Author Topic: Pit bull apologists, wake up  (Read 3368 times)

Offline Torque

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #75 on: July 07, 2004, 10:20:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by midnight Target
I would cut and paste, but the link is copyright protected.. the basteges!

Basically it says this:
"a physical standard was drawn up for the Pit Bull. The name Pit Bull was a problem for these dog show folks - they felt it would scare people off. They tried several names including Yankee Terrier (a silly name for a bulldog from the UK!) and finally settled on Staffordshire Terrier."

Further down: "To add to the confusion the name Staffordshire Terrier was changed to American Stafordshire Terrier in the 1970's when the AKC decided that the Pit Bulls in England had enough variation to warrant being called a different breed. The UK dogs were now called Staffordshire Bull Terriers."

So basically a Pit is a Pit... they need to be deleted from the gene pool.


No, a purebreed Pitbull is bred from fighting stock for game and fighting ability. What it looked like was irrelevant, while the American Staff is the complete opposite and is exclusively bred from show stock to look pretty with a good hock, colour etc...

The AKC never reconized Pits because for one, they were stuck up, and two, because of the fighting aspect; but the ADBA always did reconize Pits. Basically they're the same Dog. The only way to tell them apart is by the ADBA papers and family tree.

These Pits you see today, barrel chested with big heads,  wouldn't last more than a few minutes in a match. Some of the best known Pits Evar had small heads and were slim and sleek with deep V chest.

Originally Staffordshire Terriers were brought from Ireland and England, then bred out to hunt for wild boars in the southern states. That's how Pitbulls eventually came about.

They are bred from pure fighting stock or were, hence there aren't many, if any, purebred Pits around today. It's all scattered bred, no papers, my noodle is small but my Dog can hang from a car tire for a good hour or so.

John Colbly must be turning in his grave.

Offline Dune

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #76 on: July 08, 2004, 01:59:19 AM »
When I was in law school I interned for the SF DA's office.  I got to work on the dog case where the two Presa Canarios ate the lacrosse teacher.  Along with getting to work with a hot DA (look up Kimberly Guilfoyle, she's on CourtTV now) and I had to learn a little about dogs.  One of the reasons they want mean pits is becuase meth cooks use them to protect their labs.  They figure that the dog will slow you down.  

In fact, the AB's were trying to breed the Presa's to sell to the Mexican Mafia as an improvement over the pits.  And trust me, there isn't a better killing-dog in the business than one of these things.

PS, I've owned two pits and thought they were great dogs.  But I figure I got lucky.

Offline Maniac

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #77 on: July 08, 2004, 07:22:37 AM »
Dogs dont kill people, its the dogs owner that kills people...

Or something like that
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Offline myelo

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #78 on: July 08, 2004, 07:39:55 AM »
Patton's bull terrier was Willie, short for William the Conqueror.
myelo
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Offline lazs2

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #79 on: July 08, 2004, 07:50:57 AM »
no... left to themselves.. dogs will kill people.

lazs

Offline Coolridr

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #80 on: July 08, 2004, 07:55:28 AM »
No owner has total control over their dog....Some of these attacks probrably are more the owner's fault..But breeds like the Rottie, Pit Bull, Doberman, and Chow were bread purely to be aggressive attack/fighting dogs. This is something that is instictive not trained anymore. With the exception of the Rots these breeds are known to turn on their owners and owners families (The chow especially). The  need for this kind of dog for "home protection" does not exist. Any kind of large dog's bark will usually scare off an intruder, and in todays world where the criminal has more rights than the victim you'd probrably stand a chance of being sued and losing if your dog really tears an intruder up. Let these breeds die out I say. They are a menace and should be considered a deadly weapon.

Offline Coolridr

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #81 on: July 08, 2004, 08:04:18 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by myelo


It’s unfair because it punishes responsible owners of pit bulls, while not addressing irresponsible owners of other breeds.

.


         I don't think I've ever met a responsible Pit Bull owner. Most of these people get the things because they are fashionable. Hell they aren't even a good looking dog. One of the butt-ugliest things I've ever seen.

Offline lazs2

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #82 on: July 08, 2004, 08:37:58 AM »
I do not advocate making these dogs illegal but..

Any dog attack should be treated like assault or..if it happens .. murder.  Almost any dog attack should involve jail time for the owner.  even if the dog is provolked... if you use current practice... the breeder should be sued.   If the dog is not locked up so that he can't be gotten to by children then the owner is liable.    

lazs

Offline midnight Target

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #83 on: July 08, 2004, 09:26:53 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Torque
No, a purebreed Pitbull is bred from fighting stock for game and fighting ability. What it looked like was irrelevant, while the American Staff is the complete opposite and is exclusively bred from show stock to look pretty with a good hock, colour etc...

The AKC never reconized Pits because for one, they were stuck up, and two, because of the fighting aspect; but the ADBA always did reconize Pits. Basically they're the same Dog. The only way to tell them apart is by the ADBA papers and family tree.

These Pits you see today, barrel chested with big heads,  wouldn't last more than a few minutes in a match. Some of the best known Pits Evar had small heads and were slim and sleek with deep V chest.

Originally Staffordshire Terriers were brought from Ireland and England, then bred out to hunt for wild boars in the southern states. That's how Pitbulls eventually came about.

They are bred from pure fighting stock or were, hence there aren't many, if any, purebred Pits around today. It's all scattered bred, no papers, my noodle is small but my Dog can hang from a car tire for a good hour or so.

John Colbly must be turning in his grave.


Go read the link Torque

Offline Torque

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #84 on: July 08, 2004, 10:24:43 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by midnight Target
Go read the link Torque


Read the Book, i had a Colby Dog twenty years ago.



I'm not making any excuses for the behaviour of these scatter bred mutant BullPits of today thx to CNN, the bloodline is gone and as far as i'm concerned the name should be changed.

That's all i'm pointing out, the original Pits are nothing like the ones of today.

Offline myelo

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #85 on: July 08, 2004, 10:45:52 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Coolridr
I don't think I've ever met a responsible Pit Bull owner.


I've met about 500, although I'll concede I see a biased population.

Maybe you need new friends. :)
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Offline Cougar68

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #86 on: July 08, 2004, 12:02:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Coolridr
..But breeds like the Rottie, Pit Bull, Doberman, and Chow were bread purely to be aggressive attack/fighting dogs.


Please do not spread this ignorance around.  The Rottweiler cannot be lumped in with dogs that are bread for fighting.  As I said earlier in the thread they were originally bred to pull carts in Germany.  It's only in recent history that they've come to prominence as guard dogs and it's all due to their size, not their temperament.

A Rottweiler, like just about any other dog, can be protective of its family.  However, their instinct comes out in a totally different manner than an attack dog.  A Rottie is a passive dog.  I had one when my son was first born and the two of them bonded instantly.  If any new people came around the house she stood up and sat between them and my son.  If they made a move to get close to him, she would look over at me as if to ask "is it ok?" and then go about ignoring them.  They're fantastic dogs that have gotten a bad rap lately due to irresponsible breeding and training.

Cougar

Offline Goth

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #87 on: July 08, 2004, 12:35:08 PM »
Wasn't Petie from the Little Rascals a pit? If so, that dog saved those kids butts many a time. Prime example of a good pit.

On a more serious note, pits can be dangerous, and I for one don't think the owner can control that breed as much as they think. I do not advocate elimination of the breed, but I certainly do think they can be dangerous.

Offline Sandman

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #88 on: July 08, 2004, 12:45:13 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Goth
Wasn't Petie from the Little Rascals a pit? If so, that dog saved those kids butts many a time. Prime example of a good pit.


IIRC, that was a bull terrier. Different breed.

http://www.thebullterrier.com/bthistory.shtml
« Last Edit: July 08, 2004, 12:47:37 PM by Sandman »
sand

Offline Goth

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Pit bull apologists, wake up
« Reply #89 on: July 08, 2004, 12:56:43 PM »
To be honest, from the pictures I remember of Petie, I really think it is a pit.....but I'm certainly not a breed expert at all.

If I remember correctly, bull terriers are smaller than pits with a smaller hind leg set.

Need a judges ruling on this, maybe I will search some web pics from doggie shows.