Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang

[lazs2]

bones..  I don't get it.  If you are never going to get a thing out of the deal.. and you are going to spend all of your time and money on working on it anyway...

Why not just put it out there for everyone?

It is possible that you are some unsung genius and not a bitter nutjob.   I have no way of knowing.   I do know that I can't figure out your explanation for why you are acting the way you are.

Why not just open a website and put all your thoughts out on it?   why not update as you progress?   If it is worth a damn.. there should be plenty of people who see the value and would be glad to contribute even.

If you have lost faith in people...   I would put forth that your attitude doesn't do much for my faith in people.

lazs

[Bones]

I got my numbers from http://rredc.nrel.gov/solar/old_data/nsrdb/redbook/atlas/

I made my assumptions based on solar insolation in kilowatt-hours per square meter per day.

This is a physical phenomenon based on the sun and the earth.  Configuration of the system is moot.

http://www.solar4power.com/solar-power-insolation-window.html

The chart in the link above shows the insolation for many US cities.

This shows that your goal of 3kw/10 sq ft is much more than the sun sends us.

Allow me to take anohter tack.  What you do not know about my design is plentiful.  You have not idea how or what is being coverted to what in the design.  The assumptions you are making are too many to list.  You have no idea what energy or method is being used to convert to electricity.  You are also assuming a flat conversion of energy per square foot.  It is quite easy to multiply the amount of energy collected per square foot.

[moot]

I'm just the messenger so don't shoot me.. I think he means that there's not that much solar energy falling over that area to begin with.

[Bones]

I understand what he is saying and I know what he is referring to.  It assumes a flat model.  The same amount of energy is also available 1 foot off the ground.  Then again at 2 feet off the ground, then again at 3 feet off the ground and so on.

It is more an engineering issue than a scientific one.  There is one new piece of engineering/science, which if explained, would help you and Holden understand much more what is going on in the process.  That is my pride and joy.  The piece I worked on for over 15 years.  The piece that makes it all much easier to do, but not impossible to do without it.

I know you would like to know about it, but I am not giving that away to anyone.

[moot]

Hehe  

[Toad]

I am pretty much flabbergasted.

So you have this big secret that would <edit> potentially improve the quality of life for many, but not all </edit> and it's already working but.... you can't tell anyone and you're going to burn your notebooks and take the secret to your grave because.... <edit> you had bad luck with investors and you are so bitter about mankind in general?
</edit>

Gotcha.

[Bones]

I do not recall saying no one believed me.  If that works for you, then run with it.

I would not categorize what I have done to be a huge boon to humanity.  It had the potential to improve the quality of life for many, but not all.

Really never felt like I owed anyone an explanation for anything I have done in my life.  Whether or not I am believed makes no difference to me.

Look at it this way.  I thought of it.  You can be sure others will think if it as well.  It is the nature of invention.  Maybe those others will have better luck with investors and not be so bitter about mankind in general.  I am probably driven more by spite than any other emotion at this moment in time.

Next, will be my car.  It will take a few years, but it will get done.

[Maverick]

Toad,

I think that the discussion on solar in this part of the thread has just dropped to the "neener neener neener I know a secret and you don't!" level.

[Bones]

I like that.

Appropriate on so many levels.

[Bones]

bones..  I don't get it.  If you are never going to get a thing out of the deal.. and you are going to spend all of your time and money on working on it anyway...

Why not just put it out there for everyone?

It is possible that you are some unsung genius and not a bitter nutjob.   I have no way of knowing.   I do know that I can't figure out your explanation for why you are acting the way you are.

Why not just open a website and put all your thoughts out on it?   why not update as you progress?   If it is worth a damn.. there should be plenty of people who see the value and would be glad to contribute even.

If you have lost faith in people...   I would put forth that your attitude doesn't do much for my faith in people.

lazs

Missed this before.  I was not ignoring you.

You are correct.  You do not know if I am a nutjob or the real deal. However, I thought I was pretty clear.  I was doing it for the money.  I took my life savings, countless hours, and poured it into this project  and others.

I sought out investors.  They told me they had to have a working model.  I did it.  Then they wanted a full blown model.  I did that. Then they wanted the plans to the models so they could have third party people verify them.  All without showing me a nickle.  That I did not do and will not do.  I do not have the money for a patent attorney and right now feel it would be a waste of money.  I got screwed out of a patent before.

In my life I have made a lot of people very rich.  Twice burned.  It was not gong to happen again.  I have nothing to show for the millions I made for others but some plaques on the wall.  When I need motivation to go keep going I remind myself of what I have created that will never be available to anyone.  I can say, "Screw society!" with a smile on my face.

I am not above rubbing salt in the wound, so I will probably post pictures of the system when it is completed.  No one will be able to tell enough about it to help duplicate it.

[CAP1]

Missed this before.  I was not ignoring you.

You are correct.  You do not know if I am a nutjob or the real deal. However, I thought I was pretty clear.  I was doing it for the money.  I took my life savings, countless hours, and poured it into this project  and others.

I sought out investors.  They told me they had to have a working model.  I did it.  Then they wanted a full blown model.  I did that. Then they wanted the plans to the models so they could have third party people verify them.  All without showing me a nickle.  That I did not do and will not do.  I do not have the money for a patent attorney and right now feel it would be a waste of money.  I got screwed out of a patent before.

In my life I have made a lot of people very rich.  Twice burned.  It was not gong to happen again.  I have nothing to show for the millions I made for others but some plaques on the wall.  When I need motivation to go keep going I remind myself of what I have created that will never be available to anyone.  I can say, "Screw society!" with a smile on my face.

I am not above rubbing salt in the wound, so I will probably post pictures of the system when it is completed.  No one will be able to tell enough about it to help duplicate it.

smart thing not giving them the plans and stuff......they sound like they were roping ya along. 

i thought that once you had a patent on something, it was yours and yours only for whatever the time was? or was that twisted around by a ""better"" lawyer than you had?

[Holden McGroin]

Allow me to take anohter tack.  What you do not know about my design is plentiful.  You have not idea how or what is being coverted to what in the design.  The assumptions you are making are too many to list.  You have no idea what energy or method is being used to convert to electricity.  You are also assuming a flat conversion of energy per square foot.  It is quite easy to multiply the amount of energy collected per square foot.

If I change the design of a dam can I multiply the amount of water so that the river flows over it twice or is there only so much water flowing by?

Enlighten me.  How can you harvest more sunlight than the sun sends us?  If the sun sends us 1 kw per sq meter, designing a collector that is not more than a sq meter that collects more than 1 kw is a guaranteed Nobel Prize in physics.

[Bones]

smart thing not giving them the plans and stuff......they sound like they were roping ya along. 

i thought that once you had a patent on something, it was yours and yours only for whatever the time was? or was that twisted around by a ""better"" lawyer than you had?

Deep pockets can pretty much win whatever case they want in our court system.

If I change the design of a dam can I multiply the amount of water so that the river flows over it twice or is there only so much water flowing by?

Enlighten me.  How can you harvest more sunlight than the sun sends us?  If the sun sends us 1 kw per sq meter, designing a collector that is not more than a sq meter that collects more than 1 kw is a guaranteed Nobel Prize in physics.

I'll say it one more time.  You and those two sites you are quoting, make assumptions that do not apply to my design.  You can keep quoting them like they are some type of holy grail for energy creation, but they still do not apply to my design.  Flat panel collectors?  Voltaics?  Not even close.  You have no idea what is involved in my design.

I'll toss you a bone.  A properly engineered collector could focus 100 square feet of sunlight in an area as little as 8 square feet.  Nothing tricky about it.  It is just an engineering challenge.

So the first assumption you made was I told you the area of my collector and I have not.  Therefore you cannot make any further assumptions about the power output.  Whether it is based on voltaics or solar collection makes no difference.

I tried to hint at you that you were assuming a flat model.  I thought you might catch that.  If you still do not get it, then just drop it.

[Holden McGroin]

I'll say it one more time.  You and those two sites you are quoting, make assumptions that do not apply to my design. 

I will say it one more time.

They do not. The 2 sites I quote show how much energy the sun imparts upon a square meter of the surface of the earth.

Insolation is a measure of solar radiation energy received on a given surface area in a given time. It is commonly expressed as average irradiance in watts per square meter (W/m²) or kilowatt-hours per square meter per day kW·h/m²·day.

Over the course of a year the average solar radiation arriving at the top of the Earth's atmosphere is roughly 1366 watts per square meter.

By the time it gets to the earths surface, it is appx 1000 w/m2.

Regardless of your design, you can not harvest more solar radiation per square meter than the sun sends us.  This is not based upon design, but based upon the physical world we live in.

You could gather more energy with mirrors and reflect light to the collector, but then the mirrors are collectors and your surface area increases as you collector area is now including the mirrors:  the 1 kw/m2 is still sacrosanct.

Your 3 kw/m2 is bogus, you cannot do it.   You cannot design around the constants of our earth.

[lazs2]

bones..  at the risk of maybe getting a letter bomb in the mail....

I have upgraded you from nutjob to dangerous bitter nutjob.

I bet your system wouldn't help anyone.   

I know if I exaggerated the case a little I could say that I have come up with several ideas in the past that have made others millions and.. I never seen a cent of it.

What I did was enjoy the fact that others had a good time with some of my ideas.. 

lazs