Author Topic: I want to WHINE about suicide dweebs. Please read my PATHETIC post. (Read 5903 times)

mold · « **on:** December 14, 2003, 12:57:38 PM »

Nah, not really, but I kinda wanted to get some traffic in here. Sorry for the underhanded methods.

Anyway, I have an idea for solving the pork-auger problem. Perking bombs doesn't seem like the right way to go about this--it's like perking bullets in a fighter. Furthermore, I don't think it would solve the problem--people would still pork/auger with bullets, and even with bombs if they don't care about "the next time". Score effects will also not solve this problem, since (as others have pointed out) the reason for most pork/augering has nothing to do with score.

But here's another idea: how about making it so that, if the plane that dropped the bombs dies within 1 minute (adjustable) of the target getting hit, all damage from his bombs is negated? In fact this could be applied to any type of ground damage from a plane, including bullets--so it could take care of suicide de-ackers as well! Also this would automatically take care of dive-lancs and noe-forts.

Comments? Best idea ever? Or does it suck rocks through a straw?

Murdr · « **Reply #1 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:18:12 PM »

rocks through a straw? I have yet to see an idea that directly 'punishes' the player for that behavior that doesnt unfairly include players that just happen have the bad luck of going down just after dropping.

I think festers idea of better field ack defence, and lazs hardening of field resources (fuel) are better directions to take.
That said, the issue rarely bothers me, except on the large maps where front line bases are 25% fuel, and you have to up too far away to get to the fight.

mold · « **Reply #2 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:22:41 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Murdr
unfairly include players that just happen have the bad luck of going down just after dropping.

Is this actually a common occurence? I think probably what you attribute to bad luck is closer to bad planning, and my approach would mitigate that because everyone would know that in order to have an affect, you have to at least try to survive.

Hyrax81st · « **Reply #3 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:23:50 PM »

I think "suicide dweebs" will go away once there are multiple arenas setup for specific styles of play.

1. The Fighter Jock "dogfighting" arena where nothing can be captured or bombed.
2. The MA-as-we-know-it arena where suicide Jabo's will still be seen regardless of what you do.
3. The strategic "war" arena that we will eventually see available in AH2 where suicide Jabo runs hurt your ability to replane quickly or in the same ride...

Murdr · « **Reply #4 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:38:46 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mold
Is this actually a common occurence? I think probably what you attribute to bad luck is closer to bad planning, and my approach would mitigate that because everyone would know that in order to have an affect, you have to at least try to survive.

I routinely orbit friendly bases waiting to lead in on the next jabo artist. More often than not, they are trying to survive. Either I catch and kill them on the zoom, or bounce them down into the pack. Either way, they die shortly after the drop. Not to mention all those that happen to catch AA rounds during their drop. All cases of those that are at least trying to survive. Besides that suicide jabo was a reality, at least in the pacific, and in reality they adjusted to that by trying to beef up defences.

mold · « **Reply #5 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:38:48 PM »

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Originally posted by Hyrax81st
2. The MA-as-we-know-it arena where suicide Jabo's will still be seen regardless of what you do.

But that's the beauty of my idea. Right in the MA, it totally and completely prevents suicide jabo-ing, by construction. But in such a way as to not affect the honest stratter at all.

mold · « **Reply #6 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:48:23 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Murdr
I routinely orbit friendly bases waiting to lead in on the next jabo artist. More often than not, they are trying to survive. Either I catch and kill them on the zoom, or bounce them down into the pack. Either way, they die shortly after the drop. Not to mention all those that happen to catch AA rounds during their drop. All cases of those that are at least trying to survive.

They are always trying to survive, regardless. There is actually no suicide dweebing, until he dies--all suicide dweebers would prefer to live, except the conveyor belt types I guess. But I would say that if they dive bomb fuel while ack is up or while you are orbiting, then that is indeed a suicide run (regardless of whether they wanted to live or not). They should have brought some CAP.

Quote

Originally posted by Murdr
Besides that suicide jabo was a reality, at least in the pacific, and in reality they adjusted to that by trying to beef up defences.

You are essentially saying that suicide porkers are not a problem, and thus do not require a solution. I think there are many folks that would disagree with that, in both the strat and furball camps.

Furthermore, this is not a valid comparison--because death in this game does not have the same penalty as death in real life.

AKIron · « **Reply #7 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:49:33 PM »

This idea was tossed around some time ago and I think HiTech considered negating damage done within a specific period after one dies. There are a lot of potential problems which is why I believe he didn't implement it.

mold · « **Reply #8 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:51:13 PM »

Hmm, that's too bad. Do you recall any of the disadvantages? I will try a search and see if I can find the thread.

Arlo · « **Reply #9 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:54:11 PM »

Just have online play disabled unless the server can confirm you have the wires properly taped to your nads. Then anyone who dies (be it a suicide buff weenie or a furballer or a guy in a chute) gets their jewels electrically cleaned for a millisecond. Hmmmm ... ok ... knowing some of yas, this really wouldn't change anything.

Murdr · « **Reply #10 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:55:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mold

You are essentially saying that suicide porkers are not a problem, and thus do not require a solution. I think there are many folks that would disagree with that, in both the strat and furball camps.

Not at all read my first post, I stated that I agree with others that the solution is in hardening defences, and targets, and not in a broad brush stroke of behavior modification through penalties/reward.....Well no, I really shouldnt say 'reward' because there is none under what you are proposing.

AKIron · « **Reply #11 on:** December 14, 2003, 01:57:08 PM »

I don't recall all of the objections or problems but I do remember some. For example: You follow your buddy on an attack on the town. He kills the town ack but is hit by it and crashes just as you make a pass and drop some buildings. Since he dies the town ack is restored and kills you as you egress from your run. If the ack had been up when you started your run you wouldn't have shown it your six.

See, when you mess around with time travel you might wind up killing your own grandfather. Which is of course detrimental to your own health cause yer grandma is pissed you spoiled her sex life.

mold · « **Reply #12 on:** December 14, 2003, 02:05:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Murdr
Not at all read my first post, I stated that I agree with others that the solution is in hardening defences, and targets, and not in a broad brush stroke of behavior modification through penalties/reward.....Well no, I really shouldnt say 'reward' because there is none under what you are proposing.

I was responding to your Kamikaze comment...

Anyway, the hardening target solution IMO doesn't work. Is it a solution if two suicide porkers can destroy fuel instead of one?

mold · « **Reply #13 on:** December 14, 2003, 02:09:20 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by AKIron
I don't recall all of the objections or problems but I do remember some. For example: You follow your buddy on an attack on the town. He kills the town ack but is hit by it and crashes just as you make a pass and drop some buildings. Since he dies the town ack is restored and kills you as you egress from your run. If the ack had been up when you started your run you wouldn't have shown it your six.

Yeah, that's a wierd situation to be sure. However, I think it is somewhat marginal. Furthermore, the if the first guy knew about the ack-rebuild, he might be more careful in the first place. And if he dies, he can send a quick warning to his teammate saying "I died, watch out". So although this situation seems really wierd, I think you can work around it in this way or another way--especially since it offers such major advantages in the handling of death.

Quote

Originally posted by AKIron
See, when you mess around with time travel you might wind up killing your own grandfather. Which is of course detrimental to your own health cause yer grandma is pissed you spoiled her sex life.

LOL

mold · « **Reply #14 on:** December 14, 2003, 02:11:36 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Arlo
Just have online play disabled unless the server can confirm you have the wires properly taped to your nads. Then anyone who dies (be it a suicide buff weenie or a furballer or a guy in a chute) gets their jewels electrically cleaned for a millisecond. Hmmmm ... ok ... knowing some of yas, this really wouldn't change anything.

LOL...we can only hope!

Screw this video card in a computer crap. I want the brain plug.