The Notorious DA Challenge

[Vudak]

What's wrong with people going off to the DA?

I've never understood why anyone except someone who thinks they have something to "lose" would decline.

At the very least it gets two mouths out of the MA and off 200 for a few minutes.

[mechanic]

Shawk is not easy meat under 10k, he does take uneven fights on, and i have found him on the deck TnB'ing his Dora with spitfires so you guys are wrong.

thats not an argument, but a true statement.

and yes shawk is still a cherry picken dweebn, but he can fight when he is forced to.

S! all

[wetrat]

Originally posted by JMFJ
I think that if you are going to challenge someone to the DA there should be something on the line for the player challenged.

Example: The challenger should be willing to foot the next months HT bill for the player that was challenged, should the challenger lose.  Best of 3

It would definitely be entertaining, I would get off line and go take a seat at the colleseum (DA) to see which gladiator's blood gets spilled.  At least It would mean alot more when a challenge is shouted.

Cause for the most part the only challenges I see are from guys who know they have an advantage, or they won't run there mouth.  You don't see skyrock, chi, or any of the other guys that use the 200 channel alot challenging SHawk to the DA.

JMFJ

SHawk is a bad example... he sucks.

[yayyyy]

Originally posted by Quah!
[SIZE=16]POK3M0N RULZ TEL3TUB1eS   zOMG QUAH!!11!1[/SIZE]

[SIZE=200]D1G1M0N P1K4 P1K4[/SIZE]

[Waffle]

Originally posted by mechanic
Shawk is not easy meat under 10k, he does take uneven fights on, and i have found him on the deck TnB'ing his Dora with spitfires so you guys are wrong.

That's because he's jockeying for posistion at the head of the vulch line.

[mechanic]

well the best bit about him in my eyes is he doesnt give a damn about what we say


and no one hears people having a go at me on the board everyday.  i must not be as good or difficult to fight than shawk

[DREDIOCK]

Originally posted by wetrat
SHawk is a bad example... he sucks.

Naaa SHawk is good.
He's nowhere near that #1 ranking good but hes' good.

Good enough so that I will specifically hunt him when I know he's in the area.
I've specifically made it a point to study the way he flies to make hunting and identifying him easier.

Good enough that
I'd rather know his exact location at all times then then fly around not knowing where he is.

As a result of this I've gotten the better of him our last few meetings
but I know he is very dangerous if you arent careful.
Make a mistake and you usually pay for it

[Morpheus]

The true measure of a man is not his successes in life... But the risks he overcame to get there.

Aint it funny how the ones who avoid risk at all costs in this game are rewarded with their name on the front page?

Of course this game aint life, and this of course is just my opinion.

Now back to l33t Teletubie talk.

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK
I dont bother going to the DA.

I'd much rather kill my oponent in the MA where all can see

Besides. Half the fun is hunting him down

You get the point of the game, congratulations!

Zazen

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by Morpheus
MA is nice, its always fun to run into the same people time and time again in the course of a night. But DA is where the real learning takes place. Ask anyone who's spent any good amount of time in there and they will tel you the very same thing. But there is no substitute for the strain put on your s/a like the MA can do.

I'll use one of my favorite analogies here, "Saying a pilot is great in the MA because he has mastered the 1 vs. 1, same plane, Co-Alt/E merge in the DA is exactly like saying an artist is great because he is able to draw a geometrically perfect triangle."

There is is sooooooooooooo much more that goes into being an 'effective' MA pilot than mastering a knockout merge move in one or a couple of planes (usually only TnB planes). I have duelled literally thousands of times, for the most part it's the same co-alt/co-E mege at low-alt, he who has the 'slickest' merge usually wins. That in no way compares to the infinite variety of multiple plane engagement types, relative and disparate plane types and E states the MA offers. Having the exact same MA engagement as another is highly unlikely...ever.

As a learning tool to become an all-around effective pilot in any plane use the MA, you will need to learn alot more than a 'slick as owl chit" merge move. If you want to work on a co-E/Alt masta-merge move or how to ride the edge to get that extra second off from a stall turn in a Spit the DA is a great place to learn that. Listen to channel 200, 75% of the obsessive-compulsive whiners after they die are those that have a 'slick as owl chit' merge move, fancy themselves DA super-stars, can jerk a Spit around like it made 'em angry, but are not effective in the MA because they lack the other skills that make a good pilot in that unstructured chaotic environment (ie: Situational Awareness, Tactical Awareness, Gunnery, Energy Management, Wingman Tactics, Teamwork). The DA teaches none of those other things, they can only be learned by ALOT of MA experience. Who would you rather have clearing your six? A guy with a wonderfully fabulous, unbeatable merge masta-move in a Spit5 if he's co-alt/E, same plane cultivated by years of DA challenges and watermelon talking, or a MA fighter jock who's a good stick, with great SA, TA, good gunnery, tactics and teamwork cultivated by years of trigger-time slugging it out in an infinite variety of situations?

Enjoy.


Zazen

[BBQ_Bob]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
Because SHawk is too timid to engage in a 1v1 fight.



ack-ack

Talk about someone not wanting to go below 10K, Ack Ack is the only one here that has NASA on the side of his P-38.


From the UKNIGHTED Hit List
Got Shawk

[Morpheus]

Zazen I've told you how many times already?

You-do-not-impress-anyone.

Talk about fighters like you know them... Yet spend the vast majority of your on line time in a field gun or osti.

I told you before... Save the preaching for those that do not know you. Cause you'll always suck to those who do know you.

Edit: Few more things...

Anyone who's gone into the DA will tell you without a doubt in their mind that they perform better in the MA because of their knowledge gained in the DA.

What you learn in the DA will simply help you... Another tool so to speak... To build on your skills in the MA. Dont think for a minute that energy tactics are not learned in the DA. Again, anyone who knows about dueling will tell you its simply not about turning your plane as fast and as hard as you can to gain a gun solution.

There is alot more to be had in the DA than just 1v1s. You can set up 2 on 1's or 2 on 2s ect. They help greatly in providing you with more "tools" which you can use when you need them in the MA. We used to have a little even with a dozen or so people in the DA just about every sunday... One thing I heard the most after it was over.... a few days later was how helpful that was for them and that they learned alot about fighter tactics that they could then use in the MA.

So please... You are giving people the wrong idea about the DA. Its in no way just...yank the stick as hard as you can and get to the other guy first.

If more people would go to the DA and spend some time learning in there, and gain some confidence in them selves, things might be a little different in the MA than what they curently are.

Could you do all of the above in the MA? Sure you can. Could you do all of the above to the frequency you can in the DA... In the MA? Nope.

If you think your so bad Zazen why dont you stop by one day... That's not chest thumping... Its an invitation.

[wetrat]

I agree with Zazen for the most part (wingman tactics and teamwork are unnecessary ), BUT... I learned how to be effective in a fighter in the DA. Granted, it was with Urchin (I'm sure some of you oldies remember that bastid ) teaching me stuff, but the DA is the best place to learn rolling scissors/flat scissors/reversals/etc. In my opinion, you won't really learn anything in the DA flying spits (or other TnB'ers).. your best bet is with something like a 109, and against someone who isn't all about merging at 200mph so they can use their idiotic DA merge (that noone would even consider using in a real situation).

That being said, the co-alt, co-E, head-on/cold gun (I'd totally blast someone in the MA if they pulled some of the stuff I see on merges in the DA) merges in the DA are in NO way reflective of the actual MA game... they rarely happen, and, in all honesty, I prefer fighting from an alt/E disadvantage than "merging." What separates the men from the boys in the MA is the ability to kill people on your 6, gain an advantage quickly over someone with more alt/E, and handle situations where you've got more than 1 fighter going after you. THOSE things can only be mastered in the MA, but the best place to learn the fundamentals is in the DA with someone (ie. a good stick) attacking you from an alt advantage, showing you how to reverse on someone, etc.


Not that I have anything against the DA - other than some of the retarded merges that go on (ie. the ones where whoever merges slowest wins), that's where the best fighting is done, and it's the best place to learn how to fight 1v1.

And Zazen, what you said about it only being "better" sticks challenging people to the DA... I call BS on that. 9/10 people I see challenging someone to  a duel SUCK. BADLY. Nearly everyone that's actually worth a damn in a fighter doesn't bother with that kinda stuff (obvious exception being Shane - I know there are others, drawing a blank). I think just about everyone that's "called me out" in recent memory (I have a really good memory) was a newbie that I wouldn't piss on if they were on fire.

-rat

[mechanic]

Originally posted by Morpheus
Zazen I've told you how many times already?

You-do-not-impress-anyone.

 

I'm afraid i have to disagree, I know him resonably well, and he has certainly impressed me a few time in the arena, not to mention being a civil and inteligible BB member. his anti air gunnery is the finest in the game, and after a heated discusion in here he shot my spit5 down in his pony. the circumstances and advantages he had we're the very basis of his agument. so although i still disagree (i forget about what) his argument still stands at 1 - 0 between us for fighter planes.

what you might dislike in him could be his self confidence ?
(selfconfidence. arogance.  any difference? only in the eyes of the beholder)

[Morpheus]

I dont dislike anything about him. That's why you and I are totally different people. I dont think that him saying the DA is a worthless place is even remotely close to being correct.

As for you and arguments... Well... You lost yours with me too. So what's your point?