Ords Bunker Hardness

[thndregg]

Instead of hardening the ammo bunkers why not just add more? Scatter oh, say 75 or 80 around the field. They can't possibly take them all out.

Do it. I dare ya'.

[LLogann]

 

Do it. I dare ya'.

<S> ThndrEgg <S>

[Spikes]

Do it. I dare ya'.
(Image removed from quote.)

Heheh....owned

[DREDIOCK]

Nope. 

Ord bunkers, same as a town building, 250 pounds of explosive. 

Now honestly, I've gone back and forth on this one.  Of all the things on the base, the ord bunkers should be a little tougher maybe, but certainly not anything like doubling it to 500lbs.  Maybe 300?  No wait, I'm arguing for the other side here..............   

Nope.

 

Considering that in WWII ord  and fuel was normally kept at dumps and not bunkers except back in the states.
If anything, technically they are too hard to blow up in game. Not too soft.

They are fine the way they are

[uptown]

Heheh....owned

heheheehhehehe  my post was a joke heheheeheehehehe  Your owned claim is a fail which in fact means i owned you  heheeheeheehehehhhh

[Spikes]

heheheehhehehe  my post was a joke heheheeheehehehe   Your owned claim is a fail which in fact means i owned you   heheeheeheehehehhhh

The fact that Egg has something to counter even the extremist of things is funny.

Oh yeah I forgot.  Hehehehehe. 

[Bomber49]

Ummm..maybe up a tank to deal with a tank when ords are down? Just a thought.

[uptown]

oh..yeah sorry Spikes   

[WMLute]

Hate to disagree with Lusche (usually causes me to look foolish) but I'm with Lute on this one.  I just tried it offline, 20 rounds from the Osti took ~13 seconds.

Lusche is correct atually.  

He is basing it off a 1,000 lbs doing 1.0 in damage which is where the .3125 comes from.

The way AH deals with ord is...

A single 250lbs bomb WILL kill a town building even though the town building is .3125 because a 250lbs bomb does not do 1/4 the damage of a 1,000lbs.  It does more.

i.e.

4x250lbs bombs do closer to 1200lbs of damage vs. 1x1,000lbs bomb.

1x2,000lbs bomb actually does LESS damage than 2x1,000lbs bombs.


The 1,000 lbs is parity.  i.e. it does 1.0 damage in the AH settings.

Smaller bombs do more damage and larger do less.

Which is why it only takes 1 250lbs bomb to drop a town building even though the building hardness is .3125.
(are we all confused yet?)

I need to see if I have that thread saved that explains it better.
(anybody have it?)

[kvuo75]

Hardness of the ords bunkers don't matter much because 90% of player in AH don't even understand the importance of destroying them. They leave ords up and take a CV right up to a base and then wonder why the CV got sunk.

I rarely see the ords at the base closest to the CV being the issue... I know _I_ don't usually up to kill a cv from the base it's attacking, I take off perhaps 2-3 sectors away in 234's or some such... I see more cv's getting killed from multiple sets of bombers from many sectors away, or from shore batteries than low ju88's, ki67's, 25's, or heavy fighters suiciding on it..

you have a point though, if considering pt spawns

[Vinkman]

So up a Panzer or T34 and kill the Wirbel. Problem solved.

I made the point that getting pilots out of planes into GVs was a negative.

The GV doesn't re-up anywhere near the field in seconds. Depending on the spawn and the distance between the fields, it's likely to take him longer to drive in from the spawn than it takes you to get there with ords.

I didn't mean it re-ups right at the field, I realize they have to drive from the spawn. But the pilots needs to land, change fields, get new ords, and fly all the way back.

[LLogann]

Yes he is, as usual...... I was thinking seconds for some dumbarse reason.......   

Lusche is correct atually.  

[froger]

Lusche is correct atually.  

He is basing it off a 1,000 lbs doing 1.0 in damage which is where the .3125 comes from.

The way AH deals with ord is...

A single 250lbs bomb WILL kill a town building even though the town building is .3125 because a 250lbs bomb does not do 1/4 the damage of a 1,000lbs.  It does more.

i.e.

4x250lbs bombs do closer to 1200lbs of damage vs. 1x1,000lbs bomb.

1x2,000lbs bomb actually does LESS damage than 2x1,000lbs bombs.


The 1,000 lbs is parity.  i.e. it does 1.0 damage in the AH settings.

Smaller bombs do more damage and larger do less.

Which is why it only takes 1 250lbs bomb to drop a town building even though the building hardness is .3125.
(are we all confused yet?)

I need to see if I have that thread saved that explains it better.
(anybody have it?)

wuttt

[WMLute]

wuttt

found the thread.

LINK

These are the hardness settings:
(Image removed from quote.)

The gun and rocket power can be found here

Regarding bomb strength, I'd have to dig through my notes to put together a full list.  Just from info I have readily on hand:
2,000lb = 1.8197 vs hardness value (off the top of my head if that's not it it's close)
1,000lb = 1.000 vs hardness value
500lb = .568 vs hardness value
250lb = .315 vs hardness value

What I find interesting is how this changes what typed of bombs you should pick when flying a buff.  (or should)

Take the B-17 as an example.
16x 250lb bombs
12x 500lb bombs
6x 1000lb bombs

16x 250lb bombs do 5,040lbs of damage.
12x 500lb bombs do 6,816lbs of damage.
6x 1000lb bombs do 6,000lbs of damage.

You do more damage with 12x 500lb option.  
Factor in the drones and you get 2,448lbs of damage extra taking the 500lb over the 1000lb.


Another great example is the B-24.
12x 500lb bombs
8x 1000lb bombs
4x 2000lb bombs

12x 500 lb bombs gives you 6,816lbs of damage.
8x 1,000lb bombs gives you 8,000lbs of damage.
4x 2,000lb bombs gives you 7,278lbs of damage.

If you pick the 4x 2,000lb bombs option, factoring in the drones, you get 21,834lbs of damage.
If you pick the 8x 1,000lb bombs option, factoring in the drones, you get 24,000lbs of damage.

So in a B-24 the most bang for the buck is the 1,000lb bombs.

I USED to up the B-24 w/ the 2,000lb bombs.  Not gonna do that now 'cause I loose over a full 2k bomb worth of damage vs. the 1K option.



Found a good Google Doc. that was uploaded that shows this in a table.
LINK

[Vinkman]

found the thread.

LINK

What I find interesting is how this changes what typed of bombs you should pick when flying a buff.  (or should)

Take the B-17 as an example.
16x 250lb bombs
12x 500lb bombs
6x 1000lb bombs

16x 250lb bombs do 5,040lbs of damage.
12x 500lb bombs do 6,816lbs of damage.
6x 1000lb bombs do 6,000lbs of damage.

You do more damage with 12x 500lb option.  
Factor in the drones and you get 2,448lbs of damage extra taking the 500lb over the 1000lb.


Another great example is the B-24.
12x 500lb bombs
8x 1000lb bombs
4x 2000lb bombs

12x 500 lb bombs gives you 6,816lbs of damage.
8x 1,000lb bombs gives you 8,000lbs of damage.
4x 2,000lb bombs gives you 7,278lbs of damage.

If you pick the 4x 2,000lb bombs option, factoring in the drones, you get 21,834lbs of damage.
If you pick the 8x 1,000lb bombs option, factoring in the drones, you get 24,000lbs of damage.

So in a B-24 the most bang for the buck is the 1,000lb bombs.

I USED to up the B-24 w/ the 2,000lb bombs.  Not gonna do that now 'cause I loose over a full 2k bomb worth of damage vs. the 1K option.



Found a good Google Doc. that was uploaded that shows this in a table.
LINK

Intersting that it is set up that way.

I assume the 250 lbs bombs give you more scatter, such that you actually hit and destroy more buildings when attacking a town.  If a 1000 or 2000lb bomb lands, what is it's blast radius? And will this cause multible 'heavy' bombs to have more overlap in their blast radii resulting in less damage than spread out smaller bombs. 

Perhaps the score variation you site is an effort to compansate for that. It would be hard to get all those 250lbs bombs to hit a hangar, but if I were bombing a town, I'd want to greater spacial distribution.


So wouldn't the  'Damage' score is based on what you actually hit as well as what you drop? that probably needs to be factored in to what bomb load you take to a particular target.


Of course AH could have a code where ords dropped in the boundry of a town count toward damage ponts, or are distributed to buildings. But I hope not, that would be hokey.