Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 06, 2018, 11:48:41 AM
Phone AP game commercials for those of us who rather watch an ad for fake money than pay real money for fake money to afford that stupid in game skin or upgrade.
YouTube ads that play prior if the video. Iv seen this work well when I YouTube firearm channels. YouTube would target me and play firearm accessory ads prior if the video.
Sponsoring a YouTuber! This is huge! You can look up so many weapon tech videos/military tech vids and much much more. Its seems as if this is very popular now because I'm young dumb and watch YouTube to learn all sorts of interesting stuff. Many of these channels get support via sponsoring and recieve hundreds of thousands of views. Iv seen this with the YouTube channel simple history where they talk about interesting war events and then they do a shout out with promo code to the sponsor.
Oh yeah we love promo codes, gives us incentive. 1 month free promo code?
Post by: DmonSlyr on October 06, 2018, 01:06:28 PM
I feel like we are missing a huge market of ads that would really reach kids today. Kids nowadays dont watch TV when they have limitless electronic entertainment on there fingertips.
Phone AP game commercials for those of us who rather watch an ad for fake money than pay real money for fake money to afford that stupid in game skin or upgrade.
YouTube ads that play prior if the video. Iv seen this work well when I YouTube firearm channels. YouTube would target me and play firearm accessory ads prior if the video.
Sponsoring a YouTuber! This is huge! You can look up so many weapon tech videos/military tech vids and much much more. Its seems as if this is very popular now because I'm young dumb and watch YouTube to learn all sorts of interesting stuff. Many of these channels get support via sponsoring and recieve hundreds of thousands of views. Iv seen this with the YouTube channel simple history where they talk about interesting war events and then they do a shout out with promo code to the sponsor.
Oh yeah we love promo codes, gives us incentive. 1 month free promo code?
Promos do work. I think a month would be much better than 2 weeks in terms of getting people to stick around. It will also increase overall #s in the MA if they had a month instead of 2 weeks. Some people like me only get to play on the weekends. 2 weeks for weekend play ain't enough.
I saw a commercial last night on cartoon network for another Call of Duty game. I was thinking man, I wish that was AH.
The hardest part about getting youngsters to play is the subscription. Is not like the parents can by the CD for Christmas or something. Then on top of that, pateince to learn the game, getting their friends to play the game with them, graphics compared to other games. And just lack of market reach. I'm sure most kids haven't even heard of AH.
I think YouTube commercials might be a good idea. I'd really like to see a high quality combat commerical of AH. Anything to spread the word. Sometimes I think Market reach is simply why there arent as many players as their should be playing this game.
Post by: DLXIRON on October 06, 2018, 02:27:01 PM
They are easily ten years behind the times! I agree with you 100% on your post but it is pretty obvious by how long the number have been so low that they believe a tweak in the radar is going to turn everything around. Also to think they have the vision or resources to execute some sort of multi layer social media campaign is a bit foolish imo.
Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 06, 2018, 03:46:32 PM
No offense but did you do any type of research of Hitech Creations social media presences before posting?
They are easily ten years behind the times! I agree with you 100% on your post but it is pretty obvious by how long the number have been so low that they believe a tweak in the radar is going to turn everything around. Also to think they have the vision or resources to execute some sort of multi layer social media campaign is a bit foolish imo.
None taken but as far as resources I'm sure it's much much easier to run these sort of ads verses a TV commercial. Hell to sponsor a channel you just have to contact the host and arrange a deal for they are individuals not companies...
Post by: The Fugitive on October 06, 2018, 04:50:29 PM
If we could get a few more players to post, as well as maybe add other things.... news, pictures, screen shots, films, basically info of what is going on in the game I think it could generate interest in other players. This is something I always thought HTC should do with the social media outlets they have. A constant barrage of info from and about the game that can be shared across boards would bring in more players.
Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 06, 2018, 05:11:28 PM
I opened up "Aces High Radio" (https://www.facebook.com/FlightCityRadio/) on facebook last year and posted bits and pieces of "news" going on live time in the game. No details on missions or such, just pointing out good landing or base captures after they had been captured, or pointed out a good defense. Just a bit of a rolling ..... well monologue as I never had anyone "join in" tho a few people commented in game as I posted. I only did for a few weeks but got up to over 50 people to join.
If we could get a few more players to post, as well as maybe add other things.... news, pictures, screen shots, films, basically info of what is going on in the game I think it could generate interest in other players. This is something I always thought HTC should do with the social media outlets they have. A constant barrage of info from and about the game that can be shared across boards would bring in more players.
I agree 200%. Having good connection with social media is huge for generating clientele nowadays. I'm surprised HTC doesn't utilize Instagram and snapchat and pick a few of the latest clips and photos from films and screenshots to share with the world. It's free and effective and I speak for myself when I say this is another way I investigate a new game before purchase.
I wanted to share this video as an example of advertising. This guy has over 1 mil subscribers. Almost 500k views and look how they shout out there sponsor wix before they show the video. There are thousands of channel host like this to choose from to sponsor relating to history, aviation, weaponology and more...
https://youtu.be/fEd5uX0Lw9Y
Post by: AAIK on October 06, 2018, 06:50:48 PM
I agree 200%. Having good connection with social media is huge for generating clientele nowadays. I'm surprised HTC doesn't utilize Instagram and snapchat and pick a few of the latest clips and photos from films and screenshots to share with the world. It's free and effective and I speak for myself when I say this is another way I investigate a new game before purchase.
I wanted to share this video as an example of advertising. This guy has over 1 mil subscribers. Almost 500k views and look how they shout out there sponsor wix before they show the video. There are thousands of channel host like this to choose from to sponsor relating to history, aviation, weaponology and more...
https://youtu.be/fEd5uX0Lw9Y
He doesnt need to go with the big subscription bases either, he can pick alot of smaller, cheaper platforms as well who will be more than willing to get a few dollars in their pocket: Its probably the best place to start.
Post by: RODBUSTR on October 06, 2018, 09:32:08 PM
Post by: RODBUSTR on October 06, 2018, 09:33:11 PM
Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 06, 2018, 11:00:47 PM
I used to show it to kids and their folks, but do to the adult content of the chat and cyber bullying. the folks decided that that was not the type of arena they want their kids exposed to.
I used to mow lawns to pay for this game. But I feel like this game should be marketed to men of the early 20s and up. That's when we can start affording super computers and monthly subscriptions. I also feel this is when we start to turn to ap games and YouTube for other means of entertainment.
Post by: Ack-Ack on October 07, 2018, 01:22:55 AM
I used to show it to kids and their folks, but do to the adult content of the chat and cyber bullying. the folks decided that that was not the type of arena they want their kids exposed to.
Sounds like one of those folk's kids got one of your "cyber bully" PMs after the shot you down.
Post by: Shuffler on October 07, 2018, 06:23:22 AM
I used to mow lawns to pay for this game. But I feel like this game should be marketed to men of the early 20s and up. That's when we can start affording super computers and monthly subscriptions. I also feel this is when we start to turn to ap games and YouTube for other means of entertainment.
What do you do that requires a super computer?
Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 07, 2018, 08:39:02 AM
What do you do that requires a super computer?
Nothing.. the point i was getting at was that typically when one of us buys a nice computer for the first time we explore more games to try out to run at the highest possible fps and quality. That age curve where we can buy a nice computer allows us to run aces high at a full potential as well.
Post by: SPKmes on October 07, 2018, 12:21:32 PM
I used to show it to kids and their folks, but do to the adult content of the chat and cyber bullying. the folks decided that that was not the type of arena they want their kids exposed to.
but I bet a good percentage of them play Fortnite... together hahaha...
Post by: bustr on October 07, 2018, 12:51:31 PM
Where do you advertise an XXX adult porn fantasy game for 18 year old males? At the super market and as an advertisement on QVC or, as click bait at Anime streaming sites and Youtube feeds? I've run into a few of the click bait cross linked when I hop to amazon to look for things from reading game reviews and level\terrain building sites. Violence(shootemup) and sex still works on young males.
Since AH is full of ugly old men, it's gonna have to be shootemup.... :eek:
Post by: lunaticfringe on October 07, 2018, 01:00:58 PM
I used to mow lawns to pay for this game. But I feel like this game should be marketed to men of the early 20s and up. That's when we can start affording super computers and monthly subscriptions. I also feel this is when we start to turn to ap games and YouTube for other means of entertainment.
my computer is a 2008 HP-a stock basic internals from AArons rent to own-all I had to do was replace the video card and power supply- I get 60FPS with all the eye candy turned down-which in my opinion is better than full eye candy-which I can play full eye candy for 30-45 minutes before my video card heats up.
you don't need a 2 or 3 thousand dollar computer to play this game, just a good video card and power supply. bye the way my card is a used Evga GeForce GTX670
Post by: The Fugitive on October 07, 2018, 01:36:05 PM
my computer is a 2008 HP-a stock basic internals from AArons rent to own-all I had to do was replace the video card and power supply- I get 60FPS with all the eye candy turned down-which in my opinion is better than full eye candy-which I can play full eye candy for 30-45 minutes before my video card heats up.
you don't need a 2 or 3 thousand dollar computer to play this game, just a good video card and power supply. bye the way my card is a used Evga GeForce GTX670
Jeezzzz
The point he is trying to make is these 20 somethings are coming into money, been working for a while and finally buy there first "good" computer. Not the one mom bought them, not the one they built, beg, borrowing, and :eek: stealing parts for. They finally have the cash to BUY a good one and they do so.
THESE are the people the game should be marketed to. Why? because there are a lot of them! It has nothing to do with NEEDING a super computer.
Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 07, 2018, 03:08:37 PM
JeezzzzThank you. It is the golden age where we chase games on a system better than any other gaming platform because of the simple fact that on PC we can play games like aces high where we dont get anything like that on a ps2 or xbox however you also have the most competition on PC because of the vast options. But the nice thing on the PC is that we have options to attach pedals or a stick. Add goggles or two more monitors. This is something that I feel we dont market enough. The "wow that guy looks like hes IN the game not playin it feel". You can really submerse yourself into the gameplay instead of click click click...
The point he is trying to make is these 20 somethings are coming into money, been working for a while and finally buy there first "good" computer. Not the one mom bought them, not the one they built, beg, borrowing, and :eek: stealing parts for. They finally have the cash to BUY a good one and they do so.
THESE are the people the game should be marketed to. Why? because there are a lot of them! It has nothing to do with NEEDING a super computer.
Post by: zack1234 on October 07, 2018, 03:43:26 PM
Post by: Meatwad on October 07, 2018, 04:56:43 PM
Post by: JOACH1M on October 07, 2018, 09:34:58 PM
I used to show it to kids and their folks, but do to the adult content of the chat and cyber bullying. the folks decided that that was not the type of arena they want their kids exposed to.BS. Play ANY other online game and there will be profain language and violence in all of the chats. Aces high is probably the most mild game Ive ever played in terms of language.
The issue is going to be getting kids to like a slower paced game with subpar graphics. Younger kids want instant action with all the eye candy. Its simple.
Post by: icepac on October 08, 2018, 02:03:59 PM
Post by: Ciaphas on October 08, 2018, 02:14:22 PM
There are a plethora of advertising, live stream, video and niche sites that would benefit Aces High. It's a matter us all getting together, leaving all split hairs behind and utilizing what's already available for us to promote this game.
All community based games rely on the player base for some portion of growth. We've been debating this for a very long time and it's now time to take action and for us to put our "money" where are mouths are.
The wide skill sets that reside in this community is amazing and would serve well to get the community growth that we all want. This is not an overnight venture but one that will tale time and hard work.
It's up to you all, either we sit here and spin wheels or we lock her down in 4-wheel drive and get the machine moving again.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: DLXIRON on October 08, 2018, 03:19:32 PM
All community based games rely on the player base for some portion of growth. We've been debating this for a very long time and it's now time to take action and for us to put our "money" where are mouths are.
I dont know about that! HiTech is a really smart guy and if he is not investing his time and money into promoting this game, why should we? I mean it is his game! I am all for contributing to the success of the game but if the leader is not there, who cares?
Post by: Ciaphas on October 08, 2018, 03:25:28 PM
I dont know about that! HiTech is a really smart guy and if he is not investing his time and money into promoting this game, why should we? I mean it is his game! I am all for contributing to the success of the game but if the leader is not there, who cares?
Word of mouth, live streaming, videos etc... will always be the most powerful tool for a developer of a community based (MMO/MMORPG) style game. Take WoW, you don't achieve the player count simply by purchasing adds. It takes a word of mouth from players to other gamers to grow a fan base. In today's market, you have wonderful tools to help you reach massive groups of gamers by simply creating a video and promoting your channel or getting a few "best of the best" clips circulated around. Simply being smart does not give you success.
Post by: Ack-Ack on October 08, 2018, 03:50:44 PM
Post by: The Fugitive on October 08, 2018, 09:02:38 PM
All the marketing and promotions are nothing but wasted effort and money if the things that keep potential new players past the two week trial aren't addressed.
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a WINNER!!!!!!
Post by: Spikes on October 08, 2018, 09:12:41 PM
I agree 200%. Having good connection with social media is huge for generating clientele nowadays. I'm surprised HTC doesn't utilize Instagram and snapchat and pick a few of the latest clips and photos from films and screenshots to share with the world. It's free and effective and I speak for myself when I say this is another way I investigate a new game before purchase.
I wanted to share this video as an example of advertising. This guy has over 1 mil subscribers. Almost 500k views and look how they shout out there sponsor wix before they show the video. There are thousands of channel host like this to choose from to sponsor relating to history, aviation, weaponology and more...
https://youtu.be/fEd5uX0Lw9Y
They tried Instagram and Twitter a few years ago with what I think was an intern or something. Regardless, it didn't last long but I agree and have been saying the same for years. It is free and has the potential to reach millions. It wouldn't be a bad idea to get one of these big streamers to sponsor it one day. Though I have no idea what sort of cost is associated with that, it would have some exposure to twitch viewers, many of whom are in the age bracket you are speaking about.
I wanted to get the AH subreddit going, but it would take some effort to get it jumpstarted. Every game has a semi-active subreddit, and reddit is one of the largest sites in the world.
Post by: 1stpar3 on October 09, 2018, 12:20:35 AM
You all have been hitting the nail on the head.AMEN and pass the PLATE! I have zero skills as for Editing and Producing films...BUT I HAVE NO PROBLEM helping to fund those that CAN/WILL do these things. Need a better Editing program? What ever it is, i can ABSOLUTELY help out with costs! Its an investment into my in Game Fun! Plus, this way helps every one of us...beats picking individuals I like being around IN GAME and contributing to their needs/want to try some things!
There are a plethora of advertising, live stream, video and niche sites that would benefit Aces High. It's a matter us all getting together, leaving all split hairs behind and utilizing what's already available for us to promote this game.
All community based games rely on the player base for some portion of growth. We've been debating this for a very long time and it's now time to take action and for us to put our "money" where are mouths are.
The wide skill sets that reside in this community is amazing and would serve well to get the community growth that we all want. This is not an overnight venture but one that will tale time and hard work.
It's up to you all, either we sit here and spin wheels or we lock her down in 4-wheel drive and get the machine moving again.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Brooke on October 09, 2018, 12:44:55 AM
It's about conversion, not reaching people.
In the last 100 days aprox 40,000 people have installed Aces High, 20,000 new people have created accounts and entered an arena. Of the people entering the arena 65% are gone and do never reenter by the 10 minute mark of being in the arena. 75% are gone after 30 Minutes.
Post by: cattb on October 09, 2018, 12:51:19 AM
Post by: 1stpar3 on October 09, 2018, 12:56:15 AM
Remember, folks, the issue does not seem to be getting new players to try the game but getting new players who try the game to stay in the game.TRUE...but since HT seems to be so set in his ways(well that may no be fair to HT, but there are a LOT of game mechanic ideas floated here, with only hearing he would never change his mind,from folk who have been here longer)...the only thing we as a community have available, is to get a lot more exposure that this game exists. The more who try it out, the more folk we may find that stick it out? Its worth the effort even if its only a 1 out of 100 success rate, IMHO :uhoh
It's about conversion, not reaching people.
Post by: Ciaphas on October 09, 2018, 01:05:22 AM
TRUE...but since HT seems to be so set in his ways(well that may no be fair to HT, but there are a LOT of game mechanic ideas floated here, with only hearing he would never change his mind,from folk who have been here longer)...the only thing we as a community have available, is to get a lot more exposure that this game exists. The more who try it out, the more folk we may find that stick it out? Its worth the effort even if its only a 1 out of 100 success rate, IMHO :uhoh
agreed
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: 1stpar3 on October 09, 2018, 01:32:44 AM
Post by: Brooke on October 09, 2018, 02:32:47 AM
Conversion is the meat, folks.
Advertising -- as it turns out -- is the parsley.
Think of it this way.
You have a race car. You want it to go faster. It is fouling plugs like crazy, causing misfires and loss of horsepower.
Probably not an effective choice to focus on the paint job. :aok
Post by: ccvi on October 09, 2018, 03:02:48 AM
Should it turn into just a normal game that random people like, a kind of game of which many others exist? Or is it providing something that is unique and not available elsewhere?
Post by: Ack-Ack on October 09, 2018, 03:29:35 AM
Why is it, that HT frowns upon the "2 country" idea? I know he has his reasons but for the life of me, I cant see a negative reason for this. Even if only temporary or until we get more players. With numbers as they are...and all the griping about "Cant find a fight" what is there to lose? Personally, I believe a test on this would be WAY MORE embraced by players, than the Radar and GV dar tests. Wonder how may bottles of Scotch it would take to convince him to try the "2 country" approach? Its his Baby and this game has meant so much to me that I cant really begrudge his opinions about things. I am just thankful for HIS GAME! :rock
It has been shown in other games like Air Warrior that a 2 country system doesn't work out well. AW also showed with its small arenas that a 3 sided system can work well with small numbers.
Post by: The Fugitive on October 09, 2018, 09:35:20 AM
Why is it, that HT frowns upon the "2 country" idea? I know he has his reasons but for the life of me, I cant see a negative reason for this. Even if only temporary or until we get more players. With numbers as they are...and all the griping about "Cant find a fight" what is there to lose? Personally, I believe a test on this would be WAY MORE embraced by players, than the Radar and GV dar tests. Wonder how may bottles of Scotch it would take to convince him to try the "2 country" approach? Its his Baby and this game has meant so much to me that I cant really begrudge his opinions about things. I am just thankful for HIS GAME! :rock
with a 2 sided war you would need a much stiffer side balancing set up. You would have to force players to one side or the other as they logged in, and then as the imbalance got worst due to players logging off one side more than the other an ENY system would have to clamp down harder to force the balance back.
in a 3 sided war you can always move to another from to avoid or find a fight. There is nothing wrong with the 3 sided war, the problem lies with the players. They either gang a side relentlessly or avoid fighting as much as they can. smaller maps could help while the numbers are down. the small island map seems to work well for most players.
Post by: 8thJinx on October 09, 2018, 01:21:48 PM
Post by: CptTrips on October 09, 2018, 01:25:28 PM
It's flat out tough to compete in a market where paying folks will literally fork over $200 million a month to Tim Sweeney's Fortnite, just for costumes that their characters can wear.
LoL.
It's also hard to compete when you can buy a game like Battlefield once for $60 and play on their servers for free for 4-5 years. You don't even have to buy the DLC. Maps are eventually release to everyone after a time.
I don't know how they make a profit like that, and don't think HTC could do the same, yet that is what game companies are competing against for the "average" players time and dollars.
:salute
Post by: 1stpar3 on October 09, 2018, 11:48:45 PM
with a 2 sided war you would need a much stiffer side balancing set up. You would have to force players to one side or the other as they logged in, and then as the imbalance got worst due to players logging off one side more than the other an ENY system would have to clamp down harder to force the balance back.I guess I could/should have thought about that. I was coming straight from the game after hearing forhours ENY SUCKS :uhoh So, you think with ENY folk would still gang up? I always figured it would be harder to get THREE COUNTRY allegiances broken down...couldnt use Bishop,Rook, or Knight...without getting rid of one LORD HELP if that happened :x Just curious.
in a 3 sided war you can always move to another from to avoid or find a fight. There is nothing wrong with the 3 sided war, the problem lies with the players. They either gang a side relentlessly or avoid fighting as much as they can. smaller maps could help while the numbers are down. the small island map seems to work well for most players.
Post by: Skyguns MKII on October 10, 2018, 07:03:33 AM
What if we had 1 month free as well so players can have enough time over the learning curve and allow just just enough time for them to get hooked. What if past the 1 month free trial we allowed players to only operate field gun and supply vehicles until they pay for more?
Post by: Shuffler on October 10, 2018, 01:33:03 PM
It takes longer than 2 weeks to learn the game. The 2 weeks should be stretched and what about a deal for couple months with a limited plane set. Just like fishing need to set the hook.
YES!!! Golf should be free until we are all shooting scratch.
Post by: RODBUSTR on October 10, 2018, 02:02:44 PM
Post by: Ack-Ack on October 10, 2018, 03:07:19 PM
AkAk All I have ever done to You was ask You questions... I don't cuss or call folks bad names.. And One reply You gave Me was a loose physical threat. A classic case of transference.
Don't lie. All of your PMS to me in game have been to call me a cheater or some other insult. My replies to you have always been "why are you sending me a PM?" and then I squelch you.
Maybe cut back in the booze.
Post by: 800nate800 on October 12, 2018, 08:05:06 PM
Post by: Connery on October 12, 2018, 08:14:01 PM
It's far easier for the player base to affect conversion (which is the important issue) than it is for the player base to affect advertising (which is not the important issue anyway).
Conversion is the meat, folks.
Advertising -- as it turns out -- is the parsley.
Think of it this way.
You have a race car. You want it to go faster. It is fouling plugs like crazy, causing misfires and loss of horsepower.
Probably not an effective choice to focus on the paint job. :aok
don't fully agree I get what you guys are saying about people to stay, but it's not all about conversion rate.
Lets say you have 1% Conversion rate but you're reaching 100 people. Thats obviously 1 person staying around, but if you reach 1000 people it's 10 people.
So imo it's a balance between both. First and foremost you gotta reach people, once you get them in, you need to address the reason why they don't stick around.
Post by: CptTrips on October 12, 2018, 09:12:29 PM
don't fully agree I get what you guys are saying about people to stay, but it's not all about conversion rate.
Lets say you have 1% Conversion rate but you're reaching 100 people. Thats obviously 1 person staying around, but if you reach 1000 people it's 10 people.
So imo it's a balance between both. First and foremost you gotta reach people, once you get them in, you need to address the reason why they don't stick around.
But what about cost? Sure, without cost, advertise to million! Get 0.05% conversion and and laugh your way to the bank. :D
At some level of advertising cost, it becomes prohibitively expensive to acquire players that way.
You can find cheaper advertising mediums (which often [not always] suck that's why their are cheap), or increase your conversion rate so your cost per convert is reduced.
The higher the player acquisition cost, the longer they have to keep an account before HTC breaks even on the cost it took to acquire them. If they quit before their subscription has paid back the acquisition cost, HTC gets stuck with a net loss.
If you don't have good conversion rate, you could advertise yourself into bankruptcy.
:salute
Post by: CptTrips on October 13, 2018, 09:13:44 AM
I meant to say:
If you don't have good conversion and retention rate, you could advertise yourself into bankruptcy.
:salute
Post by: Ciaphas on October 13, 2018, 09:18:25 AM
opps edit flub.
I meant to say:
If you don't have good conversion and retention rate, you could advertise yourself into bankruptcy.
:salute
very true, back in the day this game advertised itself.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Connery on October 20, 2018, 09:05:57 PM
opps edit flub.
I meant to say:
If you don't have good conversion and retention rate, you could advertise yourself into bankruptcy.
:salute
Or watch subs falling and bleed out slowly ending in bankruptcy anyway.
Doesn't seem theres any easy fix.
Post by: TequilaChaser on October 20, 2018, 10:24:40 PM
Since AH is full of ugly old men, it's gonna have to be shootemup.... :eek:
ROFLMAO
TC
Post by: CptTrips on October 20, 2018, 10:53:20 PM
Doesn't seem theres any easy fix.
Nope. If it were easy, we'd all own a MMOG. :D
Post by: TequilaChaser on October 20, 2018, 11:08:22 PM
I think "communication" is a real problem across multiple generations and the further we age away from the history of WWII and how it all played out....
This game, itself, is approaching 20 years of existence fast..... How many other games can lay claim to this?
TC
Post by: Vinkman on October 24, 2018, 09:20:45 AM
I used to show it to kids and their folks, but do to the adult content of the chat and cyber bullying. the folks decided that that was not the type of arena they want their kids exposed to.
lol :rofl
De-tuning 200 would have avoided that issue for both the demo and their game play. But of course then you wouldn't have been able to take that pot shot at the community.
Post by: Vinkman on October 24, 2018, 09:30:27 AM
The game is basically the same game it has always been:
-Giant multi-player 3-way battle of air sea and land vehicles.
-objectives and action is determined only by the desires of the players in the arena.
But people come and go due to a variety of reasons...
1) health reasons
2) financial reasons
3) life priority reasons
The reason they are not quickly back filled with new players is a matter of conjecture. Coming from a house of gamers I feel the biggest factors are:
1) it takes a good gaming rig to play. by contrast a PS4 or XBOX is $400.
2) the competition for MMOs is much larger than it was when AH started and is growing everyday.
3) The game really required peripheries [stick, pedals, throttle, TrackIr or Oculus] to enjoy fully. this adds extra hundreds of dollars to the investment to play.
4) The game is very difficult. To not get slaughtered on must learn the game, plane controls, flight, the view system, gunnery, and ACM. This takes hundreds of hours and will only be attempted by die hard fans of the genre who come in with desire to master WWII air combat.
5) Fans of the genre are a shrinking demographic. Fighter pilot news reports ended 40 years ago. kids want to be a virtual LeBron James now, not a virtual Chuck Yeager. When was the last time you heard a "squeaker" in the arena? It's pretty rare. No it isn't because of 200 channel rants. it's because they have different idols now and the computer world allows everyone to put on the their virtual persona. This new generation doesn't know what a fighter pilot is.
So if you want the arena full you have to make the following changes (in my opinion):
1) Make a version for XBOX users that allows then to use an XBOX controller.
2) Allow cross platform play in the arena so XBOX players can play with PC players.
3) add an off-line story to play through that acts a training class so new players can learn the game, controls, and the skill set to play in the arena.
:salute
Post by: Puma44 on October 24, 2018, 10:10:30 AM
Post by: Spikes on October 24, 2018, 10:13:43 AM
Aces High attracts people who have an interest in WWII.
Other games generate possible interest in WWII based on the game itself.
Post by: Shuffler on October 24, 2018, 01:01:12 PM
Self motivation and determination goes a long way. :salute
This!
Post by: turt21 on October 24, 2018, 04:38:09 PM
I opened up "Aces High Radio" (https://www.facebook.com/FlightCityRadio/) on facebook last year and posted bits and pieces of "news" going on live time in the game.
Aces High Radio is hiding on FB. Is it still there somewhere?
Post by: 1ijac on October 24, 2018, 05:12:10 PM
a commercial lured me in at 5 years old....
Saw an Aces High commercial on AHC (American Heroes Channel) last week. An M-18 crew are talking to one another and they main gun a plane trying to kill them. :D
One-eye
Post by: 800nate800 on October 29, 2018, 02:26:20 PM
Saw an Aces High commercial on AHC (American Heroes Channel) last week. An M-18 crew are talking to one another and they main gun a plane trying to kill them. :Dthe one will the jug attacking the bridge got my number! we need in game action in the commercial!
One-eye
Post by: danny76 on October 29, 2018, 04:37:21 PM
Post by: Groth on October 29, 2018, 06:12:24 PM
How can we make this the 'goto' game for WW2?
What can we do so it is recognized as the 'Most Authentic WW2 Flight Sim', which I think it is!!???
Do we need videos, reviews, youtubestuff???
I was in an on line review a decade ago, when I shot down a newbs B 17 and he asked me questions...
turned out was from some on line 'magazine'
Where are these 'reporters' now??
JGroth
Post by: Ciaphas on October 29, 2018, 06:19:25 PM
There are a few of us who live stream just about every game session and the list of people seems to be growing.
With this game being in such a niche market, there is no one answer to the question of player growth and retention.
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Post by: Spikes on October 29, 2018, 06:27:43 PM
I am not very skilled with video editing, though, practice makes perfect. If someone where inclined, I could record my flights and pass them off for highlight reels and promo stuff.What's your twitch link? I'll drop a follow. I've toyed with streaming FSO on Fridays, but it requires a lot on my end in order to not spoil anything if someone were to "stream snipe" on the enemy side. I would run with a 5 minute delay, but also had to cover up the chat bar (easy to do) and rarely pull up my CBM (difficult to do), and hope nobody on channel says much in terms of pertinent information. Once the action starts all of that stuff goes out the window more or less since the delay is so long, but if someone sees for example, my location on climbout, that is bad news.
There are a few of us who live stream just about every game session and the list of people seems to be growing.
With this game being in such a niche market, there is no one answer to the question of player growth and retention.
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Post by: Ciaphas on October 29, 2018, 06:30:25 PM
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Post by: Wiley on October 30, 2018, 04:34:53 PM
What's your twitch link? I'll drop a follow. I've toyed with streaming FSO on Fridays, but it requires a lot on my end in order to not spoil anything if someone were to "stream snipe" on the enemy side. I would run with a 5 minute delay, but also had to cover up the chat bar (easy to do) and rarely pull up my CBM (difficult to do), and hope nobody on channel says much in terms of pertinent information. Once the action starts all of that stuff goes out the window more or less since the delay is so long, but if someone sees for example, my location on climbout, that is bad news.
I've thought a fair bit about the ramifications of streaming FSO. The answer seemed simple, just delay the stream for a couple hours. But what I saw brought up with that was then you lose interaction with the viewers.
This would essentially double the "work", but is it possible to to record the session, then afterwards stream it so you'd be able to interact with the people watching?
Just a thought.
Wiley.
Post by: Ciaphas on October 30, 2018, 04:45:28 PM
I've thought a fair bit about the ramifications of streaming FSO. The answer seemed simple, just delay the stream for a couple hours. But what I saw brought up with that was then you lose interaction with the viewers.
This would essentially double the "work", but is it possible to to record the session, then afterwards stream it so you'd be able to interact with the people watching?
Just a thought.
Wiley.
Thatvwould be cool. an Aces High sports center haha
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Post by: Spikes on October 30, 2018, 05:44:00 PM
I've thought a fair bit about the ramifications of streaming FSO. The answer seemed simple, just delay the stream for a couple hours. But what I saw brought up with that was then you lose interaction with the viewers.
This would essentially double the "work", but is it possible to to record the session, then afterwards stream it so you'd be able to interact with the people watching?
Just a thought.
Wiley.
It depends on the setup IMO. An 8th AF setup would not be good for streaming because it is a long, drawn out sortie where even the shortest of a CBM showing could spoil it (moreso for the Allies than Axis). I'd say most events can get away with a 5 minute or so delay, maybe 15 at the most. Once combat is joined that 5 minutes might as well be an hour since positions change so much, especially in the heat of battle.
/shrug, I guess I'll try Friday and see what happens.
Post by: Wiley on October 30, 2018, 06:21:10 PM
Wiley.
Post by: Spikes on October 30, 2018, 06:26:38 PM
What is the difference between a 5 minute delay and 2 hours?IMO a couple things:
Wiley.
Ability to field questions and interact if anyone is there
Probably catch more people at 11PM EST than someone would at 1AM EST
Plenty of people put 2-5 minute delays on for competetive stuff to avoid stream snipers and whatnot.
If I'm going to "Stream" it literally after the event is over, why not just post a youtube video instead?
Post by: Wiley on October 30, 2018, 07:19:46 PM
IMO a couple things:
Ability to field questions and interact if anyone is there
Probably catch more people at 11PM EST than someone would at 1AM EST
Plenty of people put 2-5 minute delays on for competetive stuff to avoid stream snipers and whatnot.
If I'm going to "Stream" it literally after the event is over, why not just post a youtube video instead?
To interact with the viewers.
Wiley.
Post by: Spikes on October 30, 2018, 08:29:42 PM
To interact with the viewers.I suppose, and that would be the sure way to make sure nothing fishy happens, but I personally don't feel like staying up until 3AM re-watching the frame just incase someone says something... :D
Wiley.
Plus I don't think you can delay that long, at least with OBS.
Post by: Wiley on October 31, 2018, 09:21:46 AM
I suppose, and that would be the sure way to make sure nothing fishy happens, but I personally don't feel like staying up until 3AM re-watching the frame just incase someone says something... :D
Plus I don't think you can delay that long, at least with OBS.
Ok. Never particularly looked into the details of streaming. It just seemed to me a 5 minute delay would be little different from an indefinite one when you're playing. Your viewers would be reacting to something that happened a while ago while you're doing something else.
It kind of seems to me an FSO wouldn't play spectacularly well to a viewing audience, with all the dead time. Perhaps in terms of generating interest edited youtube videos might be the way to go.
Wiley.
Post by: Winger1 on October 31, 2018, 10:06:16 AM
For me personally, I knew of this game when I was a teenager and wanted to play but I didn't have a credit card to make monthly payments; that was the big barrier for me. I had games like IL2, CFS2 and 3 and WW2 fighters because I could get a physical copy and play it without a subscription.
A player counter on the HTC homepage showing how many are currently in the main arena would let people know when there is a large player count and encourage people to jump on while it's busy. It would be easier to check the website on my phone rather than firing up my PC and logging in just to see how many are playing. When there's a large crowd I'm much more likely to jump on for awhile.
Post by: Shuffler on October 31, 2018, 11:01:58 AM
Post by: The Fugitive on October 31, 2018, 11:40:23 AM
You don't need a card for AH.
You do if you want to play with the majority of other players. This was one of the things that turned a lot of Steam players sour.
Post by: ccvi on October 31, 2018, 01:00:50 PM
Post by: 100Coogn on October 31, 2018, 04:01:38 PM
You do if you want to play with the majority of other players. This was one of the things that turned a lot of Steam players sour.
Is that what it was?
Coogan
Post by: Shuffler on October 31, 2018, 04:11:39 PM
You do if you want to play with the majority of other players. This was one of the things that turned a lot of Steam players sour.Prepay has been available for a long time. If steam does not do it... that is not AH fault. I don't mess with steam personally. I have no use for it.
Post by: The Fugitive on October 31, 2018, 05:36:58 PM
Is that what it was?
Coogan
That was one of a number of things. You can read the complaints/issue players had over at the message boards on Steam.
Post by: Shuffler on November 01, 2018, 04:15:02 AM
That was one of a number of things. You can read the complaints/issue players had over at the message boards on Steam.
Like I said, I do not use steam but I have a mental picture of the type that might. It is based on things I have read like your post about them. Seems a sad community from the outside. This is based on what I hear from people who have been there.
It is why I have absolutely no interest in checking out steam.
Post by: Litjan on November 01, 2018, 06:18:56 AM
They are just people from all walks of life that donīt need a physical copy of their game, and if they have tried Aces High and donīt like it and EVEN wrote why they donīt, than that is invaluable information for anyone worrying about a dwindling population.
Anyone brushing that off as "well, I donīt like them folks, they are just plain weird, is all I am telling ya! We can do without that kind!" is closing their eyes from the reality we are facing these days.
Litjan
Post by: CptTrips on November 01, 2018, 08:35:50 AM
I use Steam (and have for the last 10 years) and I think its absolutely great. Donīt know why anyone would want to write that "community" off - itīs not so much a community as just a few million customers that like the "new" way of buying and owning software usage rights.
They are just people from all walks of life that donīt need a physical copy of their game, and if they have tried Aces High and donīt like it and EVEN wrote why they donīt, than that is invaluable information for anyone worrying about a dwindling population.
Anyone brushing that off as "well, I donīt like them folks, they are just plain weird, is all I am telling ya! We can do without that kind!" is closing their eyes from the reality we are facing these days.
Litjan
+1.
They may be weird, but their money is s till green. :cool:
Post by: Shuffler on November 01, 2018, 11:23:10 AM
I use Steam (and have for the last 10 years) and I think its absolutely great. Donīt know why anyone would want to write that "community" off - itīs not so much a community as just a few million customers that like the "new" way of buying and owning software usage rights.
They are just people from all walks of life that donīt need a physical copy of their game, and if they have tried Aces High and donīt like it and EVEN wrote why they donīt, than that is invaluable information for anyone worrying about a dwindling population.
Anyone brushing that off as "well, I donīt like them folks, they are just plain weird, is all I am telling ya! We can do without that kind!" is closing their eyes from the reality we are facing these days.
Litjan
Read my post again. Just said what I have heard from folks. I have no reason to head steam so I have never been there.
Just like what you are saying they heard from folks. Kind of goes both ways.
Kids not interested in WWII are not really going to want to play AHIII.
Post by: Skyguns MKII on November 03, 2018, 09:42:28 PM
It kind of seems to me an FSO wouldn't play spectacularly well to a viewing audience, with all the dead time. Perhaps in terms of generating interest edited youtube videos might be the way to go.
Wiley.
Having a good host that is fun/funny while the anticipation builds...
Post by: Shuffler on November 04, 2018, 09:15:05 AM
Having a good host that is fun/funny while the anticipation builds...
This makes a big difference in the few that I have seen.
Post by: Spikes on November 04, 2018, 09:42:10 AM
Having a good host that is fun/funny while the anticipation builds...It is tough. I streamed Friday and was working some kinks out. I am not much of an entertainer, and I think it would be somewhat tough especially when we have in-game vox going as well as Discord.
I don't think it is bad in these types of setups where there is quick action. We climbed out for 10-15 mins and saw action pretty much after that.
Post by: Ciaphas on November 04, 2018, 09:54:41 AM
It is tough. I streamed Friday and was working some kinks out. I am not much of an entertainer, and I think it would be somewhat tough especially when we have in-game vox going as well as Discord.
I don't think it is bad in these types of setups where there is quick action. We climbed out for 10-15 mins and saw action pretty much after that.
I would like to schedule a time where three or four of us streamers are online so we can get together and make an entertaining stream.
In streams there seems to be this vail of silence, well, except for cursing losing wings and what not
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Post by: streakeagle on November 04, 2018, 10:52:47 AM
1) Monthly subscription. No one wants to pay $180 per year for any game.
2) Low numbers of people flying.
3) Substandard graphics compared to games made in recent years.
4) Unable to understand or set up the controls.
I don't see how AH can recover from the current trend of dwindling numbers of an ever older community. No reasonable tweak to AH is going to appeal to modern gamers used to free to play and state of the art graphics with no patience for realistic combat such as having to start at a safe distance to takeoff, climb to a cruise/combat altitude, and transit to a target.
While I am a long time fan of Aces High, I have not been a steady subscriber and never played it very much in those years where I did subscribe. The fictional 3-way arena battle has never been very appealing to me in the first place. Despite loving the plane set and the overall game engine, I just don't have that much fun whenever I come online. If am lucky, 1 night in 5 I will have a night where I get into some dogfights that I actually enjoy and maybe even get a few kills despite flying the P-40C.
I would hate to see AH go away, but if it turns off both new and veteran players, it is going to be relegated to the same fate as Warbirds if it doesn't shut down completely.
Post by: 100Coogn on November 04, 2018, 05:06:43 PM
If AH is going to build its numbers back up to the great levels they once were, Steam was the means to do that. But read the reviews/comments on Steam. Quite a few of the reviews are from long time and/or former Aces High players, which is the first bad sign since the goal was to attract new players. At least half of the reviews from the current/former players did not recommend the game to new players. Among the reviews from new players, the main gripes were:
1) Monthly subscription. No one wants to pay $180 per year for any game.
2) Low numbers of people flying.
3) Substandard graphics compared to games made in recent years.
4) Unable to understand or set up the controls.
I don't see how AH can recover from the current trend of dwindling numbers of an ever older community. No reasonable tweak to AH is going to appeal to modern gamers used to free to play and state of the art graphics with no patience for realistic combat such as having to start at a safe distance to takeoff, climb to a cruise/combat altitude, and transit to a target.
While I am a long time fan of Aces High, I have not been a steady subscriber and never played it very much in those years where I did subscribe. The fictional 3-way arena battle has never been very appealing to me in the first place. Despite loving the plane set and the overall game engine, I just don't have that much fun whenever I come online. If am lucky, 1 night in 5 I will have a night where I get into some dogfights that I actually enjoy and maybe even get a few kills despite flying the P-40C.
I would hate to see AH go away, but if it turns off both new and veteran players, it is going to be relegated to the same fate as Warbirds if it doesn't shut down completely.
Well said Sir. :salute
Coogan
Post by: guncrasher on November 04, 2018, 05:26:27 PM
I logged in yesterday at midday played for 12 hours straight. had no problems finding fights, it was awesome. but what do I know, i only play almost everyday now that I am on disability. maybe if I stop playing hitech will add me to the monthly email about how we have less and less players.
semp
Post by: 100Coogn on November 04, 2018, 05:35:01 PM
I love it when people that dont play the game talk about dwindling numbers as if they're in the know how. do you guys know how many people were online on friday? both in fso and ma?
I logged in yesterday at midday played for 12 hours straight. had no problems finding fights, it was awesome. but what do I know, i only play almost everyday now that I am on disability. maybe if I stop playing hitech will add me to the monthly email about how we have less and less players.
semp
Who the hell are you talking about? I've been here for over 10 years and streakeagle has been on & off for the past 18 years.
It's players like us that are "dwindeling"
Do some research, before jumping on that high-horse of yours.
Coogan
Post by: caldera on November 04, 2018, 05:53:47 PM
If AH is going to build its numbers back up to the great levels they once were, Steam was the means to do that. But read the reviews/comments on Steam. Quite a few of the reviews are from long time and/or former Aces High players, which is the first bad sign since the goal was to attract new players. At least half of the reviews from the current/former players did not recommend the game to new players. Among the reviews from new players, the main gripes were:
1) Monthly subscription. No one wants to pay $180 per year for any game.
2) Low numbers of people flying.
3) Substandard graphics compared to games made in recent years.
4) Unable to understand or set up the controls.
I don't see how AH can recover from the current trend of dwindling numbers of an ever older community. No reasonable tweak to AH is going to appeal to modern gamers used to free to play and state of the art graphics with no patience for realistic combat such as having to start at a safe distance to takeoff, climb to a cruise/combat altitude, and transit to a target.
While I am a long time fan of Aces High, I have not been a steady subscriber and never played it very much in those years where I did subscribe. The fictional 3-way arena battle has never been very appealing to me in the first place. Despite loving the plane set and the overall game engine, I just don't have that much fun whenever I come online. If am lucky, 1 night in 5 I will have a night where I get into some dogfights that I actually enjoy and maybe even get a few kills despite flying the P-40C.
I would hate to see AH go away, but if it turns off both new and veteran players, it is going to be relegated to the same fate as Warbirds if it doesn't shut down completely.
Yep. That is a hard selling point for a new player. Freemium games like WT look better and are way cheaper. Even though WT sucks IMO, the entry fee is far more enticing for a novice.
Post by: The Fugitive on November 04, 2018, 06:01:18 PM
I love it when people that dont play the game talk about dwindling numbers as if they're in the know how. do you guys know how many people were online on friday? both in fso and ma?
I logged in yesterday at midday played for 12 hours straight. had no problems finding fights, it was awesome. but what do I know, i only play almost everyday now that I am on disability. maybe if I stop playing hitech will add me to the monthly email about how we have less and less players.
semp
Just to play devils advocate here and to add context to your statement "had no problems finding fights" a quarter of your "kills" in the pony were GVs. Now, most "fighter" guys dont consider that "fights". Great you had fun. Im happy for ya, but that doesnt mean others were having fun all day. During the afternoon there were some good fights, but after supper you couldnt find a Knight to fight and the Bishops held a 3 to 1 numbers advantage on the other front. Personally I dont have fun fighting under an umbrella of high cons looking to just pick me while Im already fighting 1 or 2.
So coming in here and posting that you had a great day and lots of fights doesnt help answer the question, "How to get us youngsters to play". If the "youngsters" come in here looking for good air to air combat they are going to be pretty disappointed for the most part. I was logged in from 2 PM to about midnight but I only spent about half that time "playing" because the lack of fights. I love this game, its the only one I play but I can be honest with what I see. Sure I can "find" things to do in the game when the fights dry up, but I have been here a long time and know whats available, but new players dont have those advantages. We need to look for things that will help new players to stay and play.
Yep. That is a hard selling point for a new player. Freemium games like WT look better and are way cheaper. Even though WT sucks IMO, the entry fee is far more enticing for a novice.
Agreed, I think HTC should look into adding a "free" group of planes new players can play with in the MA. Giving them "free" arenas isnt going to hook these people by letting them fly alone in there own custom arena of MAYBE hook and fight some one in the DA.
Post by: streakeagle on November 04, 2018, 06:26:57 PM
I really don't mind an arena with 100 players if I can find a base where I can get in a few good hops before going to bed. I have a couple of nights where I was flying with the right guys and flying against the right guys. Non-stop action. Good fights. Couldn't wait to re-up for more fun. But that kind of night is at best 1 in 5 maybe 1 in 10. Whereas when a play DCS World single player, I enjoy every single minute I am flying because I don't have to count on having the right number of the right kind of people showing up.
So maybe you have fun every single night with the current subscription level and don't think the numbers are falling. But I have been playing the game a long time. Since I don't fly/win much, my rank is always close to last and let me tell you that my rank is moving up even though I am last... from 1500 to 1200 in the space of a couple of months. If that's not dwindling numbers, I don't know what is.
Now given that my son has a PC equal to mine and access to a HOTAS, he is the guy you want to try out and fall in love with the game. He played Aces High offline frequently between 3 and 5 years old. But despite being raised by an aviation nut, he has no use for flight sims in general, much less a very competitive one requiring hours of play to get up to the skill level required to survive in the main arena. He is almost 12 now and loves shooters like Star Wars Battlefront, Halo, and more recently Fortnite. If you can't get someone with access to the best hardware to even try the game, who are you going to get to play the game?
Apparently, people obsessed with being a fighter pilot are becoming fewer and fewer as a percentage of the market or even worse as an absolute number. I don't know why that is? DCS World is a pretty small niche game filled with the same 40-50 year old pilots as Aces High. Most of the players use Warthog HOTAS controllers and have a decent rig. But a pleasant surprise during a forum post about how old everyone is hit the average age of about 40 because for every guy in the 60 to 80 year old bracket (one that I am rapidly approaching as I will be 51 in Feb) there was some 16 to 20 year old who had access to a decent rig via their father and fell in love with combat flight sims. So maybe the market won't ever grow back to what it once was, but at least it may stabilize at a level to support continued game development.
If the majority of Aces High subscribers are people who have been playing on or before 2008 and that doesn't change very soon, then it is end of Aces High. No amount of marketing kept horse carriages selling well once cars took over the market. Perhaps there is nothing Hitech can do because younger generations simply don't want or like what he is selling.
Third Wire was a single developer with some contracted graphic artists. Its core game, the Strike Fighters/Wings Over XXX series became less and less profitable until it went into the red trying to update the terrain engine and sell expansion packs. Now Third Wire has free-to-play mobile games with ads and in-game purchases. If you played the PC games, you can see how much he ported over to the mobile market. You can also see how he dumbed down what was already a lite sim to appeal to a younger generation that doesn't appreciate realism... just decent graphics, lots of action and always winning no matter the odds. If Aces High is to have a future with a much larger number of subscribers, it may be as tablet game. However, that is not what I like/want, so I am left behind by companies that abandon realistic flight sims for arcade profits.
HTC needs to do what will keep their paychecks rolling in, not just try to please old fliers like me. I don't want to see Aces High change or go out of business. But it is going to be one or the other. I don't know how Warbirds has lingered on for so long. When I started flying in fall of 2000, Warbirds R2.77 was still up and Aces High was just getting its membership up. I liked Warbirds, but immediately recognized Aces High was Warbirds on steroids... much better at everything. Aces High no longer has that status. Their are competitors such as the latest IL-2:Battle Over xxx series that has great graphics, decent VR support, and aside from no support for massive arenas, better in almost every other way. Ironically, I fly IL-2:BoX much less frequently than Aces High. Maybe out of loyalty? Or preference for the much larger plane set? But most of my limited free time is spent flying DCS World. I like F-86s, MiG-15s, F-5Es, MiG-21s, F-15s, F/A-18s, MiG-29s, and Su-27s just as much as WW2 aircraft. I enjoy the DCS WW2 aircraft even more than Aces High, they just don't have all of the classics yet. Once it has P-38s, F4Us, F6Fs, A6Ms, etc., I will have little reason to come here any more other than just to show my support.
Post by: guncrasher on November 04, 2018, 09:14:46 PM
Who the hell are you talking about? I've been here for over 10 years and streakeagle has been on & off for the past 18 years.
It's players like us that are "dwindeling"
Do some research, before jumping on that high-horse of yours.
Coogan
i just asked a simple question, how many players were on on friday? I've been around for over 10 years. last couple of years I dint play much but i kept my subscription. been playing almost everyday for the last 2 months.
last Friday saw the highest number of people logged on. so if numbers are dwindling, why do we see more and more people logging in?
semp
Post by: The Fugitive on November 04, 2018, 09:19:38 PM
i just asked a simple question, how many players were on on friday? I've been around for over 10 years. last couple of years I dint play much but i kept my subscription. been playing almost everyday for the last 2 months.
last Friday saw the highest number of people logged on. so if numbers are dwindling, why do we see more and more people logging in?
semp
And what was that number? Ill bet it was less than 300 total. And once FSO was over more than half left.
Post by: guncrasher on November 04, 2018, 09:19:46 PM
Just to play devils advocate here and to add context to your statement "had no problems finding fights" a quarter of your "kills" in the pony were GVs. Now, most "fighter" guys dont consider that "fights". Great you had fun. Im happy for ya, but that doesnt mean others were having fun all day. During the afternoon there were some good fights, but after supper you couldnt find a Knight to fight and the Bishops held a 3 to 1 numbers advantage on the other front. Personally I dont have fun fighting under an umbrella of high cons looking to just pick me while Im already fighting 1 or 2.
So coming in here and posting that you had a great day and lots of fights doesnt help answer the question, "How to get us youngsters to play". If the "youngsters" come in here looking for good air to air combat they are going to be pretty disappointed for the most part. I was logged in from 2 PM to about midnight but I only spent about half that time "playing" because the lack of fights. I love this game, its the only one I play but I can be honest with what I see. Sure I can "find" things to do in the game when the fights dry up, but I have been here a long time and know whats available, but new players dont have those advantages. We need to look for things that will help new players to stay and play.
Agreed, I think HTC should look into adding a "free" group of planes new players can play with in the MA. Giving them "free" arenas isnt going to hook these people by letting them fly alone in there own custom arena of MAYBE hook and fight some one in the DA.
i got 3 maybe 4 gv kills yesterday. but then again you dint have problem finding a fight, because i saw you flying in the same area as me. if you dint find a fight then you really went out of your way to not find one. and if you are gonna say well it was mostly picking and not real fights. remember i have seen when you just flew around trying to pick people during a furball.
semp
semp
Post by: guncrasher on November 04, 2018, 09:21:15 PM
And what was that number? Ill bet it was less than 300 total. And once FSO was over more than half left.
a few less than 300, but remember a few months ago there were 160 to 180 players during fso.
semp
Post by: The Fugitive on November 04, 2018, 09:37:54 PM
i got 3 maybe 4 gv kills yesterday. but then again you dint have problem finding a fight, because i saw you flying in the same area as me. if you dint find a fight then you really went out of your way to not find one. and if you are gonna say well it was mostly picking and not real fights. remember i have seen when you just flew around trying to pick people during a furball.
semp
semp
LOL!!! ok I was in a GV on the center island when all you did was fly around looking for GVs to kill. As I said, afternoon was ok fights, but after supper it was all or nothing . Nothing from the Knights, and the usual horde from the bish. Numbers were awesome, 40+ bish and less than 20 each for Knights and rooks. Yup a stella night.
The point is that YOU may have had a great time, but it is not the same for the rest of us and for a newb looking for action..... LOL!!!! they are gone after after 10 minutes. Ask HTC.
So what can be done to entice the youngsters to play, and more importantly STAY.
a few less than 300, but remember a few months ago there were 160 to 180 players during fso.
semp
Thats the point, when 600 was a regular night and close to a 1000 was a good weekend. We need more players. You having a good time, isnt helping keep those that stop in and leave in minutes. Calling out others for not being able to find fights isnt going to help either. I spent more than an hour in a GV at that center island with you flying over head most of the time and while you werent, you were RTB or on the way in. Thats ten percent of the time you have flying just hanging out at the center island. Again, for those looking for air to air that is NOT AN OPTION.
While you can still find fun in the game as can I, its not enough for these new players. With out new players the game will continue to lose more players than it takes in. All is not well, what can be done to get the youngsters to play?
Post by: Oldman731 on November 04, 2018, 09:47:09 PM
and aside from no support for massive arenas, better in almost every other way.
I enjoy your posts, they're very well-written. But many others have already left us with "The End is Near" messages. We get that. The point of this thread (so I thought) was to generate some ideas on how things might be improved. If the answer is "there's no hope," that is probably off topic.
- oldman (not that I haven't made off-topic posts myself, you understand)
Post by: guncrasher on November 04, 2018, 09:48:38 PM
semp
Post by: 1stpar3 on November 04, 2018, 10:13:10 PM
I log in when it is convenient for me to play, not when everyone else plays. That is usually about 10 pm EST or later on week nights after my family has gone to bed. I have never seen a night with more than about 150 players and usually is closer to 100 or less. I played when there were two arenas because the first one was at 100% with like 700 and the other was stuck with the leftovers like 300 to 500. People used to complain about getting stuck in the 2nd arena with the sub-500 numbers.I know how you mean. If DCS had the MASSIVE p v p arena like AH does...Id probably never play AH. DCS for me is the FLYING :uhoh ok LEARNING :x Aces High is for the REST OF YOU GUYS...its the folk that show up that keep me coming back. That being said, my experiences in some of the DCS servers has been a bit of a NOT much fun either. So i am happy with having that option in AH, to interact with actual folk :salute
I really don't mind an arena with 100 players if I can find a base where I can get in a few good hops before going to bed. I have a couple of nights where I was flying with the right guys and flying against the right guys. Non-stop action. Good fights. Couldn't wait to re-up for more fun. But that kind of night is at best 1 in 5 maybe 1 in 10. Whereas when a play DCS World single player, I enjoy every single minute I am flying because I don't have to count on having the right number of the right kind of people showing up.
So maybe you have fun every single night with the current subscription level and don't think the numbers are falling. But I have been playing the game a long time. Since I don't fly/win much, my rank is always close to last and let me tell you that my rank is moving up even though I am last... from 1500 to 1200 in the space of a couple of months. If that's not dwindling numbers, I don't know what is.
Now given that my son has a PC equal to mine and access to a HOTAS, he is the guy you want to try out and fall in love with the game. He played Aces High offline frequently between 3 and 5 years old. But despite being raised by an aviation nut, he has no use for flight sims in general, much less a very competitive one requiring hours of play to get up to the skill level required to survive in the main arena. He is almost 12 now and loves shooters like Star Wars Battlefront, Halo, and more recently Fortnite. If you can't get someone with access to the best hardware to even try the game, who are you going to get to play the game?
Apparently, people obsessed with being a fighter pilot are becoming fewer and fewer as a percentage of the market or even worse as an absolute number. I don't know why that is? DCS World is a pretty small niche game filled with the same 40-50 year old pilots as Aces High. Most of the players use Warthog HOTAS controllers and have a decent rig. But a pleasant surprise during a forum post about how old everyone is hit the average age of about 40 because for every guy in the 60 to 80 year old bracket (one that I am rapidly approaching as I will be 51 in Feb) there was some 16 to 20 year old who had access to a decent rig via their father and fell in love with combat flight sims. So maybe the market won't ever grow back to what it once was, but at least it may stabilize at a level to support continued game development.
If the majority of Aces High subscribers are people who have been playing on or before 2008 and that doesn't change very soon, then it is end of Aces High. No amount of marketing kept horse carriages selling well once cars took over the market. Perhaps there is nothing Hitech can do because younger generations simply don't want or like what he is selling.
Third Wire was a single developer with some contracted graphic artists. Its core game, the Strike Fighters/Wings Over XXX series became less and less profitable until it went into the red trying to update the terrain engine and sell expansion packs. Now Third Wire has free-to-play mobile games with ads and in-game purchases. If you played the PC games, you can see how much he ported over to the mobile market. You can also see how he dumbed down what was already a lite sim to appeal to a younger generation that doesn't appreciate realism... just decent graphics, lots of action and always winning no matter the odds. If Aces High is to have a future with a much larger number of subscribers, it may be as tablet game. However, that is not what I like/want, so I am left behind by companies that abandon realistic flight sims for arcade profits.
HTC needs to do what will keep their paychecks rolling in, not just try to please old fliers like me. I don't want to see Aces High change or go out of business. But it is going to be one or the other. I don't know how Warbirds has lingered on for so long. When I started flying in fall of 2000, Warbirds R2.77 was still up and Aces High was just getting its membership up. I liked Warbirds, but immediately recognized Aces High was Warbirds on steroids... much better at everything. Aces High no longer has that status. Their are competitors such as the latest IL-2:Battle Over xxx series that has great graphics, decent VR support, and aside from no support for massive arenas, better in almost every other way. Ironically, I fly IL-2:BoX much less frequently than Aces High. Maybe out of loyalty? Or preference for the much larger plane set? But most of my limited free time is spent flying DCS World. I like F-86s, MiG-15s, F-5Es, MiG-21s, F-15s, F/A-18s, MiG-29s, and Su-27s just as much as WW2 aircraft. I enjoy the DCS WW2 aircraft even more than Aces High, they just don't have all of the classics yet. Once it has P-38s, F4Us, F6Fs, A6Ms, etc., I will have little reason to come here any more other than just to show my support.
Post by: Winger1 on November 05, 2018, 01:43:26 AM
Suggestions:
1. They might have to reduce or eliminate the subscription entirely and go for a pay-up-front model, at least reduce the cost; $180 a year is just way too much in this day and age. Maybe offer a specific amount of time a day, or a specific time of the day where it is free to play or have a certain plane set that is free in the MA all the time with a subscription being necessary to access all the planes.
2. Get rid of the three counties and go with a two country model as well as shrink the maps some until more players start signing up.
3. Adding some AI planes/GVs into the main arena could make for more action. AI bomber flights and fighter sweeps as well as ground offensives could be controlled like the carrier groups. This would give people more targets to shoot at and provide easier opponents for newer players so they can get some kills and build confidence.
4. Provide an easy to use offline quick combat mode where you select from a list of maps, select your plane, difficulty, altitude and the number and type of friendly and enemy fighters to fly against; this would really help new players learn. Throwing newbies into the MA against experts is a recipe for frustration.
Post by: ccvi on November 05, 2018, 01:49:56 AM
If the "youngsters" come in here looking for good air to air combat they are going to be pretty disappointed for the most part.
That's the problem: Wrong expectations. If they came here for the war with its various aspects and the cooperation with their countrymen, they would be pretty pleased, having found something that doesn't exist elsewhere.
Post by: Shuffler on November 05, 2018, 04:33:20 AM
That's the problem: Wrong expectations. If they came here for the war with its various aspects and the cooperation with their countrymen, they would be pretty pleased, having found something that doesn't exist elsewhere.
I came here for aerial combat.
Post by: Litjan on November 05, 2018, 07:13:21 AM
You regularly have nothing worthwhile to contribute, no, overbursting negativity doesnīt count.
Litjan
Post by: lunaticfringe on November 05, 2018, 08:02:59 AM
I used to mow lawns to pay for this game. But I feel like this game should be marketed to men of the early 20s and up. That's when we can start affording super computers and monthly subscriptions. I also feel this is when we start to turn to ap games and YouTube for other means of entertainment.
make up you're mind^^ this^^or this--->
Offline Skyguns MKII
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How to get us youngsters to play
Ŧ on: October 06, 2018, 11:48:41 AM ŧ
Quote
I feel like we are missing a huge market of ads that would really reach kids today. Kids nowadays don't watch TV when they have limitless electronic entertainment on there finger
kids or grown ups.
Post by: lunaticfringe on November 05, 2018, 08:16:11 AM
you kill certain players, they go ballistic, call you names,,, or use abbreviated cuss words like- pos watermelon and other such words. would be nice if hitech could put together a list to put in game that mods could use to give warnings. I have read comments on Steam about our game, often talked about is the toxicity of this game. AH3 needs to be cleaned up.
when I was playing, a new player would log on, I would welcome them, most would not respond or ask question-or some would ask questions, get answers then log off never to be seen again. 1 player was playing on the ndisles map he was pretty good for a new guy, but had trouble with English, and a player told him he would teach him how to speak English-the guy never came back.
Post by: lunaticfringe on November 05, 2018, 08:29:51 AM
we been harping about this stuff at the very least since 2014, and still nothing has changed.
to me this starts and ends with advertising or the lack there of. advertising on tv is expensive- advertising on social media, I don't know what the pricing is. but advertising needs to be on more than military type web sites.
Post by: lunaticfringe on November 05, 2018, 09:14:07 AM
I'm not playing right now because video card died but I'm not canceling my account.
somebody said $180.00 a year-I pay 192.36 a year not much more<--- then that.
I think that most of the new players are too young to have a steady income, so they just play the free 2 weeks then leave. I see a lot of players have RL expenses, family, bills, etc and they still play.
people suggest HiTech cut the subscription price-which in my book would hurt him and his company. and then the company would close. he doesn't have the backing like the others have, the companies that put out DCS-WOWP- WOT- etc that's all for now
Post by: Shuffler on November 05, 2018, 09:25:42 AM
Shuffler, why donīt you go and play Aces High and look for some aerial combat instead of trying to derail any fruitful discussion that others are trying to have here.
You regularly have nothing worthwhile to contribute, no, overbursting negativity doesnīt count.
Litjan
You just proved a point. In business you can't just say... I don't like what you say so go away. You can rattle without regard. It doesn't come out of your pocket after all.
Hitech owns a business. While you beat a dead horse he is actually doing things.
Deal with that.....
Signed
Devil's Advocate
Post by: Wiley on November 05, 2018, 11:16:37 AM
Shuffler, why donīt you go and play Aces High and look for some aerial combat instead of trying to derail any fruitful discussion that others are trying to have here.
You regularly have nothing worthwhile to contribute, no, overbursting negativity doesnīt count.
Litjan
Belaboring the same points that have been going around for years is "fruitful discussion" in spite of new information that people seem to willfully ignore? For example, "Advertising will fix everything." Except it's not people finding the game, it's retaining the people that show up that's the issue.
It's the same 5 or 6 simplistic ideas being put up as the savior of the game over and over and over. It's broken records on all sides.
Wiley.
Post by: Spikes on November 05, 2018, 04:10:09 PM
I would like to schedule a time where three or four of us streamers are online so we can get together and make an entertaining stream.I don't do the MA much at all anymore. Sometimes we go in there before FSO to grab some scalps but I pretty much only get on for FSO and Scenarios. :uhoh
In streams there seems to be this vail of silence, well, except for cursing losing wings and what not
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Post by: Ciaphas on November 05, 2018, 05:18:36 PM
I don't do the MA much at all anymore. Sometimes we go in there before FSO to grab some scalps but I pretty much only get on for FSO and Scenarios. :uhoh
I work in the evenings so my Fridays are a no go.
The only events I can participate in are the ones held on Saturdays.
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Post by: Skyguns MKII on November 05, 2018, 05:56:42 PM
make up you're mind^^ this^^or this--->
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How to get us youngsters to play
Ŧ on: October 06, 2018, 11:48:41 AM ŧ
Quote
I feel like we are missing a huge market of ads that would really reach kids today. Kids nowadays don't watch TV when they have limitless electronic entertainment on there finger
kids or grown ups.
Kids and young men...