General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: DmonSlyr on August 08, 2023, 12:24:59 PM
Title: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 08, 2023, 12:24:59 PM
In an effort to maybe talk about planes and add something positive to the discussion board about the game. I thought I'd discuss why only flying 1 plane in AH is not a good strategy for being successful for novice pilots, and can lead you into boredom or frustration.
All planes in AH have a strength and weakness, some more than others. Some planes are designed better for long high alt attack flights and some are designed better for low defensive type flights. There are but a few that are good at both though player skill greatly comes into factor. Only learning one plane can greatly start you out at a disadvantage early on if you don't fly them in the correct situation.
Situation 1 Let's say you want to start with the P51D. Everyone's favorite. Yes, it's a wonderful plane. It's well balanced and dives very well while also turning pretty decently and great at maintaining E. Here's the situation though, if you roll this plane at a field that is under attack, you are going to be already starting off at a disadvantage. Why? One of the greatest weaknesses for the P51 and many American planes is acceleration and climb speed. You do not want to be stuck on the deck having to use defensive maneuvers trying to get attacking planes to overshoot you. It's a very poor start for the p51 and you will have a lot of trouble getting the alt and E you need to be successful. This plane should really only be flown in attacking situations, where you are either A. Flying to a field your team is on the offensive, or B. Rolling from a back field to defend your base from high bombers and attack planes. You want to be able to get 17-20k and use your diving speed to your advantage. Same goes for most other American planes, 190s, Tiffies, Temps, C205, ect .If you want to defend a field, there are other planes that are great for it. The Spitfires, La7s, Ki84s, N1Ks, hurricane 2c, Brewster, A6ms, are great planes for defense rather than a P51. They accelerate fast, turn on a dime, have great cannons for quick snap shots on a overshoot. Can dive well in low alts and can gain alt rather quickly off the field. Instead of tugging that P51 off the field to defend, grab one of these other planes and learn that for defense. It will greatly improve your capabilities and will help you stay alive longer. Once you get an attack plane to turn, you will be able to out maneuver them and win the fight, or be able to dodge them diving on your easier. Normally in defense at your field, you will have more friendlies to help you, therfore being able to dodge planes easier for longer so your friends can help is very beneficial.
Situation 2: Let's say you want to start off with the Spitfires, another plane everyone loves. Unfortunately, you will not want to use this plane for attack missions as a novice. Why? You will get caught up low and slow in a turn fight with less friendlies and more enemies to gang you. You won't be able to escape the fight once this happens. The thing with great turning planes is, you want to turn them... this is a disadvantage when attacking a field. Hey we all love to do it. But as a novice you will just get ganged more times than anything and get frustrated. This is the time you want to grab a P51, P47, P38, 190, Tiffin, temp, C205, F4u ect. Don't focus so much on out turning people. Focus on keeping your speed and alt, focus on maintaining E and staying fast. Practice roping planes if you are clear from higher cons.You want to be able to dive on planes and pull out to regain your alt and be able to extend from defensive planes diving on you. These planes generally have a lot of gas so you can be more patient regaining your alt and E to come back into the fight. This will keep you alive. Your spitfire will not. It cannot dive fast enough to get away from the hoard coming after to you. I never like to encourage running, but for a novice this is your tactic until you learn ACM, flaps and throttle usage. Be aggressive but not so aggressive that you end up chasing a plane to the deck in a turn fight and getting picked. Low and slow is the last place you want to be when attacking a field.
Situation #3. You are a lover of the furball and see that both teams are fighting in the middle of the bases with co alt E. What do you do? You really don't want an attack plane, and you really don't want a slow defensive plane. Why? An attack plane is going to be too heavy vs other fighters. You aren't going to maneuverable enough to get into snapshot positions or defend from them, and if you get slow on the deck you will get ganged. A slow defense plane like Brewsters, A6ms, hurricane, older spits, ect aren't going to be fast enough to catch most planes, you will be stuck on the deck turn fighting until someone comes to pick to you, or spending most of your time dodging planes diving on you. So what plane do you choose? There are a few planes that fit well nicely in this category, and furball type scenarios are also a learned situation regarding SA and what you can and cannot get away with. Planes that I really like to use are. The 109s, they don't dive well, but have great acceleration, great climb, lots of wep, and can outrun most planes once you understand the flight models and ACM. The La7 and Yaks is very similar and great for furballing. The spit16 and spit8 or even the ki61 which is very similar but more advanced. The P38 for more advanced sticks, the Ki84, great furball plane. You want planes that can turn generally well and climb well, but not too much of a turner because you'll want to be able to escape the furball when the time comes and need quick acceleration speed, not be stuck on the deck turning and getting ganged by higher planes coming in. The F4us and 190A5 are okay for more advanced sticks but should really be flown in situation 2 to be mostly successful. These are planes than can be flown in both attack and defensive situations but are generally not the best for either because of dive speed in situation 2 and lack of turning ability on the deck for novice players in situation 1. Some generally don't have enough gas for situation 2 either like the La7 or Yak. Situation 3 planes are great for mid alt, and that's where you want to fight most of the time. I always like say in a furball, enter and strike your targets like a shark enters a school of fish. Quick stakes on planes in and out. Never follow an enemy too long. If one jumps your 6, do your best to drag then out away from the larger fight to make it a 1v1 or towards friendlies. This is where quick excelleration and decent turning comes into play when shaking an enemy.
By understanding each situation and which plane is more suitable for these situations, you will have a much better time in AH getting kills and staying alive. This is how I play the game. This is why only flying one plane can be frustrating and not helping you to be more successful in the MA. I hope this helps and that you will consider flying different planes for each situation rather than your 1 plane that may be hindering you in certain situations. :salute
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Oldman731 on August 08, 2023, 01:19:24 PM
All very good advice.
One more thought: Learning new planes is fun. AH has a lot of planes to learn.
- oldman
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Puma44 on August 08, 2023, 02:04:54 PM
Great write up and solid rational. Since written for the “newb”, suggest defining the term “E” for what it is, “energy”. Energy management is the all important factor in dogfighting, BFM, ACM, and mutual support. Lose or run low on energy (E) and the transition from fighter to hot air balloon begins. A “newb” reading an otherwise informative “how to” write up is for sure going to ask, what’s “E”? :salute :aok
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 08, 2023, 02:25:05 PM
Great write up and solid rational. Since written for the “newb”, suggest defining the term “E” for what it is, “energy”. Energy management is the all important factor in dogfighting, BFM, ACM, and mutual support. Lose or run low on energy (E) and the transition from fighter to hot air balloon begins. A “newb” reading an otherwise informative “how to” write up is for sure going to ask, what’s “E”? :salute :aok
Good point! Definitely appreciate you mentioning that. While I do intend this to be for new guys mostly. It might also be good for some players who have been frustrated or haven't thought of trying different planes for the situation before. That is mostly what I wanted to shed some experience on. Hopefully they give it another try and will have better sucess and more fun. :aok
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: nrshida on August 08, 2023, 04:00:35 PM
Great contribution Violator.
I'd build on that by describing three 'categories' of ACM-predispositions in planes. In other words a combination of design attributes makes nearly everything fall into some position on this spectrum.
First there are good-turning planes - Usually with a low wing-loading, either light like a Zero, Ki-43 or Brewster or having a relatively large wing area, like a Spitfire. Their drawback is those attributes usually limit top speed and as the war progressed design moved away from this for obvious reasons.
Next the energy-retainers - In general the energy they bring to the fight is the maximum energy they are going to have but slippery shapes and high mass means that if used wisely they can recycle that energy between angles and altitude. Most blue planes fall in here. The logical tactic is BnZ which is not the same as hitting and running as you often see in AH. Working in the vertical they can degrade an opponent's energy state to win a shot or escape at will. Typically have a higher top speed because of more powerful engines (hence the mass) and not necessarily much in the wing-loading department. They can usually choose the fight and press the fight if they want to.
Energy-builders - The most esoteric of the bunch, also a form of energy-fighting these aircraft have an emphasis on power-loading or power-to-weight ration in car terms. This is arguably the hardest category because their strengths are to build an energy advantage during a fight through sustained climbing and or accelerating - usually in short bursts or through careful BFM. This category makes for great reversals-of-fortune as you can afford to be wasteful of energy knowing you can build it back.
The freak combinators - The above is painting with a broad brush. There are obviously freaks. I'd describe the Corsair as an obvious energy-retainer, well-disposed to BnZ. Conversely deck operations made for big wings and hover flaps so they can essentially turn like a Hurricane when pressed. Certainly can't build well. The 190D-9 really should be BnZing because of it's stumpy wings but conversely has a pretty descent sustained climb-rate. A Bf109K-4 is clearly an energy-builder but in the vert is outstanding with excellent controllability very nose-high, which equates it to a retainer and you can easily BnZ in it up to a certain air speed.
Final note - as with most things in air combat, position, energy-state, number of cup-holders everything is relative. Different airframes and starting positions might make BnZ a momentarily preferable strategy for a Brewster. This holds less well for a Ki-43 who has the energy retention of a box-kite and the high speed control of Richard Hammond. A Mosquito makes a decent turn-fighter against a +e 190D-9. The D9 should be building in this fight if he can escape those guns. Nothing is absolute.
As Violator says the trouble starts when you stick with one plane or tactic you miss out.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: RELIC on August 08, 2023, 04:51:47 PM
Agree 100%. DFA used to have a "Plane Of The Month - POM" (back when I was more motivated) where I did a write-up on the fighter/POM picked for that camp and members were encouraged to fly it. Those squaddies who participated definitely benefited - and there was a swell ribbon/medal if you got enough kills or high enough K/D in it :D
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: scott66 on August 08, 2023, 04:58:56 PM
I would never cheat on my Brewster lol good advise violator
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: TryHard on August 08, 2023, 05:51:56 PM
I would never cheat on my Brewster lol good advise violator
I have similar feelings towards the FM2 I'd argue its one of the best freak combinations in the game as it could sorta do all 3 situations. Its biggest limitations are relatively slow top speed and only 4 M2s. But it has no Vne speed like Brewster it will do 500mph in a dive with good control aswell which makes it a great Boom and Zoomer. Also can turn with the Brew and has very good acceleration and climb rate for what it is. Not 109K4 or Yak3 levels but the Power to Weight compared to the F4F will surprise a lot of players expecting an easy kill, which the F4F icon people will see and flock to club you like a baby seal, not knowing until its too late and they lost all their E :D
Like statistically the best plane for a Furball would be a 262, but that doesn't make it any fun.
If I "had" to choose one airplane to fly in the main arena it would be an FM2 :salute
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 08, 2023, 06:35:17 PM
I have similar feelings towards the FM2 I'd argue its one of the best freak combinations in the game as it could sorta do all 3 situations. Its biggest limitations are relatively slow top speed and only 4 M2s. But it has no Vne speed like Brewster it will do 500mph in a dive with good control aswell which makes it a great Boom and Zoomer. Also can turn with the Brew and has very good acceleration and climb rate for what it is. Not 109K4 or Yak3 levels but the Power to Weight compared to the F4F will surprise a lot of players expecting an easy kill, which the F4F icon people will see and flock to club you like a baby seal, not knowing until its too late and they lost all their E :D
Like statistically the best plane for a Furball would be a 262, but that doesn't make it any fun.
If I "had" to choose one airplane to fly in the main arena it would be an FM2 :salute
Extremely fun plane to roll off the CV. Very versatile and maneuverable. I'd recon you may want to have the friendly advantage as you will end up getting ganged if not. Generally good to start with some alt before entering the fight. I wouldnt consider it a novice plane due to the 4 50s and slow speed, but its definitely a lot of fun to roll in a big CV fight.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Simon on August 08, 2023, 06:44:23 PM
Good post Vio.
An argument could be made that flying one type of plane can accelerate your learning curve by honing your aim and earning an intimate understanding of that plane's advantages and limitations.
If your goal is to achieve a high score, then yes, choosing the right tool at the right time is certainly necessary.
If your goal is to survive, learn the 190D, P51 or Yak3. Especially if you side-swap, the perks will come flooding in so you can fly Tempests and Deuces to avoid getting shot down even more easily.
If your goal if to win dogfights, mastering something versatile (F4U, 109, Spit, Ki84) is the way to go about it.
I wear my Corsairs-only badge with pride. I think I could do just fine in a Dora/Temp/Yak/Spit/LA, but that would be like admitting defeat. :bolt:
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: FLS on August 08, 2023, 06:59:40 PM
Another reason to fly different aircraft is just to enjoy the different flight models. :aok
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Mongoose on August 08, 2023, 10:55:41 PM
An argument could be made that flying one type of plane can accelerate your learning curve by honing your aim and earning an intimate understanding of that plane's advantages and limitations.
This right here would be my argument. A new pilot should stick with one plane until he has actually learned how to fly. By switching planes you make the learning curve steeper. Let a new pilot take one plane and learn the basics of flying in that plane. Once he has learned the basics of flying, then the pilot can appreciate the advantages of the different airplanes. Until then, he is just fighting the learning curve.
Many of us have been around so long we forget how daunting it can be for a rookie. I fondly remember my early days when I was doing my very best to not hit the ground. :airplane:
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: save on August 09, 2023, 04:07:54 AM
Looking at statistics over time, I can see the mid-tier planes have suffered heavily from the satellite real-time radar, if you look at k/D.
Planes that cannot compete using the RL tactics of shooting someone they don't see until its too late. Even hiding behind a mountain etc don't exist anymore.
Think about it, it's doesn't even work in modern combat.
Only small maps and old radar would probably bring back the diversity of plane flying in Melee arena.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Bopgun on August 09, 2023, 04:17:33 AM
I always liked having a rwepitware/ stable of fighters I’m competent in that I can use. Especially weird ones! Spit 1, P40C, ME410, the real unicorns.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Eagler on August 09, 2023, 06:26:48 AM
There is a 109 for every occasion
I don't need anything else
It's more the weapons than the plane...takes a glancing shot to take your wing from some planes while others have to chew on you a bit
Eagler
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 09, 2023, 07:08:48 AM
I usually fly the P-51D. Anyone who knows it, it’s not a real TnB ac, and doesn’t recover E all that well,.. hence the Runstang. But I throw myself into TnB (most times 3 or 5 vs 1)intensionally. It teaches SA and ACM to survive and strict muscle memory. When I fly another more uber AC its like I can do whatever I want, and my kills accelerate.
Usually when I turn into a Runstang its about drawing one or two out and away of a horde so I can try to force them to fight my way. Once that hook is in the mouth (fish on!) I have better chances. I live that some are caught up in the weak fighter Runstang, I play on it. And one way is, as soon as they tire and pull out of the chase, I’m flipping on their 6. Once they see ne coming they have to flip again and burn more E. Most of my kills (the little I have time for) come this way. The psychological part of ACM.
IMO, thise who always fly uber TnB AC aren’t learning as much, even if they have higher kill rates, they usually aren’t that good in a P51. The discipline isn’t there. The opposite of going from P51 and then TnB AC. A Spitfire and 109 is easy as it gets (uber-ish)
I’m a much better pilot flying other AC in a scenario. Which I still believe the MA is just oractice for scenarios, which is my true goal. The MA is just practice. I don’t care much if my points are low in my he MA. :)
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 09, 2023, 07:21:12 AM
Great post, great positive change of pace.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: scott66 on August 09, 2023, 12:30:21 PM
I have similar feelings towards the FM2 I'd argue its one of the best freak combinations in the game as it could sorta do all 3 situations. Its biggest limitations are relatively slow top speed and only 4 M2s. But it has no Vne speed like Brewster it will do 500mph in a dive with good control aswell which makes it a great Boom and Zoomer. Also can turn with the Brew and has very good acceleration and climb rate for what it is. Not 109K4 or Yak3 levels but the Power to Weight compared to the F4F will surprise a lot of players expecting an easy kill, which the F4F icon people will see and flock to club you like a baby seal, not knowing until its too late and they lost all their E :D
Like statistically the best plane for a Furball would be a 262, but that doesn't make it any fun.
If I "had" to choose one airplane to fly in the main arena it would be an FM2 :salute
FM2 used to be my baby in when I first started love her but I wanted something a bit lighter
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 09, 2023, 01:03:49 PM
An argument could be made that flying one type of plane can accelerate your learning curve by honing your aim and earning an intimate understanding of that plane's advantages and limitations.
If your goal is to achieve a high score, then yes, choosing the right tool at the right time is certainly necessary.
If your goal is to survive, learn the 190D, P51 or Yak3. Especially if you side-swap, the perks will come flooding in so you can fly Tempests and Deuces to avoid getting shot down even more easily.
If your goal if to win dogfights, mastering something versatile (F4U, 109, Spit, Ki84) is the way to go about it.
I wear my Corsairs-only badge with pride. I think I could do just fine in a Dora/Temp/Yak/Spit/LA, but that would be like admitting defeat. :bolt:
This right here would be my argument. A new pilot should stick with one plane until he has actually learned how to fly. By switching planes you make the learning curve steeper. Let a new pilot take one plane and learn the basics of flying in that plane. Once he has learned the basics of flying, then the pilot can appreciate the advantages of the different airplanes. Until then, he is just fighting the learning curve.
Many of us have been around so long we forget how daunting it can be for a rookie. I fondly remember my early days when I was doing my very best to not hit the ground. :airplane:
I'm with you that it's good to understand one plane and how it maneuvers with regards to BFM and ACM in order to understand the plane better. I believe that ACM and BFM should be practiced outside of the MA in a 1v1 setting to really test your limits and ability behind the controls. It also helps you really feel the plane. Once you understand ACM and BFM, then you can utilize them with any plane and get a feel for the different abilities.
The thing is though, is that for novice pilots, they don't understand what is a good turn rate vs what isn't, or what has better E capabilities off the run way vs being at high alts with speed. The issue I could see many having is not realizing that their situation is not suitable for their plane, and therfore having a harder time getting kills or not being ganged. The other thing I would mention is that even though they practice one plane for a long time, they might still never learn to take it to its full ability because they don't 1v1 or practice BFM/ACM outside of the MA. Infact I find this to be true quite a lot. So they could be flying a P51 for years and still not really take it to its full potential and hindering themselves, when they could be having a lot more success in a plane like a ki84 with better turning capabilities and 20MM cannons for quicker kills. By sticking with only one plane, they will also not understand the ability of the planes they are fighting against from that planes perspective. This can also be a disadvantage. I find that by trying new planes that are suitable for the situation, you will have a better chance at getting kills and staying alive. By limiting yourself to one plane, you are essentially missing out on other opportunities to improve. Especially when they go to a special event and have to fly something different.
For you fellas that do only fly one plane, you have been around a while and understand when you should and shouldn't roll in a situation, and also understand the flight dynamics and defensive maneuvers better. While I do think it's proficient to understand one plane to your max potential, I also believe that it's important to maybe have 3 planes you want to learn for each situation I mentioned. One geared for base defense, one geared for furballing, and one geared to longer attack missions per the planes I mentioned.
I do appreciate yalls input though. :salute
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 09, 2023, 05:30:08 PM
I'm with you that it's good to understand one plane and how it maneuvers with regards to BFM and ACM in order to understand the plane better. I believe that ACM and BFM should be practiced outside of the MA in a 1v1 setting to really test your limits and ability behind the controls. It also helps you really feel the plane. Once you understand ACM and BFM, then you can utilize them with any plane and get a feel for the different abilities.
The thing is though, is that for novice pilots, they don't understand what is a good turn rate vs what isn't, or what has better E capabilities off the run way vs being at high alts with speed. The issue I could see many having is not realizing that their situation is not suitable for their plane, and therfore having a harder time getting kills or not being ganged. The other thing I would mention is that even though they practice one plane for a long time, they might still never learn to take it to its full ability because they don't 1v1 or practice BFM/ACM outside of the MA. Infact I find this to be true quite a lot. So they could be flying a P51 for years and still not really take it to its full potential and hindering themselves, when they could be having a lot more success in a plane like a ki84 with better turning capabilities and 20MM cannons for quicker kills. By sticking with only one plane, they will also not understand the ability of the planes they are fighting against from that planes perspective. This can also be a disadvantage. I find that by trying new planes that are suitable for the situation, you will have a better chance at getting kills and staying alive. By limiting yourself to one plane, you are essentially missing out on other opportunities to improve. Especially when they go to a special event and have to fly something different.
For you fellas that do only fly one plane, you have been around a while and understand when you should and shouldn't roll in a situation, and also understand the flight dynamics and defensive maneuvers better. While I do think it's proficient to understand one plane to your max potential, I also believe that it's important to maybe have 3 planes you want to learn for each situation I mentioned. One geared for base defense, one geared for furballing, and one geared to longer attack missions per the planes I mentioned.
I do appreciate yalls input though. :salute
On the last paragraph that is good advice. For specific reasons my alternates are; 190 A8 190 A5 Any Hog Spit 16 Yak
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: LilMak on August 10, 2023, 01:45:03 PM
Clearly my plane selection has been wrong 70% of the time for a decade. 😅
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Eagler on August 10, 2023, 03:35:38 PM
Clearly my plane selection has been wrong 70% of the time for a decade. 😅
It has been for those who thought your jug was easy meat
<S>
Eagler
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: perdue3 on August 10, 2023, 03:45:31 PM
Some of my most fond memories in AH was learning/advancing my skills and knowledge in fighters that I planned on flying and signed up to fly in Scenarios. My first time in a Bf 109G-14 occurred because my friends signed up to fly them in a Scenario. I was a Bf 109G-2 guy and didn't love the 30mm so I never flew the K-4. Once I began to hone my skills in the G-14 I fell completely in love. For those 3-4 weeks of flying the G-14 exclusively, I developed an appreciation for the Bf 109 that I had not before. The G-14 is now my favorite airplane and has been since that event. Another fighter I took up because of an event was the Ki-84. I had no ambition to fly it even when it first came out. After learning its nuances and fragility, nimbleness and ferocity, I craved it. It is now easily in my top 5 favorite planes in AH. All because I signed up to fly one in an event.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: 1stpar3 on August 11, 2023, 06:13:16 AM
One more thought: Learning new planes is fun. AH has a lot of planes to learn.
- oldman
INDEED!!! Being said....I always wonder, "Hmm, if Oldman was in a Spitfire, like I was....could I have killed him?" I get it...Uber Planes dont draw as many takers as "I am gonna fight him" situations. You are usually in "Easy Kill-ish Plane" if you know what I mean? For the thrill of the limited fight opportunities? Thus Baiting? YOU- in P-39...me Spit16...and still I have to work to get you? Makes a feller wonder? :rock Love ya Brother, BW1stpar/ULCapkid
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: 1stpar3 on August 11, 2023, 06:15:57 AM
I would never cheat on my Brewster lol good advise violator
What? You cheated on ME, with a CRYPTID!!! fluff'n MOTHMAN!!!!! :devil :rofl
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: ZE on August 11, 2023, 09:24:09 AM
Great post and comments... Even anyone wants to be a successful fighter killer, in my particular case when I play (any game ) the goal is to have fun and relax for the real world life stress; by this... been flying the old Brew with a lot of fun moments in the defense or offense strategy (including those when someone insult me or my choosed plane and just “sometime” I can deliver to them a surprise lead load). Choosing a plane as everybody well recommended should be based on the mission you planning to do, and this post encourage me to try new planes that hope to learn how to fly....
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 11, 2023, 10:43:15 AM
On the last paragraph that is good advice. For specific reasons my alternates are; 190 A8 190 A5 Any Hog Spit 16 Yak
The 190A5 is such a fun plane to fly that is very under looked because everyone flies the 190D. It's great for furballing and a good plane to use as a fighter when your team is attacking bases. It can turn pretty well, not quite as good as a 109, but its quicker and has amazing roll rate for quick angles. The 4 20s with 50 calls are monsters for shredding planes and bombers. It's a really fun plane. I wouldnt use it for base defense though because it's tough to defend against planes diving on you when you are on the deck unless you really know what you are doing, and even still.
Great post and comments... Even anyone wants to be a successful fighter killer, in my particular case when I play (any game ) the goal is to have fun and relax for the real world life stress; by this... been flying the old Brew with a lot of fun moments in the defense or offense strategy (including those when someone insult me or my choosed plane and just “sometime” I can deliver to them a surprise lead load). Choosing a plane as everybody well recommended should be based on the mission you planning to do, and this post encourage me to try new planes that hope to learn how to fly....
That's great ZE! :aok Your Brewster is such a scary plane to fight :rofl
I recon a great plane you should try is a ki84. It might not dive quite as well, however I feel you might have a better chance at escaping all the gangers. It's sorta similar to a brew, but you might get a few more fights rather than those scared to 1v1 your brew and just run. It excels and rolls fast which is a big plus, the cannons are nice too for quicker kills.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: 1stpar3 on August 12, 2023, 05:47:50 AM
The 190A5 is such a fun plane to fly that is very under looked because everyone flies the 190D. It's great for furballing and a good plane to use as a fighter when your team is attacking bases. It can turn pretty well, not quite as good as a 109, but its quicker and has amazing roll rate for quick angles. The 4 20s with 50 calls are monsters for shredding planes and bombers. It's a really fun plane. I wouldnt use it for base defense though because it's tough to defend against planes diving on you when you are on the deck unless you really know what you are doing, and even still.
That's great ZE! :aok Your Brewster is such a scary plane to fight :rofl
I recon a great plane you should try is a ki84. It might not dive quite as well, however I feel you might have a better chance at escaping all the gangers. It's sorta similar to a brew, but you might get a few more fights rather than those scared to 1v1 your brew and just run. It excels and rolls fast which is a big plus, the cannons are nice too for quicker kills.
Forgive Violator..he knoweth not what fire he is stoking/fanning! :uhoh BROTHER....Ze is hard enough in a Brew! "Fly a Ki-84", he says :bhead Dang it Violator, you only see Ze, what, 1 night a week? DON"T ENCOURAGE :rofl LOVE that feller...er...but NOPE! :devil Looks like, Violated by proxy, soon around the corner? :rofl
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: save on August 12, 2023, 08:19:48 AM
The 190A5 is such a fun plane to fly that is very under looked because everyone flies the 190D. It's great for furballing and a good plane to use as a fighter when your team is attacking bases. It can turn pretty well, not quite as good as a 109, but its quicker and has amazing roll rate for quick angles. The 4 20s with 50 calls are monsters for shredding planes and bombers. It's a really fun plane. I wouldnt use it for base defense though because it's tough to defend against planes diving on you when you are on the deck unless you really know what you are doing, and even still.
The A5 should be flown only with the wing root 2 20mm*151, and leave the wing 2 20mm FF at home, give even better performance, and those 2 FF's not only weights it down ( bok for attack vs bombers though) they also have a very low muzzle velocity. Specially flying in pairs the A5 are very lethal and survivable.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Rebel28 on August 12, 2023, 11:51:05 AM
Clearly my plane selection has been wrong 70% of the time for a decade. 😅
And I still remember the flight lesson you gave me flying the Spit8 against your Jug. Reminds me I still owe you for that lesson... :) Some of the best flying I had ever seen.
Reb28
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 12, 2023, 12:25:03 PM
The A5 should be flown only with the wing root 2 20mm*151, and leave the wing 2 20mm FF at home, give even better performance, and those 2 FF's not only weights it down ( bok for attack vs bombers though) they also have a very low muzzle velocity. Specially flying in pairs the A5 are very lethal and survivable.
Yeah, I'd generally recommend only going with the 2 20s once understanding the game and plane better. However as a noob I'd probably recommend taking 4 just to be able to down planes even more quickly in the fight. I don't really think the weight difference will have too big an impact given their limited understanding of the flight models and plane capabilities but its up to them. For me, more firepower is key to downing planes faster and staying alive, not chasing them down and getting picked because they cant get enogh hits on the guy. Either way, it's still a really fun and under utilized plane.
And I still remember the flight lesson you gave me flying the Spit8 against your Jug. Reminds me I still owe you for that lesson... :) Some of the best flying I had ever seen.
Reb28
Yes, he is very good in the P47 and I'm not saying he's been "doing it wrong". My point is that a noobie who loves the P47 and only wants to fly that, is going to have a very tough time generally using that plane for base defense on a strong enemy attack rather than taking up something like a Ki84, spit, Brew, or something similar that is more versatile in the deck fight being able to dodge planes easier and get around on BnZers 6s faster.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: scott66 on August 12, 2023, 04:55:59 PM
I've seen yucca and lilmak do things in a jug that defy gravity lol they can make it almost float and hover that jug while my brew just Flys right by them... love the jug wish I could fly it
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 12, 2023, 10:55:36 PM
I've seen yucca and lilmak do things in a jug that defy gravity lol they can make it almost float and hover that jug while my brew just Flys right by them... love the jug wish I could fly it
YUCCA is an overshoot master. One of the best in the biz. I'd recommend you fly it to bases as an attacker and try not to get down in dirty low n slow too early. I imagine that would be tough for you given your style ha. But always good to practice. The p47 is NOT a noob plane. It takes patience and you have to BnZ most of the time and regain your alt if you don't want to get ganged/picked quickly. Its a decent turn fighter but you really have to know what you are doing. I had a really good tour with the D40 last month. Really enjoy flying it. One of its hidden wonders is being able to get flaps out very early at high speeds to force the overshoot, it also has amazing up elevator Trim that can give you insane lift in the rolling scissors. You just have to love the 8 50s too. Except when its on your 6!
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: save on August 13, 2023, 12:44:25 PM
Yeah, I'd generally recommend only going with the 2 20s once understanding the game and plane better. However as a noob I'd probably recommend taking 4 just to be able to down planes even more quickly in the fight. I don't really think the weight difference will have too big an impact given their limited understanding of the flight models and plane capabilities but its up to them. For me, more firepower is key to downing planes faster and staying alive, not chasing them down and getting picked because they cant get enogh hits on the guy. Either way, it's still a really fun and under utilized plane.
One problem is that you use up those 60 or 90 drum magazine FF shells in the A5, you're basically flying with 2*20mm mg151 that have 250 shells of ammo storage. If you need firepower the A8 is the answer, changing the 2 20mm FF for MG151, and up-gunning the 7mm peashooters to 13mm that hurt some. Flying the A8 in a dogfight is for the experten , and never ever stay below 300mph if you don't want a fast trip to tower.
The A8 and 109g6 along with AH - died to me with the all-seeing mountain-penetrating real-time radar that does not resemble even the current radar systems. You can even look at the radar when you lost visuals at the plane you are dog-fighting against.
I suggest reverting the radar to like it was before and only field small maps. SA is a main key to AH as it should be.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: LCADolby on August 14, 2023, 04:39:58 AM
Once you learn how to fight in a 109 and have learned how to transition on a whim between the BnZ and the TnB you're almost an unstoppable force. Not to mention, once you learn to fly the 109 well, you can fly any plane well.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Shuffler on August 15, 2023, 05:01:07 PM
The trick to flying one plane successfully is simple.... make sure ity has 2 engines. :devil
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: 1stpar3 on August 16, 2023, 03:40:39 AM
The trick to flying one plane successfully is simple.... make sure ity has 2 engines. :devil
You misspelled 'Blenders'! :devil :rofl
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 16, 2023, 09:40:09 AM
I tend to stay away from the uber planes.
In AW the Spitfire was the uber plane, the path of least resistance to get kills/points. As soon as a Spit jockey bragged of kills it ended with, “ya, but you fly a spit, so…”.
In AH it seems to be the 109, why its perked. IMO, anything with nose guns will be more accurate and require less ammo per kill.
When I move from 51 (wing guns) to 190s (nose guns) my kills double. If I’m going after buffs it will more likely be an 190-A8. More accurate, more gun power.
Killing a 109 with a 51 is gratifying.
IMO, people who complain about a Runstang probably don’t understand how to fly it. After 2 turns it requires time to rebuild lost E, or it keeps dumping and becomes an easy target. A 109 can turn all day.
Skills of a 51 jockey will be pretty good in a A5 or A8. If I’m going to TnB its going to be in a Spit or Yak, with ease.
Selecting an AC that compliments your style of flying is key. Sometimes its muscle memory. I don’t want to fly a TnB then move to a BnZ. Easier to go from BnZ to TnB…IMO. 51 is my msin plane.
But that’s just me. <shrug> I suck no matter what I fly, I still have fun.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Mister Fork on August 16, 2023, 10:16:26 AM
I remember that it was either Rude or Midnight that taught me when I first started flying:
fly slow first so you can learn how to fly fast
Best advice ever to give a new pilot learning to fly. Great chats here guys.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Eagler on August 16, 2023, 10:23:40 AM
Yes the 109 is so easy to get kills in you see the skies in ma filled with them... not!
Every plane has its advantages and disadvantages when flown against a different plane than itself..then when the plane is the same it depends on the pilot and who has the most buddies close by that determines the outcome
Eagler
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 16, 2023, 11:51:11 AM
Yes the 109 is so easy to get kills in you see the skies in ma filled with them... not!
Every plane has its advantages and disadvantages when flown against a different plane than itself..then when the plane is the same it depends on the pilot and who has the most buddies close by that determines the outcome
Eagler
Yeah the 109 is definitely not a beginner plane. It's lack of dive ability and cockpit views make it very tough for people to get shots. It's because you have know how to set up shots rather than lead from the 6, and that takes time and practice. It's maneuverability is decent but you really have to understand flaps and throttle in vert ACM. The 109k is a very solid plane, but easy to compress and tough to get shots if you don't understand crossing and snap shots. The G14 is great, but still challenging if you don't know what you are doing especially if you don't use gondies.It's a decent turn fighter but really have to understand vert ACM and angles which is advanced concepts. Crazy to think its a 25 eny plane :rofl Yhe G2 is a lot of fun, but slow which makes it easy to get picked and not able to catch planes as easily. The Ki84 is a better plane to learn before jumping into the 109, imo. Very similar planes but the ki84 has a little better views, better roll rate, and maneuverability. I wouldnt consider the 109 in most cases a defense or attack plane, it's more of a mid alt furballer and bomber interceptor. Its great for furballing but you really have to learn defensive ACM more than other turn fighters or you will get picked since you cannot dive fast out of the fight if you have a guy bearing down on you.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 16, 2023, 04:09:08 PM
Yes the 109 is so easy to get kills in you see the skies in ma filled with them... not!
Every plane has its advantages and disadvantages when flown against a different plane than itself..then when the plane is the same it depends on the pilot and who has the most buddies close by that determines the outcome
Eagler
I didn’t say it was easy. My point was, as with many AC, once its learned its a killing machine. Guns, capabilities, power, E recovery… Doesn’t matter who flies it, its a brute compared to many other AC. Why its a fav.
Now the spit is easy.
The power killers are perked for a reason.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 16, 2023, 04:16:06 PM
Yeah the 109 is definitely not a beginner plane. It's lack of dive ability and cockpit views make it very tough for people to get shots. It's because you have know how to set up shots rather than lead from the 6, and that takes time and practice. It's maneuverability is decent but you really have to understand flaps and throttle in vert ACM. The 109k is a very solid plane, but easy to compress and tough to get shots if you don't understand crossing and snap shots. The G14 is great, but still challenging if you don't know what you are doing especially if you don't use gondies.It's a decent turn fighter but really have to understand vert ACM and angles which is advanced concepts. Crazy to think its a 25 eny plane :rofl Yhe G2 is a lot of fun, but slow which makes it easy to get picked and not able to catch planes as easily. The Ki84 is a better plane to learn before jumping into the 109, imo. Very similar planes but the ki84 has a little better views, better roll rate, and maneuverability. I wouldnt consider the 109 in most cases a defense or attack plane, it's more of a mid alt furballer and bomber interceptor. Its great for furballing but you really have to learn defensive ACM more than other turn fighters or you will get picked since you cannot dive fast out of the fight if you have a guy bearing down on you.
I’ve seen you dump planes with only few-several rounds. I prefer not to be down range with you in a 109. Once its learned and muscle memory develop, that thing is just wicked.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Shuffler on August 16, 2023, 04:48:37 PM
I remember that it was either Rude or Midnight that taught me when I first started flying:
fly slow first so you can learn how to fly fast
Best advice ever to give a new pilot learning to fly. Great chats here guys.
That is exactly what I do with newer folks. I get them to fly low and slow and learn to use flaps. When you fly fast, you can go right through targets. At some time you will end up slow somewhere and need the skill to survive. Learn slow first.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: guncrasher on August 16, 2023, 07:12:00 PM
dude, glad some of you fly different planes, I am all for it. when I started it was the zero, one of them, then the spits, then the niki, everythime I landed kills, it was blah, blah, fly the 190, 109, goon, whatever. now I fly the p51, been flying it for over 10 years, if eny goes to hell then I fly all the other pp planes.
Pony was my love. now when I fly unless I am the only unlucky one, i see a mix of planes ponies are not in the top of them.
so as to why flying one plane is not the answer you didnt ask the question. we fly what we want, whenever we want eny permitting. other than that get rid of bombers and gv's
semp
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: GasTeddy on August 17, 2023, 02:03:31 AM
I'm changing the plane relatively often. Probably too often to find out, what really fits me. Also not yet sure if I want to be a boomer or fifferist. At least Fi156 obeys me pretty well but its kill ratio is not very impressive. Maybe I should concentrate in GVs as so far haven't stalled a tank... :D
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Shuffler on August 17, 2023, 03:58:11 PM
I can hear Teddy now.... dang thing won't start. :rofl
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: icepac on August 18, 2023, 08:30:37 AM
Yak9u is a great all around plane. Most of my kills in it were above 25,000 feet.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 18, 2023, 09:57:00 AM
Some of my most fond memories in AH was learning/advancing my skills and knowledge in fighters that I planned on flying and signed up to fly in Scenarios. My first time in a Bf 109G-14 occurred because my friends signed up to fly them in a Scenario. I was a Bf 109G-2 guy and didn't love the 30mm so I never flew the K-4. Once I began to hone my skills in the G-14 I fell completely in love. For those 3-4 weeks of flying the G-14 exclusively, I developed an appreciation for the Bf 109 that I had not before. The G-14 is now my favorite airplane and has been since that event. Another fighter I took up because of an event was the Ki-84. I had no ambition to fly it even when it first came out. After learning its nuances and fragility, nimbleness and ferocity, I craved it. It is now easily in my top 5 favorite planes in AH. All because I signed up to fly one in an event.
Very true, the events provide a great opportunity to practice new planes. :aok Definitely recommended. The g14 and ki84 are 2 of my favorite planes as well.
One problem is that you use up those 60 or 90 drum magazine FF shells in the A5, you're basically flying with 2*20mm mg151 that have 250 shells of ammo storage. If you need firepower the A8 is the answer, changing the 2 20mm FF for MG151, and up-gunning the 7mm peashooters to 13mm that hurt some. Flying the A8 in a dogfight is for the experten , and never ever stay below 300mph if you don't want a fast trip to tower.
The A8 and 109g6 along with AH - died to me with the all-seeing mountain-penetrating real-time radar that does not resemble even the current radar systems. You can even look at the radar when you lost visuals at the plane you are dog-fighting against.
I suggest reverting the radar to like it was before and only field small maps. SA is a main key to AH as it should be.
I really dislike the 190A8, it should be used mostly as a tank killer, or for shooting ammo, radar, and buildings, and maybe a bomber interceptor. Its just too heavy and bulky to be used as a fighter and it's turn rate is horrendous, same for the F. I'd much prefer the A5. I wouldn't recommend a G6 either. Use the G2 if you want to fly earlier models and the 109f if you really want a challenge. I like the G2 better for furballing simply because of the gondolas. The G6 is just too heavy. The G2 also has a better nose for aiming than the G6 and turns better. G2 is probably one of my favorite birds, but its easy to get ganged in the MA as it's just a tad slow. The G14 is better for bigger furballs for that reason if there are more enemy than friendlies.
dude, glad some of you fly different planes, I am all for it. when I started it was the zero, one of them, then the spits, then the niki, everythime I landed kills, it was blah, blah, fly the 190, 109, goon, whatever. now I fly the p51, been flying it for over 10 years, if eny goes to hell then I fly all the other pp planes.
Pony was my love. now when I fly unless I am the only unlucky one, i see a mix of planes ponies are not in the top of them.
so as to why flying one plane is not the answer you didnt ask the question. we fly what we want, whenever we want eny permitting. other than that get rid of bombers and gv's
semp
Yeah I'm not saying you can't fly whatever you want whenever. The point of my post is to show different situations that you will have an easier time with if you fly certain planes in them. Rolling a P51 at a field being attacked is going to be tough for a new person who doesn't really understand the planes strengths and weaknesses, while flying a spit to attack a field isn't going to generate the results you want either. Not saying you can't fly them if you are so brave however its good to understand that certain planes are more capable in certain situations and can lead to more success early on.
Yak9u is a great all around plane. Most of my kills in it were above 25,000 feet.
Yak9U is a pretty decent bird. Great for furballing. Right there with the 109. Unfortunately the Yak3 F16 has overshadowed it. Imo, the yak3 should have never been created, and the eny should be higher. It's an extremely tough plane to shoot down and holds E extremely well. The Yak9u is a fun plane though does take some practice with its cannon and opposite torque. I'd recommend learning the 9u over the 3, but the 3 is probably better for noobs in defense and furballing.
In AW the Spitfire was the uber plane, the path of least resistance to get kills/points. As soon as a Spit jockey bragged of kills it ended with, “ya, but you fly a spit, so…”.
In AH it seems to be the 109, why its perked. IMO, anything with nose guns will be more accurate and require less ammo per kill.
When I move from 51 (wing guns) to 190s (nose guns) my kills double. If I’m going after buffs it will more likely be an 190-A8. More accurate, more gun power.
Killing a 109 with a 51 is gratifying.
IMO, people who complain about a Runstang probably don’t understand how to fly it. After 2 turns it requires time to rebuild lost E, or it keeps dumping and becomes an easy target. A 109 can turn all day.
Skills of a 51 jockey will be pretty good in a A5 or A8. If I’m going to TnB its going to be in a Spit or Yak, with ease.
Selecting an AC that compliments your style of flying is key. Sometimes its muscle memory. I don’t want to fly a TnB then move to a BnZ. Easier to go from BnZ to TnB…IMO. 51 is my msin plane.
But that’s just me. <shrug> I suck no matter what I fly, I still have fun.
Some good points here: The spit actually still Is an Uber plane in AH. Atleast the spit16, also a F16. It's probably one of the best fighters in the game. It's just that people die because they get caught up low n slow in a turn fight. It gets just as much kills as the P51 every month. I think its a nuisance plane and should be perked. (Considering the spit14 use to be perked and the 16 is way better). I hate that damn plane lol. It's just not necessarily suitable for attacking, though because it's so Uber people can get away with it.
The spits I would recommend are the Spit8 and 9 for defense. Very fun planes but not as uber. I'd also recommend trying a seafire off the CV. It's a fun one for a big furball and the cannons are helpful.
The P51 is flown wrong by 90% who fly it. They are never aggressive enough. The plane can get flaps out at 350 and can get almost any plane chasing it to overshoot at high speeds because of it. This allows you to be able to jump a 6 and turn the tables. Most people don't know defense ACM so they just run away. It can turn with a 109 at speeds above 300. That is your sweet spot. After 2 rolls, if you cannot get inside, then it's best to extend. A good trick is to drag a 109 down slightly in a chase so it gets over 400 mph, then you extend flaps in the P51 and do a nose down turn to defensive barrel roll. Because the 109 is going too fast, it compresses and cannot turn or slow down quickly enough. This allows you to force an overshoot to roll around it and jump the 6. I do this a lot with the P47 as well.
Your last point: Flying a plane that benefits your style is something you should consider. If you like to turn and burn, fly a turn and burn plane (generally defense type planes). If you like to BnZ fly an attack style plane. That being said, it's good to understand both types because you never know when you will need to utilize either tactics whether it's being forced into defense with a plane diving on you, or maintaining E in a TnB plane so you don't end up low n slow on the deck to get picked. Also, if your style is BnZ, then you shouldn't roll a BnZ plane during defense. The goal of defense is to turn quickly and jump planes 6s so they extend away from the field. You aren't going to be BnZing in this case. If you really have to BnZ than it's highly recommended to roll from a back field in an attack plane and get plenty of alt so you can dive on the attackers who will also be high. You will have to really make sure you keep your alt and don't chase planes to the deck because then other BnZ style planes will now be diving on you. Defending a base from a back field you have to be the most patient and understand your SA because as soon as you dive, other really fast planes may engage you. You have to make sure you keep the alt cap in this situation which takes a lot of patience and discipline. If you dive with higher cons around. Make sure you can escape so you can regain your alt and come back in.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 18, 2023, 12:23:04 PM
The A8 I use as you described. OR if I get HOed too much from specific group. Lol
Ironically The next vid, almost done, is P-51 vs 109. A personal file I picked to get acquainted with Vegas. its a 6 minute fight. It illustrates exactly what you just said about both 51 and 109. I avoid giving a 109 my 6 at all cost. Its going to take a good 51 jockey to take on a good 109 jockey. For whatever reason, spotting a 109 puts me on edge. There are some seriously good 109 pilots in this sim. They usually aren’t new. I’m going to have to be at my best to take it on.
I have stick issues, so my kill rate is not as high as it should be. But you’re going to work for my kill. :)
BTW, great post. IMO, this is what the boards should look like. Informative over throat cutting. + 1 I didn’t forget your vid. I just rather trash my own getting to know Vegas.
.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 18, 2023, 01:39:11 PM
The A8 I use as you described. OR if I get HOed too much from specific group. Lol
Ironically The next vid, almost done, is P-51 vs 109. A personal file I picked to get acquainted with Vegas. its a 6 minute fight. It illustrates exactly what you just said about both 51 and 109. I avoid giving a 109 my 6 at all cost. Its going to take a good 51 jockey to take on a good 109 jockey. For whatever reason, spotting a 109 puts me on edge. There are some seriously good 109 pilots in this sim. They usually aren’t new. I’m going to have to be at my best to take it on.
I have stick issues, so my kill rate is not as high as it should be. But you’re going to work for my kill. :)
BTW, great post. IMO, this is what the boards should look like. Informative over throat cutting. + 1 I didn’t forget your vid. I just rather trash my own getting to know Vegas.
.
I use to call it going on a "HO rampage" when I got mad at people HOing me. I'd grab a 190A8 with full guns and spray like a mother... they'd think twice haha
In "reality" a p51 should always be higher than a 109, or atleast be faster if at the same alt, or have more E if under it (speed from dive). So if the 109 dives it still cannot catch you. You have to use the 109s biggest weakness against it, speed and compression.
NP, I'm in no rush with a film. I appreciate whatever you put together. I too enjoy these types of discussions rather than drama based finger pointing. Talking about planes and situational aspects doesn't get enough mention here. :aok
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: LilMak on August 18, 2023, 02:42:47 PM
If you want to get good in any plane. The best advice I can give is…
Fly stupid. Die a lot. Try new things.
Most importantly…record your fights (especially the ones you lose) and watch the recordings from your enemy’s perspective.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: The Fugitive on August 19, 2023, 03:55:41 PM
I usually fly the P-51D. Anyone who knows it, it’s not a real TnB ac, and doesn’t recover E all that well,.. hence the Runstang. But I throw myself into TnB (most times 3 or 5 vs 1)intensionally. It teaches SA and ACM to survive and strict muscle memory. When I fly another more uber AC its like I can do whatever I want, and my kills accelerate.
Usually when I turn into a Runstang its about drawing one or two out and away of a horde so I can try to force them to fight my way. Once that hook is in the mouth (fish on!) I have better chances. I live that some are caught up in the weak fighter Runstang, I play on it. And one way is, as soon as they tire and pull out of the chase, I’m flipping on their 6. Once they see ne coming they have to flip again and burn more E. Most of my kills (the little I have time for) come this way. The psychological part of ACM.
IMO, thise who always fly uber TnB AC aren’t learning as much, even if they have higher kill rates, they usually aren’t that good in a P51. The discipline isn’t there. The opposite of going from P51 and then TnB AC. A Spitfire and 109 is easy as it gets (uber-ish)
I’m a much better pilot flying other AC in a scenario. Which I still believe the MA is just oractice for scenarios, which is my true goal. The MA is just practice. I don’t care much if my points are low in my he MA. :)
But it is so much fun twisting and turning in a pony!
https://youtu.be/jcUp9603zZw
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Animl-AW on August 19, 2023, 07:19:16 PM
But it is so much fun twisting and turning in a pony!
https://youtu.be/jcUp9603zZw
Lol, nice I do quite a bit of TnB on the deck over a base, usually against 3-5 on me. OTOH, once ya do that you just committed to dying soon. Once in a while I break free. But damn its fun. Most don’t expect that from a 51. :)
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Eagler on August 20, 2023, 07:52:38 AM
The plane goes so far then its the pilot
:cheers:
Eagler
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: FLS on August 20, 2023, 09:17:59 AM
The 109s are special because they have automatic slats. This gives them a high speed wing and a low speed wing. This likely makes them more difficult for new players.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: LCADolby on August 20, 2023, 01:47:44 PM
The P51 is much better than most AH pilots one dimensional flying allows. :uhoh
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: alskahawk on August 27, 2023, 08:48:13 PM
Fly what you like. It's your money. If you want to really get good in one plane, stick with it. Or jump around, try them all out.
I like to fly a particular aircraft for a month or two then switch to another plane. But then I play to escape real life and enjoy myself. :banana:
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Eagler on August 28, 2023, 06:36:30 AM
Monday Night Madness is a great place to get experience in multiple fighters without worrying about the hoing one experiences in MA
Eagler
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: icepac on August 28, 2023, 08:32:48 AM
Most people who fly only one plane……only fly one mission profile.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: icepac on August 28, 2023, 08:52:31 AM
The Ki84 was the Uber plane in air warrior.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Bopgun on August 28, 2023, 10:23:55 AM
Monday Night Madness is a great place to get experience in multiple fighters without worrying about the hoing one experiences in MA
Eagler
Ill be there tonight :rock
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Muzzy on August 28, 2023, 02:24:58 PM
One plane, many planes, it's really up to you. I've seen guys that stuck to one bird and dominated, but others that could put up a fight regardless of what they flew.
One thing that I learned was that variation will make you a better pilot in the long run. I started out in the A8, which made up for my poor marksmanship. I flew it to the point where I was comfortable but then I realized its weaknesses, so I moved to another plane. Eventually I had experience in every available plane, and I knew their strengths and weaknesses, and I was much better at knowing what to expect from my opponents because I had flown their birds before.
Sure, some rotations I went for as high a score as I could get, so I stuck with a comfort pick, but you never know what you might do with another bird. Just have fun with it.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: nrshida on August 28, 2023, 02:50:23 PM
I'm mostly this fellow as I found an affinity for the Ki-84 after an early Zero phase and easily flew that the most. Latterly I enjoyed the late model 109s but they are closer to the Ki-84 than a Spitfire is, IMHO. One thing I didn't do though was to stick to one style, only in chunks but it was always moving. When Skyrr showed up I learned to BnZ (in a dedicated aeroplane) to see what that was all about. But in the background I had moved anyway from purely stall fighting to +e fighting. My ACM is quite different from StepSis, say, I think he (or she) has a more effective fundamental technique but I was never very motivated by results or efficiency.
One thing about Violator's proposition of having multiple tools, it then more often seems to be the case you wanted a Ki-84 while you had already upped a K-4 etc. You can't alter the tools to the job once you've taken it out of the box and offered fights and situations were always fluxing :joystick:
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Muzzy on August 28, 2023, 05:56:18 PM
“Hamburger is still hamburger, no matter what you wrap it in”. Author unknown. :salute
"Spoonful of crap spoils bucketful of honey but a bucketful of crap does not became edible, even if you add spoonful of honey". Author has his picture in my ID. :D
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 30, 2023, 09:43:37 AM
Yeah, you know this post wasn't about saying not to fly what you want. I just wanted to shed some light on why flying what you want isn't always the best idea if you don't understand the gameplay, and how people play, and why you are at a disadvantage if you roll a P51 for base defense if you cannot get away to gain alt first. Fighting that thing on the deck is going to get you in trouble where as if you grabbed a more defense oriented plane that accels and turns quicker, you will have a better chance at being successful in the fight. I don't want people to get discouraged because they die easily in their favorite planes a lot when there is a better choice that can benefit them in the situation.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Wiley on August 30, 2023, 01:21:34 PM
One thing about Violator's proposition of having multiple tools, it then more often seems to be the case you wanted a Ki-84 while you had already upped a K-4 etc. You can't alter the tools to the job once you've taken it out of the box and offered fights and situations were always fluxing :joystick:
That's my experience quite often, the fight I took the best tool for the job at the time ends, and then a different set of enemies comes in.
If the enemies are committed to fighting, the all rounders like the KI84 are great. However if you run into a crowd of one pass and reset ponies, doras, and typhs, you're either going to have to be great at fighting from the bottom/getting shots on overshoots or you're going to have a bad time.
If I'm in something fast to run down the one pass and reset ponies, doras, and typhs I feel like I often run into a swarm of KI84s, Spit16s and Yak3s with alt on me. Just the way it works out. :joystick:
Generally speaking if I don't know what the enemy's up to, I will use a K4. It's faster than a lot of the all rounders and its main downside is the gun's not that user friendly. But it can dogfight decently, keep up with a lot of planes, and will take out bombers depending on how good of a gunnery day I'm having.
Several planes turn better but they aren't as fast/don't climb or accelerate as well. Those two attributes go a long, long way for me in the MA.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: fuzeman on September 02, 2023, 05:00:11 PM
Hmmm, this topic brings a certain special event to my mind that is now deceased.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Eagler on September 03, 2023, 06:52:56 AM
Hmmm, this topic brings a certain special event to my mind that is now deceased.
Can it be resurrected? :pray
Some of us miss that event, the pilots that participated and the host immensely!
:cheers:
Eagler
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: fuzeman on September 03, 2023, 08:20:49 AM
Guilty of hi-jacking. Attendance, attendance, attendance. I doubt that has changed. Ohshutupfuzeman.
Title: Re: Why only flying one plane is not the answer
Post by: Lazerr on September 03, 2023, 10:01:22 AM
I'd personally rather see a monthly combat challenge than a KOTH. Based on attendance, I'd say most agree. It could be on Friday evenings on the FSO off week.