Author Topic: luffwobble abuse?  (Read 10089 times)

Offline hitech

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« Reply #30 on: December 30, 2002, 04:43:06 PM »
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The only group that gets categorically singled out for attack and labeling are luftwhiners.


grunherz, need to call Bull ---  on this one.

Ever here of .

spit dweebs
Quake heads
Run stang.
Furballers.
Milkrunners.
Vulchers.
Gangbangers.
Realism Nazies.
Thought Police.


To name a few, all of these are exactly the same as the term luftwhiner. Notice how you are still arguing that only the Luftwhiners get singled out?

HiTech

Offline hazed-

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« Reply #31 on: December 30, 2002, 04:44:50 PM »
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Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
BS-- that's one thing that does exist... and used periodically... in a thread about German planes, someone (won't name names) comes in and says, "Of course that won't get fixed, but [insert something allied] will" or something along those lines.

That's saying that there is an intentional bias- hence a conspiracy.
-SW


er i think you have missed something here SW.

It is not a case of people claiming there is some kind of conspiricy.

I dont think HT or anyone in HTC cares or has the time to work out some antiLW plot but i do see bias of sorts.

one example is when i asked about why the 190d9 was set the same for wep and cooling times as the 190A's when it quite clearly has a different cooling system, ie water cooled I was accused by HT of only wanting to have a super plane for my own use. He implied my sole reason for asking was for personal gain.He even then went on to say that i wouldnt post anything in the BBs that might show any luftwaffe aircraft should be reduced or toned down if i found evidence of it.Utter roadkill and I found it extremely offensive.

If i was to look at all the posts on all the aircraft, 90% of them are posts from a player who likes a particular aircraft and happens to have more books on that particular aircraft . And a high percentage of these are requests for improvements to their model. i.e. combat flaps on p38s.
 
I never saw HT call those players who asked for stuff of being only after self gain (or whatever he thinks my motive was) and therefore their research or discovery of info is to be ignored as biased.

Theres also the pointthat in all the time we have had the 190F8 there have been constant requests for greater variety of loadouts with tonnes of info showing what they could carry.I can appreciate HTC dont always have the time to add every request made but comon this has been requested since its addition to the planeset.
You might say its because LW are always asking for it and so have annoyed HTC so much that they decide not to do it but do you think any player who flies the USAAF planes like p47 p51 or p38 wouldnt have asked the same amount of times had HTC only added half the bomb options they have?
I have yet to find a reference or photo of a p51,p38 or p47 with the maximum loadouts possible in AH.I have seen references to them using bombs OR rockets and rockets with lighter bombs than 1000lbers but they have been included in AH so we have to accept HTC has info that says they were right?
I have seen many photos and references to 190f8's having far more diverse loadouts and ive seen many a post in here but those players asking were either abused or accused of whining etc.Even HTC seemed to totally ignore it until very recently.

The way i figure it maybe HTC has had a lot of trouble from LW types since the warbirds days? and perhaps there is a certain type of player who demands too much for his liking? I dont know but i must say I have lost a lot of respect for this company recently after recieving what i would call a rude answer from them.
Players who ask about LW planes are no different to those asking about any plane.  They are fans of HTCs game and should not be treated any differently.At first i used to laugh along with the leather jokes etc but now I find it all a bit petty and childish.
The reason it lost its comic effect is that it has been used as a weapon to annoy and frustrate players asking legitimate questions. One thing I know is when i see someone post a query about a spitfire or ki 61 I dont assume the guy posting it is hell bent on making that aircraft the best and therefore ignore what he has written because he isnt capable of an objective discussion.
I have seen this sort of thing happen to wotan and several others including myself.

I still have yet to see an explanation from anyone in here as to why the 190a8 doesnt match any charts or info ive seen concerning its climbrate over 25k. I still dont know quite whats modeled into the ta152 (as in mw50? gm1? whatever). I dont know if ill ever see the 190f8 get the upgraded armour it was made with or the loadouts it had. I still dont understand why the 190d9(an inline jumo engine with liquid cooling) has the same timing for cooling as the 190A's(air cooled radial) yet the 109G's are totally different (liquid cooled inlines again). and then theres the RAF planes that are different in cooling again!. If you can give me any of the answers to these questions SW and perhaps explain just what HT meant in the reply to my infamously SELFISH questions on cooling(sheesh!) then by all means post it.

I dont assume a conspiracy. but i do see a different attitude shown towards LW players. From customers in here abusing to strange criptic comments from HT every now and then. It is here and it doesnt do HTC's reputation much good when someone totally new to online sims comes into these boards and reads it.

I have to say it SW most of the time i see you as one of the worst offenders.There have been times where ive seen you be very reasonable like the discussion about the 190a8 where you posted info, I posted info and between us we kind of worked out that HTC must have taken an average of all info to model our 190a8.In that post i thought you was pretty good with what you said.In others I see you trying your best to aggrivate the poster or just plain take the piss.

If the intention is to piss off customers who like LW so much that they lose interest in trying to get their aircraft improved or dont bother to ever post info they find about LW in these boards then I have to say its working.At least it has against me.I dont think i'll ever stop feeling annoyed by it all or for that matter ever stop wondering what the answers are but I have lost a huge part of the AH experience now that i dont really follow the technical side of the game.The questions on accuracy or modeling were all part of the enjoyment for a long time.I bought many books because of AH and because i wanted to see just how accurate it is.Now it seems to have just become like any other flight sim where I have no chance to get involved in its development or refinement.
Think about it, we all love these boards because we can put in ideas or info in the hope it helps HTC decide on new features.Thats what i assumed these boards were all about.Seems lately they are just about who has the snappiest insult or who can flame a player the best.Its like juvenille hall.

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #32 on: December 30, 2002, 04:45:52 PM »
So what does that have to do with your conspiracy proving, or are you trying to suggest only luftwhiners get frustrated and squeak on the BBS..

Offline SOB

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« Reply #33 on: December 30, 2002, 04:51:17 PM »
There's no point in arguing this with you Grun, you've made up your mind and your blinders are firmly in place.  Any mention of anything anti-LW, even in jest makes you fly off the deep end.  Seek help.


SOB

PS...The picture was posted by Commander Rialbh, AKA Hblair, AKA guy who flies LW planes.
Three Times One Minus One.  Dayum!

Offline Sachs

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« Reply #34 on: December 30, 2002, 04:51:44 PM »
hitech, those are all said, but when a question is brought out about a certain Luftwaffe plane it turns into a Luftwhiner post.  As a Luftwaffe die hard myself I have run out of whits about what to say and I have posted a few rants.  I can clearly remember a post I put in the A section showing valuable data, not one thing has been said or done about an obvious deletion.  I used to like this board when it wasn't patrolled by the BBS whine police along time ago.

Offline hitech

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« Reply #35 on: December 30, 2002, 04:57:26 PM »
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The only group that gets categorically singled out for attack and labeling are luftwhiners.


Are you total blind grunherz?

The word "Only" implies one,uno,1 ,0000001,0x000001, 0+1,unique, no other like it.

This is what the  conserpericy theory is, think that one group is singled out, treated different,abused by it self.


HiTech

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #36 on: December 30, 2002, 04:58:06 PM »
Hitech how often is anyone who flies spits or vulches automatically attacked by a consitent group of people because they do that if they ask a question about their planes.  Plus there is a distinction to be made here. If somebody vulches a lot then yea you can call them a vulcher. If somebody flies a FW190D9 a lot you can call them Hunstang. The distinction between those and Luftwhiner is the aoutomatic labeling of so many LW questions as a luftwhine, no matter how concise, clear and level headed the issue is presented.

I hardly ever see Funked or Fester's rants pointed out as alliedwhining. Or what about lazs and his quest to elimate bombers and fast planes from gameplay?  If they were flying mostly LW planes and not spits or P38 or Corasirs or FM2  you know they would automatically be put in that group.

It just creates a negative atmosphere. Surely ypu must see that?

Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #37 on: December 30, 2002, 05:03:52 PM »
Hazed- because most of those threads do not contain solely a platform to discuss... they've quickly become a platform to squeak that they aren't getting attention about the issue or that if it were allied, it would be fixed.

Grun- someone insinuated that there is a bias towards Allied aircraft over German aircraft. <--- That is a conspiracy in favoring one party.

I've seen several other people come and go from AH that were "LW" and insinuate that there is a favoring for the allied side while the German (note: not axis) side gets screwed.

I can't remember what thread it was in, but a while ago someone said that the majority of bugs on German aircraft were detrimental to performance bugs and that all bugs on allied planes made them better. Ignoring that both bugs got fixed when proven to be bugs.

In any event, I'm... I clearly pointed out there is a percieved conspiracy for the allied side against the German(not axis for some wierd reason) side (even happens in that thread "simple request to HTC") and you think it somehow supports your argument that you get unfairly abused.
-SW

Offline funkedup

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« Reply #38 on: December 30, 2002, 05:04:14 PM »
Actually Grun, Fester has been banned at least once, and the last time I got on a serious rant rampage, Pyro gave me a warning.  Pick better examples.

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #39 on: December 30, 2002, 05:06:27 PM »
Hitech can you honestly say any group of AH airplane fans are so diectly ostracized and made fun of as LW guys? Thats my point, no need to focus on a single word.

Honestly?


SOB I am trying to argue my point.  After years of wathing tjhis on the BBS I feel its very important to finally stand up and confront this behavior however I can. I just dont lile it because its having a negative impact on the game I like and the community here.

Offline Dnil

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« Reply #40 on: December 30, 2002, 05:12:24 PM »
wew! made into the dumbest post ever.

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #41 on: December 30, 2002, 05:15:08 PM »
Funked you guys are the perfect examples, you have clearly acted shamefully on the BBS, you have been banned and kicked of the BBS and such yet nobody is ranting about you as allied whiners and brininging your poor example up when somebody asks question abou P51 or Spitfire or whatever.

Actually your post is perfect also because it illustrates the wrong preception you have of what I'm arguing. You are basically thinking that since you two, Funked and Fester, have been punished for misbehavior that this proves HTC doesnt let non LW off the hook for bad behavior - and that this is bad example for my argument.  By this you imply that my argument is that HTC favors allies or non LW.

Well thats not my argument. My issue with hitech is what Kweassa so perfectly explained.

Understand wgat I'm getting at Funked?

Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #42 on: December 30, 2002, 05:15:40 PM »
Hey Grun, remember this thread:

http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=73943

You ever gonna put up? I did here... you couldn't there...

Hmmmm...
-SW

Offline hitech

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« Reply #43 on: December 30, 2002, 05:16:35 PM »
Yes I see the negative atmosipher, it's realy why i'm even bothering with this decusion.
But the resone for the negative attude, is the luftwhiner type posts. And people trying to give credibilty to there style. There attitude is what causes the problems, not some one calling them on the attitude.

It's why I told ram he is his worst enemy.

Is why hazed is very close to loosing bbs privs.

Let me give you some very resont examples.

By mandoble:
Quote
Diving and max G test

Test purpose:
Measure the max G load and elevator authority of several planes diving at 550mph.

Test conditions:
Terrain dueling, base A1, Alt 15k.
All planes loaded with 50% fuel, taking off by North.
All planes diving vertically untill 550mph, trimmed for speed, then recovering pulling stick as hard as possible without manual trim.

Results:
Ta152H - 6.5g for a fraction of second.
190D9 - 6g for a fraction of second.
190A8 - 6g for a fraction of second.
Typhoon - Well above 9g substained, after some seconds pulling > 9g, wings broke.


Nice and hidden here, but notice the planes chosen.

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190D9 radiator/oil Seems that everything hitting my D9 from 6 o'clock kills my radiator with a single ping (no matter if 50" or guns) and then I have only about 10-15 seconds before engine stops. In the other hand, I rarely have oil system damage, but when I have, oil tank empties extremely quickly, twice as fast as a La7. What was the oil capacity of 190D9, and what the La7 capacity?




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New P51D is it me or..... does it roll and handle even better than before?


Nice reverse back flip whine on this one. But at least it was formed as a question, wrather than the more normal,cipes HTC you improved the p51d and not changed the F190D. Take note I did answere this one because it was stated fairly.

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Stuka we have DID have siren......
I noticed the stuka we have , by this i actually mean the EXACT model we have represented is the same ju87 that was flown by the RAF and was written about in 'wings of the luftwaffe' by Capt.eric brown

Notice the deffintate statement in the title.
Just wanting to prove that he wants a siren.

These were just very recent history.

Like I said in my list the anti whine whiners are currently growing to a level that they need to be delt with. But grunherz, you are trying to defend somthing that is not defensible.

HiTech

Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #44 on: December 30, 2002, 05:23:16 PM »
BTW, does any other group of people need such high maintenance?
-SW