Author Topic: Flight & Combat Basics  (Read 3163 times)

Offline Kidjel

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Flight & Combat Basics
« on: July 01, 2004, 09:48:00 AM »
I am a true newb to flight sims... I've been trying AH II offline to get the knack of flying and trying to shoot down the drones... Not having much success.

The AH II Help Files really don't have anything on the basics of flight and basic air combat. Where can I find that kind of guidance? I do have MS Flight Sim 2004...  Is the MS Flight Sim close enough in flight sim to AH II that I should learn my flight basics there? And then come back to learn combat in AH II after I have the flight basics down?

Offline Flit

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Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2004, 10:08:54 AM »
I would recommend that you go to the training arena,there is usaully someone there who is willing to help.
 whatever you do ,don't get discouraged,flying agianst other people is a lot different then flying agianst AI

Offline SlapShot

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« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2004, 10:19:22 AM »
Kidjel ...

If you are in your 2 week trial or a paying customer, you can go to the Training Arena and hook up with a trainer.

You can also go here ...

netaces.org

They have some great write ups.

Don't get discouraged ... Aces High has a tremdous learning curve. Stick with it and it will come into place.
SlapShot - Blue Knights

Guppy: "The only risk we take is the fight, and since no one really dies, the reward is the fight."

Offline flyingaround

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« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2004, 10:38:56 AM »
When you can, log online and hop into the Training Arena.  Look for a Trainer (or me if i'm there) and they/me will be happy to help you.  

-WMLute III/JG26 9th ST WidowMakers
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Offline TweetyBird

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Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2004, 02:15:24 PM »
Dont worry, half the people in the MA don't know how to fly, and the other half kills them :)

I'd practice a lot of landings offline, because if you can do that successfully, you probably have the flight basics down. If you're having trouble with that, I'm sure you'd have no problem finding tons of stuff on flight basics if you search (google or some other search engine) +flight +basics +simulators. Start with something easy to land (like a p38 or a p51) and when you think you're good, try a f4u :)

After that, there are sites devoted to air combat sims.
They're good reading when you can't play, but it would be much more enjoyable to go to the Training arena to learn some stuff. I mean you're paying to play online and meet people :)

Its gonna be long (but fun) road from learning to fly to being successful in AH, so the more friends you can make while doing it, the more fun the game will be. Set realisitic goals, and follow your own timetable. Its a game that will keep your interest for years.

Offline mars01

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« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2004, 05:22:00 PM »
If you can successfully go through the MSFS lessons then you will be able to transfer that basic knowledge and skill to AH.  The planes will obviously have different characteristics here, but that you will learn.

Air Combat Maneuvers are something that comes with knowledge, experience and time.

Knowledge - Understanding basic and advanced ACM.  Understanding the strengths and weakness of each plane.

Experience - The more fights you engage in the more you will understand and strengthen your knowledge.

Time - It takes a certain amount of time for everything to sink in and for you to move to the next level.  Then it starts all over.

Patience is the key.  Don't rush into your fights, don't fly into bad situations unless your ready and can turn them into your favor.Gunnery is very big.  Go to the training arena and get a trainer.  Ask them how to use the friendly lock so that you can get an idea of what a snapshot is, what a lead shot is etc.

Go to the site slap recommended there is alot of info there and most of what you will need for the knowledge part.

Then fly your prettythang off and don't get worried when you get killed and plan on dying a lot, till you get through the first level.  To get a handle on what each plane is capable of, you have to fly and experience them.

Record all your engagements and review them.It takes about a month or two to get your bearings and at least six months to get comfortable in the MA. 8).

Most of all keep a good sense of humor and don't take things to seriously.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2004, 05:27:58 PM by mars01 »

Offline Soda

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Re: Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2004, 12:00:43 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kidjel
I am a true newb to flight sims... I've been trying AH II offline to get the knack of flying and trying to shoot down the drones... Not having much success.

The AH II Help Files really don't have anything on the basics of flight and basic air combat. Where can I find that kind of guidance? I do have MS Flight Sim 2004...  Is the MS Flight Sim close enough in flight sim to AH II that I should learn my flight basics there? And then come back to learn combat in AH II after I have the flight basics down?


If you find that a trainer is not online when you are then feel free to email us and pre-arrange a time to meet.  We'd be happy to hook up with you for some 1 on 1 time.

trainers@hitechcreations.com
or me
soda@hitechcreations.com

AH has a pretty steep learning curve, like some others have pointed out, but if you can get some time working on some basics and understanding them it will come a lot easier.  It'll just take some time and practice.

Offline J_A_B

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Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2004, 03:02:03 PM »
Flight and combat basics ?

First thing first--learn to take off and land your plane.  And no, auto-takeoff doesn't count.  If you're unable to even land, then you're not going to be terribly effective in combat.  Get good enough at landing that you can even land on the CARRIERS.   You can practice this offline.  

Second--learn to shoot.  If you can't hit anything from a moving airplane, then further flying skills beyond what you'd already have at this point are worthless.  You don't need to be the world's greatest shot, but practice against the offline drones goes a long way towards making you competent in air to air gunnery.

Third--VIEWS.  Rubberneck CONSTANTLY.  Set your views and use them a LOT.  Check your 6 a LOT--get into the habit of checking your 6 every time you're about to open fire on someone else--that is when a lot of people will try to shoot YOU down.  

Ok, if you did all of that in order, you will end up with basic flying ability, some level of gunnery ability, and you'll be good at using your view keys.  Then and ONLY then should you worry about learning more advanced maneuvers.  

For a new player learning the basics of flight and gunnery, my personal recommended airplane is the F6F Hellcat.  It is easy to take off and land (even on carriers), is tolerant of a new pilot's flight errors (read:  it is somewhat resistant to stalling), it has a LOT of ammo to practice shooting with, it's views out of the cockpit are sufficient, and it takes a LOT of damage before being shot down itself.  An added bonus is you can practice using bombs or rockets without having to select a different plane.

The Spitfires and the N1K2 are also good to learn AH with, but neither are as versatile as the F6F hellcat is from a trainee's perspective.

J_A_B

Offline J_A_B

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Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2004, 03:21:13 PM »
Ok, some speifics:

Learn the keyboard.  In particular know the location of your flaps, and your brakes.  This doesn't just mean the generci "brakes" button (spacebar is default), but also the individual left/right wheel brakes--these are vital for controlling your plane on takeoff and landings.

Takeoffs:

Get used to using your rudder or your wheel brakes to keep the plane straight on the runway.  Do not oversteer or else you will crack up before ever leaving the ground.  You do NOT need to use your ailerons (joystick x axis) to stay centered down the runway; using them will likely cause you to crack up.   In general you are okay if you veer slightly off center, so just concentrate on getting off the ground in one piece for now.  MAKE SURE that Auto-Takeoff is OFF.


Landings:

The most important thing about landings is to GIVE YOURSELF ENOUGH TIME.  A lot of people come in too close to the airfield, try to land too quickly, then crash.  A new pilot isn't going to know the techniques to slow down in a short distance (indeed, a new pilot shouldn't even try it), so start a landing approach a fair distance out from the base.  Several miles should work.

Basic landing steps--

Reduce speed.  This is easily done by cutting throttle to 0 and flying level at about 1000 feet altitude above the base and a couple miles out from it.  Your speed will soon drop to about 150 MPH.  Use throttle to hold your plane at about 150 MPH for now.

Drop FULL flaps and landing gear.  This will slow you to about 120 MPH or less.   Do this when you're getting close to the runway--close enough where it is becomming tough to see over the nose.  Do not let your speed drop under 100 MPH (yet) or else you will probably stall.

You will probably be gradually be losing altitude in this flight configuration--that is the point.  At this speed your plane will be somewhat nose-up just trying to stay airborne and will STILL be gradually losing altitude (if you aren't losing alt, then you are too fast).  Basically you should run out of altitude about the time you reach the landing strip.  Special technique--if you feel like you can't "pull the nose up"with the engine on idle right before landing, hit FULL throttle for a short time--this will cause the nose to veer up.  Once on the runway, use the brakes to stop. Use just one wheel brake if you need to turn slightly to keep it straight.

You SHOULD NOT ever have to point your plane down in order to get it to land.  IF you have to physicallypoint your nose DOWN to land it, then you are landing too fast.  Landings should be at about 100 MPH, with touchdown at somewhat less than that.  

Once you are good at landing, practice carrier landings (remember to use the tail hook on a plane so equipped; F6F is a good plane for this).  Remember that the carrier flightdeck is about 60 feet aove the water.

The best way to practice landings, IMO, is to practice flying at slow airspeeds with gear/flaps down in the AIR several thousand feet up, to get used to how the plane flies like that.  That way if you mess up you just stall and climb back up, instead of planting yourself into the runway.

Honestly, once you get good at takeoffs and landings, you are already as good a pilot as at least 1/4 of the MA fliers.  I frequently see MA pilots who crash trying to take off or land.

J_A_B

Offline TequilaChaser

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Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2004, 09:18:59 PM »
Also Turn Stall Limiter Off.......that is if it is turned on in the flight set up.........it will hender your flying abilitys........

Best to start off learning with out it than to learn with it on then start all over learning with it off..........IMHO...YMMV

Make sure you start out with your tracers turned on, until you get a feel of where your ammo is going once you accomplish an average gunnery skill then you may want to experiment with them turned off to increase your gunnery skill, also read up on gun convergence , is best to go thru all the planes and set the convergence ( usually 300 to 500 for most people ) read up on this subject.......

If you want to leave auto-take off on, you can always knock it off when you launch by moving stick back ( pull back ) it will disengage it so you can practice taking off with out it..........
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline Crumpp

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« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2004, 09:35:39 AM »
You've been given some great advice for getting started bro.  Only thing I could add is get a copy of Robert Shaw's "Fighter Combat:  Tactics and Manuvering".

 http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0870210599/102-8222359-5914556?v=glance

Don't try and reproduce the diagrams.  Learn the principals and "why's and how's" things happen in air to air combat.

Memorize Boelcke's Dicta:

==============================================

1. Try to secure advantages before attacking. If possible, keep the sun behind you.

2. Always carry through an attack when you have started it.

3. Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your sights.

4. Always keep your eye on your opponent, and never let yourself be deceived by ruses.

5. In any form of attack, it is essential to assail your opponent from behind.

6. If your opponent dives on you, do not try to evade his onslaught, but fly to meet it.

7. When over the enemy's lines, never forget your own line of retreat.

8. For the Staffel: Attack on principle in groups of four or six. When the fight breaks up into a series of single combats, take care that several do not go for one opponent.

http://www.geocities.com/aw3aw3/dicta.htm

==============================================

And most importantly: Learn to shoot, fancy flying has never shot another airplane down.

Good Luck!  Don't be afraid to ask questions if your online.  Their are plenty of good folks who will lend a hand.

Crumpp

Offline _Schadenfreude_

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« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2004, 11:26:47 AM »
If it's a fair fight you've done something wrong...

Offline o0Stream140o

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« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2004, 02:03:23 PM »
Learn how to survive and then learn how to kill...

Offline Kidjel

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« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2004, 12:34:21 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by o0Stream140o
Learn how to survive and then learn how to kill...

Ok... This seems to be the key! LOL!

I've done everything I can do offline. Everything in this thread has helped tremendously... Especially the NetAces site. I can takeof, fly & land OK, but I'm a terrible shot.  I guess that will come with experience.

Is there a time of day when there are more folks in the TA? I've tried the MA but I only last a minute in an air engagement on MA... Not long enough to learn anything.

In the mean time I guess I'll man a gun on a field or on a carrier... ;)

Offline SlapShot

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Flight & Combat Basics
« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2004, 01:26:15 PM »
In the mean time I guess I'll man a gun on a field or on a carrier...


Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt ... WRONG ANSWER !!!

Step away from the gun and get back in the plane and keep getting killed. You will learn nothing while sitting in a gun. Take off from a field where many are also taking off .. follow them and try to stay alive long enough to see some of their engagements ... better yet ... film it and watch it later.

Dieing, as terrible as it may seem, is not dishonorable, nor should you be chastized for it.

I died ALOT when first starting this game, as well as many others have, but I just kept going back for more and each time learned something new.

I still die alot, but not as much as I use to ... ;)
SlapShot - Blue Knights

Guppy: "The only risk we take is the fight, and since no one really dies, the reward is the fight."