Author Topic: Rooks Win Reset Despite ENY (Read 8336 times)

Arlo · « **Reply #150 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:42:11 PM »

Are you actually saying that flying any plane but the La-7 in AHII seems masochistic to you but being stubborn about switching sides to fly it and logging on anyway to fly something else isn't? Just checking.

blutic · « **Reply #151 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:43:28 PM »

In the MA nothing should be perked. The perk system came about because whinners didnt like getting shot down by an F4U-C.
If you want a limited plane set go to the CT. If not get used to being shot down by 262s and every other late war plane.
Just my opinion.
Blutik

DoKGonZo · « **Reply #152 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:44:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Zazen13
... HTC knows full well Airwarrior existed 3 times as long as AH has with the same population demographic just on a larger scale and was balanced perfectly for that entire duration by simply allowing complete and total individual freedom of choice. ...

AW was "perfectly balanced?" HT - stop laughing!

Not since the first campaign was AW balanced - at that time all new players were A-landers by default and got vultched ad nauseum.

Vad · « **Reply #153 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:45:02 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Arlo
Are you actually saying that flying any plane but the La-7 in AHII seems masochistic to you but being stubborn about switching sides to fly it and logging on anyway to fly something else isn't? Just checking.

Looks like you don't see difference between masochism and excruciation.

Arlo · « **Reply #154 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:47:34 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Vad
Looks like you don't see difference between masochism and excruciation.

Welp ... you may be right about that. Maybe the word we're both looking for is "martyrdom", though.

Murdr · « **Reply #155 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:47:57 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by TBolt A-10
And, when the game isn't fun to play anymore, people DO walk; the core community crumbles & the company dies (it has happened many times before).

That is how the ENY thing came about. The game wasnt fun when people logged on to look at the roster and the map, and see little or no viable way to make an enjoyable flight night after night.

Quote

Originally posted by Zazen13
There's no need to 'hard-code' solutions to gameplay player balance issues. Players balance themselves over time. The economics of finding good fights and human nature will alone achieve balance if left unmolested.

There seems to be evidence disputing that statment in this very thread:

a lot of these players have been flying for a team...with friends...for years -- YEARS. We don't just pick up our bags and "switch sides." End of story. There is no further discussion about it.
Myself and other Rooks will not switch sides.
B17skull12, reference my previous post to Kev. WE, the Rooks, are not going to switch sides. The Rook hordes, that so many seem to whine about, are not going to go away....Eny limiter or not.
So, please, quit suggesting that we "switch sides." That just isn't how things work whether you like it or not.
I don't need to check with my schedule to make sure that other people are on at the same time, I don't want to have to make an appointment to fly so I can make sure my group can run a mission we plan with the planes we chose.

Everyone who is complaining seems to just gloss over the fact that if this were only a "one night a week problem" the ENY wouldnt turn on any other time. When I see comments on how things must be: "I must fly for ", "Squad night must be on ", "My squad must be able to fly ". My sympathy level drops to zero. If you are blind to, or dont care how ruining others ability to enjoy the game is affected by your percieved right to do things your way, then there is your answer to why the ENY rule came into being.

Murdr · « **Reply #156 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:56:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Zazen13
HTC knows full well Airwarrior existed 3 times as long as AH has with the same population demographic just on a larger scale and was balanced perfectly for that entire duration by simply allowing complete and total individual freedom of choice.

Lol, that is bull. "balanced perfectly for the entire duration" What a crock.
By the way, in AW if you logged on to an arena and your country was getting ganged, you had other identical arenas to go to, or you could go to the other theater. In AH you can go to CT, which differs in many respects or log off.

Vad · « **Reply #157 on:** September 06, 2004, 03:56:38 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Arlo
Welp ... you may be right about that. Maybe the word we're both looking for is "martyrdom", though.

I didn't know this word, thank you.

Frankly, I don't speek English so well to feel difference between 'martyrdom' and 'excruciation'. Seems, the first one is more mental, I would say. If it is so, you are right.

DoKGonZo · « **Reply #158 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:00:36 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Murdr
... If you are blind to, or dont care how ruining others ability to enjoy the game is affected by your percieved right to do things your way, then there is your answer to why the ENY rule came into being.

Then why was it acceptable for the Rooks to be the most outnumbered side for almost a year? I wasn't around for this, but enough people have told me what it was like (with 8x10 color screen-shots).

To folks who played through that and overcame it, to now see other sides given a "free ride" when it's their turn in the pit will trigger the natural reaction to dig in. Why are these other people so special that they need to be spared, right?

We're talking human dynamics here.

Now, in terms of the game - well odds have always swung to and fro. It sucks being outnumbered, true. But why couldn't squads from one of the weaker countries move so that maybe a second numerically strong country came to the battle? There has been nothing stopping such migration which, although it would create a heavily weakened 3rd country, there would be a massive battle going on between the two stronger sides. Why must the country with numbers "give back their gold medal" when the weaker sides can just pool their resources if they want to fight with even numbers?

-DoK

Arlo · « **Reply #159 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:14:23 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by DoKGonZo
Then why was it acceptable for the Rooks to be the most outnumbered side for almost a year? I wasn't around for this, but enough people have told me what it was like (with 8x10 color screen-shots).

Are you saying that HT should have waited almost a whole year to implement the horde ENY restriction so the other chess pieces could have their fair share of "unfairness?" Because if HT is to give into the human dynamics part of this equation then it won't stop with the ENY restriction.

I'm not much for conspiracy theories (and I'm not saying you are, DG) .. but I kinda doubt the ENY restriction was something HT was thinking about a couple of years ago but only decided it was a good idea when the rooks had numbers. From what I've read from some here .... though ..... hehe.

Of course ... to be honest (and I've said this before) ... the numbers disparity never bothered me all that much. Challenge is good. Guess that's why the ENY restriction doesn't bother me all that much, either.

Excessively bothered people kinda bother me. Until I remember how funny they can be. (Again .. not you, per say, DG.)

Goobman · « **Reply #160 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:20:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Arlo
You really ARE a goob, man.

You were gonna log for the night but you saw a chance to screw your fellow rooks out of some rides so you stayed on and twiddled your fingers? Then you got the gall to make a big deal over the rooks "winning the war" anyway? Heh ... you're too much.

" .... as did many other Rooks."

What .... did you guys get together on squad channel and go "huhuhu .... we'll show THEM .... huhuhu .... we'l make every rook as pissed off as we are ... huhuhu .... wait a sec .... look .... there's rooks that don't care .... LOOK ... WE WON! WE WON!

Quick eveyone (the 20 or so odd rooks that have had a wet diaper since the eny limit was imposed) ... there's GOT to be a way we can put a bad spin on this!!!!!"

That's as dumb as "Ah will naht change frum Rookland, evah evah. Rule Rooklandia! Fly for ahnother side? Unthinkable!"

Well .... you showed us!

(Opposite effect? Well ... there's a tard factor to most things that defies logic, I suppose)

p.s. Yeah .... I know ... this post has a very limited shelflife.

And my reply will probably have as much shelflife.

Your intelligence (or lack of it) shows by your blatent attack on me. Instead of making an intelligent argument against my thoughts (maybe for lack of ammo on your part) you try to flame and get personal. Your kind sickens me and your ignorance is apparent to most. Your post is almost laughable except it is probably embarrassing to your friends. Get a life and learn the meaning of intelligent discourse and debate.

Coolridr · « **Reply #161 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:24:53 PM »

Here's mu only problem..The 339thFG was REAL late war...only existed about a year..They only flew the 51B for a real short time...They were a 51D squad...we are modeled after a historic squad and like to fly that way..we have tried to move our squad night to less popular nights to fly but that still hasn't worked...we didn't choose the plane as much as we chose the squad..now we can't hold our squad night and be happy about it....we took a vote to change countries..and at was 75% to stay rook because of the friendships and teamwork we have there...and to put it out there this game darn near lost an entire squad in the matter of 1 day. There has to be a better way to balance sides..the way we are doing it now only causes hate and discontent...and with lack of a better game to play (as far as MMOG flight sims go) what choice do we have but to stay here....HT has us all over a barrel with this

Arlo · « **Reply #162 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:26:47 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Vad
I didn't know this word, thank you.
Frankly, I don't speek English so well to feel difference between 'martyrdom' and 'excruciation'. Seems, the first one is more mental, I would say. If it is so, you are right.

Depends on whether you view it's root as a verb or a noun. If you view it as a verb it implies that HT is the sadist and you are the masochist. If you view it as the latter, you can be a masochist with no actual sadist involved but your imagination ... as long as you feel you're suffering for a just cause.

BTW ... you handle English better than any second language I do. I must admit that I suffer from acute monolingualism. Some here think I have mono now.

Arlo · « **Reply #163 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:28:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Goobman
And my reply will probably have as much shelflife.

Your intelligence (or lack of it) shows by your blatent attack on me. Instead of making an intelligent argument against my thoughts (maybe for lack of ammo on your part) you try to flame and get personal. Your kind sickens me and your ignorance is apparent to most. Your post is almost laughable except it is probably embarrassing to your friends. Get a life and learn the meaning of intelligent discourse and debate.

Was this intended to be a shining example?

Hornet · « **Reply #164 on:** September 06, 2004, 04:38:49 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by DoKGonZo
Then why was it acceptable for the Rooks to be the most outnumbered side for almost a year? I wasn't around for this, but enough people have told me what it was like (with 8x10 color screen-shots).

To folks who played through that and overcame it, to now see other sides given a "free ride" when it's their turn in the pit will trigger the natural reaction to dig in. Why are these other people so special that they need to be spared, right?

We're talking human dynamics here.

Now, in terms of the game - well odds have always swung to and fro. It sucks being outnumbered, true. But why couldn't squads from one of the weaker countries move so that maybe a second numerically strong country came to the battle? There has been nothing stopping such migration which, although it would create a heavily weakened 3rd country, there would be a massive battle going on between the two stronger sides. Why must the country with numbers "give back their gold medal" when the weaker sides can just pool their resources if they want to fight with even numbers?

-DoK

It's interesting because I was there fighting for Rooks during that time. I left when the horde tactics took over.

Recently, in part because this seems to be a source of angst, I've been fiddling back through the stats with the idea of assigning country origin for the Top 100 fighters in camps where Rooks were "in the bucket".

The focus being: of the number of the ranking Rooks back then, what number are now flying for either Knights or Bish. And the same analysis done in reverse to see of the number of ranking Rooks last camp, how many ranked during the In-the-bucket time frame. This would give a better sense of who actually flew effectively back then and continues to do.

It's been slow going and time better spent flying, and defining that time period is tough. I'll probably only get 3 or so camps mapped, if anyone else would like to jump feel free, but it should be interesting.