Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Flench on January 27, 2013, 09:45:41 AM
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Why would a person want a AR-15 or AK-47 ? I have been thinking of buying one BUT what would I use it for . I think each gun is a tool and that tool is used for what season it is . Like I am a big time hunter . Hunt every chance I get but I'm not going to deer hunt with a AK-47 so why buy one ? I'm not going to use it to protect my home so I can't justis buying one .
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You could deer hunt with an AK-47 just as easily as you would any other .30 cal rifle, unless you shoot your deer at ranges beyond 3-400 yards. The AR in 5.56mm would equal (or actually be a little better) than any .223 rifle.
Of course this depends on the quality of the weapon. A proper new-built AK will shoot 1-1.5 MOA which will give you a grouping of 1-1.5 inches at 100 yards. AR's generally shoot better than that.
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The best definition I have seen is that they (Speaking mostly for AR15's) are "modern musket". Regardless of every other use for them (Varmint hunting, shooting competitions like 3 Gun, etc) there purpose is for a civilian to own a weapon capable for him to take up arms against a corrupt government. That was the original purpose of the 2nd Amendment was to allow the people to have the necessary tools to form a militia to go up against the corrupt governments military arm. Back then it was Muskets, today it's AR15 and it's variants.
That and they're just fun to shoot! :aok
See Rule #14
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If you have no desire for one, don't buy one. Beats me what you are looking for here, short of trolling against certain guns. If you feel you have to justify each purchase to include a gun, my sympathies, your life must be boring.
Many who purchase weapons like you mention do it just because they want to. They buy them because they admire the weapon, it's design, or just flat out enjoy shooting it. AR's are very accurate, and can be made to be extremely accurate. Many, many shooters compete in marksmanship contests with them. Some like to shoot them for the pure fun, including plinking. (I love plinking, with .22 or any other rifle or handgun) I also target shoot, challenging myself to improve.
AR's can be used for hunting, and in fact are used by many hunters for that. Coyotes, feral pigs, etc are well taken with an AR. AR's are easy to shoot, with the semi-auto action and straight stock design delivering a very reduced recoil.
Personally I have no use or desire for an AK. I don't feel they are well made, accurate or of any use for me. So I don't have one, do not plan to ever buy one. But, I know there are many who enjoy the weapon, good for them, have fun. Just not for me.
I didn't need to ask anyone why I should or should not buy one.
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Hunting hogs. You wanna get several of in one go you get an AR maybe an M1A, AK, Mini14/30. all work well for this role.
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Hunting hogs. You wanna get several of in one go you get an AR maybe an M1A, AK, Mini14/30. all work well for this role.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGC1tjHCSVE :aok
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Hunting hogs. You wanna get several of in one go you get an AR maybe an M1A, AK, Mini14/30. all work well for this role.
Now I could see it used for hogs .That be fun . To bad we have none here in Mississippi .
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I used to use a stock Colt AR15 to shoot prairie dogs very consistently out to 200-250 yards. I put a 20X scope on top, fine tuned some ammo (reloaded), and worked in the trigger and it was impressive how accurate it was.
I used 20rd mags for all of that work. In fact, I dont hardly use any of my 30rd mags for much. I use 20rd mags for range work and shooting varmints. Yes, a .223 can take a deer with the right bullet but when there are better calibers and big game hunting platforms available then why?
As far hunting deer with an AK.... dont. If you so desire then be sure and get a shorter capacity mag (10 or 20rd) so the rifle is more handy and weighs less, AND USE PROPER AMMO!!! Remember, hunting is far more about precision and AK's were not built to be accurate no matter how desperate a person wants it to be. There is very little a guy can do with an AK for deer that a Remington or Browning autoloader hunting rifle cant do better with a more suitable caliber. Heck, even the lever actions in .30-30 caliber (a twin in performance to the 7.62x39 Soviet) would be a better platform to hunt deer with than an AK. Yeah, it can be done and unless there are mag capacity restrictions for hunting big game there is nothing "wrong" with hunting with an AK, but you're rubber stamping yourself if when you do.
Ultimately, if you want an AR15 or an AK variant of some kind then plan on it being in the case or gun safe unless you're taking it to the range for fun. If the zombie apocalypse ever comes you will be able to stave off a few based on how much ammo you have. :aok Do you *need* one to hunt? No, not at all. I actually frown upon using them to hunt in their "military" form. It is your choice, but if you're looking for a hunting platform them buy a hunting rifle. ;)
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Why would a person want a AR-15 or AK-47 ?
do you ever do anything just for fun? Do you own an ATV, jetski, skiboat, airplane, dirtbike? I bought my AR because I like the weapon and I enjoy "tactical" style shooting -- I don't hunt.
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Hunting hogs. You wanna get several of in one go you get an AR maybe an M1A, AK, Mini14/30. all work well for this role.
One of my next purchases is a Mini14, stainless Ranch Rifle with a good set of optics.....Swarovski maybe ...probably going to look into having it put into a nice highend wood stock, im thinking Tiger Maple. :aok I always liked the look of that rifle, and am very pleased with the way they function and shoot............one more for the list.
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I don't own either and probably never will. I liken these guns to sports cars. They look cool and have a certain mystique about them. When you do shoot one you feel a little bit cooler than the guy next to you at the range...but...they are niche guns that can't do a lot other than shoot fast and only the AR does it accurately. Go get a more versatile caliber like a 30-06 in either a bolt design or semi auto. You can do a lot more with it and shoot just about any bullet weight you want. That will open up options for hunting that you wont get with either the AR or the AK.
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If you use a lever action in .30-30 you're not shooting much beyond 100 yards due to the rounded nose bullets; maximum effective range at about 200 yards. A good AK with good ammo is accurate at those ranges, even with just iron sights. That has nothing to do with being desperate. It's just a fact.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8-nIV9kq-4
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One of my next purchases is a Mini14, stainless Ranch Rifle with a good set of optics.....Swarovski maybe ...probably going to look into having it put into a nice highend wood stock, im thinking Tiger Maple. :aok I always liked the look of that rifle, and am very pleased with the way they function and shoot............one more for the list.
I would not waste my money on nice optics for a mini 14...you can not float the barrels in most designs and you will never get better than average accuracy with it.
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As far hunting deer with an AK.... dont. If you so desire then be sure and get a shorter capacity mag (10 or 20rd) so the rifle is more handy and weighs less, AND USE PROPER AMMO!!! Remember, hunting is far more about precision and AK's were not built to be accurate no matter how desperate a person wants it to be. There is very little a guy can do with an AK for deer that a Remington or Browning autoloader hunting rifle cant do better with a more suitable caliber. Heck, even the lever actions in .30-30 caliber (a twin in performance to the 7.62x39 Soviet) would be a better platform to hunt deer with than an AK. Yeah, it can be done and unless there are mag capacity restrictions for hunting big game there is nothing "wrong" with hunting with an AK, but you're rubber stamping yourself if when you do.
This, and double check your hunting laws, I know in PA hunting with a Semi Auto rifle is against the law.
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I would not waste my money on nice optics for a mini 14...you can not float the barrels in most designs and you will never get better than average accuracy with it.
Actually a good friend of mine has one that he had done by EGW a years ago (Evolution Gun works is a custom gunsmith near me, built my IPSC 45, also built IPSC champion Doug Koenigs)......he is punching cloverleafs at 200yrds with custom (handloaded) Hornaday 55gr bullets and Zeiss optics.
I still shoot circles around him with my Paul Jaeger custom tho.... :D
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One resone I ask was it be hard for me to put down my Browning Semi Auto 270 . I just don't think one could get a better deer hunting gun .
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One of my next purchases is a Mini14, stainless Ranch Rifle with a good set of optics.....Swarovski maybe ...probably going to look into having it put into a nice highend wood stock, im thinking Tiger Maple. :aok I always liked the look of that rifle, and am very pleased with the way they function and shoot............one more for the list.
Put an accu-strut on it. I put one on my mini 30 and I shoot close to 2 1/2" groups at 300 yds. Probably get better than that with the mini-14. Of course I only use Golden Bear hollowpoint as well .
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I collect them and shoot them, that's why I choose to own them.
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..I know in PA hunting with a Semi Auto rifle is against the law.
:O
:mad:
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As far hunting deer with an AK.... dont. AK's were not built to be accurate no matter how desperate a person wants it to be.
Ultimately, if you want an AR15 or an AK variant of some kind then plan on it being in the case or gun safe unless you're taking it to the range for fun. If the zombie apocalypse ever comes you will be able to stave off a few based on how much ammo you have. :aok Do you *need* one to hunt? No, not at all. I actually frown upon using them to hunt in their "military" form. It is your choice, but if you're looking for a hunting platform them buy a hunting rifle. ;)
You are aware that some of the AK style rifles coming out now are more than accurate enough for deer hunting. and another the few deer Ive shot being from East Texas have been at less then 70 yards, if you cant hit a deer accurately at that range you shouldn't be shooting at animals period. That being said do I have an AK no, will I buy an AK probably not. First two deer I killed were with a .22 Hornet and the last couple were with my Model 70 Winchester featherweight in -06. But to tell the people of this forum not to do something, knowing that most of us are knowledgeable enough to know our own limits(or too dumb to listen) is silly to me.
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If your state hunting laws allow it (I'm praying for you and your state, mbailey :angel:), there is no reason an AR couldn't be a good hunting platform.
In VA, we have a restriction on big game hunting with anything .22 caliber and below, which is stupid IMO. Right across the border in WV, their only restriction is the rifle must be centerfire, which opens up anything down to a .22 Hornet. Having personally witnessed a .22 magnum take down a fairly robust 8 pointer (shot placement is king, after all), I wouldn't have any reservations about taking a typical "good shot" with a .223. Range would be more limited, of course, which may be a factor for you down there.
The accuracy potential for most well built AR's shocks most people who've never messed with them. While I've seen a good number of good shooting non-AR semi's in my lifetime, the AR raises the bar. There is TONS of info and tips on the net for making AR's more accurate.
Something like a Nosler Partition would be excellent bullet choice. Especially if you reload, there is absolutely no reason why a .223 can't offer up more than adequate results.
*edit* - I totally forgot to mention the plethora of other calibers available in the AR. While I would stay away from most, the AR10/SR25 pattern guns are chambered for .308. The .300 Blackout is another option, with the big advantage being after a barrel change, everything else(bolt, mags, etc.) in the typical 5.56/.223 AR interchanges. If I were to build a non .223 hunting AR (and money weren't really an object), I'd look directly at the Knights Armament SR-25 or the LMT MWS. Both have excellent reputations.
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:O
:mad:
Thats ok...i dont mind at all....I rarely use a second round anyway :D
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Thats ok...i dont mind at all....I rarely use a second round anyway :D
Ahh... the patient stand hunter. I can do that sometimes... when I fall asleep. :rofl
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when I fall asleep. :rofl
:rofl Heck i sleep better in the woods, than i do in my bed
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Now if the AR-15 came in a 243 cal ,I would not mine having one .
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Now if the AR-15 came in a 243 cal ,I would not mine having one .
That would actually be an AR10 and yes, you can get one in a 243. :aok
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Now if the AR-15 came in a 243 cal ,I would not mine having one .
There are .243 AR's out there, but they'll likely be from "boutique" or less well known makers (read: could be good or could suck) and very hard to find. A lot of these off caliber AR's suffer from feeding/extraction issues from sheer lack of testing. As an owner of a Browning semi, I'm sure you know the fine line the gun walks from the moment you pull the trigger until the next round is chambered. Some guns run like sewing machines, others choke and puke their way to the junk pile. AR's are no different, and it's made worse because everyone and their brother makes them.
One thing I've learned about AR's over the last several years... all AR's are not created equal.
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http://www.lmtstore.com/complete-weapon-systems-firearms-guns/complete-gas-weapons/308-modular-weapon-system-black-barrel.html (http://www.lmtstore.com/complete-weapon-systems-firearms-guns/complete-gas-weapons/308-modular-weapon-system-black-barrel.html)
(http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/21473698/images/1352329875509.jpg)
They've gone up $700 since the last time I looked! :O
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Also, you can go here: http://www.m4carbine.net/forumdisplay.php?f=10 (http://www.m4carbine.net/forumdisplay.php?f=10)
Good info along side of some of the usual idiots. M4C does everyone a favor by identifying "experts" (industry professionals, subject matter experts, etc.) under the user name.
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Why would a person want a AR-15 or AK-47 ? I have been thinking of buying one BUT what would I use it for . I think each gun is a tool and that tool is used for what season it is . Like I am a big time hunter . Hunt every chance I get but I'm not going to deer hunt with a AK-47 so why buy one ? I'm not going to use it to protect my home so I can't justis buying one .
I guess you need to follow the old logic, if you need to ask then you dont need it. you dont get a gun so you can find a way to use it, but because you have a use for it.
midway
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Not sure I'd want to use 7.62x39 for anything more than short range hunting (<100m where you're guaranteed a head/neck shot). I know pig hunters here like the AK clones for as a backup (feral pigs are usually hunted by dog then killed by knife).
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...you dont get a gun so you can find a way to use it, but because you have a use for it.
midway
:uhoh
What the hell is my wife doing on this forum?!?
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I use my Ak almost every weekend at the ranch. Its my truck gun and if you ask me what gun do i use to the most for hunting it would be the AK.
Dont think that a AR or a Ak is just for the military. Its just a modern firearm just like my mauser back in the early 1900's.
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There are .243 AR's out there, but they'll likely be from "boutique" or less well known makers (read: could be good or could suck) and very hard to find. A lot of these off caliber AR's suffer from feeding/extraction issues from sheer lack of testing. As an owner of a Browning semi, I'm sure you know the fine line the gun walks from the moment you pull the trigger until the next round is chambered. Some guns run like sewing machines, others choke and puke their way to the junk pile. AR's are no different, and it's made worse because everyone and their brother makes them.
One thing I've learned about AR's over the last several years... all AR's are not created equal.
Good info and thanks for the links .
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the ar15 is good for long range hunting or target practice now the people that are discing the AK47 probably don't own one I have a Norinco AK47 and its very accurate out to a range of 250-300yds I can a hit a steel plate thats 12in in diameter with open sights on it I used hunting here in missouri and I loved it not to much weight and your not suppose to be hunting with a mag that has over 11 rounds in it anyways so I just the 5 round one that I use for target practice its also very fun to shoot with my 2 40rd banana clips in it as well :D lol the AR is going to have less recoil than the AK just because its a bit better system and the round doesn't have as much powder behind as the 7.62X39 has ammo is cheap for both of them I think I pay $6 for 223 and $5.50 the 7.62X39 idk there both about the same you can go get a cheap AK for about $300-400 depending on what you get but I paid 500 for mine cause it was made by norinco and its an NHM91 version 20" barrel with bipod and the gun its worth about 1200 right now a good AR will run you about anywhere from 700-1500 or more
both very good guns both reliable
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You could deer hunt with an AK-47 just as easily as you would any other .30 cal rifle, unless you shoot your deer at ranges beyond 3-400 yards. The AR in 5.56mm would equal (or actually be a little better) than any .223 rifle.
Of course this depends on the quality of the weapon. A proper new-built AK will shoot 1-1.5 MOA which will give you a grouping of 1-1.5 inches at 100 yards. AR's generally shoot better than that.
Hunting Deer would be much better with an SKS over an AK-47. The "hunting deer with an AK-47" is played out.
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Hunting Deer would be much better with an SKS over an AK-47. The "hunting deer with an AK-47" is played out.
At 200 yards the energy on a 7.62x39 drops under the magic 800 ft/pounds recommended for deer (in fact between the 223 and this there's not a huge E difference). I assume people aren't confusing the 7.62x39 with the 7.62x54?
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:uhoh
What the hell is my wife doing on this forum?!?
:rofl
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Hunting Deer would be much better with an SKS over an AK-47. The "hunting deer with an AK-47" is played out.
Yes, but also no...
I don't necessarily have an issue with you deciding one weapon is better than the other, it's the "played out" comment I don't like (just my opinion).
If you're looking for a "best" option for deer, it's likely not going to be any non-bolt action firearm (IMO). I'd also argue that the caliber choices in any of the .223 range are far from "good" when it comes to hunting deer.
I've hunted deer successfully with my .22-250, which has substantially more punch to it than any of the .223's, even though it fires essentially the same bullet. Is an itty-bitty 55gr or so bullet, that will perform just fine on even large whitetails out to several hundred yards if you make a nice clean broadside shot. I just shot 2 nice whitetails with my .22-250 this fall. The one that went the furthest went less than 50 yards, and left a wonderful blood trail.
I'd still consider that to be way, way, way "down there" when it comes to choosing an effective deer caliber though.
On the other hand, I absolutely love hunting deer with muzzle loaders, and my .54 flintlock is my number one "go-to" choice for deer hunting over any other rifle I've ever seen or heard of. Of course, I'm not basing that entirely on effectiveness. My .54 flintlock pistol is my second choice firearm.
I also LOVE hunting deer with my longbow and wooden arrows.
Heck, the vast majority of my hunting is with a hawk or falcon catching rabbits, squirrels, ducks, pheasants, crows, or pigeons. I'd much rather hunt with a bird than any weapon at all.
Fortunately, we aren't limited to the "best" or "better" choices when it comes to hunting.
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Why would a person want a AR-15 or AK-47 ? I have been thinking of buying one BUT what would I use it for . I think each gun is a tool and that tool is used for what season it is . Like I am a big time hunter . Hunt every chance I get but I'm not going to deer hunt with a AK-47 so why buy one ? I'm not going to use it to protect my home so I can't justis buying one .
Oh for gods sake, if you can't think of one don't buy one. Take this passive aggressive political crap off the boards for crying out loud.
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Why would a person want a AR-15 or AK-47 ? I have been thinking of buying one BUT what would I use it for . I think each gun is a tool and that tool is used for what season it is . Like I am a big time hunter . Hunt every chance I get but I'm not going to deer hunt with a AK-47 so why buy one ? I'm not going to use it to protect my home so I can't justis buying one .
why does anyone need a car with 400+ hp?
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Why would a person want a AR-15 or AK-47 ? I have been thinking of buying one BUT what would I use it for . I think each gun is a tool and that tool is used for what season it is . Like I am a big time hunter . Hunt every chance I get but I'm not going to deer hunt with a AK-47 so why buy one ? I'm not going to use it to protect my home so I can't justis buying one .
because it is your right as an American to own whatever firearms you desire
do you hate freedom bro?
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because it is your right as an American to own whatever firearms you desire
do you hate freedom bro?
but that wasnt the question, was it?
midway
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because it is your right as an American to own whatever firearms you desire
do you hate freedom bro?
Let's not do this again..
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because it is your right as an American to own whatever firearms you desire
do you hate freedom bro?
shouldn't you be at the beach cuz?
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I think most people buy the AKs, ARs, tactical shotguns and SKS' because they look cool and are fun to shoot. Personally, I'd feel like a idiot packing one in the timber to hunt something.
Other then my turkey/pheasant gun,(Remington 12ga.) I'm a black powder guy myself.
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shouldn't you be at the beach cuz?
Yep, I really should! I'll be meeting the family down there in a few hours when I finish work ;D
whoopee I love the weather in this country
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Personally, I'd feel like a idiot packing one in the timber to hunt something.
Other then my turkey/pheasant gun,(Remington 12ga.) I'm a black powder guy myself.
Being an idiot is carrying a .300 Win Mag in the woods during squirrel season. :D
It's really just the stereotype that's making you feel that way. The actual operation of the gun differs little from more 'traditional' looking guns. The advantages are a proven, rugged design with a higher potential for accuracy vs. other semi-auto's. Whether it tickles your fancy though, is another matter entirely.
:salute
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I use them for pigs. We have a very large problem with pigs in Texas, and the AR 15 type rifles and AK type work the best for that. You're able to take down multiple at a time. Plus as its been said in this thread they really are fun to shoot. :aok :salute
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i've filed recently for my foid. i had originally planned only on target shooting, and possibly some sort of competitions like i did with archery. a longtime customer(been working on his cars for over 15 years) has offered to take me under his wing hunting, including covering my butt if i lose the stomach to gut the animal after i kill it. that's a good thing, 'cause i KNOW i can't do that after shooting it. he said it's not as hard as i think, and he'll work with me.
since someday i'll probably need to be able to do this, i'm gonna take him up on his offer. he's a cool old guy, and has always been good to deal with.
so.......i'll probably end up with fancy stuff for target/competition/zombie apocalypse, and "normal" stuff to take out in the field to kill dinner with. or i'll give the old guy a good laugh and take some of the fancy stuff out there too, lol
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Being an idiot is carrying a .300 Win Mag in the woods during squirrel season. :D
It's really just the stereotype that's making you feel that way. The actual operation of the gun differs little from more 'traditional' looking guns. The advantages are a proven, rugged design with a higher potential for accuracy vs. other semi-auto's. Whether it tickles your fancy though, is another matter entirely.
:salute
Speaking of 300 win mag....
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,344675.0.html
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If you use a lever action in .30-30 you're not shooting much beyond 100 yards due to the rounded nose bullets; maximum effective range at about 200 yards.
30-30
(http://media.midwayusa.com/productimages/2200x1650/primary/775/775263.jpg)
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Nice. The "flex tip" is some sort of rubber compound protecting the primers I take it?
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One rifle not mentioned yet in this thread that fulfills both the "hunting" and "tactical" requirements is the M14/M1A rifles. It has a decent cartridge that is more than enough for deer/elk, and can even take care of moose with the proper ammunition (.308 hunting ammo), and also has the ability to be quickly reloaded by a detachable high capacity box magazine (typically a 20 rounder). For 1500$ you can find a version that is "National Match" quality in terms of accuracy i.e. it will likely out shoot your capability to shoot it, at least in the offhand or standing position. Sure, it has a WW2 vintage wood stock sans pistol grip, but in terms of capability, it surpasses the AR platform in many regards, such as energy delivered on target, range, and sometimes accuracy.
I think the old "but you can't hunt with it, so why should somebody want it or need it" argument was old 20 years ago. Honestly, the reason why many shooters take "comfort" in owning an AR based rifle is that it is the primary weapon of their nations armed forces and police, and that in a time of some future unforeseeable and unpredictable crisis, said owner will have parts not only available but compatible with their rifle, and magazines and ammunition will be easily available as well. I suppose this also holds true for the present time, due to the fact of the AR platforms popularity there is ample available parts, ammunition, and magazines - times of saber rattling not withstanding and the temporarily empty shelves as a result. I believe this to be true as there is dozens of different "assault" type rifles available to the public in the USA, yet the AR platform outsells all of them put together for a reason, and it isn't quality, cost, or capability as there is many types that are superior to a base/stock-ish AR not in one of those categories, but all of them.
The AK while not being any western nation's primary rifle is still quite popular with the general population, and has a large following due to its lack of expense when compared to an AR, as well as a perceived higher "robustness" than the AR platform rifles by many of its users. There is also many manufacturers of the AK in the USA of note, which build far better rifles in terms of quality and tolerance than their Chinese and Russian counterparts.
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I use them for pigs. We have a very large problem with pigs in Texas, and the AR 15 type rifles and AK type work the best for that. You're able to take down multiple at a time. Plus as its been said in this thread they really are fun to shoot. :aok :salute
Now that would be fun :aok
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Now that would be fun :aok
We have way too much fun :D :aok. About six of us go out with our AR 15s and each come back with normally three coolers full. :)
Here's two of the four AR15s that we took last time.
(http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv3/1sum41/2012-11-07195046.jpg)
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Nice. The "flex tip" is some sort of rubber compound protecting the primers I take it?
from what i understand of it (and someone feel free to correct me on this) its basically a hollow point with a rubber tip to improve the balistics
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I can relate with you Sum41.
(http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i382/Gmansig220/ar15s.jpg)
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from what i understand of it (and someone feel free to correct me on this) its basically a hollow point with a rubber tip to improve the balistics
From what ive read its for lever guns with tubular mags.
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One of my next purchases is a Mini14, stainless Ranch Rifle
That or an M1 Carbine is my next gun. I really want the Ranch Rifle but I also wanting the M1 Carbine as a companion for my M1 Garand.
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Being an idiot is carrying a .300 Win Mag in the woods during squirrel season. :D
:salute
That and a ticket here . I grew up shooting a Remington 742 , 30-06 and killed a many many deer with it but went to the Browning 270 in 89 after I seen a guy in our hunting club hunting with one for a few year's . The gun well never jam like the Remington will after a box of ammo has been shot through it . That's 24 year's of hunting I have put on my Browning and it has never jammed the first time and has killed a many many deer .
I think I will buy a small Browning hand gun next that I can carry concealed besides my heavy S&W 9mm .
(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y313/LittleGeorgeJr/gun.jpg)
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Nice. The "flex tip" is some sort of rubber compound protecting the primers I take it?
Correct.
Like someone else said, it tries to fix the poor ballistic profile of the flat nose 30-30, which has traditionally been that way to avoid primer detonation in tube magazines.
I've not tried them, as I have no need to stretch my 30-30 out to longer ranges. If the 30-30 goes out in the field with me, I'm basically looking for something under 150 yards.
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I can relate with you Sum41.
(http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i382/Gmansig220/ar15s.jpg)
Nice! :aok
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That and a ticket here . I grew up shooting a Remington 742 , 30-06 and killed a many many deer with it but went to the Browning 270 in 89 after I seen a guy in our hunting club hunting with one for a few year's . The gun well never jam like the Remington will after a box of ammo has been shot through it . That's 24 year's of hunting I have put on my Browning and it has never jammed the first time and has killed a many many deer .
I think I will buy a small Browning hand gun next that I can carry concealed besides my heavy S&W 9mm .
(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y313/LittleGeorgeJr/gun.jpg)
OK.... now that's funny!! gonna steal it for facebook, lolol
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From what ive read its for lever guns with tubular mags.
Well, pretty much all 30-30 factory loads are designed around tubular mags. The normal previous solution had the noses being quite flat, but made of metal. This would prevent a jar setting off the primers, but ballistic coefficients sucked. The flex tips there look interesting, not quite sure what I make of them.
30-30 wouldn't be improved THAT much by a more aerodynamic bullet, I'd imagine. Still, kind of neat.
Wiley.
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You'd be surprised how much longer a spitzer bullet retains energy. Especially if it's a boat tail too. It will just about double the effective range of a rifle cartridge, compared to round-nosed bullets.
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You'd be surprised how much longer a spitzer bullet retains energy. Especially if it's a boat tail too. It will just about double the effective range of a rifle cartridge, compared to round-nosed bullets.
It would be interesting to see if you're right. I've always put my range limit on the 30-30 to 150 yards. A 300 yard shot with a 30-30 is Quigley Down Under stuff to me. :lol
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It would be interesting to see if you're right. I've always put my range limit on the 30-30 to 150 yards. A 300 yard shot with a 30-30 is Quigley Down Under stuff to me. :lol
Lemme guess... Model 94 with buckhorn sights, right? :)
The one I grew up with had a sight I've never seen on one before or since. It wasn't a flip up peep sight mounted on the tang behind the hammer, it was a peepsight mounted just in between the hammer and the ejector port. 2 screws on the side of the receiver and then it came over the top in front of the hammer. Simple as hell, durable as all hell, but doubled the sight radius on the thing.
First deer I ever shot was with that thing at ~250 yards.
Wiley.
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Don't know about the .30-30; it doesn't look optimal. It looks short, like a pistol bullet. How far is the bullet pressed into the cartridge?
The 7.62x39 that people say the .30-30 is equal to in energy has a proper spitzer boat tail bullet. Fired from an AK it is still supersonic at 400 yards. The iron sight on the AK is adjustable up to 800 meters; with the AKM they increased it to 1000 meters. I wonder what they were hoping to hit at one kilometer with an AK...
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30-30
(http://media.midwayusa.com/productimages/2200x1650/primary/775/775263.jpg)
The stuff had me bring my old Marlin that I got at 12 back into service. With a new Burris scope it now shoots good at 200yds. That's the max distance I'd shoot it at game or course. Popped a hog at 150yds now problem.
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Don't know about the .30-30; it doesn't look optimal. It looks short, like a pistol bullet. How far is the bullet pressed into the cartridge?
The 7.62x39 that people say the .30-30 is equal to in energy has a proper spitzer boat tail bullet. Fired from an AK it is still supersonic at 400 yards. The iron sight on the AK is adjustable up to 800 meters; with the AKM they increased it to 1000 meters. I wonder what they were hoping to hit at one kilometer with an AK...
At 1 km if someone with an AK started popping off, I'd get behind something. Heck, a 30-30, even a .22, I'd get behind something. At 300fps a .30 cal projectile has enough oomph to be lethal if it hits the right spot on a person, is something I recall reading once.
Wiley.
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Lemme guess... Model 94 with buckhorn sights, right? :)
The one I grew up with had a sight I've never seen on one before or since. It wasn't a flip up peep sight mounted on the tang behind the hammer, it was a peepsight mounted just in between the hammer and the ejector port. 2 screws on the side of the receiver and then it came over the top in front of the hammer. Simple as hell, durable as all hell, but doubled the sight radius on the thing.
First deer I ever shot was with that thing at ~250 yards.
Wiley.
Model 94 Carbine (Trapper) with saddle ring. :neener:
Never seen a peep sight on a 94. I need to get out more. :uhoh
Don't know about the .30-30; it doesn't look optimal. It looks short, like a pistol bullet. How far is the bullet pressed into the cartridge?
The 7.62x39 that people say the .30-30 is equal to in energy has a proper spitzer boat tail bullet. Fired from an AK it is still supersonic at 400 yards. The iron sight on the AK is adjustable up to 800 meters; with the AKM they increased it to 1000 meters. I wonder what they were hoping to hit at one kilometer with an AK...
The 30-30 accepts a standard .308 bullet, and without having ever loaded for the 30-30 I don't know off the top of my head what the typical seating depth is. I would bet it's on par with most .30 caliber rifles though.
And yes, I've wondered about those 1000 yard sights too. :lol
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That and a ticket here . I grew up shooting a Remington 742 , 30-06 and killed a many many deer with it but went to the Browning 270 in 89 after I seen a guy in our hunting club hunting with one for a few year's . The gun well never jam like the Remington will after a box of ammo has been shot through it . That's 24 year's of hunting I have put on my Browning and it has never jammed the first time and has killed a many many deer .
I think I will buy a small Browning hand gun next that I can carry concealed besides my heavy S&W 9mm .
(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y313/LittleGeorgeJr/gun.jpg)
I've seen 740's run and run and run... and I've seen a few that couldn't get through a mag without choking. :headscratch:
Most of my rifles are Remingtons. I'm a bit of a fanboy. Yet not everything they make is gold. :cry
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(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y313/LittleGeorgeJr/gun.jpg)
That picture reminded me of the Simpsons episode where Homer learned he could shoot anyone within his home so he went out to call Flanders for a visit :D
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Here's my .32 cal sniper rifle. One shot one kill boys. :D
(http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk121/TheAmish/32cal_zps9b503bec.jpg)
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See Rule #14
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See Rule #14
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Don't know about the .30-30; it doesn't look optimal. It looks short, like a pistol bullet. How far is the bullet pressed into the cartridge?
The 7.62x39 that people say the .30-30 is equal to in energy has a proper spitzer boat tail bullet. Fired from an AK it is still supersonic at 400 yards. The iron sight on the AK is adjustable up to 800 meters; with the AKM they increased it to 1000 meters. I wonder what they were hoping to hit at one kilometer with an AK...
That goes for ANY combat rifle with iron sights. Without high magnification optics the shooter is literally peeing in the wind. There is a reason "assault" rifles have an optimal max range of 300-44 yards, the human eye can only deal with distance to a point then it is fruitless to even try.
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I'm not sure what you mean by "That goes for ANY combat rifle with iron sights." What goes? Surely not one kilometer iron sights?
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I bought some 30-30 hornaday leverlution bullets for my 336 marlin. Has pointed rubber tips safe for tubular magazines. Shoots out to 250 yds accurately no problem.