.XIV just for the extra fuel and the bubble canopy. Since a good many of them had clipped wings, it would be SO unstable but it would have pretty decent performance!
Never going to happen but it's nice to have a longer-ranged high-performance Spitfire.
The clipped birds were mostly post war Pappy. I've only seen a couple of photos of FRXIVs flown by the Canadiens and it was very end of the war if not during occupation duty. The XIVs delivered to the CBI were full span and the majority of the XIVs in the ETO were full span wing birds.
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I will be honest, yes my info may be a bit off, I just saw some photos, and a little text bit on the side of the pictures talking about the spit 14, I will go buy a real book about late war/griffon powered spitfires and come back with real numbers and facts, can anyone point me in the right direction?
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The plane is uber. Leave it as is. Would you want HTC to add a bigger engine to the K4? What I thought.
perdweeb
hmmmmmm :devil
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It is still as perk-worthy as before, it's simply that nobody wants to talk about perking the 2 planes that perform just as well or better than the 14, that have since been added. And yes IMO those hispanos do account for part of the perk... Were it a less lethal package (4x .50s for example?) you'd definitely see no perk, no matter how well it climbed/ran.
You claim this all the time, yet you have NEVER been able to support the claim and always resort to mystical "Its just better." crap when it is pointed out that you are wrong.
In every measurable way, the Spitfire Mk XIV's outcomes are inferior to many free aircraft.
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You claim this all the time, yet you have NEVER been able to support the claim and always resort to mystical "Its just better." crap when it is pointed out that you are wrong.
In every measurable way, the Spitfire Mk XIV's outcomes are inferior to many free aircraft.
Are these results factoring the pilot into the equation?
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Which free planes climb better then the Spitfire Mk.XIV?
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Are these results factoring the pilot into the equation?
Yes. Being a perk plane, the Spitfire XIV should, like all other perk planes, have a significantly higher K/D ratio due to those flying it, its raw capability and people being cautious because they paid perk points for it. It does not and never has had a K/D ratio above all free fighters, unlike any other perk fighter.
Which free planes climb better then the Spitfire Mk.XIV?
That has nothing to do with my comment. I was speaking of outcomes. The Bf109K-4 climbs better in some ways, due to having twice the WEP duration. That doesn't matter though, what matters is the outcomes and the Bf109K-4, despite being flown by a far wider selection of players, has a much more positive outcome.
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So in your oppinion, should the Spit 14 stay perked?
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So in your oppinion, should the Spit 14 stay perked?
Yes, with the qualifier that it should also be given 150 octane fuel and raised to +21lbs boost.
If it stays on 100 octane fuel at +18lbs boost I can't see any justification for it being perked when something like the Bf109K-4 is not only not perked, but not even particularly low ENY.
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Yea drop the perks. While we're at it, add a 20mm P-51, oh and if we can find room a B-29. Let us not forget the F4U-4C and also the Sea Fury.
And please leave the 190A-8 and its incorrect model which has been admitted by HTC.
perdweeb
The 20mm P51 was crap, yes on the B-29, Both the F4U-4c and Sea Fury were after WW2?
Only a pansy boy would be caught dead in a 190.
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Yes, with the qualifier that it should also be given 150 octane fuel and raised to +21lbs boost.
If it stays on 100 octane fuel at +18lbs boost I can't see any justification for it being perked when something like the Bf109K-4 is not only not perked, but not even particularly low ENY.
okay then, I shall change my wish too:
either leave the spit 14 as is and drop the perks, of as you sudgested, give it accurate fuel, and run it at proper boost
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okay then, I shall change my wish too:
either leave the spit 14 as is and drop the perks, of as you sudgested, give it accurate fuel, and run it at proper boost
Both fuel types and boost settings are accurate. Both were used operationally.
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I think the spit 14 shouldn't be perked. I'd almost say, if any spit to be perked, it should be the 16.
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okay then, I shall change my wish too:
either leave the spit 14 as is and drop the perks, of as you sudgested, give it accurate fuel, and run it at proper boost
word
Leave as is and just drop perks
also I think our spit and 109s are evenly matched in competitiveness as of right now (see graphs for these planes)
109e - spit1
109f - spit5
109g2/109g6 - spit9
109g14 - spit8/16
109k - spit14
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So you have proven that a K4 has a speed advantage. I could easily rebutt with the fact that the Spit14 has a solid turn rate advantage.
iirc 109k torques to the left and spit14 torques to the right... so i think 109k can keep up with spit 14 in left turns, and spit 14 can keep up with 109k in right turns
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word
Leave as is and just drop perks
also I think our spit and 109s are evenly matched in competitiveness as of right now (see graphs for these planes)
109e - spit1
109f - spit5
109g2/109g6 - spit9
109g14 - spit8/16
109k - spit14
I beg to differ. G14≠XVI. The 16 is slower and has less WEP, but climbs better after 5K, turns tighter, has superior visibility, and superior armament (in terms of rate of fire, number of 20mm cannons, and in said weapons trajectories.).
iirc 109k torques to the left and spit14 torques to the right... so i think 109k can keep up with spit 14 in left turns, and spit 14 can keep up with 109k in right turns
The spitfires turn rate is vastly superior, and its torque is insignificant (from the perspective of a cartoon 109 pilot,at least). Provided that the spitfire does not try to turn to the right with throttle at 100% while the K4 has throttled down with flaps out, the spitfire will out turn the 109.
Compare the turn rate charts of both aircraft. The Spit XVI has a turn rate with flaps up (and I assume at full speed) that is comparable to that of the 109's with full flaps down(again here assuming at a much lower speed).
Performance charts here: http://www.gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php
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iirc 109k torques to the left and spit14 torques to the right... so i think 109k can keep up with spit 14 in left turns, and spit 14 can keep up with 109k in right turns
Man, sometimes I wish this was true, the spit 14 can easily out turn a k4. I'm not that familiar with a spit14s stability at slow speeds, but the k4's is awful when slow, unless your very good with the throttle.
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Ok, quick statement here...
109K4 has a 30mm cannon with a low ammo count at 60 rounds that the majority of pilots in AH dont know how to use properly. Spit14 has 250 rounds of 20mm Hispano (if i recollect, is the most accurate 20mm in the game?) and 2 .50cals at 500 rounds, the 109k4 (has 7.7mm mgs in the wings correct?).
Spit14 has near equivalent speed and climb rate but has anyone thought of acceleration? Whenever i fly a sporkteen at 15-20k, i go from 200mph to 350 very rapidly. It also out turns a 109K4 too.
The 14 dives as well as a 109K and possibly even better (yeah, the roll rate is poor because of its elliptical wings but ive never seen this as a major problem when im diving on enemies).
Sporkteen is perk worthy. Just learn to fly it. I've started flying it lately in the MA and i haven't been opposed evenly by any aircraft at level alts. Even when against 3 P47Ms and a P51D with them 5k above with my sporkteen and 2 P51s below them, i took out 2 of the 47s and then killed a low flying F4U1D with one of my squaddies taking the 51 and the other 47 out. Not bragging, I'm using this as a point. I'm learning the plane and it seems easy to fly (maybe because i fly 51s? the 14 seems to be like a 51 sometimes).
Edit: you also need to remember that alot of noobs or fresh pilots will use the spit14 expecting it to fly as well as the 16 or better due to the perks. i have a feeling that many pilots think, its got perks, so everything about it is better than the other models. This would include turn rate, speed, ammo, climb rate, dive capability, etc.
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The spitfires turn rate is vastly superior, and its torque is insignificant (from the perspective of a cartoon 109 pilot,at least). Provided that the spitfire does not try to turn to the right with throttle at 100% while the K4 has throttled down with flaps out, the spitfire will out turn the 109.
You might want to fly the Spitfire Mk XIV before pontificating about it. Claiming it has insignificant torque compared to the much less torquey Bf109K-4 invalidates your whole position.
Are you mistakenly thinking of the Spitfire Mk XVI?
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if you guys could read my statement. im trying to put a point in here to settle this...
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So you have proven that a K4 has a speed advantage. I could easily rebutt with the fact that the Spit14 has a solid turn rate advantage.
and also... if your flying in main arena why would you commit in slow, turn fight in spit 14 against 109k.
Maybe if you have lots of perk points to waste you can
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Ok, quick statement here...
109K4 has a 30mm cannon with a low ammo count at 60 rounds that the majority of pilots in AH dont know how to use properly. Spit14 has 250 rounds of 20mm Hispano (if i recollect, is the most accurate 20mm in the game?) and 2 .50cals at 500 rounds, the 109k4 (has 7.7mm mgs in the wings correct?).
Spit14 has near equivalent speed and climb rate but has anyone thought of acceleration? Whenever i fly a sporkteen at 15-20k, i go from 200mph to 350 very rapidly. It also out turns a 109K4 too.
The 14 dives as well as a 109K and possibly even better (yeah, the roll rate is poor because of its elliptical wings but ive never seen this as a major problem when im diving on enemies).
Sporkteen is perk worthy. Just learn to fly it. I've started flying it lately in the MA and i haven't been opposed evenly by any aircraft at level alts. Even when against 3 P47Ms and a P51D with them 5k above with my sporkteen and 2 P51s below them, i took out 2 of the 47s and then killed a low flying F4U1D with one of my squaddies taking the 51 and the other 47 out. Not bragging, I'm using this as a point. I'm learning the plane and it seems easy to fly (maybe because i fly 51s? the 14 seems to be like a 51 sometimes).
Edit: you also need to remember that alot of noobs or fresh pilots will use the spit14 expecting it to fly as well as the 16 or better due to the perks. i have a feeling that many pilots think, its got perks, so everything about it is better than the other models. This would include turn rate, speed, ammo, climb rate, dive capability, etc.
No, it has 13.7mm machine guns at 300rpg in the nose.
Yes, we have analyzed acceleration and compressability.
You might want to fly the Spitfire Mk XIV before pontificating about it. Claiming it has insignificant torque compared to the much less torquey Bf109K-4 invalidates your whole position.
Are you mistakenly thinking of the Spitfire Mk XVI?
Uhm. Have you flown a 109K4? The torque has been the death of many many cartoon pilots, this I can guarantee.
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Edit: you also need to remember that alot of noobs or fresh pilots will use the spit14 expecting it to fly as well as the 16 or better due to the perks.
Neither numbers, nor checking the actual name list support that. The perked 14 is very rarely taken into the sky, which is absolutely the opposite what would happen if it where a preferred n00b ride.
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Uhm. Have you flown a 109K4? The torque has been the death of many many cartoon pilots, this I can guarantee.
I think throttle management is the key.
As for auto trims... I turn it off. When combat ready i set aileron and elevator trims at neutral and rudder at 350mph IAS
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Uhm. Have you flown a 109K4? The torque has been the death of many many cartoon pilots, this I can guarantee.
Yes, I have. It has torque. It is, however, noticeably less torque than the Spitfire Mk XIV. The Bf109K-4 is not the most maneuverable fighter, but it does not feel like it is actively fighting me at all times. The Spitfire Mk XIV does.
It also lacks the horrible nose bounciness that the Spitfire Mk XIV has, an effect that completely removes the flatter Hispano trajectory from the equation.
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Karnak is true barron, Spit 14 has way more tourque then the K-4, and it stalls way worse because of it
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It also lacks the horrible nose bounciness that the Spitfire Mk XIV has, an effect that completely removes the flatter Hispano trajectory from the equation.
ive never noticed this bounce
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Neither numbers, nor checking the actual name list support that. The perked 14 is very rarely taken into the sky, which is absolutely the opposite what would happen if it where a preferred n00b ride.
SpitXVI killed the 14 24 times alone. 11 kills to ship gunnery, and approximately 30 more kills to planes that should not even qualify in the idea of killing Spit14s. this theorizes pilots using the 14 to counter enemies 10k and below in base defense and offense. im pretty sure the a6m5b shouldnt kill 11 spit14s unless the 14 pilot didnt know what he was working with (aka they thought that because it was a perked spit, they could possibly turn with a zero).
P51D killed it 31 times though... this makes more sense and 109K4 got it 21 times. these make sense.
but a6ms, la7s, nikis, and sea based planes dont make sense at all unless you calculate pilot's misunderstanding of the plane.
the answer's there, you just need to read it correctly...
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the answer's there, you just need to read it correctly...
Exactly my point. You should try it :)
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I beg to differ. G14≠XVI. The 16 is slower and has less WEP, but climbs better after 5K, turns tighter, has superior visibility, and superior armament (in terms of rate of fire, number of 20mm cannons, and in said weapons trajectories.).
The spitfires turn rate is vastly superior, and its torque is insignificant (from the perspective of a cartoon 109 pilot,at least). Provided that the spitfire does not try to turn to the right with throttle at 100% while the K4 has throttled down with flaps out, the spitfire will out turn the 109.
Compare the turn rate charts of both aircraft. The Spit XVI has a turn rate with flaps up (and I assume at full speed) that is comparable to that of the 109's with full flaps down(again here assuming at a much lower speed).
Performance charts here: http://www.gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php
You obviously have never flown the 14 have you? I have flown both birds in question and the 14's torque is amongst the most severe in the game.
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I don't see that huge of a difference between Spit XIV and Spit XVI asside from the 5 blade prop and eliptical wings. I'd say the noobs don't fly it because there's very little difference between that and the spixteen, so why not fly the free-ride and save your perks for a Tempest and 4 lasers?
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Exactly my point. You should try it :)
agree to disagree then? :aok
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I don't see that huge of a difference between Spit XIV and Spit XVI asside from the 5 blade prop and eliptical wings. I'd say the noobs don't fly it because there's very little difference between that and the spixteen, so why not fly the free-ride and save your perks for a Tempest and 4 lasers?
That theory doesn't hold up as the Spitfire Mk XIV wasn't used when there wasn't a Spitfire Mk XVI or Mk VIII either.
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Don't see what you're trying to say... the Spit XIV just isn't that spectacular. The I think the Spit IX is just as good, little slower, and again, no perks. So yes, theory holds up fine. If Spit XIV was the only spit, then I think you'd see people flying them. There's just not enough of a difference in performance and loadout to make the XIV more worthwhile than a free ride.
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The F4U-1D is "just a little slower" than the F4U-4 too.
Sorry, but the reason the Spitfire Mk XIV has never gotten much use is because it is not particularly survivable as a perk plane, not because the Spitfire XVI, VIII or IX exist.
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The F4U-1D is "just a little slower" than the F4U-4 too.
Exactly, and how often do you see a U4 involved in a base attack taking out hangars? You don't, an F4U-1D is free and can accomplish the same job. Thanks for proving my point.
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Exactly, and how often do you see a U4 involved in a base attack taking out hangars? You don't, an F4U-1D is free and can accomplish the same job. Thanks for proving my point.
The F4U-4 is much more expensive than the Spitfire Mk XIV and yet is used much more often and with much more success than the Spitfire Mk XIV.....
What does that mean? It means your comparison is flawed.
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The F4U-4 is much more expensive than the Spitfire Mk XIV and yet is used much more often
F4U-4 is available from carriers, Spit XIV is not. I'm sure this has a big impact on usage as well (though not K/D)
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What does that mean? It means your comparison is flawed.
It means my initial response was indeed correct, and you keep making the point for me... the benefit you get from a SpitXIV is not worth the cost. A Spit IX or XVI can do all the same things at no cost.
I've stated my point? What is yours... :huh
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If you want to appreciate the Spit14 for it's strengths do what Waystin and I do with it when we run a POTW high hoard smack down.
On TT there is always a hoard of bish or rooks that hovers over a knight airfeild from 25k down. They suck the life out of any kind of fight by populating all the airspace but, not willing to engage. Just mass pick anyone willing to fly above 1k while waiting for their bombers to kill the fighter hangers. POTW will up a sector away with 12-20 spit14 and climb to 25k, then engage the hoardlings.
At 25k the spit14 on WEP is like the spit16 on WEP at 5k. We out turn everything. Out run everything. And outclimb everything the hoardlings bring to hide above 15k from the fight. We smack the hoard down to the deck and 99% of the time that tips the tide of the fight in the sector because we won't let anyone hide up on top from the battle. Our spit14 sweep only starts taking casulties when we drop below 15k to pick up some kills. Above 15k its WEP makes it a monster as an air superiority fighter against other fighters. No one furballs up there enmass in the MA. So like the Ta152 it rarely ever gets used for it's true strengths. It gets forced into being a low atltitiude carney ride.
Blelow 15k the spit14 cannot turn with the spit16 in a furball. The P51 is faster. The K4 out excellerates it and has a better climb. Any veteren in a spit9 below 15k can chew up a spit14 the same way they do to a P51, K4 or Tiffy in furballs. That aside you can say something similare for the P47M above 15k on WEP. I watch spit14 die all the time in furballs below 15k. But, just like the K4 expertin, I've seen a few dedicated players walk through furballs and kill everything in sight.
After all these years I don't see why the thing is still perked. For 4/5 of the players it's a death trap at any altitiude. Our games expertin class could make people want the I16 perked if tomorrow they suddenly decided it was the flavor of the month. Because of the spit14's handleing nuiances at low alt, I don't think unperking it will make the other spits hanger queens like unperking the CHog and 4Hog would to the Hog lineup. If anything the muppets would have a new ch200 entertainment because they would probably pick on spit14 drivers if it was unperked for awhile to show them what a POS low alt garbage it is compaired to a K4 or G14.
Spit14 even compresses like a K4 in a dive....spit14=Lawnspit
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If anything the muppets would have a new ch200 entertainment because they would probably pick on spit14 drivers if it was unperked for awhile to show them what a POS low alt garbage it is compaired to a K4 or G14.
Bustr you BASTAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you promised not to tell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Class, dont listen to the evil Bustr! he is trying to con you out of flying your rightful allotment of Spit XIV's! he is trying to make you believe that it is a bad ride so that he can keep them all to himself! you should learn from his attempt at deception and fly them often! you should fly them low and slow and turn fight with everything just feet off the deck!!!!!
EVIL EVIL BUSTR!!!!!!!!!!!!
:devil :x :devil
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Bustr you BASTAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you promised not to tell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Class, dont listen to the evil Bustr! he is trying to con you out of flying your rightful allotment of Spit XIV's! he is trying to make you believe that it is a bad ride so that he can keep them all to himself! you should learn from his attempt at deception and fly them often! you should fly them low and slow and turn fight with everything just feet off the deck!!!!!
EVIL EVIL BUSTR!!!!!!!!!!!!
:devil :x :devil
I rest my case..................... :old:
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Don't see what you're trying to say... the Spit XIV just isn't that spectacular. The I think the Spit IX is just as good, little slower, and again, no perks. So yes, theory holds up fine. If Spit XIV was the only spit, then I think you'd see people flying them. There's just not enough of a difference in performance and loadout to make the XIV more worthwhile than a free ride.
Some folks assume that because it's a Spitfire it should fly like another Spitfire. It's a Griffon engined bird, that's heavier. Prop rotates the opposite of the Merlin. It was a rocket going upstairs.
Problem is folks take it up and fly it like a Spit V or IX and get themselves killed not using it's best assets.
It is most definately not a Spit XVI which as has been pointed out a million times is nothing more then a Spit LFIXe with an American built Packard Merlin 266 instead of a Rolls Royce built Merlin 66.
Make the XIV a free ride, get some folks to learn it's strengths and you'll see a lot of use.
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Just came across this:
but a6ms, la7s, nikis, and sea based planes dont make sense at all unless you calculate pilot's misunderstanding of the plane.
You can't be serious. :huh
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It's the only spit you have to fly like a 109 or a 51D to survive in and below 15k both are faster than it.
It's magic trick is not usable until you are above 15k. Most players don't know how to use that trick when they are there.
The K4 has a better chance of making a rooky into a vet under 15k just by being in it than the spit14 does.
Under 15k even the G14 and spit16 on WEP chases down the spit14 and eats it.
Using a dive under 15k to get enough speed to run away in a spit14 turns into a locked up controls and hole in the ground.
Trying to pull tight turns in low furballs augers it in seconds.
Trying to do rapid stick snapping evasives in a low furball when you get bounced emidiatly stalls you into the ground.
Below 15k its not much better than the spit8 which most non vets bring too much fuel in it and stall it in tight turns.
The top 1/5 of the games talent will be just as deadly in it as they already are in G14, K4, 51D, F4U-4, F4U-C, 262, 163 and a Piper Cub with a Tommy gun. Everyone else will suck in it because of it's inherit problems and need of a sensitive hand on the stick. Oh and it sucks fuel almost as fast as the 163.
Un-Perk it and let the baby seal terror hoards kill themselves flying it into the deck.
Hey..... here comes Vdogfight's 20k spit14 hoard to stomp our furball. Everybody check everything the hoard is diving on us! Does anyone hear what sounds like a bus load of little girls shreiking??????? HuH....WoW...thirty spits just roared by and augered. At least the shreiking stopped....... :cheers:
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Just came across this:
You can't be serious. :huh
have you seen an la7 above 15k feet lately that could outfly the 14?
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It means my initial response was indeed correct, and you keep making the point for me... the benefit you get from a SpitXIV is not worth the cost. A Spit IX or XVI can do all the same things at no cost.
I've stated my point? What is yours... :huh
not true... compare a spit8 to a 9 and youll see a difference, and compare the 8 and the 16 and you will see (a smaller) difference. the 14's griffon is beautiful at altitudes and ok at lower levels.
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the Mk14 has more akin to the MkXII (which we don't have in game) and the MkIV ( test bed for the griffon engine which after alteration to wings and fuselage became the MkXII) than the MkIX and IIX spits . I'd hate to fly the Mk XVI anywhere near the MkXIV above 17K and the MKIX is only just able to turn with it due to it not having the clipped wings , thou it is vastly under powered compared to the Spit XIV . The XIV should be perked lightly as it is due to this advantage over most of the other aeroplanes at 17K or above.
The biggest draw back to the XIV was it over sensitive controls , especially when firing it's guns. The toque effect can be used to great advantage in a scissors fight . By chopping and then opening the throttle you can really make it roll quite aggressively at altitude . The Spit XIV should never be used as a turn fighter unless at very high altitude.
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What's with all the hatin' on the Spit XIV? IMO it's a beautiful plane to fly at high alt.
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IMO it's a beautiful plane to fly at high alt.
But for only a limited time.
P-51 and F4UA is still the best up there imo :aok
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What's with all the hatin' on the Spit XIV?
for having perk pts
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Spitfires > P51s & F4Us, therefore SpitXIV > P51&F4U
I love logic :old:
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But for only a limited time.
P-51 and F4UA is still the best up there imo :aok
stick a drop tank to the spit14 and you will have approx 30 minutes flying time, once youre at altitude, throttle back and cruise with it and youll save fuel. it climbs better than the P51s and F4Us even with 100% and DT and gets to alt fast
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Spitfires > P51s & F4Us, therefore SpitXIV > P51&F4U
I love logic :old:
Below 15k the P51, G14, K4 and F4u-4 are faster than the Spit14. The F4u-4, G14, K4 climbs better and the P51 is about equal in performance + or -.
The spit16 out performs the spit14 below 15k. ERGO......unperk the 14 because 5/6 of the players will fly it below 15k in it's WORST possible flight envelope. It will never be a game imbalance because its perk 10+ or - makes it available to squads at ALL TIMES who would know how to use it EnMasssss. Only the POTW use it in 12+ fighter sweeps to try and change the flow of the game. We don't do that more than 4 times a month on average. I apologise to all of Aces High if I'm wrong. I'm not Snailman with the stats.
HiTech SIR.....pull past stats and see this is generaly true. You have offered it at a NOTHING perk price and it is not used. As a test reduce it to 3 perks for a tour and watch the usage stats. I bet if you reduced the spit14 to 3 and the 262 to 50 the 262 would fly out of the hanger.........Or reduce the F4U-4 to 20 and the Spit14 to 15. Bet the F4U-4 would get more use...................
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have you seen an la7 above 15k feet lately that could outfly the 14?
You rarely find a con at 15K or above (compared to lower alts) let alone a Spit 14. Up to 10K the La7 should handle the Spit14 easily. This is the place where AH combat takes place.
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If everyone flying the 16 today flew the 14, some very skilled 16 pilots would do better and most would just die terribly. switching the 16 with the 14 for perks would be an interesting experiment for a few tours and i think more justified.
The reason the K4 is not perked is because mastering the 30mm takees a lot of time, and 65 shots is not a lot. . . I think my Yak is bad at 120 toejamvak shots, but the 65 shots in the k4 is the only reason I don't fly it more - I take a lighter 20 mm G14 out instead.
anyway, I would love to watch all the 16 pilots in 14s. . . it would make me very happy to see them stalling lik hell all over the place.
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You rarely find a con at 15K or above (compared to lower alts) let alone a Spit 14. Up to 10K the La7 should handle the Spit14 easily. This is the place where AH combat takes place.
every flight i make now is 15k or above. this gives me the advantage of attacking cons lower than me. spit14s are beautiful in this role and in BnZing. a fight i was in it was me in the 14 below 15k with jugMs above and an F4U below and i had 2 squaddies with me one in a ponyB. i killed 3 of the 5 enemies... use the spit as an overpowered P51 that can turn better than a p51 also... its near perfect in this role.
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I have always thought the SpitxIV being perked was a bit of wishful thinking. Having flown it and flown against it, it never seemed worth the perkies. It's a fine plane, but it doesn't instantly make a noob an ace, nor does it's existence make other Spits irrelevant.
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every flight i make now is 15k or above. this gives me the advantage of attacking cons lower than me. spit14s are beautiful in this role and in BnZing. a fight i was in it was me in the 14 below 15k with jugMs above and an F4U below and i had 2 squaddies with me one in a ponyB. i killed 3 of the 5 enemies... use the spit as an overpowered P51 that can turn better than a p51 also... its near perfect in this role.
I'm glad you like the Spit14. But still, saying that a La7 has the same capabillities killing a Spit14 as a A6M or a N1K is quite a bit off, isn't it?
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If the Spit 14 is on the La-7's turff (below 10k) then it is no contest for the La-7, however, if the La-7 comes to play at the spits house (15K or above) then the fight favors the spit
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I'm glad you like the Spit14. But still, saying that a La7 has the same capabillities killing a Spit14 as a A6M or a N1K is quite a bit off, isn't it?
If the Spit 14 is on the La-7's turff (below 10k) then it is no contest for the La-7, however, if the La-7 comes to play at the spits house (15K or above) then the fight favors the spit
this
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this
And? Zekes ans Niks have little chances against a Spit 14 no matter what altitude, the LA only suffers at high alts. Low alt tends to favor the La.
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And? Zekes ans Niks have little chances against a Spit 14 no matter what altitude, the LA only suffers at high alts. Low alt tends to favor the La.
and other planes can take out spit14s at high alts but are worthless at low alts. the spit14 still has a good fighting chance at low alts against even other spits.
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Just give the spit14 the large drop tank and that alone will be worth the perks. There is no way to use the 14 at its optimal altitude with the current fuel loadout it has.
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Just give the spit14 the large drop tank and that alone will be worth the perks. There is no way to use the 14 at its optimal altitude with the current fuel loadout it has.
with the slipper it goes approx 3-3.4k feet per minute already and just throttle back at altitudes. the spit14 is great around 15k-20k and it doesnt take long for it to get there. my squaddie acehavok flew 4 sectors with one and at the same time got it to 25k feet. granted he had only 5 minutes to fight then leave but for what it needs to do, its fine the way it is.