Author Topic: Al Qaeda lost (Read 3244 times)

Tango · « **Reply #75 on:** September 26, 2007, 04:26:36 PM »

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Originally posted by Viking
To even mention the incident in the same context as the Holocaust is an insult to the victims of the Nazis and to the Jewish people as a whole. At the time, the gassing of the Kurds wasn't even illegal.

BOTH incidents were the murder of innocent civilians. How is it an insult to "mention the incident in the same context as the Holocaust"?

Are you saying one was worse than the other? BOTH cases was murder and needed to be stopped.

Dadano · « **Reply #76 on:** September 26, 2007, 04:47:31 PM »

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Originally posted by Tango
Unlike you I don't want events like that to happen again if we can prevent them. Sounds like you would be more like those German citizens that looked the other way while the Holocaust was happening.

Darfur.

VOR · « **Reply #77 on:** September 26, 2007, 04:48:25 PM »

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Originally posted by Tango
Unlike you I don't want events like that to happen again if we can prevent them. Sounds like you would be more like those German citizens that looked the other way while the Holocaust was happening.

Big on accusations aren't you?

Tango · « **Reply #78 on:** September 26, 2007, 04:52:56 PM »

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Originally posted by VOR
Big on accusations aren't you?

Small on caring aren't you?

VOR · « **Reply #79 on:** September 26, 2007, 04:56:17 PM »

No, I'm not small on caring but I am big on honesty.

Unless I'm mistaken, that was another accusation?

john9001 · « **Reply #80 on:** September 26, 2007, 05:54:54 PM »

librul::"we should attack every evil dictator in the world at the same time."

librul::" the US military is "broken" and can't even win in Iraq, bring the troops home and end the war"

Tango · « **Reply #81 on:** September 26, 2007, 06:14:43 PM »

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Originally posted by john9001
librul::"we should attack every evil dictator in the world at the same time."

librul::" the US military is "broken" and can't even win in Iraq, bring the troops home and end the war"

Careful John. That could be considered an "accusation".

Viking · « **Reply #82 on:** September 26, 2007, 06:38:34 PM »

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Originally posted by john9001

What was unclear?

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Originally posted by SteveBailey
Does that make it less reprehensible?

Depends on whether you consider legality and morality to be linked. I personally do not, so my answer to your question is: No. Whether it was legal or not does not affect the morality (or immorality) of the act.

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Originally posted by Tango
BOTH incidents were the murder of innocent civilians. How is it an insult to "mention the incident in the same context as the Holocaust"?

Are you saying one was worse than the other? BOTH cases was murder and needed to be stopped.

Not true. The Holocaust was the mass murder of millions of innocent civilians for nothing more than racial bigotry and cruelty. The Holocaust is perhaps unrivaled in the cruelty and complete pointlessness of the crime.

The chemical bombardment of the Kurdish village of Halabja in 1988 was an act of war. Halabja was located on the front line of the Iran-Iraq war and was at the time of the bombardment occupied by Iranian forces and Kurdish guerrillas fighting on the Iranian side. Yes ... the Kurds betrayed Iraq and fought for Iran. Chemical weapons were used by both Iraq and Iran during that 8 year war, and was not at the time classified as a "weapon of mass destruction", but as conventional munitions. Iraq and Iran were not signatories to the treaty banning chemical weapons, and neither was the Unites States of America for that matter. Under international law and the articles of the Geneva Conventions Halabja was a legitimate military target controlled by an enemy force, attacked and bombarded by weapons that were legal at the time (though frowned upon).

Considering that you are from a country that has used nuclear weapons on two cities and firebombed several others I find your outrage more than a little hypocritical.

And yes ... it is an insult to compare the horrors of the Holocaust to an act of war. By doing so you belittle the people that suffered and perished and degrade the meaning of the word "Holocaust".

john9001 · « **Reply #83 on:** September 26, 2007, 07:22:00 PM »

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Originally posted by Viking

Considering that you are from a country that has used nuclear weapons on two cities and firebombed several others I find your outrage more than a little hypocritical.

Considering that you are from a country that welcomed the german invaders and gave up it's natural resources and women i don't think you are in a position to criticize what USA did in WW2.

The US fought the war and did what it had to do to win.

Viking · « **Reply #84 on:** September 26, 2007, 07:44:23 PM »

Actually Norway was fighting the Germans long before the USA even entered the war and we kept fighting until VE day, but ... I'm not criticizing what the USA did in WWII, and that's my point that obviously went right over your head. Snappy knee-jerk reaction though!

Tango · « **Reply #85 on:** September 26, 2007, 08:11:39 PM »

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Originally posted by Viking
... it is an insult to compare the horrors of the Holocaust to an act of war. By doing so you belittle the people that suffered and perished and degrade the meaning of the word "Holocaust".

I find it interesting that Human Rights Watch considered the gasing of the Kurds genocide, as well as the rest of the world, but you consdier it an act of war that was justifiable.

As for the Holocaust, it was one of the, if not THE most, disgraceful acts of evil ever commited. I know that and have known that, and I find it offensive that you make it sound like what was done the Kurds was justified.

ANY dictator that commits genocide needs to be taken out of power. Peacfully or with force. If the people of Europe in 1938 had stood up to Hitler, millions of Jews may have been saved. Instaed many of them chose to look the other way. Pretty much the same way alot of them did with Iraq and now Iran.

LEADPIG · « **Reply #86 on:** September 27, 2007, 07:46:51 AM »

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Originally posted by bongaroo
See now this bugs me just a little bit because to me it sounds like you've been brainwashed to spew the same rhetoric that the Republicans push everyone with. Contributing to the discussion intelligently would have you engaging what he said with facts, not attacking the person as dumb and brainwashed.

Are you sure you haven't been brainwashed? Starting to believe the long line of bull that Bush has been laying for 8 years?

My thoughts exactly. They say everyone else is brainwashed, when they themselves sound like a tape recording. Alot of ventriliquist dummies.

I honestly can't see why half the people here thought Iraq was a good idea, is a good idea, and will be a good idea. It's pretty obvious were're getting sucker punched over there. Can't see how that's a good idea. Only a masochist would want to continue at this rate.

LEADPIG · « **Reply #87 on:** September 27, 2007, 07:54:40 AM »

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Originally posted by Tango
I find it interesting that Human Rights Watch considered the gasing of the Kurds genocide, as well as the rest of the world, but you consdier it an act of war that was justifiable.

As for the Holocaust, it was one of the, if not THE most, disgraceful acts of evil ever commited. I know that and have known that, and I find it offensive that you make it sound like what was done the Kurds was justified.

ANY dictator that commits genocide needs to be taken out of power. Peacfully or with force. If the people of Europe in 1938 had stood up to Hitler, millions of Jews may have been saved. Instaed many of them chose to look the other way. Pretty much the same way alot of them did with Iraq and now Iran.

I didn't agree with that either Tango. Genocide is genocide. As for the second part, what possible justification could their be for going around toppling dictators? The U.S. military should be used to protect the U.S. that's it. Not going around toppling people we don't like. I think we should stay out of those things unless we are going to be directly effected.

I hear the argument by a lot of folks here. "Look what Sadaam was doing to his people he needed to be stopped" Why the sudden outpouring of support. I say if there was no oil in Iraq he can do whatever he wants to his people, it's not our business. Soldiers lifes or worth more than that, i can barely stomach that they are dieing over there for basically amounts to oil now.

SkyRock · « **Reply #88 on:** September 27, 2007, 08:08:41 AM »

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Originally posted by john9001
librul::"we should attack every evil dictator in the world at the same time."

librul::" the US military is "broken" and can't even win in Iraq, bring the troops home and end the war"

I'm not sure what you are referring to, but I think priority would be what most would want! When we go around and only appear concerned with the lives of a nation that has resources to plunder, it takes away from our moral position. It is inexcusable and irresponsible to act in such a manner. It is defintiely not the way I want our government to represent me. Does political pride mean more to you than doing the right thing?

Well if you answered no, then we have to prioritize the needs and procede with very calculated planning.

LEADPIG · « **Reply #89 on:** September 27, 2007, 08:12:35 AM »

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Originally posted by Jackal1
You straddle the fence so much it`s a wonder you haven`t pulled a groin muscle.

Acting on information that is to the best of your knowdlegde (WMD'S) true, to me is not being dishonest. Acting on information that is to the best of your knowledge false and then putting the burden of that on other people is to me misleading, dishonest, reprehensible and impeachable. I believe Bush commited the former. Bush is not smart enough to be misleading on purpose. Now should he be impeached, possibly, for blatant errors and malfeasance he has thrown on the backs of our soldiers, and other lies i believe he has told and knew were lies and continued to propagate at the expense of the fighting men under him. For the latter to me that is an impeachable offense. For plain being stupid which i believe Bush is, that's debatable. To me however Bush has done many more wasteful and detrimental things with regard to human life, than Bill Clinton ever did for his laughable offense. Hell they'd have to impeach more than half the presidential alumni if that was the offense.