Author Topic: In other news (Read 3604 times)

Jackal1 · « **Reply #15 on:** April 07, 2005, 09:26:32 AM »

I think it is also taking into account the multiple assailant scenario.

storch · « **Reply #16 on:** April 07, 2005, 09:44:08 AM »

my beloved Florida has always been reasonably sensible regarding self defense issues. we were the first state to implement shall isue permits for the common law abiding non mentally incapacitated citizen. this new legislation is a step in the right direction affirming the basic human right of self preservation. not that this legislation is really needed here in my beloved Florida. some of us were discussing this new legislation issue earlier today at a local building department and an eaves dropper claiming to be Arizonan commented that in his former state they allowed open carry. I was tempted to call BS except that I haven't been to Arizona since 1998 so I was unsure. would any Arizonans confirm this for me? thanks.

storch · « **Reply #17 on:** April 07, 2005, 09:46:36 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Jackal1
I think it is also taking into account the multiple assailant scenario.

I think the significant change is that now if you are robbed you can shoot the assailant as he tries to flee. I'm not sure if this is true because I haven't seen the bill but a few people have made this comment.

CyranoAH · « **Reply #18 on:** April 07, 2005, 12:27:24 PM »

Okee then, I want to kill somebody... I just piss him off, let him advance towards me, I shoot him. No witnesses.

Is it so hard to envision such a scenario where wrongdoers actually exploit this bill?

Daniel

AWMac · « **Reply #19 on:** April 07, 2005, 12:47:01 PM »

Quote

an eaves dropper claiming to be Arizonan commented that in his former state they allowed open carry. I was tempted to call BS except that I haven't been to Arizona since 1998 so I was unsure. would any Arizonans confirm this for me? thanks.

Yes Storch it's true. I lived in Arizona and they do have an open carry. There's nothing like strolling into a McDonalds and see a few holsters with firearms. I think it deters alot of crime.

Mac

VOR · « **Reply #20 on:** April 07, 2005, 12:54:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by GScholz
Why do you have "crack fiends with guns" running around?

Crack should be banned. You know, as in made illegal so people can't buy it. Come to think of it, the same rule might work for guns!

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #21 on:** April 07, 2005, 01:06:12 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by VOR
Crack should be banned. You know, as in made illegal so people can't buy it. Come to think of it, the same rule might work for guns!

I cant believe someone who lives in TN would make a statement like that. Hang on while we trace the IP address wouldya?

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #22 on:** April 07, 2005, 01:12:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by GScholz
Why do you have "crack fiends with guns" running around?

Not here, thank God. And there's no reason for people to go around armed here either (yet). Altho Hawaii does have a Concealed Carry law, they never issue them. Havent seen a reason yet to think thats a bad thing either.

However, St. Louis was a very different thing, and I'm glad to see they wised up and passed Concealed Carry in MO. I'll do some digging on the Post Dispatch website and see if I can find the story, but back in about 96/97 we had a pizza driver stopped by two druggies and he gave them all his money without argument. They decided to shoot him anyway just because they thought it would be fun. Thats when he pulled out his concealed 9mm and killed the first one, wounded the other one. Yes it was illegal. No he didnt get arrested for it. Although they did take his gun. City cops in St Louis tend to understand reality.

lazs2 · « **Reply #23 on:** April 07, 2005, 02:40:12 PM »

sof... it really doesn't matter where you live or what the history is... It should be up to the individual to decide if he should carry concealled or not.

oh... I did a job in East ST Louis... One of the guys on the crew was on his second shooting. He had killed his second burglar. Interesting stories.. 2 of his friends on the crew had shot at and wounded people on their propety. None of them had spent even an hour in jail.

lazs

storch · « **Reply #24 on:** April 07, 2005, 03:21:10 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by AWMac
Yes Storch it's true. I lived in Arizona and they do have an open carry. There's nothing like strolling into a McDonalds and see a few holsters with firearms. I think it deters alot of crime.

Mac

now there's a reasonable place to live. kudos Arizona. Thanks Mac

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #25 on:** April 07, 2005, 03:43:16 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
sof... it really doesn't matter where you live or what the history is... It should be up to the individual to decide if he should carry concealled or not.

lazs

Point taken

rshubert · « **Reply #26 on:** April 07, 2005, 04:00:54 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by storch
my beloved Florida has always been reasonably sensible regarding self defense issues. we were the first state to implement shall isue permits for the common law abiding non mentally incapacitated citizen. this new legislation is a step in the right direction affirming the basic human right of self preservation. not that this legislation is really needed here in my beloved Florida. some of us were discussing this new legislation issue earlier today at a local building department and an eaves dropper claiming to be Arizonan commented that in his former state they allowed open carry. I was tempted to call BS except that I haven't been to Arizona since 1998 so I was unsure. would any Arizonans confirm this for me? thanks.

I have always wondered where the line that Florida was first with a "shall issue" law came from. IMO, that's an urban myth. I had a "shall issue" permit in Indiana in 1979, YEARS before Florida set up their system. The Indiana law stated that they MUST issue a permit to any person who could pass the criminal check for reasons of self defense.

Later, some time after I moved away, they changed the law to make it almost mandatory to have a CCW if you own a handgun, yet kept it sensibly simple to go through the process. A very enlightened state, that Indiana.

In most states, the criteria for use of deadly force of any kind is the perception by a "reasonable individual" that they (or a person near them) are in danger of grievous bodily harm or death. In other words, you can't use deadly force on a thief for stealing your stuff, unless you feel threatened. Most states do not have a requirement for a retreat, as Florida apparently did prior to this legislation. NO place requires that you be on your own property, or that the assailant be inside your house, or any of the other BS you typically hear.

rshubert · « **Reply #27 on:** April 07, 2005, 04:06:11 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Masherbrum
Good. I'm a Designated Driver, amongst friends when hanging out. I am looking to get my CCW here in Michigan this year. I'm usually sucking down Sprites for free at bars, because of the DD thing. Funny thing is, 99% of the LAW ABIDING citizens won't be a problem. You're always gonna have the 1% who are the prettythang*oles, that is life.

Karaya

Better check before carrying into a bar. Most states prohibit carrying a concealed weapon into a place where alcohol consumption is the primary business. I am not sure about the Michigan law about this.

john9001 · « **Reply #28 on:** April 07, 2005, 04:46:00 PM »

in florida it's a felony to bring a gun into a bar , unless you have a CWP , then it's a misdemeanor.

fla defines a "bar" as a business or the part of a business that makes over half it's income from alcohol sales, so you will have to contact the owner and their bookkeeper before entering a "bar & grill"

a restaurant is ok but not the "bar" part of the restaurant, way too much gray there.

storch · « **Reply #29 on:** April 07, 2005, 05:00:12 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by rshubert
I have always wondered where the line that Florida was first with a "shall issue" law came from. IMO, that's an urban myth. I had a "shall issue" permit in Indiana in 1979, YEARS before Florida set up their system. The Indiana law stated that they MUST issue a permit to any person who could pass the criminal check for reasons of self defense.

Later, some time after I moved away, they changed the law to make it almost mandatory to have a CCW if you own a handgun, yet kept it sensibly simple to go through the process. A very enlightened state, that Indiana.

In most states, the criteria for use of deadly force of any kind is the perception by a "reasonable individual" that they (or a person near them) are in danger of grievous bodily harm or death. In other words, you can't use deadly force on a thief for stealing your stuff, unless you feel threatened. Most states do not have a requirement for a retreat, as Florida apparently did prior to this legislation. NO place requires that you be on your own property, or that the assailant be inside your house, or any of the other BS you typically hear.

prior to the "shall issue" law it was ok to carry in your vehicle or to and from your vehicle to anywhere you were going. most everyone I've ever known has had a pistol or shotgun in their cars and trucks. as far as I know my beloved Florida was the first state in the nation to say it was legally and socially acceptable to go about your business armed.