Adjustment to Scoring (idea)

[Wax]

I have to say I like some of the ideas. I was thinking. I see a lot of talk about the Hoard and that seems to be 1 of the  problems. How is the hoard created? By Missions? why not limit the amount of missions during uneven sides or when ENY kicks in on all sides or the side with the most #s that is doing the hoarding. Would this help create less hoarding? just a thought

[BiPoLaR]

or even do ENY per base

[Lusche]

I have to say I like some of the ideas. I was thinking. I see a lot of talk about the Hoard and that seems to be 1 of the  problems. How is the hoard created? By Missions? why not limit the amount of missions during uneven sides or when ENY kicks in on all sides or the side with the most #s that is doing the hoarding. Would this help create less hoarding? just a thought

I don't think so, because you don't need an official mission (created with AH mission planner) to conduct a NOE mission. Large & better organized squads (and that are the ones usually being at the core of those rapid series of landgrabbing NOE's) certainly can get around that restriction with ease.
The folks that could not mount a raid without mission planner arent the most successful landgrabbers anyway

[xNOVAx]

Another thing (not sure if this has been mentioned already).. If someone kills someone within 30 seconds of upping on the ruway, that kill will not be added into the # of kills that show up when you land at the end of a sortie.. You could have 20 "vulches" but 2 actual kills, and when you land it only says 2 kills.. I think a big part of why people vulch so much is to get their name highlighted at the end of a sortie with a ton of kills.. Everyone gives you <S>'s and WTG's having no idea you just vulched a bunch of helpless planes on the runway, but it's always 'nice' to be recognized right?? People shouldn't be recognized for vulching IMO (myself included) but should be recognized for legit kills which would hold more weight if this was implemented..

[Zazen13]

I have to say I like some of the ideas. I was thinking. I see a lot of talk about the Hoard and that seems to be 1 of the  problems. How is the hoard created? By Missions? why not limit the amount of missions during uneven sides or when ENY kicks in on all sides or the side with the most #s that is doing the hoarding. Would this help create less hoarding? just a thought

In AW there was a mechanic whereby only so many people from your team could up from a base until they dispersed and thinned out over the adjacent areas. This basic principle could be adapted to AH and the ENY system. But, I recall HiTech mentioning he didn't like this method.

I had an idea years ago, I can't remember if it was in AH or AW. I thought it up to add depth to the strat game and help with the problem of the BIG BLOB milk-hordes. Here was the thought...

All Fighters can up at all airfields.
Medium Bombers (twin engine) can only up at medium and large airfields.
Heavy Bombers (4 engines) can only up at large airfields.

This would make large airfields very important, adding far more strategic depth and create strat based 'choke-points' because it would be critical to defend certain types of bases vehemently in various areas of the map to preserve the ability to conduct certain operations in that area. It would also make coordinating huge missions logistically more complex. It would also likely change mission composition to reflect multiple smaller specialized groups of aircraft instead of one HUGE Blob which would be much more practical to mount a significant defense against. In real life, bombers and fighters seldom used the same airfields, they had to coordinate in the air, this factor is lost in AH. The only problem with this idea is the maps would have to be tweaked so there is a more logical pattern of base type distribution that is conducive to creating contentious points throughout the geography.

As it is now, the only distinction between the airfield types we already have is a few more buildings and ack, which is in my opinion a waste of the potential to deepen AH's strat aspect with relatively little effort. As has been mentioned the strat game is pointless on maps with 200+ fields, this sort of idea could not only create more fights but make strat'ing meaningful again.

[crockett]

btw just for those that are for or against the idea. 30 seconds isn't really a great deal of time. It's not going to make the difference for a single fighter upping at a base with 10 cons capping it. 30s is is about enough time to spawn on the runway get rolling and if you fly straight you will be at the other end of the runway.

Basicly it's enough time to get your gears up and have just enough speed to make some evasive turns. That means if you do get vulched you at least have some sort of chance to defend your self.  If they do kill you before 30 seconds then you would still be dead but it wouldn't count aginst your score nor add to theirs.

This is a film I did last night at a lightly vulched field, I was already rolling when the film starts so you would need to add 5 to 8 seconds at the start, but it gives you a good idea of what 30 seconds means.

http://www.wargamerx.com/films/vulch-field.ahf

[DoNKeY]

Murdr, are you saying that you find vulching fun?

[Murdr]

Well what ya gonna say now Murdr?

I would say it's not the first time his take on something has surprised me, and it won't be the last.

I would also say that it's not uncommon for me to play devils advocate, even if I fundamentally like the idea that I'm poking at.  This is not one of those times.  You give a no score risk period to a "defender", and it will be taken advantage of to the fullest extent.  Playing peek-a-boo with the vulch is a fairly old but actually good tactic, but the sortie does count, and it does affect score via the per_sortie stats.  I guarantee you that egg timers will be sitting on computer desks marking the period where the player "loses nothing", with the intent of wasting the attackers time and then ending flight.  

No risk period, equals more defenders, equals more fighting opportunities.  Sounds good if you are looking for a fight.

However if your Aces High focus is taking bases, this throws a bit of a kink in things.  The idea of not porking the base anymore than needed will no longer be palitable if people are free to up like cockroaches and have the option to renige with no consequences if they don't like what they see.  Seems to me the two possible answers to that is an SOP of flattening all hangers, and/or bringing a bigger horde.  

I like to tag along with base captures, sometimes good fights errupt.  If not, I'm satisfied to cap while the toolshedders do their thing.  Of couse, if the dynamics change where the game pretty much forces fields to be flattened if you want to achive a capture, I'll no longer have a reason to tag along.  Instead of more fighting, there is less.

I don't claim right, but it is a very plausible effect.

[crockett]

For anyone that cares this was my old post on limiting ENY by zones rather than total player numbers.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,206911.0.html

To be fair though, I haven't seen the ENY problems lately like we used to have. Back when I wrote that post, t was almost a nightly thing to be on Rooks and have sky high ENY late at night. Granted there may still be ENY issues but I just don't notice them because now days I typically just swap to the lowest number team with my squad.

[Murdr]

Murdr, are you saying that you find vulching fun?

Go to google, type in vulch, click on the top return, and see if you see any names on that page that you recognize.

[Zazen13]

I
However if your Aces High focus is taking bases, this throws a bit of a kink in things.  The idea of not porking the base anymore than needed will no longer be palitable if people are free to up like cockroaches and have the option to renige with no consequences if they don't like what they see.  Seems to me the two possible answers to that is an SOP of flattening all hangers, and/or bringing a bigger horde.  

If a player's motivation is to take the field, he is free to vulch as soon as the enemy appears at the take-off spot as is the case now. Only players that vulched for score, rank and the text buffer puff piece at the end of their flight will likely elect to give 30 seconds before they pounce the E bankrupt defender. It is already SOP for the buff guys to try to drop FH's, the only difference will be the defenders may be able to have a few low guys that can pop the low and dive bombing heavies before they can drop their ordnance.

[crockett]

In AW there was a mechanic whereby only so many people from your team could up from a base until they dispersed and thinned out over the adjacent areas. This basic principle could be adapted to AH and the ENY system. But, I recall HiTech mentioning he didn't like this method.

I had an idea years ago, I can't remember if it was in AH or AW. I thought it up to add depth to the strat game and help with the problem of the BIG BLOB milk-hordes. Here was the thought...

All Fighters can up at all airfields.
Medium Bombers (twin engine) can only up at medium and large airfields.
Heavy Bombers (4 engines) can only up at large airfields.

This would make large airfields very important, adding far more strategic depth and create strat based 'choke-points' because it would be critical to defend certain types of bases vehemently in various areas of the map to preserve the ability to conduct certain operations in that area. It would also make coordinating huge missions logistically more complex. It would also likely change mission composition to reflect multiple smaller specialized groups of aircraft instead of one HUGE Blob which would be much more practical to mount a significant defense against. In real life, bombers and fighters seldom used the same airfields, they had to coordinate in the air, this factor is lost in AH. The only problem with this idea is the maps would have to be tweaked so there is a more logical pattern of base type distribution that is conducive to creating contentious points throughout the geography.

As it is now, the only distinction between the airfield types we already have is a few more buildings and ack, which is in my opinion a waste of the potential to deepen AH's strat aspect with relatively little effort. As has been mentioned the strat game is pointless on maps with 200+ fields, this sort of idea could not only create more fights but make strat'ing meaningful again.

Not a bad idea IMO, but would likely require maps to be set up differently, because you would need to make sure there was large airfields well placed around the map. It would however likely lead to more realistic usage of bombers rather than seeing b24's up off a field and NOE a CV.

[Zazen13]

Not a bad idea IMO, but would likely require maps to be set up differently, because you would need to make sure there was large airfields well placed around the map. It would however likely lead to more realistic usage of bombers rather than seeing b24's up off a field and NOE a CV.

Yup, I already thought of that (see below)...It is definately the most likely reason this will never happen, changing the field type distribution for all the maps would be a serious pita I would imagine.

The only problem with this idea is the maps would have to be tweaked so there is a more logical pattern of base type distribution that is conducive to creating contentious points throughout the geography.

[DoNKeY]

Go to google, type in vulch, click on the top return, and see if you see any names on that page that you recognize.

Still doesn't answer my question.  Why are you skirting it?  I'm just wondering.

[xNOVAx]

Another thing (not sure if this has been mentioned already).. If someone kills someone within 30 seconds of upping on the ruway, that kill will not be added into the # of kills that show up when you land at the end of a sortie.. You could have 20 "vulches" but 2 actual kills, and when you land it only says 2 kills.. I think a big part of why people vulch so much is to get their name highlighted at the end of a sortie with a ton of kills.. Everyone gives you <S>'s and WTG's having no idea you just vulched a bunch of helpless planes on the runway, but it's always 'nice' to be recognized right?? People shouldn't be recognized for vulching IMO (myself included) but should be recognized for legit kills which would hold more weight if this was implemented..

To go along with my last point, I think individual people SHOULD be recognized in the text buffer when they capture a base..