Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: nugetx on May 25, 2017, 05:06:32 AM
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What would you think of the proposed gameplay changes for main arena? This comes from the fact, that some people consider AH in current state to be 'air quake arena' due to the fact that there are non real life maps and all planes are available on all sides and this potentialy drives them away from playing the game.
The proposed gameplay changes would do the following: bring a level of historical accuracy to the game, delete the 'air quake arena' status which some consider the game to be for kids only, along with steam this could potentialy bring further even more players.
1) Real life maps
European theatre and Pacific theatre seem like the most logical choice
2) Removal of the 3 chess sides and replacing them with 2, Axis vs Allies
Removal of the fantasy element of the game and introducing historical aspect of the WW2 to the game - Axis vs Allies. This would do 3 things. It could potentialy balance out the player numbers so it's easier to find opponents and battles in the arena because players would be equaly balanced out between the 2 sides.
You would always fight vs the other opponent, currently if you fight vs 1 one side, there is the third side whom you don't see and is doing something else somewhere elsewhere.
The game would have historical encounters, 109 vs spits, 190 vs p51s. No more fantasy encounters of spits vs spits.
Ofcourse, there would be japanese planes fighting spits in europe, but I believe it's better to have that than non realism at all.
3) War 1939-1945
Introduction of time passage from 1939 to 1945 which would happen in real life time. For example 1 hour of real life time would equal 1 week in game time(this is just an example I currently have no idea of how fast or how slow time would pass, everything would have to be tested to find the perfect desired number to have a fun and balanced play).
If a side a wins the war in 1942, the side gets a 'win', the game resets and continues to 1945. Once it's past 1945 the clock goes back to 1939 and 'wins' in the war are counted up for the player and there could even be a uniform page where other players and you could see your achievements.
(http://i.imgur.com/wS1jbQT.jpg)
4) Rolling plane set
Along with the war 1939-1945, RPS aka Rolling Plane Set introduced which would bring historical time frame of when the planes appear.
Example:
Spit I - september 1939
109 E4 - september 1939
190 A5 - early 1942
Effectively this would bring early, med and late planes to the play. All planes would be used, something which we don't see today on the arena. Most people like to play the late war planes because they tend to be 'the best'.
This further accompanies other points of this post.
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Now this is the first part of this post which I would consider a 'necessary' change for the popularity, second part of the post changes the game a little bit further and is more of a 'what if' scenario if Aces High had could be enhanced even further.
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An introduction of a visible movable front line which would serve as an indication of where the current action is which encompasses the fields. When the fields are taken, the front line would move also, this could be potentialy helpfull to the new players easing them to the game. New players entering games like this one, tend to be lost and asking questions 'what do i do?' this would be a visual identification of showing them where they can expect action and where to go.
(http://i.imgur.com/uknzJjj.jpg)
What do you think?
As always, thanks for reading.
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Not gonna happen.
I enjoyed all these things in Brand X though.
We should have two sides however, for many reasons. Wishful thinking.
What I want to see is no perks for winning the war. Then we won't have so many fakes camping on the winner trending side causing spikes to ENY.
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#1...If you want real life maps during WWII...find a FSO squad, these are the type of maps we use in FSO...there are also real life maps in Axis Vs. Allies arena
#2...If you want a 2 sided war go to Axis Vs. Allies arena when they are running an event...or join a FSO squad and play AVA...the MA isn't that place
#3...We have early war events from time to time...maybe not 1939 but the idea isn't all bad...if you want someone to see how you are doing after a tour (which is 1 month) post your score here on the BBS or tell everyone in game to do a .score for your in-game name which we still don't know what is...
#4...if you want a rolling plane set go the the AVA or find a FSO squad to fly with...they both have different plane sets each month....
So overall you get a -4
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1) Real life maps
2) Removal of the 3 chess sides and replacing them with 2, Axis vs Allies
3) War 1939-1945
4) Rolling plane set
If you had taken the amount of time it took you to type all that up to search you would have found that these ideas have been talked to death and will never happen in the Main Arena.
It is available in the Axis vs Allied arena. The "Combat Theater" later renamed to the Axis vs Allied Arena (AvA) has been around since Dec 2001. In that time it has never been very popular. If that was how the game was setup in the Mains this company would be closed in weeks.
There is really nothing wrong with the game in the Main arena. Its a big sand box that has all kinds of game play covered. The problem arise when the numbers are low like they are now. With the numbers low sometimes you log on and its a majority of GV battles. If you dont like GVing, your one of a few in the air. Sometimes you log in and its a horde group rolling the map and they are not fighting on your front. Again your type of play is screwed.
With three times the numbers, more people are playing more types of play at the same time and it is easier to find the type of play a player likes and can ignore the other types with out being frustrated by being forced to play the only thing really going on in the game at that time. That is the real strength of this game and one of the secrets to its longevity, the ability to play it many different ways.
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If you had taken the amount of time it took you to type all that up to search you would have found that these ideas have been talked to death and will never happen in the Main Arena.
It is available in the Axis vs Allied arena. The "Combat Theater" later renamed to the Axis vs Allied Arena (AvA) has been around since Dec 2001. In that time it has never been very popular. If that was how the game was setup in the Mains this company would be closed in weeks.
There is really nothing wrong with the game in the Main arena. Its a big sand box that has all kinds of game play covered. The problem arise when the numbers are low like they are now. With the numbers low sometimes you log on and its a majority of GV battles. If you dont like GVing, your one of a few in the air. Sometimes you log in and its a horde group rolling the map and they are not fighting on your front. Again your type of play is screwed.
With three times the numbers, more people are playing more types of play at the same time and it is easier to find the type of play a player likes and can ignore the other types with out being frustrated by being forced to play the only thing really going on in the game at that time. That is the real strength of this game and one of the secrets to its longevity, the ability to play it many different ways.
AvA is dead for other reasons. It's settings are NOT the same as the OMA, and this goes beyond maps and two vs three sides.
Arenas are popular based on critical mass. AvA with two sides and RPS was a massive hit in WBs and then, for some reason almost overnight, the MA became popular. The horde follows the horde.
Edited to say OMA not MA.
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Need to lose the entire "Main" arena title. There is no such thing and that is an issue we have dealt with for along time. Everyone wants one arena to be all things to all people and that cannot happen.
Having hundreds of players in one arena, whom have all their own ideas on how it should be played (and not respecting how others want to play), only serves to create frustrations, which manifest in all manner of negativity.
Everything in this wish is already available, in one form or another. Trying to shoehorn all things, to all people, into one arena, would be a disaster.
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OMA.
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OMA.
Okay, I am pretty sure that does not mean "Oregon Mediation Association". If it does, then what does that have to do with this thread?
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Okay, I am pretty sure that does not mean "Oregon Mediation Association". If it does, then what does that have to do with this thread?
Open
Melee
Arena
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The "Open Melee" arena means anything goes, but when other players have zero respect for how other players want to play, it creates a nasty environment.
Toad gets it. He is making his own brand of fun instead of trying to force everyone in the Melee arena to play his way.
Almost everyday I see players come to this board complaining about how people are not playing the way they think it should be played.
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It is actually "Melee Arena", meaning anything goes, but when other players have zero respect for how other players want to play, it creates a nasty environment.
Toad gets it. He is making his own brand of fun instead of trying to force everyone in the Melee arena to play his way.
Almost everyday I see players come to this board complaining about how people are not playing the way they think it should be played.
It says Melee not Open Melee? Then my saying MA is apparently correct.
Toad and I discussed this at length. We played dozens of drone missions trying to sort it out. Glad he's taken the next step.
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It says Melee not Open Melee? Then my saying MA is apparently correct.
My bad, it does say that, but my statement still stands. Modified for the boo-boo.
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My bad, it does say that, but my statement still stands. Modified for the boo-boo.
:salute
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Having hundreds of players in one arena, whom have all their own ideas on how it should be played (and not respecting how others want to play), only serves to create frustrations, which manifest in all manner of negativity.
I'm confused with this one. Is it an observation or a prelude to a pending change? That has always been why the Melee Arena (MA) has worked good or bad.
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Don't over think it bustr. It is an opinion. I have no control over the direction the game takes. I want to make that very clear.
When people keep tossing around "Main Arena", it makes me cringe.
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The idea that people have their own way of playing is absurd.
The game is built with specific frameworks and rules, just like any other game; like chess or checkers.
The natural thing then to happen is the people themselves build rules to make engagements/interactions more fair or "honourable". Just like how religion shaped itself from the environment, evolved and grew to what it is now. The idea that someone was a "Dweeb" grew from this *meta* of interaction and expectations called "a game". It is but a layer of tradition, a well formed layer of guidelines.
As well, it is the choice of those who wish to stand for these more fair rules to preserve that tradition in order to allow other players to experience the effects of it. They must be commended, because it is those very traditions that add depth and increase the meaning of every encounter.
It is the easy way vs the hard way. That is an eternal struggle in a human sense of the way and takes part in everything that is human.
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The idea that people have their own way of playing is absurd.<snip>
Sorry, but you have not read or listened to the players if you think that is true.
1) Players complain about GV's ruining their fights.
2) Players complaining someone wants to land their kills.
3) Players complaining about CV's not being used the way they should be.
4) Players complaining about being picked in a fight.
5) Players complaining about other players not playing the way they thing they should be.
6) Players complaining (long and loud) about being found and shot down.
I could go on. I spend a lot of time reading the logs and the dealing with player communications. All the above is the result of players wanting others to play the way they think the game should be played.
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Sorry, but you have not read or listened to the players if you think that is true.
1) Players complain about GV's ruining their fights.
2) Players complaining someone wants to land their kills.
3) Players complaining about CV's not being used the way they should be.
4) Players complaining about being picked in a fight.
5) Players complaining about other players not playing the way they thing they should be.
6) Players complaining (long and loud) about being found and shot down.
I could go on. I spend a lot of time reading the logs and the dealing with player communications. All the above is the result of players wanting others to play the way they think the game should be played.
I am not sure, Skuzzy. It sound like these things are a threat to each person's ego. That isn't much of a "please play my way" than it is a expression of pure frustration/venting.
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If you push them, you will eventually will get to the bottom of the muck and find they get mad because so-and-so was not doing what they thought they should be doing.
I agree, there is also ego at play. Pride as well. That will vary depending on the person.
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If you push them, you will eventually will get to the bottom of the muck and find they get mad because so-and-so was not doing what they thought they should be doing.
I agree, there is also ego at play. Pride as well. That will vary depending on the person.
Most likely the other person is not 'dying' at their hands?
What if I told you that these rules/traditions that have been passed on cultivate a more controlled state of mind/different expectations?
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Most likely the other person is not 'dying' at their hands?
What if I told you that these rules/traditions that have been passed on cultivate a more controlled state of mind/different expectations?
It does not matter if the manifestations are not good. Abusive, derogatory comms are not good for the health of the community unless your idea of it being healthy is to drive off players who might not play the game you would expect them to play.
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Don't over think it bustr. It is an opinion. I have no control over the direction the game takes. I want to make that very clear.
When people keep tossing around "Main Arena", it makes me cringe.
My apology, read way too much into it. I can understand the MA issue, hope it works itself out eventually.
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It does not matter if the manifestations are not good. Abusive, derogatory comms are not good for the health of the community unless your idea of it being healthy is to drive off players who might not play the game you would expect them to play.
It is a confusing and complicated issue. I remember not having any problems or reservations being killed or out-smarted by other people when I first started playing these games. It would be an interesting observation to work out when people started becoming toxic so that there might be some sort of 'therapy' for it.
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Almost everyday I see players come to this board complaining about how people are not playing the way they think it should be played.
This is exactly what we are facing. Skuzzy is right on the mark here.
The scenario goes something like this; We have this big, beautiful playground, with all kinds of cool toys. Over there we have some guys playing tag. Over here we have some guys playing hide-and-seek. Over here we have some guys playing capture the flag.
Cue whiney voice: "Mr. Hitech. Those guys aren't playing tag with us they way they are supposed to. They're using the playground wrong. Make them stop!"
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My favorite whines come from those who want a dedicated area of the map for a specific type of game play, instead of just going to the arena, or creating an arena which actually offers the type they want.
My head just hits the desk when I read those.
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If you had taken the amount of time it took you to type all that up to search you would have found that these ideas have been talked to death and will never happen in the Main Arena.
It is available in the Axis vs Allied arena. The "Combat Theater" later renamed to the Axis vs Allied Arena (AvA) has been around since Dec 2001. In that time it has never been very popular. If that was how the game was setup in the Mains this company would be closed in weeks.
There is really nothing wrong with the game in the Main arena. Its a big sand box that has all kinds of game play covered. The problem arise when the numbers are low like they are now. With the numbers low sometimes you log on and its a majority of GV battles. If you dont like GVing, your one of a few in the air. Sometimes you log in and its a horde group rolling the map and they are not fighting on your front. Again your type of play is screwed.
With three times the numbers, more people are playing more types of play at the same time and it is easier to find the type of play a player likes and can ignore the other types with out being frustrated by being forced to play the only thing really going on in the game at that time. That is the real strength of this game and one of the secrets to its longevity, the ability to play it many different ways.
True!
But to paraphrase someone, if AvA was to suddenly gain favor amongst the players, then play in MAs would suffer.
FWIW: I like the idea of a End-to-End emulation of WWII!
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FWIW: I like the idea of a End-to-End emulation of WWII!
Yea that's the idea.
I called it the 'main arena' because it's where the most players flock to.
Also 3 sides is not the best solution for low players numbers. Even if Steam bumps the play numbers, in time, they might go lower again, and AH might be in same situation.
While writing this I not only thinked about low player numbers, but also a long term perspective of the game...... new players after time might get bored with all planes unlocked all the time.
I don't know about you guys, but all planes unlocked is bad for the metagame, because early and mid war planes are ciminaly underused, leaving people using 2-3 types of late war planes.
That's why rolling plane set is a good solution for this, because early med and late are shared through times.
If you had taken the amount of time it took you to type all that up to search you would have found that these ideas have been talked to death and will never happen in the Main Arena.
If they had been talked to death it means people would like to see them and something that should be considered imo.
There is really nothing wrong with the game in the Main arena.
What about a handfull of planes being used only ?
When I'm in a spit...... and a spit goes against me.... I always get this feeling 'wait.....something is not right here', and plenty of other people get also that play flight sims for over 20 years.
The scenario goes something like this; We have this big, beautiful playground, with all kinds of cool toys. Over there we have some guys playing tag. Over here we have some guys playing hide-and-seek. Over here we have some guys playing capture the flag.
Cue whiney voice: "Mr. Hitech. Those guys aren't playing tag with us they way they are supposed to. They're using the playground wrong. Make them stop!"
And if we would be doing this in a historical setting, I guarantee you, that more people would come.
Again, like in the other thread i made.... I am pro HTC and i'm posting this as a solution to a problem that is right there in the face.
I am not saying this is perfect solution, but I proposed something which I would consider to be logical.
Saying all that, I enjoy the game, but something should be done about atleast:
All planes available to all sides -- because fighting vs the same side plane in a ww2 flight sim REALLY makes people run away.
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:bhead
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:bhead
That wall has to creak eventualy :angel:
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I don't know about you guys, but all planes unlocked is bad for the metagame, because early and mid war planes are ciminaly underused, leaving people using 2-3 types of late war planes.
That's why rolling plane set is a good solution for this, because early med and late are shared through times.
Rolling plane set will drive away players if they don't have access to the planes they want to fly. It didn't work for WB and one of the main reasons why I left that game. It sucked having to wait 2 week to fly the P-38F and then an additional week if I wanted to fly the J model and had to wait until almost the end of the campaign to fly the L model. At the time of the introduction of the rolling plane set in WB, it started the exodus from that game. Even HiTech (the creator of WB) has posted that the RPS in WB was a bad idea and why it hasn't been introduced into Aces High.
People cry that they can't fly their plane of choice when ENY kicks in, imagine the cries if they can't fly their plane of choice for days or even weeks due to a RPS system.
All planes available to all sides -- because fighting vs the same side plane in a ww2 flight sim REALLY makes people run away.
This isn't a WW2 flight sim, the core game in no way tries to simulate or replicate WW2. The core game just aims to simulate in a game environment a combat simulator using WW2 vehicles, not the war itself.
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Rolling plane set will drive away players if they don't have access to the planes they want to fly. It didn't work for WB and one of the main reasons why I left that game. It sucked having to wait 2 week to fly the P-38F and then an additional week if I wanted to fly the J model and had to wait until almost the end of the campaign to fly the L model.
Well it could be the same like there is with the 163 and 262 currently.... once you get enough points you can fly your plane before its 'release' date.
And not to make it super hard or frustrating, once you get enough points, you get for example 4 uses of that plane. If you get back to base you don't loose any uses, but if you die you get one plane less.
This way you would have to make lets say 1 sortie with kills with the 'base' plane of the current year to have a higher tier plane, 3-4 sorties for even higher tier etc. This would have people fly early and mid planes.
So have all planes possible to fly by accumulating enough points, and have them gradually being introduced by the time of year.
Everyone is happy = more players = HTC is happy
This isn't a WW2 flight sim, the core game in no way tries to simulate or replicate WW2.
Ugh i might be missing something, but this is from the front page of the website
'Welcome to the best WW2 combat experience online'
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Well it could be the same like there is with the 163 and 262 currently.... once you get enough points you can fly your plane before its 'release' date.
And not to make it super hard or frustrating, once you get enough points, you get for example 4 uses of that plane. If you get back to base you don't loose any uses, but if you die you get one plane less.
This way you would have to make lets say 1 sortie with kills with the 'base' plane of the current year to have a higher tier plane, 3-4 sorties for even higher tier etc. This would have people fly early and mid planes.
So have all planes possible to fly by accumulating enough points, and have them gradually being introduced by the time of year.
Everyone is happy = more players = HTC is happy
Again, look how many complain about not being able to fly the plane of their choice when ENY kicks in. There will be far more complaints and players leaving if they are denied for a period of time the plane of their choice, which will happen when a RPS is introduced.
Ask yourself why the creator of WB hasn't introduced a RPS system into AH. You can find the answer if you search the boards from HiTech himself saying the RPS was a mistake.
Ugh i might be missing something, but this is from the front page of the website
'Welcome to the best WW2 combat experience online'
Ask HiTech yourself. He has said many times himself that Aces High does not try and recreate WW2, it's a combat simulator using WW2 aircraft and vehicles. If the game did try and simulate WW2, we wouldn't be fighting using chess pieces as countries.
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There will be far more complaints and players leaving if they are denied for a period of time the plane of their choice, which will happen when a RPS is introduced.
What about the point system, which is being used right now for planes like 163 and 262 (tempest?).
Maybe expand it further and tweak it, so everyone starts with a early war plane.
But this could potentialy be worse, because with RPS, everyone in the end gets to fly most of the planes.
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Nugetx, I honestly think your best bet of this happening would be with a completely different arena than the Melee Arena. The Melee Arena needs to stay as it is, a sandbox style arena. Most of this can be accomplished in the AvA arena. Maybe you can talk with one of the AvA guys and they may give it a whirl.
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Maybe you can talk with one of the AvA guys and they may give it a whirl.
Good advice.
Years ago we tried a historical RPS in AvA. Some determined person figured out all the when-were-they-introduced/when-were-they-withdrawn data for the ETO, then compressed it all into a span of about a month. I'm sure I have it somewhere, and certainly other geezers do, too. People who naturally gravitated to the AvA found it was a lot of fun, but clearly it isn't for everyone, or even for most people. We only ran it twice. It was a lot of work for the AvA staff, but they have always been a dedicated bunch.
My own most vivid recollection was how long the Spit V vs. 109F lasted - seemed like it took weeks, rather than days, before that plane set changed. As others have said, in light of the horror that many people experience when they can't get their favorite plane for ten minutes, it's no wonder that RPS emptied out Warbirds.
- oldman
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AvA had an evolving war type thing not too long ago...they didn't get the support needed to keep it going
If you want these types of things either make an arena for them, join a FSO squad
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Yea that's the idea.
I called it the 'main arena' because it's where the most players flock to.
Also 3 sides is not the best solution for low players numbers. Even if Steam bumps the play numbers, in time, they might go lower again, and AH might be in same situation.
While writing this I not only thinked about low player numbers, but also a long term perspective of the game...... new players after time might get bored with all planes unlocked all the time.
I don't know about you guys, but all planes unlocked is bad for the metagame, because early and mid war planes are ciminaly underused, leaving people using 2-3 types of late war planes.
That's why rolling plane set is a good solution for this, because early med and late are shared through times.
If they had been talked to death it means people would like to see them and something that should be considered imo.
What about a handfull of planes being used only ?
When I'm in a spit...... and a spit goes against me.... I always get this feeling 'wait.....something is not right here', and plenty of other people get also that play flight sims for over 20 years.
And if we would be doing this in a historical setting, I guarantee you, that more people would come.
Again, like in the other thread i made.... I am pro HTC and i'm posting this as a solution to a problem that is right there in the face.
I am not saying this is perfect solution, but I proposed something which I would consider to be logical.
Saying all that, I enjoy the game, but something should be done about atleast:
All planes available to all sides -- because fighting vs the same side plane in a ww2 flight sim REALLY makes people run away.
What kind of guarantee are you talking about? For HTC a lot of money is on the line, you willing to cover the loses?
I have been here for almost 15 years playing this game. In that time a matched setup with a two sided world has been available and has NEVER had the people we have in our 3 sided, all planes and vehicles available world. It wont work.
Hitech has tested many different numbers of teams and 3 works best for a Melee type arena which is their "bread and butter".
You sound like your looking for a full out WWII simulation. Well I hate to say it, but you may have to look someplace else. This is NOT a simulation. It is a GAME that uses WWII type equipment for PLAYERS to battle it out on the land, in the air, and at sea.
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No really guys. An RPS has never worked for a game like this in the past, but this time it will work! Really!
I wish HTC would just remove the population cap from the custom arenas. If someone can come up with an idea like their Awesome WWII Simulation Arena, or No Icons Blind Man's Bonanza, or 2 Sided War (Pick Allies or you'll be horde rolled), or whatever other set of specialty settings they think would fix every problem the game has why not let it hold as many people as it can?
I realize most of the ideas won't draw enough people to hit the cap of the custom arenas, but it would be nice if the cap wasn't there, just so they couldn't use that as a reason for why the arena's empty.
Wiley.
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Good advice.
Years ago we tried a historical RPS in AvA. Some determined person figured out all the when-were-they-introduced/when-were-they-withdrawn data for the ETO, then compressed it all into a span of about a month. I'm sure I have it somewhere, and certainly other geezers do, too. People who naturally gravitated to the AvA found it was a lot of fun, but clearly it isn't for everyone, or even for most people. We only ran it twice. It was a lot of work for the AvA staff, but they have always been a dedicated bunch.
My own most vivid recollection was how long the Spit V vs. 109F lasted - seemed like it took weeks, rather than days, before that plane set changed. As others have said, in light of the horror that many people experience when they can't get their favorite plane for ten minutes, it's no wonder that RPS emptied out Warbirds.
- oldman
It WAS a lot of work - I know cause we ran it (Jaeger, Soda, Ranger, you and I). It was also a lot of fun. I was also the one who gathered all the historical plane sets service dates and Jaeger put that into a RPS table that we used to create the maps. The RPS every week based on a 14 month advance. Was fun and we had anywhere from 30-50 players per night partaking.
If we're talking about a faster RPS arena, it would be kinda cool to do it in an arena that every hour opens up aircraft per service date. I.e. 4pm 1939, 5pm 1940, 6pm 1941, 7pm 1942, 8pm 1943, 9pm 1944, 10pm 1945. That might be fun!
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No really guys. An RPS has never worked for a game like this in the past, but this time it will work! Really!
I wish HTC would just remove the population cap from the custom arenas. If someone can come up with an idea like their Awesome WWII Simulation Arena, or No Icons Blind Man's Bonanza, or 2 Sided War (Pick Allies or you'll be horde rolled), or whatever other set of specialty settings they think would fix every problem the game has why not let it hold as many people as it can?
I realize most of the ideas won't draw enough people to hit the cap of the custom arenas, but it would be nice if the cap wasn't there, just so they couldn't use that as a reason for why the arena's empty.
Wiley.
RPS was one of my favorite things in WBs.
The game didn't die because of that or two sides. It had other issues and fierce competiton from AH.
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I find it pretty amusing when someone thinks there is a magic bullet that will fill the AvA arena. It's ALL been tried with some only temporary successes.
I had recently come up with a war concept that followed 2 particular units from 1941 through 1945 in the ETO.
We had to use staged missions to guarantee action, but I did think it had some potential...then my personal life blew up.
Sigh..I hope someday to try again, but it's not easy to get the required help you need when you can offer no compensation and have limited arena scoring /logging options. I was also spending my own money on additions that I decided I really couldn't afford.
That said, we have room for a couple new staffers, I am currently on LOA, so to speak. Might inquire if you can try your ideas with us.
Contact captain1ma or Jeager as he is known.
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RPS was one of my favorite things in WBs.
The game didn't die because of that or two sides. It had other issues and fierce competiton from AH.
As I'm sure you're aware, you are deeply in the minority. It surely wasn't just that, but anywhere I've seen an RPS mentioned you see a few guys saying it's swell, and a vast majority despising it.
YMMV.
Wiley.
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RPS was one of my favorite things in WBs.
The game didn't die because of that or two sides. It had other issues and fierce competiton from AH.
Yes Warbirds died because Aces High does everything it does and better and not because of 2 sides or AvA.
Besides if I understand correctly, Hitech is the one behind WB also, so it's only natural people came here.
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As I'm sure you're aware, you are deeply in the minority. It surely wasn't just that, but anywhere I've seen an RPS mentioned you see a few guys saying it's swell, and a vast majority despising it.
YMMV.
Wiley.
We had full arenas the entire time the RPS was up when I was there.
The most fun ever was Spit I vs 109E in the Euro map and Zeke vs F4F-3 in the Pacific. People loved it.
Jet day sucked. That was a universal gripe.
RPS was awesome. Frankly, I wish there was a mechanism to encourage more EW plane fights without forcing a rolling plane set. I can't think of anything, though.
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. Frankly, I wish there was a mechanism to encourage more EW plane fights without forcing a rolling plane set. I can't think of anything, though.
Current point system could be used though, all players start with few early war planes, and to unlock mid and late planes you need to get points for them (like for the me 163 and 262 currently).
Once you die you have to restart, and for it not be hard and frustrating have a few planes uses of the unlocked plane.
This way we would see waaaaaaay more early and mid war planes.
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Current point system could be used though, all players start with few early war planes, and to unlock mid and late planes you need to get points for them (like for the me 163 and 262 currently).
Once you die you have to restart, and for it not be hard and frustrating have a few planes uses of the unlocked plane.
This way we would see waaaaaaay more early and mid war planes.
This way we would see waaaaaaay more runners.
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This way we would see waaaaaaay more runners.
So what's the point of having so many planes if people use 2-3 planes ?
It's not fun to constantly fly and fight vs 3 late war planes
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So what's the point of having so many planes if people use 2-3 planes ?
It's not fun to constantly fly and fight vs 3 late war planes
I agree completely. I was referring to the "once you die, you start over".
People run now as it is. This is just giving them a better reason to run.
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I agree completely. I was referring to the "once you die, you start over".
People run now as it is. This is just giving them a better reason to run.
rgr lol
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Interesting proposals from a new player who can't even play the game because of missing payment options... :old:
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Interesting proposals from a new player who can't even play the game because of missing payment options... :old:
Well, i'm waiting for steam version :noid
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Warbirds is still in business and when I left 6 months ago the RPS was still in use. I was one of the many that didn't really like it. Early war planes are slow and that just adds to the time between action. Smaller maps for early war might help that, possiblg grow the available bases outward as the plane sets change. Regardless, AH has an arena for two sided wars and the possibility for rolling plane sets. Doesn't sound to be very popular. FSOs are also available. and custom arenas.
I would like to see more variety in my opponents but trying to force people to fly the matchup you want doesn't really work.
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Warbirds is still in business and when I left 6 months ago the RPS was still in use. I was one of the many that didn't really like it. Early war planes are slow and that just adds to the time between action. Smaller maps for early war might help that, possiblg grow the available bases outward as the plane sets change. Regardless, AH has an arena for two sided wars and the possibility for rolling plane sets. Doesn't sound to be very popular. FSOs are also available. and custom arenas.
It was never a problem when we had numbers.
I would like to see more variety in my opponents but trying to force people to fly the matchup you want doesn't really work.
One idea is to let players fly EW rides for free after their two-week trial ends.
Another may be airstarts for EW rides in certain places to encourage their use.
EW ride fights are among the most fun. The trouble is you can't fight a Zeke in your F4F without getting picked by a Mustang or a Dora.
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EW ride fights are among the most fun.
Agreed. They require you to actually get on someone's tail and stay there, rather than obliterating him (or her!) with a barrage of ordnance.
- oldman
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Yea when is the last time you saw someone flying Hurr I ?
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Yea when is the last time you saw someone flying Hurr I ?
Yesterday, me.
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Hmmm nugetx wouldn't be Bluberry would he??? For a newbie he seems to know a lot.
Dang we've been hacked!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :bolt:
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Hmmm nugetx wouldn't be Bluberry would he??? For a newbie he seems to know a lot.
Dang we've been hacked!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :bolt:
Once you play flight sims past 20 years, you know them all :D
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Rolling plane set will drive away players if they don't have access to the planes they want to fly. It didn't work for WB and one of the main reasons why I left that game. It sucked having to wait 2 week to fly the P-38F and then an additional week if I wanted to fly the J model and had to wait until almost the end of the campaign to fly the L model. At the time of the introduction of the rolling plane set in WB, it started the exodus from that game. Even HiTech (the creator of WB) has posted that the RPS in WB was a bad idea and why it hasn't been introduced into Aces High.
People cry that they can't fly their plane of choice when ENY kicks in, imagine the cries if they can't fly their plane of choice for days or even weeks due to a RPS system.
This isn't a WW2 flight sim, the core game in no way tries to simulate or replicate WW2. The core game just aims to simulate in a game environment a combat simulator using WW2 vehicles, not the war itself.
Sorry but it seems to being going that way :aok
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Sorry but it seems to being going that way :aok
There has been no indication that the game is going to a RPS system. In fact, HiTech has stated previously that the game will not go the RPS route.
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I would definitely scale back if RPS was introduced. I get my kicks in FSO, RPS has no place in the "main" arena.
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Nugex you know what would really make it more fun is if you get a subscription.
Semp
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Sorry but it seems to being going that way :aok
Interesting!
but now the more I think more about I think the RPS with the point system would be even better! So people would not have to wait a week for 'their' plane, they could unlock 'higher tier' plane with points, and to make it even better, have all planes unlockable, so you can remain points for the plane you want! But I cannot edit my main post to change it.
I think this would be the best middle ground in those that want RPS and those that do not want RPS.
Nugex you know what would really make it more fun is if you get a subscription.
i'm waiting for steam!
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Interesting!
but now the more I think more about I think the RPS with the point system would be even better! So people would not have to wait a week for 'their' plane, they could unlock 'higher tier' plane with points, and to make it even better, have all planes unlockable, so you can remain points for the plane you want! But I cannot edit my main post to change it.
I think this would be the best middle ground in those that want RPS and those that do not want RPS.
i'm waiting for steam!
Some people grumble quite loudly if they can't fly their plane of choice for even one sortie. If you want people to fly other planes, you need to make an incentive for doing so. Flying them only to grind out the perks to get what they really want isn't the best way. Perhaps adding in a score multiplier based on ENY for kills and damage. That way they would get more perks and additional score points for using lower tiered rides.
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Some people grumble quite loudly if they can't fly their plane of choice for even one sortie.
I thought flight simmers are the patient ones :P
Perhaps adding in a score multiplier based on ENY for kills and damage. That way they would get more perks and additional score points for using lower tiered rides.
Sure, things can be dony in many ways..... in the end it's HTC who makes the call :P
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I thought flight simmers are the patient ones :P
Not this bunch. And AH is more game than sim.
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so it's only natural people came here.
Always an assumption that is not true. Very few people migrate to a different competing game.I learned this lesson when creating WBs. Only a few people moved from AW until it ended. The few times people did move was when an entire squad decided to move.
What counts is which game is drawing in more new players.And that was the big fault that started bringing WBs down. They put Hot Seat in charge of game play changes. A long time player who catered to the whims of the hard core long time player like some of the players here.
HiTech
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S! Hitech, i'm humbled that you took time to respond to my post.
I'm looking forward to the future of AH on steam, and the possible game play changes. :salute
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S! Hitech, i'm humbled that you took time to respond to my post.
I'm looking forward to the future of AH on steam, and the possible game play changes. :salute
This seems to be a troll
:rock
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RPS?? what does that mean
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Rolling Plane Set - and that really killed WB numbers, I did like it, but I was one of the few.
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Rolling Plane Set - and that really killed WB numbers, I did like it, but I was one of the few.
Why people say that RPS killed WB ? :headscratch:
I don't realy have a favourite plane, so i always fly whats available. Is it because people want to fly so badly with their 'favourite plane' ?
Are you not good in the plane of the current year? Well, git gud! This is war soldier, in war there are no 'favourite planes' !
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Why people say that RPS killed WB ? :headscratch:
Because in the time I spent in Warbirds it hadn't begun its real death spiral yet, but talking to anybody who was there for the first RPS years ago, it was wildly unpopular.
Shortly after I left, they implemented one again and the numbers took a steeper dive, likely for a multitude of reasons but it don't believe it did it any favors.
I don't realy have a favourite plane, so i always fly whats available. Is it because people want to fly so badly with their 'favourite plane' ?
Good for you. Many people don't think that way.
Are you not good in the plane of the current year? Well, git gud! This is war soldier, in war there are no 'favourite planes' !
:rofl Whatever you reckon.
Wiley.
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Rolling Plane Set - and that really killed WB numbers, I did like it, but I was one of the few.
Didn't kill numbers.
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Because in the time I spent in Warbirds it hadn't begun its real death spiral yet, but talking to anybody who was there for the first RPS years ago, it was wildly unpopular.
Shortly after I left, they implemented one again and the numbers took a steeper dive, likely for a multitude of reasons but it don't believe it did it any favors.
Good for you. Many people don't think that way.
:rofl Whatever you reckon.
Wiley.
Untrue. RPS did not affect numbers at all. Other changes did after the population shifted from AvA to the Main.
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Didn't kill numbers.
Says the person that only flies the Pony.
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Says the person that only flies the Pony.
Who cares what I fly?
I've flown lots of planes in the past. Boring. I can fly a Dora and be 25:0. Woopie do.
Mastering the Mustang is one of the toughest challenges in this game. It's faster than most and has great range and visibility. Otherwise it's fairly mediocre.
Doubt me? Let's hit the Dueling Arena together. You may end up wondering what hit you.
That said, I love an RPS. You can fly EW planes and not be afraid of a LW pick. It's a blast. The BoB planeset in WBs was the most fun ever. Spit I vs 109E. The best. PH planeset? Zeke vs Wildcat? Amazing.
Wish we had that kind of thing again, but we won't. So we have a lot of useless FMs. It is what it is. But the RPS was awesome and I hope it becomes viable again someday. A man can dream....
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Spit I vs 109E. The best.
Yep, Spit 1 vs 109 E over english channel is what dreams are made of.
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Yep, Spit 1 vs 109 E over english channel is what dreams are made of.
Is it???
Maybe you need to check this out...
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,387248.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,387248.0.html)
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My perspective from a long time, very involved Warbirds veteran (Head Trainer, creator of hundreds of scripted events, and in my last iteration flight modeler extraordinaire and deeply involved in the code itself) who is on his second round of Aces High.
When I started in Warbirds in the last century, it was $2 an hour to play and it was pure aerial action. Fields were captured by landing on the runway in anything. The "squadron" I joined was actually 5 squadrons with over 200 members.
Radar was all seeing above 200 feet.
An anecdote serves to illustrate the difference between those days and now. One fine evening in Warbirds late in the last century we were capping a field in our P-38's and one of established groups was rolling in opposition. Our groups had a intense yet friendly rivalry in the game. I personally killed 17 of them on that sortie as they desperately tried to mount a defense. It was a glorious time for all, the vulched and the vulchers.
And then the Main Arena was changed to Axis versus Allies. It shattered the established groups into little pieces and folks started leaving.
And then AI was introduced and wing men for bombers. Ground vehicles started appearing. Numbers were down but not drastically. Aerial action was harder to find with players retreating to ackwagons instead of rolling a fighter at a capped field. The community was permanently split and rancor developed. Ego's were bruised by simply dying in the game.
This rumbled along for a few years until Warbirds let a fellow named Crump mess with the FM's. The result was painful enough for our group at the time, 475FG, to leave our home of many years. We came to AH and found a new home but after 2 years in AH, we noticed that after about 10 PM central time it was difficult to find an aerial fight. Range channel sounded like Saturday night in the Tennessee hills with all the GV drivers. Guys slowly drifted off bored and I hung on, migrating to the Furball Lake and the no icon, airplane only AvA for my aerial fights but I, too, left when HTC shut down the no icon AvA for reasons unknown. I played Silent Hunter occasionally and flew real airplanes a lot.
I was out of WWII flight sims for several years when an old friend from Warbirds convinced me to come back and work on FM's. I built some fabulously fun FM's with torque and realistic stall characteristics, digging into the code and fixing some very old math hacks that caused a lot of the FM silliness in the Warbirds FM. There was loads of push back from folks whose ego's could not take FM's that rewarded smooth flying and respected the limits imposed by real world physics. The push back led to my eventual ouster and the 475FG was once again back in AH just in time for AHIII.
I was super excited to be back in a much more developed game. My excitement has dampened quite a bit in the intervening 8 months as I have realized AH is plagued with the much of the same core problems that has resulted in WB's having a single digit population in its arena most of the day.
Game play is more hide and seek than combat. Instead of Axis versus Allies as the root cause of the division, HTC has extremely long side switch times building that wall. Players retreat to GV's instead of airplanes, players remain in the safety net of short range radar for them only and the AAA. FSO is now only orbit in your radar ring over the known target when on defense until the offense arrives at T+45 (give or take 5 minutes). Graphics are below average. FM's are built to cater to the lowest element (probably necessary considering the market demographic AH is in, folks who can scrape together $15 for the subscription but not the $1000 for the gaming rig) and are generally silly.
There are a lot of things I really like about AH and I will probably remain as there is no other option for the persistent arena model I grew up with but it is slowly committing suicide by boredom. My time in the Melee arena (now only once a week) is mostly a struggle to find a good fight with my group.
I don't expect agreement with my assessment but it is my personal viewpoint. I go online to engage in simulated aerial combat against human opponents in the most realistic flight models I can find. As Skuzzy has said, I am upset when I can't find enough folks who want to play my way. I am part of the problem. I guess I should embrace manning a AAA gun or spawning a cockroach-like ackwagon.