Author Topic: mmmmriiiiiight.  (Read 2370 times)

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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« Reply #60 on: June 17, 2005, 02:56:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Raider179
A report by the Congressional Research Service undermines Vice President Dick Cheney's denial of a continuing relationship with Halliburton Co., the energy company he once led, Sen. Frank Lautenberg said Thursday.

The report says a public official's unexercised stock options and deferred salary fall within the definition of "retained ties" to his former company.

Without naming Cheney or Halliburton, the service reported that unexercised stock options and deferred salary "are among those benefits described by the Office of Government Ethics as 'retained ties' or 'linkages' to one's former employer.

According to The Post, while Cheney was defense secretary the Pentagon chose Halliburton subsidiary Brown & Root to study the cost effectiveness of outsourcing some military operations to private contractors. Based on the results of the study, the Pentagon hired Brown & Root to implement an outsourcing plan. Cheney became Halliburton CEO in 1995.



433,000 unexercised options of stock sounds like a good way to me to make money. Especially once you have a hand in boosting the company's profits through the roof.




Good find on the unexercised stock options and deferred salary, if it is not covered in his required transfer to a blind trust, then yes, he is wrong for not doing so. He SHOULD be called on it, and I'll be glad to see him get called on it.

However, the fact remains that Haliburton and Kellog Brown and Root have been getting the contracts for decades, and got them regardless of whether or not Cheney or any Republican was in office. Haliburton is not getting any contracts in any greater numbers than it was before Cheney became VP.

IF people are going to try to say that the war in Afghanistan, in Iraq, and the war on terrorism in general is being fought just to make Haliburton money, I think that is a stretch that just doesn't reach.
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Offline Silat

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« Reply #61 on: June 17, 2005, 03:10:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
now that was an interesting post...  

It is bad to intimidate that people are homosexual unless you do it?  and..

Would you say that more gay people were liberal or conservative?

lazs


Equal. Not that it matters but since you asked:
right now it seems the conserv gays have had more access to the White House:) GANNON

                              :lol
+Silat
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Offline Raider179

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« Reply #62 on: June 17, 2005, 03:21:34 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts


However, the fact remains that Haliburton and Kellog Brown and Root have been getting the contracts for decades, and got them regardless of whether or not Cheney or any Republican was in office. Haliburton is not getting any contracts in any greater numbers than it was before Cheney became VP.

IF people are going to try to say that the war in Afghanistan, in Iraq, and the war on terrorism in general is being fought just to make Haliburton money, I think that is a stretch that just doesn't reach.


1)I havent seen anyone say the war is "just being fought to make haliburton money"(at least on this board/thread). Key word here being "just" meaning only.

Oh and it shows Cheney profit's if Haliburton's profits increase. That is a direct financial link between the two.

What he will do with those profits remains unknown. (I have seen it said he will donate such and such amount to charity, but thought it sounded funny the way it was worded so I discounted it as mere media ploy, perhaps we can find more info on it, but who will know until he sells his shares and the longer he waits the less likely anyone is to remember.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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« Reply #63 on: June 17, 2005, 03:42:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Raider179
Here are some facts for you then.

1)Charging US $1.70/gallon for gas in the middle east.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,100202,00.html

 Two Democratic lawmakers say Vice President Dick Cheney's (search) former company, Halliburton (search), is gouging U.S. taxpayers while importing gasoline into Iraq. The Houston-based company contends it is paying the best price possible.

Reps. Henry Waxman (search) of California and John Dingell (search) of Michigan complained to the Bush administration that Halliburton's KBR subsidiary is billing the Army between $1.62 and $1.70 per gallon, while the average price for Middle East gasoline is 71 cents.

They also complained that Iraqis are charged between 4 cents and 15 cents at the pump for the imported gasoline.

2)Operating inside of Countries known to have US sanctions against them.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7119752/

Yet, in January, Halliburton won a contract to drill at a huge Iranian gas field called Pars, which an Iranian government spokesman said "served the interests" of Iran.  

"I am baffled that any American company would want to have employees operating in Iran," says Sen. Susan Collins, R-Maine. "I would think they'd be ashamed."  

Still, Halliburton stands out because its operations in Iran are now under a federal criminal investigation. Government sources say the focus is on whether the company set out to illegally evade the sanctions imposed ten years ago.

3)And finally bribery...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4163810/

The Justice Department has opened up an  inquiry into whether Halliburton Co. was  involved in the payment of $180 million in possible kickbacks to obtain contracts to build a natural gas plant in Nigeria during a period in the late 1990’s when Vice President Dick Cheney was chairman of the company, Newsweek has learned.


These are Facts, and they cause suspicion as to why a company that screws over its clients repeatedly, keeps on winning bids.




Interesting quotes you LEFT OUT of your posts.


 
There is no evidence that Cheney was aware of the payments in question and an aide said today the vice president has not been contacted about the probe.


A Justice Department official confirmed to NEWSWEEK today that prosecutors have been seeking information from Halliburton related to the Nigerian contract and that the company was cooperating. But the official said the company’s reference to being asked for “a report” by Justice was “not accurate.” Rather than a report, Justice has sought documents from the company—and Halliburton has been turning them over, the official said. Another Justice official described the inquiry as a review of documents supplied by Halliburton and said it was still in its early stages.

By the way, the above inquiry was going on while Ashcroft was still the AG, AND no one has been proven to have done anything wrong yet. Innocent until proven guilty.

Halliburton says the operation — videotaped by NBC News — is entirely legal. It's run by a subsidiary called "Halliburton Products and Services Limited," based outside the U.S. In fact, the law allows foreign subsidiaries of U.S. corporations to do business in Iran under strict conditions.

Other U.S. oil services companies, like Weatherford and Baker Hughes, also are in Iran. And foreign subsidiaries of NBC's parent company, General Electric, have sold equipment to Iran, though the company says it will make no more sales. (MSNBC is a Microsoft-NBC joint venture.)

Halliburton says it is unfairly targeted because of politics, but recently announced it is pulling out of Iran because the business environment "is not conducive to our overall strategies and objectives."


So, while they aren't doing anything different than other companies, they too are going to get out. They are a for profit corporation, like any other for profit corporation. Is it good that they are there? No. Should they be there? No. Is the fact that the company that reported this was also doing business there NEWS? No! Does that make it right? No. But the only reason Halliburton is NEWS is because it MIGHT make the current administration look bad. The best they can offer is that the subsidiary won't answer questions. There's a big surprise. Considering the continual investigations, an official at a subsidiary doesn't want to answer questions. Sounds like the subsidiary is practicing CYA.


"Although Iraq has the second largest oil reserves in the world, the U.S. taxpayer is, in effect, subsidizing over 90 percent of the cost of gasoline sold in Iraq," the lawmakers said in the latest Democratic attacks against the Houston company that received a no-bid contract.

The charges cover the purchase and transportation of the petroleum from Kuwait and other countries.


A little side note on this. Published reports show that both Kuwait and Qatar charged Halliburton prices for the products that were higher than the average local prices, because Halliburton was not an average local consumer. At least one report shows that Halliburton didn't charge an excessive markup on petroleum products purchased from Kuwait and Qatar and sold to the military.

The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, which chose Halliburton, has received bids for a replacement contract that could be awarded this month.

Corps spokesman Robert Faletti said he could not confirm the figures that Waxman and Dingell cited in a letter to Joshua Bolten, director of the Office of Management and Budget.

He said, however, that the contract is being audited by Congress and the Army.


And finally:

In a further move against Halliburton, Sen. Frank Lautenberg, D-N.J., announced Wednesday he would propose barring the government from awarding Iraq reconstruction contracts to companies that maintain close financial ties to the president, vice president or members of the president's Cabinet.

Lautenberg wants the measure added to an $87 billion reconstruction bill for Iraq and Afghanistan.

Cheney receives deferred payments from Halliburton and also has stock options.

Cheney's office has said the vice president had no role in the contract and that the deferred payments were for his services while he headed the company. He has said he would give the proceeds to charity should he profit from the exercise of stock options.


A special law to apply ONLY to companies that MIGHT have ties to the current administration, added to another piece of legislation. It conveniently enough is not a law that would apply to ANYONE, like other government officials, but ONLY to the CURRENT ADMINSTRATION, and ONLY to Iraq rebuilding.:rolleyes:

Oh, and 90% of what you are quoting from is OLD news, some from at least 2-3 years ago. Evidently, nothing has come of it in 2-3 years, but it is still news, still a scandal, and still fodder for a mudslinging contest.
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe


Offline Toad

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« Reply #64 on: June 17, 2005, 03:50:20 PM »
You're just no fun, Virgil.

Don't you get it? It's TEH BOOSH.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline slimm50

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« Reply #65 on: June 17, 2005, 03:55:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by JB88
darling, in case ...88

you never call me "darling".:(

Offline Toad

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« Reply #66 on: June 17, 2005, 03:59:04 PM »
Heck,

you don't have to call me darling, darling; you never even call me by my name.

Btw, I was drunk the night my mom got out of prison....
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Silat

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« Reply #67 on: June 17, 2005, 04:06:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
Again, after looking around to see what everyone was complaining about, and after talking to dozens of friends who have been in the military for decades, nothing is different now that Cheney is Vice President than it was when any other adminisatration was in office.

Cheney didn't invent the no bid government contract (not EXACTLY what you're saying, but more to the point, EXACTLY what people a implying or saying), that is utter nonsense. It does not apply to Haliburton any more than it does anyone else that I've heard of, again after asking people who have been there for decades.

I'm STILL asking, what is the difference between Haliburton getting those contracts NOW and say TWELVE years ago? They got them when Cheney was neither SecDef nor VP, so where is the big scandal?




Im with you Sav.
Halli is the company for the job and has been for many administrations.
If there are any conflicts then they should be investigated and proper action taken.
But I do understand that perception of the issue is important.
+Silat
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"Conservatism offers no redress for the present, and makes no preparation for the future." B. Disraeli
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Offline WMLute

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« Reply #68 on: June 17, 2005, 04:35:05 PM »
lol nice "Facts".

If anything, they prove opposite what was intended, due to the FACT nothing has come of them.

So far, we have been shown allusions, and hyperbole.  

Still waiting for actual "proof" as opposed to slander and conjecture.  Unless, that is, if y'all are ok with lynching people w/o having to fulfil your burden of proof.  If that's the case, keep it up, you're doing a great job.
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Offline WMLute

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« Reply #69 on: June 17, 2005, 04:51:37 PM »
actually, as much as I hate to hijack this thread, here are some interesting FACTS about Bill Clinton that I found fascinating.

ADMINISTRATION RECORDS SET
- The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
- Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates
- Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
- Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
- Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
- First president sued for sexual harassment.
- First president accused of rape.
- First first lady to come under criminal investigation
- Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
- First president to establish a legal defense fund.
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad


CRIME STATS
- Number of individuals and businesses associated with the Clinton machine who have been convicted of or pleaded guilty to crimes: 47
- Number of these convictions during Clinton's presidency: 33
- Number of indictments/misdemeanor charges: 61
- Number of imprisonments: 14
- Number of congressional witnesses who have pled the 5th Amendment, fled the country to avoid testifying, or (in the case of foreign witnesses) refused to be interviewed: 124


where were you guys when clinton was the pres?  I see alot of ya' comin' down hard on Cheny, yet turning a blind eye to the biggest crook to have ever held the office of the president.
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Absurdum est ut alios regat, qui seipsum regere nescit

Offline JB88

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« Reply #70 on: June 17, 2005, 04:53:29 PM »
the stats pretty much speak to the fact that people were not silent during his administration lute.

dont they?
this thread is doomed.
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word.

Offline Raider179

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« Reply #71 on: June 17, 2005, 04:54:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by WMLute
lol nice "Facts".

If anything, they prove opposite what was intended, due to the FACT nothing has come of them.

So far, we have been shown allusions, and hyperbole.  

Still waiting for actual "proof" as opposed to slander and conjecture.  Unless, that is, if y'all are ok with lynching people w/o having to fulfil your burden of proof.  If that's the case, keep it up, you're doing a great job.


Nothing has come of them?

http://www.ocnus.net/cgi-bin/exec/view.cgi?archive=51&num=13266

Hmmm Nigeria for example?

US oil services group Halliburton will pay 7.5 million dollars to settle charges of misleading accounting when Vice President Dick Cheney was in charge, regulators said. Cheney, who is not accused of any wrongdoing, gave sworn testimony to the Securities and Exchange Commission and "cooperated willingly and fully" in the investigation, the SEC said in a statement. The company struck a deal to pay 7.5 million dollars while former Halliburton financial controller Robert Muchmore agreed to pay 50,000 dollars, it said.

All I am saying is Halliburton profits off illegal activities. And Cheney has 433,000 shares of stock. That pretty much sums it up.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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« Reply #72 on: June 17, 2005, 04:55:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toad
You're just no fun, Virgil.

Don't you get it? It's TEH BOOSH.


I get it, I get it. But can't we keep playing?
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe


Offline Maverick

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« Reply #73 on: June 17, 2005, 04:57:30 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by WMLute
Still waiting for actual "proof" as opposed to slander and conjecture.  Unless, that is, if y'all are ok with lynching people w/o having to fulfil your burden of proof.  If that's the case, keep it up, you're doing a great job.


This is the O'Club. some folks don't need no steeeeenking facts. They get in the way of the conjecture, supposition and plain fantasy.
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Offline Sixpence

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mmmmriiiiiight.
« Reply #74 on: June 17, 2005, 05:05:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mini D
Actually, I think it is you that is a bit confused as to what a "conflict of interest" is.


It's when you want to do your girlfriend's sister
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)