Author Topic: Cutting Aid to Israel (Read 5178 times)

NUKE · « **Reply #60 on:** June 21, 2004, 04:41:11 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by ravells
um well, actually there were plenty of jews living there before Israel was created.

But it's not right to go and build settlements on other people's property in a very small country when the people you've displaced have nowhere to go, is it?

btw, you didn't answer my question.

Ravs

so if Jews lived there and no country existed ( Except Israel in ancient times) who's land is it?

Israel is the ONLY nation in history that existed there.

ravells · « **Reply #61 on:** June 21, 2004, 04:47:35 PM »

Flyboy:

Good points, well made.

Isn't it the fact though, that the people who are building these settlements are extremist jews? There was a post up here recently, of an article written by Israeli soldiers who were shocked by how they saw Palestinians treated by settlers.

I understand your real politik argument, but it cuts both ways: if you move the settlers then maybe things will get better, but Israel has to take the risk?

I go back to my old solution: get Israelis and Palestinians in primary schools and mixing with each other from an early age, and then have places where they can be sent abroad to live with each other without the pressure of immediate problems. Maybe a few marriages between the two? Good things might happen.

Ravs

lada · « **Reply #62 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:02:15 PM »

Flyboy

Since there is problem regarding some piece of land, it seems to be quite more correct that nobody will live there rather that the one with bigger guns untill agreement will be reached.

What do you thing ?

Since you fear that terrorist will flee your cities, you can still build that wall on your territory.

Btw did you ever try to imagine how could palestine people act, if Israel will apology to them ? Because the key in annihilating militants is not in killing them, but to make them unpopular among people from whitch they are recruited.

Like in Iran.. Goverment often abuse word Islam, so Iranian doesnt reconize themself with islam. Once there will be big majority, goverment will become history.

Have been sutch ideas presented in Israel in past ?

lada · « **Reply #63 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:03:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by NUKE
so if Jews lived there and no country existed ( Except Israel in ancient times) who's land is it?

Israel is the ONLY nation in history that existed there.

BS

in acient times everything were own by monkeys

Flyboy · « **Reply #64 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:07:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by ravells
Flyboy:

Good points, well made.

Isn't it the fact though, that the people who are building these settlements are extremist jews? There was a post up here recently, of an article written by Israeli soldiers who were shocked by how they saw Palestinians treated by settlers.

yes they are extremist and they do treat arabs worse then dogs

they are one of the roots to the probelm and they must be moved. but it cant be done with just one swift blow, it will take time.

Quote

I go back to my old solution: get Israelis and Palestinians in primary schools and mixing with each other from an early age, and then have places where they can be sent abroad to live with each other without the pressure of immediate problems. Maybe a few marriages between the two? Good things might happen.

ahhh in a perfect world maybe

dont take this the wrong way but its a naive sulotion.

there are few people (from both of the sides) that will allow it to their children, and those who will allow are the ones that allready recognized in the co-existence.

on a more optimistic note, your solution is allready applied- there are elemntry schools kinder gardens and seminars that have both israelies and palestinians, a friend of mine is flying to the US to take part in such seminar that discuss coexistence, in which she will sleep with palestinian girls in the same room for allmost a month with no grown ups from both sides (she is 17).

i myself will join/ be drafted to the army in less then a year.

NUKE · « **Reply #65 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:07:29 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lada
BS

in acient times everything were own by monkeys

Israel was the only nation ever established there.

Maybe monkeys owned the land you took over.

Flyboy · « **Reply #66 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:16:18 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lada
Flyboy

Since there is problem regarding some piece of land, it seems to be quite more correct that nobody will live there rather that the one with bigger guns untill agreement will be reached.

What do you thing ?

Since you fear that terrorist will flee your cities, you can still build that wall on your territory.

i think its not practical, sorry

Quote

Btw did you ever try to imagine how could palestine people act, if Israel will apology to them ? Because the key in annihilating militants is not in killing them, but to make them unpopular among people from whitch they are recruited.

Like in Iran.. Goverment often abuse word Islam, so Iranian doesnt reconize themself with islam. Once there will be big majority, goverment will become history.

Have been sutch ideas presented in Israel in past ?

lada, im sorry but i am having trouble understanding what you wrote, its probably a combination of a few typo's on your side and the "less then perfect" (

) english on my side.

please rephrase your post.

ravells · « **Reply #67 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:42:39 PM »

a friend of mine is flying to the US to take part in such seminar that discuss coexistence, in which she will sleep with palestinian girls in the same room for allmost a month with no grown ups from both sides (she is 17).

Lesbo sex! even better!

Ravs

Pongo · « **Reply #68 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:55:34 PM »

Your being way to honest for some of your supporters here flyboy. Better edit some of that.

"condemn us, frankly i dont care. what the army is doing in thwe occupied territories saves dozens of people a day.
terrorism."

My point was that the Army is there because the settlements are there. The settlements are illegal and the centeral point of the conflict. I see that I am preaching to the converted though.
My stroke of the pen statment was in regards to how the US can influence Isreal to find leaverage to change this policy and withdraw.
I aggree with the concept of the wall. But i should be on the border not in the middle of the West Bank.

lada · « **Reply #69 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:55:38 PM »

damm you Ravs... dont speak about it or i will imagine those 2 big black Eyes and it will cause serious problem in my pants

chmmmmmm

edit: geeez.. imagine 4 big black eyes in one baaaad...

uuuuuuuuuu

xrtoronto · « **Reply #70 on:** June 21, 2004, 06:54:42 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by NUKE
Pongo, easy for you to say living in Canada, far from Arab suicide freaks.

All safe and secure up in Canada, making judgments with no clue. Nice.

LOL

nuke you live in Az (not downtown Tel Aviv)

xrtoronto · « **Reply #71 on:** June 21, 2004, 07:01:01 PM »

I have a question for Flyboy.

This is not directly related to this thread, but I wondered why some Jews don't like the existence of Israel?

Toronto had the worlds largest pro Israeli march recently and it was part of the news that night. Some Jews were speaking out against Israel. I didn't understand that.

ravells · « **Reply #72 on:** June 21, 2004, 08:18:06 PM »

maybe they just want to be treated like everyone else?

Ravs

Toad · « **Reply #73 on:** June 22, 2004, 12:55:45 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Pongo
My countrymen have been involved physically in Mid east peace for probably 50 years.

Mine too. We're paying the Egyptians $1.3 Billion a year as part of the deal to get them to recognize Israel. A MAJOR step towards peace in the area wouldn't you say? Or have you forgotten how many times Egypt and Israel went at it all out despite the few Blue Berets on the lines? (BTW, US troopers did/do duty there too you know. One of my son's buddies just got back.)

And that $1.3 Billion is only the MILITARY aid. We also agreed to give them $815 million in economic support fund assistance --making Egypt the second largest regular recipient of conventional U.S. military and economic aid, after Israel. and we've been paying this much every year since the agreement.

We BOUGHT peace between Egypt and Israel. Something no Blue Berets were ever able to do, eh? But you gotta do what you gotta do and them as can DOES while them that can't DON'T.

Toad · « **Reply #74 on:** June 22, 2004, 01:02:33 AM »

Quote

PongoHow do you reconcile that Toad? You always ignore it and drag these discussions to something else.

Wrong.

You either haven't read what I've said about it here or you have forgotten.

I'm on record as saying that Israel needs to move back to the initially established UN 1947 borders. Otherwise it's accepting the conquest of territory by force of arms. That's something the UN and the US has always opposed.

I was pretty suprised at Bush when he changed that stance recently.

I'm also on record as being in favor of cutting/stopping US aid to Israel.

In short, I haven't ignored it and my position is the same as yours.

Your either too forgetful to remember it or delusional.